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Thread: A Few Words, Thoughts, Opinions...

  1. #41
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    Six out of the past seven Jets regular season games have been a complete and utter embarrassment. The chances of the team's fortunes turning around without any significant changes to management or the roster are very slim in my opinion.

    It pains me to say that things are turning out exactly as I envisioned. Sanchez and the offense would continue their struggles, and now the team is in the undesirable position of handing the keys to an option quarterback who can't run a traditional NFL offense.

    The Jets need to clean house and it needs to start at the top. We need management that can evaluate talent properly and build a team to be successful in today's NFL (elite quarterback, pass rush), and a coach who doesn't prioritize one side of the ball, gets the most out of his players, holds them accountable, and sets a good example of professionalism.

    Rebuilds used to take a very long time, but it's not necessary in today's NFL. If we make the right moves, we can get this thing turned around by the 2014 season.

  2. #42
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    Fish, I agree with just about everything you wrote.

    That game exposed all of the fears I had with this team.

    I've always supported Sanchez, and I will continue to as long as he plays. But I do think it's almost time to pull the plug on him. He's not getting any better. The weapons around him are bad, yes. That's no excuse for the terrible accuracy though. He's just missing the throws he should hit every single time, always has.

    I was skeptical of the Sporano hire. He must be waiting to break out all of the really good wildcat stuff.

    The decision not to go after a TE this off-season is really hurting them now. Martellus Bennett is the guy I really wanted.

    Greene is a backup and not even one of the better #2's in the league IMO. Powell isn't great either. McKnight hasn't had many opportunities, so they must really not like him. I don't know what they're doing with the RBs at all. It appears they don't either.

    Still no pass rush despite using a 1st round pick on DL the past two years. They also can't stop the run. So what can they do?

    The good thing is, it doesn't take as long to rebuild as it used to. They have some very good players still IMO but they need to completely change the approach and philosophy. Ground and pound has no business in today's NFL.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by parafly View Post
    Six out of the past seven Jets regular season games have been a complete and utter embarrassment. The chances of the team's fortunes turning around without any significant changes to management or the roster are very slim in my opinion.

    It pains me to say that things are turning out exactly as I envisioned. Sanchez and the offense would continue their struggles, and now the team is in the undesirable position of handing the keys to an option quarterback who can't run a traditional NFL offense.

    The Jets need to clean house and it needs to start at the top. We need management that can evaluate talent properly and build a team to be successful in today's NFL (elite quarterback, pass rush), and a coach who doesn't prioritize one side of the ball, gets the most out of his players, holds them accountable, and sets a good example of professionalism.

    Rebuilds used to take a very long time, but it's not necessary in today's NFL. If we make the right moves, we can get this thing turned around by the 2014 season.
    Good point dating back to last season, 6 of last 7 games we have looked like a bad football team. After last season's late collapse, the coach and GM promised they would get things turned around. Hasn't happened, if anything, things are worse than ever. This is as bad as the Jets have ever looked under Rex and he's a divisive guy to begin with.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by parafly View Post
    Six out of the past seven Jets regular season games have been a complete and utter embarrassment. The chances of the team's fortunes turning around without any significant changes to management or the roster are very slim in my opinion.

    It pains me to say that things are turning out exactly as I envisioned. Sanchez and the offense would continue their struggles, and now the team is in the undesirable position of handing the keys to an option quarterback who can't run a traditional NFL offense.

    The Jets need to clean house and it needs to start at the top. We need management that can evaluate talent properly and build a team to be successful in today's NFL (elite quarterback, pass rush), and a coach who doesn't prioritize one side of the ball, gets the most out of his players, holds them accountable, and sets a good example of professionalism.

    Rebuilds used to take a very long time, but it's not necessary in today's NFL. If we make the right moves, we can get this thing turned around by the 2014 season.
    It's worse than that. The defense is terrible, and they have stopped tackling, a sure sign that the team has given up. Offense, defense and coaching are all piss-poor.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzsaw View Post
    It's worse than that. The defense is terrible, and they have stopped tackling, a sure sign that the team has given up. Offense, defense and coaching are all piss-poor.
    That's the troubling part. In the past, you could at least sense the defense would have a quick turn-around. This year, its as big of a problem as our QB & Offense.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisjets23 View Post
    That's the troubling part. In the past, you could at least sense the defense would have a quick turn-around. This year, its as big of a problem as our QB & Offense.
    I think part of the defense's problem is that they have absolutely NO faith in the offense to pull its weight. They see it in practice every single day and they know better than anybody else just how pathetic Sanchez, Greene and Co. really are.

