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Thread: Giving up PSL's?

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Alkrotraz View Post
    jets would rather have you switch seats than downgrade. Why dont you see if they have any 15K PSLs open on the Jets side lower level with the 145 face.

    Those seats you wont lose money selling give they are 25 yard line lower level with a 145 face.
    thats an option at this point. thanks lower my cost for each season easier to swallow.

  2. #102
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    I am amazed that people didn't consider the good and the bad.

    It's not like the Jets can be run like the Yankees. They cannot just write a big check and steal Breeze, Megatron, and MJD from small market teams.

    The only recipe for long term success in the NFL is lucking into a superstar QB - Manning I, Brady, etc. Without someone like that, you get good years and bad years.

    Year after year, something like 50% of playoff teams don't make it the next year.

    Enjoy the game; enjoy the spectacle. Winning is the bonus.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    I bought the cheapest PSL at the time, $4,000.

    I find it hard to believe that someone who bought 2 seats and financed $8,000 for 10 years is having a hard financial issue over $800 a year- especially since the ticket cost itself is $2,600 a year.

    People who are talking about getting out of PSL's are just being emotional and short-sighted. It's Year 3 of a 30 Year process. Somewhere in there we'll have our run again, win the AFCE a few times, get some home playoff games, get to the Super Bowl.

    SAR I
    Sar, correct it is not just the cost of the psl but the price of the tickets that are causing some fans to question thier purchase. 3 years ago the jets went to the playoffs, jet fans thought Brady was going to retire in 3 years and they bought at a period of peak demand.

    Fans think the good time is going to last forever. These new STH dont have the emotional commitment and are willing to eat the delta between the aftermarket and the thier original purchase price rather than pay for the ST while the team rebuilds. It is not the just PSl installment that is making the decision but the price of both.

    If a guy with a $2000 PSl can get $1000 for the seat that leaves a delta less than what is the cost of next years tickets. He then joins the great majority of fans that only go to the games they want to.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    I said "if" the Jets become an elite team the PSL values will go up.

    Everyone wants to talk about the downside; there's an upside too.

    SAR I
    Because there is a definite downside, 30 years is going to happen and then there is no value. They may be an upside if the jets over the next 15 years become the Pats, Colts, Steelers or Ravens. Teams that have dominated for 15 years. Then, for a new owner to pay just face is in reality paying twice what you thought was reasonable 3 years ago.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by patman View Post
    Because there is a definite downside, 30 years is going to happen and then there is no value. They may be an upside if the jets over the next 15 years become the Pats, Colts, Steelers or Ravens. Teams that have dominated for 15 years. Then, for a new owner to pay just face is in reality paying twice what you thought was reasonable 3 years ago.
    Putting it very simply:

    I had $16,000 in 2009 and it didn't bother me to put it towards PSL's. That money is gone, I don't need it back, I never think about it at all except when one of these threads pops up once a year.

    I have been spending an average of $5,000 on season tickets each year since 2001, nothing changes for me now, same entertainment/fun budget it's always been.

    In a given season, no matter how bleak the team is playing, there will be 2 elite games in which selling my seats can pay for 30-50% of the whole year. Back in the Herm era, all those Chad Bodypart seasons, always got paid for the big games.

    The new stadium helps the average PSL owner markedly. The lousy upper deck views and all the pricey Club seats means that there are thousands fewer good/affordable seats to hit StubHub on Sunday's. Used to be that a 40 yard line LL seat and a endzone mezzanine seat cost within $20 of each other. Now one is $400 and the other $125. Used to be that an upper deck seat in the first 20 rows was an awesome location, now it's awful.

    Lastly, the PSL money isn't "gone". It comes back to you on resale if you need it. The Jets are still selling PSL's at full price. A PSL owner can sell a similar seat at a 20% discount, still is getting 80% of it back.

    SAR I

  6. #106
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    I find it funny that people purchased a PSL knowing full well that you are locked into buying season tickets for the next 30 years (or forfeit your PSL), then as soon as the team is playing poorly are jumping ship and crying about a bad investment.

    For anyone that follows the Jets or pretty much any team for that matter you have to expect the good and the bad (look at SF for example), especially over a 30 year period.

    I personally have no complaints about the PSLs... it allowed me and my friends to get all our seats together (16 seats) in a good section 205A with what I think is a great view and at a reasonable price PSL (4K) and game (125).

    We get there early every game (pre-season included) and enjoy tailgating with friends and family before every game. In my personal opinion that is as much a part of the experience as the game itself.

