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Thread: SportsGeek-All 22 Tape: Kyle’s Bad Day

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    SportsGeek-All 22 Tape: Kyle’s Bad Day

    No idea who this guy is but worth a read..

    Kyle’s Bad Day

    October 2, 2012 · by SportsGeek33

    In the first piece of this two-part defensive breakdown we’ll look at the role that poor pass defense played in contributing to the New York Jets’ 34-0 defeat at the hands of San Francisco on Sunday.
    According to the Week 4 NFL team statistics, the Jets currently occupy 21st spot in overall defense – this despite coach Rex Ryan’s certainty in August that it would be a “given” for his team to finish the year with a Top 5 defense.
    Injury to key cornerback Darrelle Revis certainly hasn’t helped Ryan’s cause but nonetheless the under-achievements of the Jets defense are giving cause for serious concern in New Jersey right now.
    To begin this breakdown, let’s take a look at a play from the First Quarter (Picture 1 below). The 49ers have a 1st & 21 on their own 26-yard line, they’re out in 11 personnel and have set up in Singleback Slot Strong with Kendall Hunter (orange) in the backfield. The Jets are in their base nickel package.
    When the teams initially line up, Jets CB Kyle Wilson (red) appears to be taking responsibility for 49ers WR Mario Manningham (yellow).
    Picture 1

    Prior to the snap, however (Picture 2), QB Alex Smith motions Hunter out of the backfield. Wilson moves across, and so does ILB Bart Scott, giving Smith the impression that not only are the Jets playing man-to-man but also that he’s created a huge mismatch advantage by isolating Manningham against Scott.
    Picture 2

    But when the ball’s snapped it soon becomes obvious that the Jets have been disguising their coverage and are actually playing a Cover 2 Zone defense. But while Scott (blue) has remained aware of the fact that Wilson (red) is no longer covering a WR, Wilson appears to have lost focus. So all Hunter (orange) has to do in order to take the dumbstruck CB out of the game is to simply stand stone-cold still (Picture 3). As Wilson freezes, Scott reacts by instantly rolling into the flat so as to cover Hunter while at the same time desperately shouting to Wilson and pointing him (see inset) in the direction of Manningham (yellow) who’s now wide open.
    Picture 3

    Manningham sees what’s going on, converts his route to an out pattern, and when Smith releases the pass the former Giants wideout has a full 10-yards of separation from Wilson. Safety LaRon Landry comes across to push the receiver out of bounds and the 49ers have an easy 26-yard gain on a 1st & 21.
    Picture 4

    The true price of this error was potentially far greater than a First Down, however: Because the initial defensive movements had created the impression that the Jets were playing man-coverage, Smith would probably have believed that the apparent mismatch between Manningham and Scott was a surefire certainty. So the chances are that if Wilson had reacted to the play as a more experienced/competent CB might have done, Smith would have made the throw based on his initial read rather than the actual coverage, and consequently there would have been the opportunity for a pick.
    Sadly, the game also showcased Wilson’s rather more obvious shortcomings in man-to-man coverage, and this skills deficit combined with the poor footballing intelligence that’s illustrated by the above example only serve to underline how badly the Jets secondary is likely to miss the absent Revis. The recent signing of former Detroit Lions cornerback Aaron Berry at least gives Ryan the option of replacing Wilson for the Monday night game against Houston.
    Before leaving this play, there is one more thing that we’ll take a quick look at. Many fans have been hyper-critical of the Jets inability to put opposing QBs under pressure, and by considering how the line performed here we can begin to get some understanding of whether or not that really is a problem.
    The Jets front four is aligned so that RE Quinton Coples (red) and DT Kenrick Ellis (yellow) will be blocked one-on-one by the 49ers left tackle and guard respectively. NT Sione Pouha (orange) is shaded to the center’s left, and LE Mike DeVito (blue) is set to do battle with the left tackle (Picture 5).
    Picture 5

    When the play starts (Picture 6), the first thing to notice is that Pouha is handled by 49ers center Jon Goodwin while right guard Leonard Davis looks right to see if help is required elsewhere. This kind of blocking is almost dismissive of the threat that Pouha poses as a bull-rusher, and also serves as an indication of how his reputation has begun to decline league-wide.
    Picture 6


    http://sportsgeekguy.wordpress.com/2...kyles-bad-day/

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    Finally, by the time Smith is ready to throw the ball to Manningham (Picture 7), it’s all too clear that even though every lineman is up against single-team blocking, the Jets front four have failed to generate anything that vaguely even resembles pressure. Again, changes may have to be made before taking on the Texans next week.

    Picture 7

    Tomorrow we’ll take a look at how the Jets have come to be ranked as being the NFL’s second-worst team in run defense.

    http://sportsgeekguy.wordpress.com/2...kyles-bad-day/

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    I know manningham had a step or two on kyle a bunch of times. But, how many catches/yards did he give up in the end?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chupa View Post
    I know manningham had a step or two on kyle a bunch of times. But, how many catches/yards did he give up in the end?
    I'm sorry on this reply but you can't look that up??

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    One thing that second play shows is that Coples is already too high so he's lost the battle.

    The left tackle's arms are fully extended and has Coples "locked out". Notice Coples arms are bent at the elbow and against his body. Then notice the tackles pad level is lower than Coples...