    If your partner at work was constantly under-performing and submarining you, I imagine you'd have trouble putting forth 100% effort, too.

    The other part is that they're simply not as good as they used to be. But with a competent offense, this could still be a top 10 defense IMO. Certainly a good enough defense to win with.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzsaw View Post
    It's worse than that. The defense is terrible, and they have stopped tackling, a sure sign that the team has given up. Offense, defense and coaching are all piss-poor.
    The defense was completely pushed around and looked terrible yesterday, but I would say overall they are about average. It does seem like they have given up ... maybe a combination of losing Revis and getting fed up with carrying the offense for several years now?

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    Fish, I agree with just about everything you wrote.

    That game exposed all of the fears I had with this team.

    I've always supported Sanchez, and I will continue to as long as he plays. But I do think it's almost time to pull the plug on him. He's not getting any better. The weapons around him are bad, yes. That's no excuse for the terrible accuracy though. He's just missing the throws he should hit every single time, always has.

    I was skeptical of the Sporano hire. He must be waiting to break out all of the really good wildcat stuff.

    The decision not to go after a TE this off-season is really hurting them now. Martellus Bennett is the guy I really wanted.


    Greene is a backup and not even one of the better #2's in the league IMO. Powell isn't great either. McKnight hasn't had many opportunities, so they must really not like him. I don't know what they're doing with the RBs at all. It appears they don't either.

    Still no pass rush despite using a 1st round pick on DL the past two years. They also can't stop the run. So what can they do?

    The good thing is, it doesn't take as long to rebuild as it used to. They have some very good players still IMO but they need to completely change the approach and philosophy. Ground and pound has no business in today's NFL.
    Ditto, but the grass is only greener for him because he is being coached up and held accountable as a Giant. The TNF game against Carolina proved it.

    He had his lapse and Eli got on him and fixed it. The only difference was after he made the mistake of running his route wrong, Eli went back to him and completed the same exact play, providing positive re-enforcement.

    I mean fixing things aren't supposed to be ground breaking. Rex sends everyone out on a soul searching voyage to fix things.

  9. #49
    The NY Jets have to get back to football fundamentals. Block, tackle, catch, throw, route running. Just do the basics.

    There was nothing sound about the performance yesterday. Nothing. Just before the half, things fell apart and then after the half, it got worse

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    No, but like I just said to Boroguy, yesterday was not the team I saw play on opening day, and is not the team and QB I saw play in 2010.

    In fact, we saw the same 2010 team put up another big stinker against New England in the 45-3 game, I liken yesterday's game to that game in that both teams were coming off of losing a key player, Leonard in that Patriot game, and Revis in yesterday's game.

    I saw a team that didn't have conviction, no fight, and no heart yesterday, I believe that is not the team that started this season and even showed some of it last week against the Dolphins.

    Sure, now they embarrassed themselves yesterday, and I'd like to think they have a lot more pride than what they showed yesterday, and because I haven't yet lost hope in Ryan, I think he can get this team back on track.
    The Jets were great for the first 2 quarters in buffalo, dominant, they had a chip on their shoulders and kicked ass...then they took their foot off the pedal after awhile and have not looked good since, they can't score or tackle...knocking a player off their feet is not tackling, only Landry could pull that off.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Was away Sunday, at the Lake, but still got the game (National TV) until it was yanked off for being uncompetative.

    I started this season very optimistic, an unusual occurence for me. I am no longer so, and I admit my optimism appears to have been rather misplaced.

    I had hope Sanchez was the answer at QB. While I appreciate his weapons are not stellar, and I truly like the kid, I am no longer of the belief that Sanchez will be our answer. His play was so bad yesterday, it is almost beyond comment.

    Greene and the running game? The less said, the better.

