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Thread: Vrentas: Jets enlist ex-military members to help build unity and leadership with team

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Ah, Rah-Rah is heard from once again. Surprising after an 0-fer preseason.

    Jenny Vrentas, Queen of The Blind Homer Cult will change her tune and run for the hills soon too, you'll see.

    SAR I
    Hard to disagree with you here brother... and the saddest part is that "0-fer" not only refers to our record, but also our ability to get in the end zone. It’s said time and again by the media pundits (and I really hate talking heads) that classy organizations with strong leadership (Giants, Patriots and Steelers) simply embody this as part of their culture.
    Say what you want about Belichick and how he’s a boring, monotone leader, but I remember watching a two part special on the NFL network about him and he called out his players for not celebrating. His logic was simple – you’ve scarified so much to get there and worked so hard to make these plays you should celebrate each big play as a team. He calls out the players for not huddling around someone who made a play. Hell, he even renamed his boat after each super bowl (2 –rings, 3-rings, 5-rings) so he really isn’t about modesty. Its just the way organizations carry themselves. We need to learn and adopt at least a little of this and I don’t think you can buy it.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    You can't make leaders out of followers. Or leaders out of guys who are not meant to lead (Santonio).

    Leaders should emerge out of the normal football related situations these guys face everyday -- game days, practice, meeting rooms, film study, etc. Leaders shouldn't emerge out of faux situations that these guys are not going to be facing.

    The problem here is that Rex is trying to force leaders out of his group when he should let the situation dictate themselves. For example, him picking the captains instead of players voting them in last year was one of the dumbest moves ever. Now this garbage.

    Your leaders have to be the guys who not only other players respect, but guys who other players will look up to by the way they perform on the football field.

    I don't know what kind of exercises they did at this leadership camp, but if it's like a lot of those leadership conferences I've been forced to go to by the companies I've worked for, then it's really dumb.
    This is actually the exact opposite of Rex trying to force leaders. It's to help leaders learn how to lead, and how to follow. No one is coming out of this with a certificate saying "I'm the leader now".

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    This is a joke move, another act in the circus.

    Rex can't lead like the other 31 NFL head coaches, so he outsources it. Not a month goes by that the team doesn't bend over backwards to help this fool do a job that he's clearly incapable of. Another humiliation, another press of the SOJF undo button that he helped eradicate in 2009.

    "Innovative?" nice spin. Pathetic.

    SAR I
    Is this worse than Mangini bringing in Teddy Atlas to box train the players and give motivational speeches??

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Is this worse than Mangini bringing in Teddy Atlas to box train the players and give motivational speeches??
    Yeah. That was a one hour speech to the whole team to get them pumped up.

    This was an overnight conclave for a selected few, the very opposite of a team-bonding experience. This causes more dissection and distraction.

    SAR I

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Is this worse than Mangini bringing in Teddy Atlas to box train the players and give motivational speeches??
    Apples & oranges IMO. Bring in a person who is a champion level trainer for an alternative method of working out while offering inspirational anecdotes and support is not the same as a leadership assessment and training program design to compensate for a clear leadership vacuum the coach was unaware of a year ago. There are a few exceptions, but for the most part players carry out the coaches strategic objectives. There are the occasional players like Peyton, Lewis, Brady, Brees, etc, but those are not the norm. Look at least years final four – all of them have strong leadership qualities that start at the head of the teams and, for the most part, the players execute as dictated from the top. Atlas was brought in to change it up from the daily grind, not to address a systemic problem with the organization.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    I'd almost love to have the drugs that you are on.
    You'll need 'em when Tebow gets the ball and we boo him back to the bible belt.

    SAR I

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    You can't make leaders out of followers. Or leaders out of guys who are not meant to lead (Santonio).

    Leaders should emerge out of the normal football related situations these guys face everyday -- game days, practice, meeting rooms, film study, etc. Leaders shouldn't emerge out of faux situations that these guys are not going to be facing.

    The problem here is that Rex is trying to force leaders out of his group when he should let the situation dictate themselves. For example, him picking the captains instead of players voting them in last year was one of the dumbest moves ever. Now this garbage.

    Your leaders have to be the guys who not only other players respect, but guys who other players will look up to by the way they perform on the football field.