    Don't get me wrong I am as big a Jet fan as anyone one this site, been one for 40+ years, traveled to every road playoff game during the 2009/10 runs and was in Miami two weeks ago.... and I am sick over the current state of this team...

    However we don't draft players or play the games and we can't control the outcome... if you didn't get into this to enjoy the experience (win or lose) you did make a bad investment. I for one will continue to be there every week, support the team, and hope for the best... when the lose I am crushed and when they win it makes my week, but if you are a true fan you need to be there for both.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Digetydog View Post
    I am amazed that people didn't consider the good and the bad.

    It's not like the Jets can be run like the Yankees. They cannot just write a big check and steal Breeze, Megatron, and MJD from small market teams.

    The only recipe for long term success in the NFL is lucking into a superstar QB - Manning I, Brady, etc. Without someone like that, you get good years and bad years.

    Year after year, something like 50% of playoff teams don't make it the next year.

    Enjoy the game; enjoy the spectacle. Winning is the bonus.
    The real issue for me this year is it's become very clear that my regular tailgate crew of 20+ has turned into 3-4 with some stragglers... those 20+ person tailgates were 75% of the reason we all went to the games... without those, plus a recent move to long island and a baby = going to 3-4 games is the new normal for me. so season tickets no longer make sense.

  8. #108
    having season tickets to the jets in my own name was hard to believe. the initial investment wasnt all that bad at the time. new stadium rex ryan new things to come. here we sit four games into the 2012 season and we are discussing whats been done so many times before.

    when we just had tix and no psls it wasnt a big deal to miss a game or two or give the tix to a neighbor. now with the psl fee looming over my head a bad investment i seem to have made.

    im going to call the ticket office and see if i can swap them for anything else cheaper. at this point id even take uppers if they allow me to swap them for multiple years free on my $60k investment. i dont want to walk away unless i have to.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneTime View Post
    I find it funny that people purchased a PSL knowing full well that you are locked into buying season tickets for the next 30 years (or forfeit your PSL), then as soon as the team is playing poorly are jumping ship and crying about a bad investment.

    For anyone that follows the Jets or pretty much any team for that matter you have to expect the good and the bad (look at SF for example), especially over a 30 year period.

    I personally have no complaints about the PSLs... it allowed me and my friends to get all our seats together (16 seats) in a good section 205A with what I think is a great view and at a reasonable price PSL (4K) and game (125).

    We get there early every game (pre-season included) and enjoy tailgating with friends and family before every game. In my personal opinion that is as much a part of the experience as the game itself.

    Don't get me wrong I am as big a Jet fan as anyone one this site, been one for 40+ years, traveled to every road playoff game during the 2009/10 runs and was in Miami two weeks ago.... and I am sick over the current state of this team...

    However we don't draft players or play the games and we can't control the outcome... if you didn't get into this to enjoy the experience (win or lose) you did make a bad investment. I for one will continue to be there every week, support the team, and hope for the best... when the lose I am crushed and when they win it makes my week, but if you are a true fan you need to be there for both.
    Quote Originally Posted by E4orBust View Post
    The real issue for me this year is it's become very clear that my regular tailgate crew of 20+ has turned into 3-4 with some stragglers... those 20+ person tailgates were 75% of the reason we all went to the games... without those, plus a recent move to long island and a baby = going to 3-4 games is the new normal for me. so season tickets no longer make sense.
    Both points of view are opposing but both are correct.

    PSL's are no different than an annual vacation club or a country club membership. You go to Costa Rica as often as you want and if it is no longer fun you stop. You sell your annual commitment for as much as you can, pick it back up again when you feel in the mood again.

    30 years is a long time. Taking a few seasons away isn't abnormal, losing money when the team is bad isn't abnormal. PSL's have nothing to do with it. It's just a price increase.

    SAR I

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Nike View Post
    having season tickets to the jets in my own name was hard to believe. the initial investment wasnt all that bad at the time. new stadium rex ryan new things to come. here we sit four games into the 2012 season and we are discussing whats been done so many times before.

    when we just had tix and no psls it wasnt a big deal to miss a game or two or give the tix to a neighbor. now with the psl fee looming over my head a bad investment i seem to have made.

    im going to call the ticket office and see if i can swap them for anything else cheaper. at this point id even take uppers if they allow me to swap them for multiple years free on my $60k investment. i dont want to walk away unless i have to.
    It is your ticket price that is killing you. For instance Coaches Club for Sundays 49ers game were only actually selling for around $600 bucks each with a face of $700 that is a loss.
    Meanwhile a few seats over in the 15K PSLs that are non-club with a face of $145 I saw those seats selling for $$300 each.