    Rex? I've been squarely in his corner, trusting he knew what he was doing even when he wouldn't shut up and the team appeared to fall to undisciplined crap around him. My faith in him is sorely shaken. Not broken yet, but close. It will probably not survive the season.

    Sparano? Shotty II, predictable (sorry, but he is), and misusuing his talent at every turn (greene starting, Sanchez glued to the pocket, Tebow used less and worse than the 49'er Version). He's everything my Phins Fan brother said he'd be....and thats a deep and bloody insult, not a compliment.

    The Defense. Valiant and gutsy, if nothing else, but clearly a solid two-steps back from what it was a mere few years ago. And no, not just because of the loss of Revis. That hurts, no doubt, but we appear to have nothing to fill the gaps. No depth. The youth we have, almost universally, underperforming thus far.

    The Owner and GM.....well, again, I've been unusually defender'like towards them this offseason, but they have perhaps not earned it. If the GrassyKnoll'ers here turn out to be correct, and Tebow gets the starting job at some point in 2012.....well, Woody, thats going to say alot about your priorities.

    All in all, yesterday was perhaps the most embarassing loss I can recall in the 25+ years I've been watching and loving the team. An manhandling, from start to finish, in every aspect of play. We looked like a college scout team playing a Super Bowl champion. And on the biggest stage, National TV to everyone, we were yanked before the game was over due to a total lack of competativeness.

    I have no answers, no solutions, not calling for any firings, and apart from Greene I'm not even calling for any benchings. I honestly have no idea how or what could fix this team now, or going forward.

    But I may have learned my lesson about being optimistic. It seems, with this team, it is rarely truly warranted.

    I'm right there with you. The only thing I would add is as much as I love Rex, the league has changed and his style is just not likely to win these days. This is an offensive league. The league doesn't want bone jarring hits and shutouts. It wants offense, lots of it. Ground and pound is a relic. Sad really because I always loved defensive football, but I love winning Superbowls more. I think this team desperately needs a great offensive mind.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Was away Sunday, at the Lake, but still got the game (National TV) until it was yanked off for being uncompetative.

    I started this season very optimistic, an unusual occurence for me. I am no longer so, and I admit my optimism appears to have been rather misplaced.

    I had hope Sanchez was the answer at QB. While I appreciate his weapons are not stellar, and I truly like the kid, I am no longer of the belief that Sanchez will be our answer. His play was so bad yesterday, it is almost beyond comment.

    Greene and the running game? The less said, the better.

    Rex? I've been squarely in his corner, trusting he knew what he was doing even when he wouldn't shut up and the team appeared to fall to undisciplined crap around him. My faith in him is sorely shaken. Not broken yet, but close. It will probably not survive the season.

    Sparano? Shotty II, predictable (sorry, but he is), and misusuing his talent at every turn (greene starting, Sanchez glued to the pocket, Tebow used less and worse than the 49'er Version). He's everything my Phins Fan brother said he'd be....and thats a deep and bloody insult, not a compliment.

    The Defense. Valiant and gutsy, if nothing else, but clearly a solid two-steps back from what it was a mere few years ago. And no, not just because of the loss of Revis. That hurts, no doubt, but we appear to have nothing to fill the gaps. No depth. The youth we have, almost universally, underperforming thus far.

    The Owner and GM.....well, again, I've been unusually defender'like towards them this offseason, but they have perhaps not earned it. If the GrassyKnoll'ers here turn out to be correct, and Tebow gets the starting job at some point in 2012.....well, Woody, thats going to say alot about your priorities.

    All in all, yesterday was perhaps the most embarassing loss I can recall in the 25+ years I've been watching and loving the team. An manhandling, from start to finish, in every aspect of play. We looked like a college scout team playing a Super Bowl champion. And on the biggest stage, National TV to everyone, we were yanked before the game was over due to a total lack of competativeness.

    I have no answers, no solutions, not calling for any firings, and apart from Greene I'm not even calling for any benchings. I honestly have no idea how or what could fix this team now, or going forward.

    But I may have learned my lesson about being optimistic. It seems, with this team, it is rarely truly warranted.

    Most of what you say here I have to agree with.

