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Thread: Fact Check: Is Romney's tax rate really lower than yours?

  1. #1
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    Fact Check: Is Romney's tax rate really lower than yours?

    President Obama's campaign, with a good dose of help from the media, is pushing a claim that millionaire Mitt Romney is taxed at a "lower rate" than someone making $50,000 a year.

    The claim, though, is open to debate. It only holds up in a particular scenario in which both income and all payroll taxes are counted.

    The president's campaign presumably is referring to Romney's release last week of his 2011 tax returns, which showed he paid an effective tax rate of 14.1 percent.

    This revelation, as might be expected, fueled a wave of campaign stump speeches and videos. The latest was an Obama Web video blasting Romney's "strange take on tax fairness." It included clips of people accusing Romney of paying a lower rate than "average" Americans. An accompanying campaign email said: "Mitt Romney admitted he thinks it's fair that his $20 million income was taxed at a lower rate than someone making $50,000."

    IRS data, though, shows that Romney's effective income tax rate -- that's what he pays as a percentage of his income once deductions and other benefits are factored in -- is actually far higher than what most Americans pay.

    And it's certainly higher than what someone making $50,000 pays.

    IRS data from 2010 shows someone making between $50,000 and $75,000 on average pays an effective rate of 7.8 percent. Even someone making between $100,000 and $200,000 pays a 12.1 percent rate -- also lower than Romney's.

    So what is the Obama campaign referring to? There are a couple possibilities.

    The campaign likely is trying to make the point that Romney's income -- at least the huge chunk of it that is derived from investments -- is taxed at a 15 percent rate, while others who earn their money from a paycheck are taxed at marginal income rates going all the way up to 35 percent.

    The latter percentage, though, comes down once deductions and exemptions are included. The Tax Foundation estimated in a report in January that Romney's rate in 2010 -- which was also about 14 percent -- was higher than what 97 percent of Americans pay.

    The math works out better for the Obama campaign's claims if all payroll taxes are included in the formula.

    Since Romney earns most his income from investments and not from a paycheck, he doesn't have to pay much toward Social Security and Medicare taxes. But if both the employee and employer share of those taxes are included, according to a Tax Policy Center chart, the middle tier of earners would be paying a 15.5 percent effective rate. (As pointed out in an earlier report by FactCheck.org.)

    That would be slightly higher than Romney's rate.

    The Obama campaign, asked about its latest Web video, told FoxNews.com "you can't ignore the payroll tax" considering how big of a hit that is for most middle-class families.

    The Obama campaign also referred FoxNews.com to Romney's comments to CBS' "60 Minutes.

    In the interview, Romney was asked by reporter Scott Pelley whether Romney's rate is "fair to the guy who makes $50,000 and paid a higher rate than you did?"

    Without disputing that claim, Romney said it was fair and explained: "It is a low rate. And one of the reasons why the capital gains tax rate is lower is because capital has already been taxed once at the corporate level, as high as 35 percent."

    The claim by Pelley, though, made certain assumptions without explaining them.

    Obama used Pelley's phrasing to repeat the claim Monday on ABC's "The View."

    "Yesterday Governor Romney on 60 Minutes said -- was asked does he think it is fair that he pays a lower tax rate than somebody that's making $50,000 a year, and he said yes," Obama said.

    As the Media Research Center pointed out, an ABC reporter also claimed that Romney's 14.1 percent rate was "lower" than that of an auto mechanic making $75,000.

    While Romney may or may not pay less than the average middle-class earner -- depending on how one defines middle class and how one defines tax rate -- one thing is clear: Romney does pay at a lower rate than the typical wealthy person.

    IRS data for 2010 showed those making between $1 million and $10 million typically paid at an effective tax rate of more than 25 percent.

    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012...#ixzz27X4DDRbh

  2. #2
    Hmm, what concerns me more: Mitt Romney's tax rate or Barack Obama getting reelected and unemployment goes to 12% in 2013?


  3. #3
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    He paid more taxes than he had to as to not offend anyone...

    4:15 in this video:

    http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tu...-way-but-lucid

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    Yes, it is.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by SafetyBlitz View Post
    He paid more taxes than he had to as to not offend anyone...

    4:15 in this video:

    http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tu...-way-but-lucid
    He's a douche. He was worried that all his charitable donations would reduce the rates too much so like the scum he is he ended up filing for less than the total deduction he was able to claim. If he was a stand up guy like Sortero he would have simply not donated money to charity this year to avoid all these headaches. What a charitable scumbag he is.

  6. #6
    In income taxes alone Romney's rates were higher then mine. My effective rate after deductions is around 12%

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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefst2000 View Post
    He's a douche. He was worried that all his charitable donations would reduce the rates too much so like the scum he is he ended up filing for less than the total deduction he was able to claim. If he was a stand up guy like Sortero he would have simply not donated money to charity this year to avoid all these headaches. What a charitable scumbag he is.
    But see, we're not talking about what he did with the money that he kept. We're talking about his tax rate.

