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Thread: You're Problem Starts at Woody Johnson.

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Queens Jet Fan View Post
    Guido is absolutely right. Batman did you read the article you linked to? It totally proves our point.
    Jets income for the 2 years of the NMS was just $8Mil in 2010 and $25Mil in 2011. Now read footnote 5 next to the Income graph.

    What do you figure the interest costs are on $750 Mil of debt. I don't know the interest rate but doubt it would be less then 6% - is probably more. That is $45 Mil of interest which means that for 2011 there was a negative cash flow conservatively figured of at least $20 Mil. There was a greater loss in 2010 before they sold the naming rights and the new CBA. And what about taxes? That's not included in the income figures either.

    So now you see how Woody went from making sh*tty money with a lousy lease in Giant Stadium to losing money owning half of Met Life.

    Yeah he's a great business man
    How much revenues are coming from the stadium? You don't seem to be counting for that.

    But still can't figure out why you don't root for another team. You hate the location hate the owner and hate the team.

    Just be happy and find a team u can love. The vast majority of your posts are so darn negative about the jets. Don't u want to be happy? What about greenbay? How about Dallas?

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by sec.101row23 View Post
    How about the facility in Florham Park? Was that donated from a charity?
    The land for the facility was donated by the State of NJ as part of the stadium deal. Woody did build a nice facility but that was planned before tickets at NMS went on sale and Woody had much higher projections of what his revenue would be.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by sec.101row23 View Post
    LOL...please show us where the penny pinching is. How about the facility in Florham Park? Was that donated from a charity?
    He's not able to see the FP facility. It's in nj. Remember he's the queens jet fan.

    The new stadium was the last straw for him. Before he still had hope that the jets would get back to queens.

    Let's find him another team.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by batman10023 View Post
    How much revenues are coming from the stadium? You don't seem to be counting for that.
    Seriously have you read the article you linked to? I don't count the gate receipts? Hey Batman these are figures from Forbes not from me. It says in the article the gate receipts are $77 Mil which is $10 Mil less then the Giants get from the same stadium.

    But still can't figure out why you don't root for another team. You hate the location hate the owner and hate the team.
    Why do you worry so much who I root for? I happen to root for the Jets. Not for their owner and yes I'm happy that you are happy with your seats. This stadium is not for me. Why can't you respect that?

    I guess when you can't argue your case on the facts you worry about who I root for.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    You are DEAD wrong here. Re-read the article you linked. It clearly shows a value for the team at $1.22 billion with a debt/value ratio of 61% ($744 million) Do you really think a buyer IGNORES the debt when buying an asset? Sorry, but any Business 101 major can explain how you are 100% wrong here.


    Assuming Woody could find a buyer using the Forbes numbers, he would NET around $378 million. Not a penny more.
    So using the Forbes numbers are you saying that the Giants are worth 650mm?

    I believe those numbers are very low based on previous sales of nfl franchises

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Queens Jet Fan View Post
    Seriously have you read the article you linked to? I don't count the gate receipts? Hey Batman these are figures from Forbes not from me. It says in the article the gate receipts are $77 Mil which is $10 Mil less then the Giants get from the same stadium.


    Why do you worry so much who I root for? I happen to root for the Jets. Not for their owner and yes I'm happy that you are happy with your seats. This stadium is not for me. Why can't you respect that?

    I guess when you can't argue your case on the facts you worry about who I root for.
    All you do is complain about stuff related to the jets. Just hoping you can find a team that provides you with more joy.

    With respect to the Forbes valuation just look at the breakdown. They have the breakdown by category. It shows that you are wrong. The stadium is a net value of 177mm

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by batman10023 View Post
    So using the Forbes numbers are you saying that the Giants are worth 650mm?

    I believe those numbers are very low based on previous sales of nfl franchises
    The Giants are worth whatever someone is willing to pay for them. As are the Jets, although given their history, lower debt load, and higher operating revenue the Giants are worth significantly more than their little cousin.

    But yes, with a 50% debt to equity ratio the Giants owners would "only" net $650 million if they sold the team tomorrow for the $1.3 billion Forbes says it's worth.

    It's pretty simple. I don't understand why you can't get it.
    Last edited by GuidoYaztremski; 10-01-2012 at 11:08 PM.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    The Giants are worth whatever someone is willing to pay for them. As are the Jets, although given their history, lower debt load, and higher operating revenue the Giants are worth significantly more than their little cousin.

    But yes, with a 50% debt to equity ratio the Giants owners would "only" net $650 million if they sold the team tomorrow for the $1.3 billion Forbes says it's worth.
    Look I believe you are reading it wrong and have pointed several things out to show u.
    But you aren't buying it so let's agree to disagree.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by batman10023 View Post
    Look I believe you are reading it wrong and have pointed several things out to show u.
    But you aren't buying it so let's agree to disagree.
    I can read. It's there in black and white. Clearly you don't have even the most basic business knowledge or acumen. Debt doesn't just disappear after a sale. Giants sell for $1.3 billion. They must either pay off their debt, or any debt left on the books comes off the sales price ($650mm). That's how things work in the real world. You're dumb.