    You try to give support and loyalty to the GM-HC regime, that brought the Jets two AFCCG's. But the state of the offense has deteriorated from neglect. The starting LB's are old and slow. And yes...Sanchez has been awful these past three weeks. A bad omen for a 4th year QB with over 60 starts.

    And for the RB's...here's the irony...

    The Jets are starving for a playmaker at the RB position. And Joe McKnight is the most explosive runner they have. Yet he is more valuable to Rex...as a future corner. So for now...the priority is for Joe to take CB 101 lessons. Instead of being integrated into the offensive game plan. Being given more snaps and playing time...at a position of need...that McKnight is already capable of playing right now. To make such a move...this when the offense is bleeding so badly...is just mind boggling.

    For me...this loss to the 49ers is as humiliating as the infamous spike game. And we all know what happened next. Jets spiraled downward for the rest of the season. Pete Carroll was fired after just that one season. And the house cleaning gave us Rich Kotite.

    I'm getting tired of the house cleaning that ends up getting the Jets nowhere.

    This franchise should be renamed...the Circle-Jerk Jets. Cause it just goes on...and on...and on. But it looks like that's where Jets are heading again. I just hope that it's done with a great deal of thought.

    Woody needs to consult with football knowledgeable people, separate from the organization. And then meet with Tanny and Rex, about the rest of this season. I expect another debacle in Houston...so this should begin soon. IMO...change should be be done slowly...and carefully. Get it done right.

    In those talks with Tanny-Rex, Woody should insist that the Jets see what they have with the younger 1st-2nd year players. No more loyalty for aging-underachieving veterans. Who will not be on the Jets next year. If you're gonna lose...then play the young talent...so that you can properly evaluate them.

    Along with Wilk...Ellis and Coples are the future of the DL. Start them. Give them the reps now. This trio needs to play together...so that they can start to reach their potential. As a dominant force on this D.

    Demario Davis...McIntyre...Mauga...Bellore, should play a lot more at LB to evaluate their future. Put Ricky Sapp on the 53 man roster. Rex has kept him around all of last year...and up until now...cause he's been intrigued by his pass rushing potential. If healthy...let's see what he can do as a rush OLB/DE. Cause Jets are sorely in need of getting more pressure on the QB. To help out a secondary without Revis.

    Hill-Kerley are keepers. But who among Gates-Schilens-Cumberland-Reuland, should be included among next year's receiving corps. Holmes...keep him or trade him? That is the question. What team will take on his bloated contract? Keller...is not a dominator. He has to step up and show a lot more then he's done...to merit a new Jets contract. Start Ducasse over Slauson...time to find out NOW about him. As a #2 pick of the draft...Jason Smith has talent. Play him anywhere needed. See if Smith is a possible long range solution at either guard or tackle. If Austin Howard continues to slip...play Smith and see how he does.

    Sanchez gets the rest of this season. If it's more of the same. If the offense isn't playing better in the 2nd half of the season. Then maybe it's best for both Jets and Sanchez to part ways. He has 10-12 years left of QB play in his career. So Jets can keep him...for one more year of evaluation with better much improved offense to operate with. Or the Jets trade Sanchez. Some team may be interested enough to take his contract...with just that one last year of guaranteed money...to see what he can do. Then they can either cut or keep Sanchez.

    No matter what Woody decides. Just hope he doesn't make drastic changes in an irrational-emotional manner. Like many around here would have him do. Cause I'm tired of the continuous Circle-Jerk Jets...wandering around in the desert...like a Lost Tribe of 40+ years.

    It will either be Tanny-Rex having this year to evaluate the young talent...and then making the necessary off season moves through the draft-FA/trade route. Then having next season to put a team on the field that make the playoffs, and can be a contender again. Or it's another whole new regime to start the process all over...again.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzsaw View Post
    Yesterday was beyond brutal, one of the worse days ever of being a Jet fan for me. Not because of the loss or the score, but because it hit me like a ton of bricks that Tannenbaum and Rex likely need to be fired, and Sanchez has to be replaced. Horrible feeling. The GM, HC and QB all suck and we won't be competitive for a couple years at best.
    Me too, especially when I was sure that this trio would get the Jets a SB victory.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post
    The NY Jets have to get back to football fundamentals. Block, tackle, catch, throw, route running. Just do the basics.