    He left 1.5 million out of his deductions because he wanted to artificially raise his tax rate, as people would be watching this time around.

    And good for him that he's charitable. Never said the guy was a bad man. Just disagree with his politics. But even if we did decide to speak about where his charitable donations went, we'd likely have to talk about the Church of Latter Day Saints.

  8. #8
    I hope Romney will point out that this tax rate was just after Obama and the democrats had the house and senate and if they had a problem with they could have fixed it.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by SafetyBlitz View Post
    But see, we're not talking about what he did with the money that he kept. We're talking about his tax rate.

    He left 1.5 million out of his deductions because he wanted to artificially raise his tax rate, as people would be watching this time around.

    And good for him that he's charitable. Never said the guy was a bad man. Just disagree with his politics. But even if we did decide to speak about where his charitable donations went, we'd likely have to talk about the Church of Latter Day Saints.
    He said he did it because he wanted to be consistent with his campaign claim that he had been paying around 14% a year. The extra deduction for charity could have brought him down closer to 12.5%. Either way he pays more than I do and I make a top 7% income.

    As to the second part of your comment I'm confused. Are you claiming here that the Mormon Church is some sort of nefarious terrorist organization? Who are you or I to judge what church or synagogue someone chooses to support?

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    as long as Romney didn't break any laws, who the **** cares?

    Lets focus on how Obuttocks sucks as POTUS

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    Palmetto is right this is why Romney won't beat the propaganda machine. "Evil stuffy rich guy gives ladies cancer and don't pay as much tax as me...and he'll take away my free phone".

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by quantum View Post
    as long as Romney didn't break any laws, who the **** cares?

    Lets focus on how Obuttocks sucks as POTUS
    Obama literally doesn't even know what the national debt is. The guy was on Letterman talking about how the national debt is no big deal. He has no plan to deal with it. His tax hikes are based on supposed fairness and the revenues from his Buffet plan are exactly the same dollar amount (3 Billion) as the government free cell phone program that this Obama Supporter got her free phone from:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpAOwJvTOio
    Last edited by chiefst2000; 09-28-2012 at 04:08 PM.

  13. #13
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    Lol.


    You're election to lose. And y'all nominated a walking/talking piece of fecal matter.


    Sent from my Double-Wide using Semaphore...

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by quantum View Post
    as long as Romney didn't break any laws, who the **** cares?
    voters

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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefst2000 View Post
    He said he did it because he wanted to be consistent with his campaign claim that he had been paying around 14% a year. The extra deduction for charity could have brought him down closer to 12.5%. Either way he pays more than I do and I make a top 7% income.

    As to the second part of your comment I'm confused. Are you claiming here that the Mormon Church is some sort of nefarious terrorist organization? Who are you or I to judge what church or synagogue someone chooses to support?
    He planned to artificially increase his tax rate by paying more than he owes. It's just shady when you remember that he only released a couple of years of tax returns.

    As for the Mormons, I mean, no, they're not nefarious. But read about Joseph Smith. PK was on to something comparing it scientology. I don't celebrate scientologists giving to their church. Hell, I'm Roman Catholic, and I don't celebrate anyone giving them money that they'll turn around and use to cover-up pedophilia.

    What do those organizations do with their money, not all faiths are equal in how they spend their tithe.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by chiefst2000 View Post
    He said he did it because he wanted to be consistent with his campaign claim that he had been paying around 14% a year. The extra deduction for charity could have brought him down closer to 12.5%. Either way he pays more than I do and I make a top 7% income.

    As to the second part of your comment I'm confused. Are you claiming here that the Mormon Church is some sort of nefarious terrorist organization? Who are you or I to judge what church or synagogue someone chooses to support?
    And of course amending his return after the election to take the deduction at the full rate is out of the question.

    He certainly pays less then I do and he keeps claiming to lower deductions to keep his plan revenue nutral without actually naming deductions he is going to reduce. BS

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winstonbiggs View Post
    And of course amending his return after the election to take the deduction at the full rate is out of the question.

    He certainly pays less then I do and he keeps claiming to lower deductions to keep his plan revenue nutral without actually naming deductions he is going to reduce. BS
    You paid $2M in tax? Do tell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Shift Jet View Post
    You paid $2M in tax? Do tell.
    Obama is responsible for your current tax rate?

    Do tell.

  19. #19
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    Seriously why bother with.Willard. He'll be a little remembered answer to a trivia question about Prrsidential campaign losers in November.

    Sadly we blew the chance of victory by rejecting Dr Paul and allowing Koch Bros cash to buy a nomination for an empty suit instead

    Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Obama is responsible for your current tax rate?

    Do tell.
    0's just responsible for preserving it...I had it for years before he came back to America.

    The multi-trillions in waste/political paybacks/reparations, along with the free phones, higher cost of living he can take credit for

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