  10. #70
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4626264]I can read. It's there in black and white. Clearly you don't have even the most basic business knowledge or acumen. Debt doesn't just disappear after a sale. Giants sell for $1.3 billion. They must either pay off their debt, or any debt left on the books comes off the sales price ($650mm). That's how things work in the real world. You're dumb.[

    Ha ha

  11. #71
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4626264]I can read. It's there in black and white. Clearly you don't have even the most basic business knowledge or acumen. Debt doesn't just disappear after a sale. Giants sell for $1.3 billion. They must either pay off their debt, or any debt left on the books comes off the sales price ($650mm). That's how things work in the real world. You're dumb.[

    Nope.

  12. #72
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    who else can we attack? we got the QB, coach, GM, owner.

    i know!

    the guy who answers phones at Florham Park, what an ass hole!

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by JetsFanatic View Post
    Maybe it's because I spent so many years rooting/suffering for this team when Leon Hess was the owner, but I don't believe Woody is a bad owner.

    Also his politics is a separate issue. Just because the Jets had a poor/embarrassing performance doesn't he can't be on TV for other matters.
    He isn't a bad owner, has won his fair share, more than most since he's bought the team.

    People love to have someone to blame. Rich white guys make good targets. And take a lot less thought than looking at the entire picture.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    I can read. It's there in black and white. Clearly you don't have even the most basic business knowledge or acumen. Debt doesn't just disappear after a sale. Giants sell for $1.3 billion. They must either pay off their debt, or any debt left on the books comes off the sales price ($650mm). That's how things work in the real world. You're dumb.
    and you really should learn what non recourse debt is my friend.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by batman10023 View Post
    and you really should learn what non recourse debt is my friend.
    Sorry "friend" but that is REALLY stupid. Non-recourse debt isn't in play here. It has NOTHING to do with the stadium financing. Woody's debt /equity ratio, vis a vis the stadium is 60%, a bit over what is generally allowed in a non recourse loan. What you are ignoring (after looking up the term on Google undoubtably) is that he only owns HALF of the pledged asset, the stadium. therefore there is zero chance he has a non recourse loan as he his HIGHLY leveraged. And even if he did, which he doesn't, that doesn't mean he could sell the team and walk away from the obligation. Nor does it mean that a buyer would pay full value PLUS assume the huge stadium debt.

    Stop posting on a subject you clearly know nothing about. You're only digging a bigger hole here. His equity in the team is still only around $400 million. Non recourse debt? That's dumb.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanchez 3:16 View Post
    who else can we attack? we got the QB, coach, GM, owner.

    i know!

    the guy who answers phones at Florham Park, what an ass hole!
    I don't know. That list seems pretty accurate to me.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    Sorry "friend" but that is REALLY stupid. Non-recourse debt isn't in play here. It has NOTHING to do with the stadium financing. Woody's debt /equity ratio, vis a vis the stadium is 60%, a bit over what is generally allowed in a non recourse loan. What you are ignoring (after looking up the term on Google undoubtably) is that he only owns HALF of the pledged asset, the stadium. therefore there is zero chance he has a non recourse loan as he his HIGHLY leveraged. And even if he did, which he doesn't, that doesn't mean he could sell the team and walk away from the obligation. Nor does it mean that a buyer would pay full value PLUS assume the huge stadium debt.

    Stop posting on a subject you clearly know nothing about. You're only digging a bigger hole here. His equity in the team is still only around $400 million. Non recourse debt? That's dumb.
    Do I have your permission to use thiese few posts as an example of recourse vs non - recourse debt and basis regulations? Real world examples are so helpful.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by southparkcpa View Post
    Do I have your permission to use thiese few posts as an example of recourse vs non - recourse debt and basis regulations? Real world examples are so helpful.

    Of course. As always, I'm just here to help.

  19. #79
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    For people telling me that Woody isn't a penny pitcher / headline grabber, just look at facts. Braylon Edwards had the most chemistry with Sanchez on this team beside Keller. The organization preaches they believe in Sanchez. Yeah they believe in him so much that they take away his best receiver for a jail bitten Plaxico and washed up Derrick Mason. This year, we had a back up QB in Stanton, but of course he had to grab the headlines and grab Tebow. Last year when Turner went down, we could went to get a veteran free agent, but no the penny pitching organization ran by Johnson goes with Colin Baxter.

  20. #80
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    Once I heard the Romney comment from Woody, I knew the season was over. Sad day but reality hits.

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