    There was nothing sound about the performance yesterday. Nothing. Just before the half, things fell apart and then after the half, it got worse
    NY JETS. FISH STORE

    Everything you need EXCEPT Block and Tackle

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    I'm right there with you. The only thing I would add is as much as I love Rex, the league has changed and his style is just not likely to win these days. This is an offensive league. The league doesn't want bone jarring hits and shutouts. It wants offense, lots of it. Ground and pound is a relic. Sad really because I always loved defensive football, but I love winning Superbowls more. I think this team desperately needs a great offensive mind.
    +1
    This is the exact reason why I think it is time to part ways with Rex. He has made adjustments, but he's proven to be stubborn on the most important issue at hand. And that is his philosophy. Elite defense and ball control game managing offense is not the recipe for winning a SB anymore. You need to be able to throw the ball and pressure the QB. Rex hasn't changed and won't. Even if we give him a new QB he won't be developed correctly. He will be told don't screw it up for the D instead of put the team on your back and go win this
    Last edited by carlito1171; 10-01-2012 at 08:27 PM.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptath2 View Post
    I too have had my faith shaken in Rex, I have feared that he was to much of a players coach like Herm Edwards and Pete Carrol, but if Rex is to amount to anything it probably won't be with the Jets. The best case for Rex is that he learns some hard lessons and does better with another team (Bellichump, Couphlin). It is my feeling that players play hard for "buddy" coaches for a while, but when the wheels fall off it is done, and the team is lost, Where we are now.

    I didn't like the Sanchez draft (trading half that years draft for a 1 year starter seemed risky to me, sue me), but when he joined the team, I hoped for him to do well, I gave him three years, and I have seen enough. I remember making the same excuses for Clemons as people make for Sanchez, He doesn't have a good line, little or no play makers at WR, but after while you don't get the job done you don't get the job done, period. Lets Face it Sanchez outside of far to few flashes of adequacy, has looked every bit as confused, and Scared as Clemons did in his last starting attempt (and even now Clemons was behind a much worse O-line).

    I don't know I am bewildered after Sundays game, I saw no leaders on offense or Defense, outside of our punter there were no highlights.

    It has brought back feelings of Kotite, and Pete Carrol after the fake spike. I hope this game was an anomaly -end of therapeutic vent.
    Great point about Kellen Clemens! I agree with pretty much all you wrote.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    +1
    This is the exact reason why I think it is time to part ways with Rex. He has made adjustments, but he's proven to be stubborn on the most important issue at hand. And that is his philosophy. Elite defense and ball control game managing offense is not the recipe for winning a SB anymore. You need to be able to throw the ball and pressure the QB. Rex hasn't changed and won't. Even if we give him a new QB he won't be developed correctly. He will be told don't screw it up for the D instead of put the team on your back and go win this
    All that you and Snell said is spot on. problem is...he's not even dele opted a good defense here. All the good young players were here from Mangini except a small few. He can't evaluate offense, can't evaluate defensive talent and I honestly now question his mental capacity.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    +1
    This is the exact reason why I think it is time to part ways with Rex. He has made adjustments, but he's proven to be stubborn on the most important issue at hand. And that is his philosophy. Elite defense and ball control game managing offense is not the recipe for winning a SB anymore. You need to be able to throw the ball and pressure the QB. Rex hasn't changed and won't. Even if we give him a new QB he won't be developed correctly. He will be told don't screw it up for the D instead of put the team on your back and go win this
    The 49ers seem to be doing pretty well with that philosophy

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    The 49ers seem to be doing pretty well with that philosophy

    Until they win the big one I will state otherwise. Unless your last name is Brees, Rodgers, Manning, or Brady, you havent won a superbowl in the last decade. Hell we even got as far as they did with the same strategy....

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    Until they win the big one I will state otherwise. Unless your last name is Brees, Rodgers, Manning, or Brady, you havent won a superbowl in the last decade. Hell we even got as far as they did with the same strategy....
    Unless your name is roethlisberger or johnson I guess. But those don't count right?

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