    The ticket price is the key. For instance LGL at $130 or LSL at $145 are easy seats to sell at a profit.

    The PSL sometimes is least of problem. I was talking to one guy who at time I thought was crazy. Around two weeks after Jets lowered prices in Endzone to 2.5K he bought four seats in 5k Endzone corners. I was like why did you do that you paid double. He said I dont care about the PSL. He said I was able to get low row on the aisle seats right next to the 6k seats and tickets only have a $125 face. In a low row corner aisle seat one seat from the $130 tickets I never have to worry about selling at a loss. I will eat the $20k now. Plus he said I give them to clients and wanted cheapest ticket price in a seat client would still enjoy. Three years late I now understand. You just need to get the better seats.

    Those 15K seats right next to Coaches Club have amazing views, and at a $145 ticket price no way you are ever selling a regular game at a loss.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by patman View Post
    The 5th game of the season, against a non division foe, a team with which you have no history with and during a season when the jets are not playing playoff caliber ball.

    True, while not "meaningless", certainly not a premium game in a resell market.
    Such as raiders, steelers, phins, pats, ravens, giants etc. Not even a NYC-boston-Chicago-philly rivalry type game.

    While Houston is playing good ball, they are not a team that has you circling the date on the calender.
    You said it was a meaningless game. The Jets are 2-2 vs a team in their conference that is 4-0. Whether its as strong of a resale game as the Pats or 49ers is irrelevant to your initial statement.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by E4orBust View Post
    The real issue for me this year is it's become very clear that my regular tailgate crew of 20+ has turned into 3-4 with some stragglers... those 20+ person tailgates were 75% of the reason we all went to the games... without those, plus a recent move to long island and a baby = going to 3-4 games is the new normal for me. so season tickets no longer make sense.
    First of all, congrats on the baby. They are really expensive. The "tuition" for my 2 year olds daycare is 4X the cost of the tuition that I paid for law school (state U).

    If people cannot or don't want to pay for tickets b/c of other priorities, I get that. My tickets are a luxury and would be first on the chopping block if I needed to cut my budget.

    My main gripe was with people who want to give up their PSL's b/c the team is bad this year and will likely be bad for the next couple of years. Given the history of the team, I find that concept bizarre.

    The Jets aren't the Yankees with dozens of championships - the Jets are Charlie Brown trying to kick a field goal. The struggle is half the fun.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by fivewide View Post
    You said it was a meaningless game. The Jets are 2-2 vs a team in their conference that is 4-0. Whether its as strong of a resale game as the Pats or 49ers is irrelevant to your initial statement.
    My statement was in response to a guy paying 1500 for 4 tickets. All 16 games have meaning. In context of sthe value of somone paying 2x face for a game, that game is much less meaningful vs a game with direct playoff implications or against a rival.

    Houston is a very good team playing a jets team that is not playing well and taking place in the first part of the year. OThe only less meaningful game this year is the Colts

  14. #114
    The PSL was just a different avenue for raising prices of seats to fair market value.

    In the NYC market, a 20-30 yard line lower level seat is underpriced at $150. If there were no PSL's for these seats they would be a scalpers paradise. The Jets could have either charged an average of $250-$300 for these seats (no PSL) or institued a PSL. It was clearly in their best interested to do a PSL (no arguement)

    My math might be slightly off and Im rounding up, but I believe if you finance 15 years, a 10k psl adds $100 per ticket/per game, a 15 year psl $150, etc. So in essence these seats are costing the consumer $250-$300 per seat, which i believe to be the average fair market value for a NY NFL game in really good seat.

    There are plenty of options for those who didnt want to buy PSL's. (upper deck, stubhub, ticket exchange, etc). It comes down to personal choice.

    I have 8 PSL's and Im very happy with them. I take clients, nephews, brothers, friends....I tailgate everygame with friends whoI sometimes dont get to see except on gameday. When I have extra seats I sell them on the secondary market and have been averaging the earlier mentioned premium above face.

    We've had not so great tickets in my family since 1978. Never could get upgraded. Now I have amazing seats. Call me a sucker, thats fine, its your right, but Im happy to be a part of the Jets family with my tickets. Winning seasons, shi**y seasons, heartbreak, coaching changes, management changes, players coming and going, etc...we are the ones who are here year after year.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by fivewide View Post
    The PSL was just a different avenue for raising prices of seats to fair market value.