    I don't know what kind of exercises they did at this leadership camp, but if it's like a lot of those leadership conferences I've been forced to go to by the companies I've worked for, then it's really dumb.
    This is the sort of thing you put the bad people in a company through to get them to straighten up and fly right.

    "Leadership Camp" is code for "Reform School". No matter, it's just a resume building puff piece for the Ryan Family Resume as both twins will be seeking employment soon. Maybe they can start their own team.

    SAR I

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Yeah. That was a one hour speech to the whole team to get them pumped up.

    This was an overnight conclave for a selected few, the very opposite of a team-bonding experience. This causes more dissection and distraction.

    SAR I
    Atlas worked with the Jets on a weekly basis. It wasn't just "one hour."

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    This is actually the exact opposite of Rex trying to force leaders. It's to help leaders learn how to lead, and how to follow. No one is coming out of this with a certificate saying "I'm the leader now".
    It's taking them outside of football related activity. While someone might be better to lead a group doing a hike, that person might not be the right person to lead defensive huddles.

    Ex. Tebow is going to lead this group in prayer huddles, but is he the right person other players should look for in leadership in tight games when he's not even playing?

    Leaders should be guys other players gravitate towards because of who they are and their performance on the field.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Yeah. That was a one hour speech to the whole team to get them pumped up.

    This was an overnight conclave for a selected few, the very opposite of a team-bonding experience. This causes more dissection and distraction.

    SAR I
    Yet again your penchant for distorting the truth to backup your own inane argument. It was not an overnight trip.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    This is the sort of thing you put the bad people in a company through to get them to straighten up and fly right.

    "Leadership Camp" is code for "Reform School". No matter, it's just a resume building puff piece for the Ryan Family Resume as both twins will be seeking employment soon. Maybe they can start their own team.

    SAR I
    Leadership camps do work in the corporate world. But in athletics? I don't think it's a good idea.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhyan66 View Post
    Apples & oranges IMO. Bring in a person who is a champion level trainer for an alternative method of working out while offering inspirational anecdotes and support is not the same as a leadership assessment and training program design to compensate for a clear leadership vacuum the coach was unaware of a year ago. There are a few exceptions, but for the most part players carry out the coaches strategic objectives. There are the occasional players like Peyton, Lewis, Brady, Brees, etc, but those are not the norm. Look at least years final four – all of them have strong leadership qualities that start at the head of the teams and, for the most part, the players execute as dictated from the top. Atlas was brought in to change it up from the daily grind, not to address a systemic problem with the organization.
    Right, and Pete Carroll took them bowling and bought them pizza.

    There are ways to change the daily grind without going over-the-top, which is how I would describe the Atlas thing. Maybe some players felt that was a grind as well. Maybe some players needed more time on football training and the boxing training was an unneeded distraction.

    They bring in a boxing coach to train football players to box and give motivational speeches.

    Well, how did that work out? Did it help? Did it start a trend in the NFL?

    It was a great move by Mangini.

    His team responded with a 4-12 season.

    Maybe they should have spent more time on football? Yes?

    I criticize Rex a lot. But I have no problem with this. A HC is not responsible for making leaders. You're either a leader or you're a follower. Players have it or they don't. I see nothing wrong with a little confidence-building for those who may need it.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    It's taking them outside of football related activity. While someone might be better to lead a group doing a hike, that person might not be the right person to lead defensive huddles.

    Ex. Tebow is going to lead this group in prayer huddles, but is he the right person other players should look for in leadership in tight games when he's not even playing?

    Leaders should be guys other players gravitate towards because of who they are and their performance on the field.
    "Outside of football activities" Is it such bad thing when teams cancel a TC practice and go bowling, or to a bar for a pool tournament? It takes away from football?

    This was a 6-8 hour event, that was on a day before a game that these players were not playing.

    The only reason ANYONE is stuck defending it is because the blowhard of all blowhards sar decided to rip it because he is bored.

    If we are looking for ridiculous things to discuss on the day every NFL roster is being remade, we might as well just discuss sar's repeated claims that the stadium is sold out even though there are seats available in every section....that would be equally dumb wasteful of peoples time.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Yet again your penchant for distorting the truth to backup your own inane argument. It was not an overnight trip.
    He doesn't address posts that prove him wrong. He'll ignore yours and my posts and continue on his merry way.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    He doesn't address posts that prove him wrong. He'll ignore yours and my posts and continue on his merry way.
    I know, he did it yesterday just like the whiny b*tch he is.