    In the NYC market, a 20-30 yard line lower level seat is underpriced at $150. If there were no PSL's for these seats they would be a scalpers paradise. The Jets could have either charged an average of $250-$300 for these seats (no PSL) or institued a PSL. It was clearly in their best interested to do a PSL (no arguement)

    My math might be slightly off and Im rounding up, but I believe if you finance 15 years, a 10k psl adds $100 per ticket/per game, a 15 year psl $150, etc. So in essence these seats are costing the consumer $250-$300 per seat, which i believe to be the average fair market value for a NY NFL game in really good seat.

    There are plenty of options for those who didnt want to buy PSL's. (upper deck, stubhub, ticket exchange, etc). It comes down to personal choice.

    I have 8 PSL's and Im very happy with them. I take clients, nephews, brothers, friends....I tailgate everygame with friends whoI sometimes dont get to see except on gameday. When I have extra seats I sell them on the secondary market and have been averaging the earlier mentioned premium above face.

    We've had not so great tickets in my family since 1978. Never could get upgraded. Now I have amazing seats. Call me a sucker, thats fine, its your right, but Im happy to be a part of the Jets family with my tickets. Winning seasons, shi**y seasons, heartbreak, coaching changes, management changes, players coming and going, etc...we are the ones who are here year after year.
    The haters here have no respect for your position. They will insist on condemning your decision because it makes them feel superior. But many of us feel the same way as you. You just have to ignore the embittered azzholes who are using this opportunity to rekindle their boring schtick.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Digetydog View Post
    First of all, congrats on the baby. They are really expensive. The "tuition" for my 2 year olds daycare is 4X the cost of the tuition that I paid for law school (state U).

    If people cannot or don't want to pay for tickets b/c of other priorities, I get that. My tickets are a luxury and would be first on the chopping block if I needed to cut my budget.

    My main gripe was with people who want to give up their PSL's b/c the team is bad this year and will likely be bad for the next couple of years. Given the history of the team, I find that concept bizarre.

    The Jets aren't the Yankees with dozens of championships - the Jets are Charlie Brown trying to kick a field goal. The struggle is half the fun.
    much appreciated. thanks. yeah it's not the jets record or anything like that (though that only hurts what i can make on stubhub), it was realizing that my tailgate crew has all more or less given up on going to the full slate of games and we're better off just picking 3-4 games a year to do like the old times, full tailgate and all...

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Putting it very simply:

    I had $16,000 in 2009 and it didn't bother me to put it towards PSL's. That money is gone, I don't need it back, I never think about it at all except when one of these threads pops up once a year.

    I have been spending an average of $5,000 on season tickets each year since 2001, nothing changes for me now, same entertainment/fun budget it's always been.

    In a given season, no matter how bleak the team is playing, there will be 2 elite games in which selling my seats can pay for 30-50% of the whole year. Back in the Herm era, all those Chad Bodypart seasons, always got paid for the big games.

    The new stadium helps the average PSL owner markedly. The lousy upper deck views and all the pricey Club seats means that there are thousands fewer good/affordable seats to hit StubHub on Sunday's. Used to be that a 40 yard line LL seat and a endzone mezzanine seat cost within $20 of each other. Now one is $400 and the other $125. Used to be that an upper deck seat in the first 20 rows was an awesome location, now it's awful.

    Lastly, the PSL money isn't "gone". It comes back to you on resale if you need it. The Jets are still selling PSL's at full price. A PSL owner can sell a similar seat at a 20% discount, still is getting 80% of it back.

    SAR I
    But SAR your tickets are not average $4000 PSl tickets. Your case does not hold true for the majority of PSL owners. And if you think a guy in the back of mezz b can get 80% of his original price you are deluding yourself. You keep trying to equate an average psl holder to yourself. As you pointed out plenty of times you have some means.

  18. #118
    PSL's give you guaranteed tix to the once a decade home playoff game!!!!

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by patman View Post
    But SAR your tickets are not average $4000 PSl tickets. Your case does not hold true for the majority of PSL owners. And if you think a guy in the back of mezz b can get 80% of his original price you are deluding yourself. You keep trying to equate an average psl holder to yourself. As you pointed out plenty of times you have some means.
    If you don't plan to resell, Mezz B seats offer cover from the elements, a less drunk group of fans, and a decent view relative to the UD.

    When we start bring our daughters to games, our plan is to sell our 2 LLEZ seats on SH and buy as many seats in Mezz B's family section as we need for the games.

  20. #120
    the jets ticket office just told me via the phone they will do the best they can to accomodate my wishes of a seat transfer but nothing will be discussed until next season and actually had the balls to tell me im making a hasty a decision and everyone is upset with the teams performance.

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