    This was a good thing the team did, not indicative of anything else other then trying to get better as players and as people

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    "Outside of football activities" Is it such bad thing when teams cancel a TC practice and go bowling, or to a bar for a pool tournament? It takes away from football?

    This was a 6-8 hour event, that was on a day before a game that these players were not playing.

    The only reason ANYONE is stuck defending it is because the blowhard of all blowhards sar decided to rip it because he is bored.

    If we are looking for ridiculous things to discuss on the day every NFL roster is being remade, we might as well just discuss sar's repeated claims that the stadium is sold out even though there are seats available in every section....that would be equally dumb wasteful of peoples time.
    This was an attempt by our HC/FO to filter a leader from our team through non-football related activity. That's what it is. Defend it all you want, but the point is pretty clear.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Is this worse than Mangini bringing in Teddy Atlas to box train the players and give motivational speeches??
    uhhh

    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Yeah. That was a one hour speech to the whole team to get them pumped up.

    This was an overnight conclave for a selected few, the very opposite of a team-bonding experience. This causes more dissection and distraction.

    SAR I
    ohhhh


    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Atlas worked with the Jets on a weekly basis. It wasn't just "one hour."
    ahhhh

    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Right, and Pete Carroll took them bowling and bought them pizza.

    There are ways to change the daily grind without going over-the-top, which is how I would describe the Atlas thing. Maybe some players felt that was a grind as well. Maybe some players needed more time on football training and the boxing training was an unneeded distraction.

    They bring in a boxing coach to train football players to box and give motivational speeches.

    Well, how did that work out? Did it help? Did it start a trend in the NFL?

    It was a great move by Mangini.

    His team responded with a 4-12 season.

    Maybe they should have spent more time on football? Yes?

    I criticize Rex a lot. But I have no problem with this. A HC is not responsible for making leaders. You're either a leader or you're a follower. Players have it or they don't. I see nothing wrong with a little confidence-building for those who may need it.



    I think Tangini did a good job assembling and training core parts of what we have now. 2007 had Chad fighting back from injuries and an overmatched Clemons; some high points for sure; set the table for 08 and 09 and 10

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    This was an attempt by our HC/FO to filter a leader from our team through non-football related activity. That's what it is. Defend it all you want, but the point is pretty clear.
    Who would you say are the teams leaders? Because anyone you are going to say was there at the event. If we were looking for new leaders, then it would have been done at a different time and included other players.

    This was done to foster and improve leadership qualities in EVERYONE that went. Whether they were already leaders on the team or people who the organization wants MORE leadership from.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    It's taking them outside of football related activity. While someone might be better to lead a group doing a hike, that person might not be the right person to lead defensive huddles.

    Ex. Tebow is going to lead this group in prayer huddles, but is he the right person other players should look for in leadership in tight games when he's not even playing?


    Leaders should be guys other players gravitate towards because of who they are and their performance on the field.
    Actually, yes, Tebow very well could be ONE of the leaders that guys look to in tight games, even if he isn't on the field.

    Tebow actually has a very delicate balancing act to play. He has very strong leadership traits/skills, but he has to figure out how to be effective, without undercutting Sanchez. You know, to be a "follower" while being a leader as well.

    During games, he could very well be a motivator on the sidelines helping to keep guys focused. He could help shape attitudes and outlooks if/when the team is down by 10 with 7 mins to go in the 4th Q. You know, continue to have hope and optimism. He can be a settling influence when mistakes happen or drives stalls. The old "keep your chin up" attitude.

    BTW, all of the above applies to other guys as well, not just Tebow. I used him specifically because you asked about him.

    Funny thing is that in the military, while an officer is usually "in charge" of a platoon, company, battalion, etc, it is the Non Coms who are usually the leadership backbone of the units. It's a rather interesting dynamic.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by First DOWN! View Post
    This was an attempt by our HC/FO to filter a leader from our team through non-football related activity. That's what it is. Defend it all you want, but the point is pretty clear.
    The point that is "pretty clear" is that you don't understand the actual point.

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