    In this play, he shows bad form. He's in no position to bull rush or to rip an arm to get by the tackle. He's made two fatal mistakes in this play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chupa View Post
    I know manningham had a step or two on kyle a bunch of times. But, how many catches/yards did he give up in the end?
    It's called luck. A better qb would not have overthrown Manningham the way smith did a few times. If wilson was recovering and making a play on the ball that is one thing, but wilson was beat like a red headed step child on more then a few occasions. He was very very lucky to not be further exposed then he was.

    If your happy with a cb that has to get very very lucky, while not playing against an elite qb or wr, to not be torched then I guess you'd be ok with wilson's performance.

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    B-b-b-but he could start on every team

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    Quote Originally Posted by CleatMarks View Post
    One thing that second play shows is that Coples is already too high so he's lost the battle.

    The left tackle's arms are fully extended and has Coples "locked out". Notice Coples arms are bent at the elbow and against his body. Then notice the tackles pad level is lower than Coples...

    In this play, he shows bad form. He's in no position to bull rush or to rip an arm to get by the tackle. He's made two fatal mistakes in this play.
    Ellis actually looks like he is pushing his man back and starting to beat him, got him turned sideways. Coples - he just needs to learn better how to match up against NFL-level talent. I am confident he will.

    But - yeah - DeVito and Pouha just get stood up and go nowhere. A few posters have mentioned the inability of our D-front to get off blocks and make tackles. It seems to me, also, that if you get stood up like that [something I saw a lot of during the game] you are NEVER going to be able to tackle someone back toward the line of scrimmage. Instead, as we all see lots of these days, the ballcarrier hits our guy with momentum and either gets another 2-3 yards as they go down or bust through the tackle.

    Guys standing up too much - well, that's at least partly to blame on conditioning. It's a mix though - of being on the field too long, perhaps playing injured, etc.

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    That is just the perfect patter to beat Cover 2, it's not any more Wilson's fault than it is Landry's on this particular play. If this pattern is run and the pass is thrown on time and target. Cover 2 can't really stop this play unless a player does something special. In a Cover 2, Wilson is responsible for the flats, and since Hunter is there, Wilson can't just abandon that his area. The 2 Safties are responsible for the entire deep halves of the field, so this flag pattern hits the soft spot in the coverage. If it was Cover 4, ten Wilson would be 100% at fault, but in this case it's not really hi fault, just a perfect play design to beat the coverage.

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    I watched the all-22 footage from the game. Here are my general observations:

    #1 problem with our defense was poor tackling, plain and simple, especially against the run

    our pursuit on running plays was generally horrible; we were running out of position a lot; on a bit of a separate note, numerous times, Bart Scott would take on the lead blocker when he could have easily just gone after the ball carrier--I know he's supposedly asked to do that lots of times, but why bother when you have a free lane to the RB and can just hit him? Bart was probably the worst one on defense between the pursuit issues and tackling problems; we missed a lot of tackles at the defensive line level; we either just missed or didn't do a good enough job of shedding the blocker before the attempt to tackle the RBs;

    Initially, our defense looked like they had no clue on how to defend the wildcat, as if they had never seen it in practice; they weren't staying in their lanes; they seemed to make adjustments in the 2nd quarter and do better against it;

    We drop Calvin Pace into coverage way more than we should (since he's allegedly our best pass rusher)

    49ers defense is good; against our wildcat they were staying in their lanes from the beginning and just reading and reacting; they also had most of our pass plays completely covered so Mark had nowhere to throw; a lot of that is due to the 49ers only rushing 4 guys most times; even against the run they were good, very disciplined (the opposite of us); i was very impressed with their defense;

    Our offensive line was generally horrible; they could't stop four lineman and had issues run blocking most of the game; the few times they opened a hole, it closed fast or the RB missed it (if i recall, there was one run where the hole was massive and all the RB had to do was keep running straight and he would have had at least 30 yards; instead, after a few yards, he inexplicably decides to run right and hit the defender for no reason--I believe it was Greene--the pic i took of it came out blurry)

    Cumberland was our best player on offense; a couple times he was the anti-Kyle Brady and would keep running for yards after he got hit;

    I thought our secondary played pretty well against the pass generally; Cromartie played really well;

    Alex Smith deserves a hell of a lot of credit; he was throwing accurately; he was constantly audibling (run/pass or run left/right) and he was right basically every time. I would say his audible calls were the biggest reason for their success on offense aside from our tackling issues.

    I generally didn't care about special teams, but on one special teams play, Demario Davis's speed really stood out to me; never saw a LB change direction and out run a returner to a spot and tackle him like that;


    I would be interested to read what other people thought. I know some of you also watch the footage. This may sound strange, but I actually feel better after watching the footage. A lot of our issues don't seem to be coaching and are execution issues. I think the issues on defense can be corrected if the players accept the coaching. The o-line and Green's lack of vision are most concerning to me.

    EDIT: i didn't waste my time talking about Kyle Wilson since his issues were already discussed in other threads
    Last edited by escamoter2; 10-02-2012 at 09:08 PM.

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    Thanks for the detail breakdown slide by slide coach. Good to see someone capable of in depth analysis for us common fans

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    Quote Originally Posted by escamoter2 View Post
    I watched the all-22 footage from the game. Here are my general observations:

    #1 problem with our defense was poor tackling, plain and simple, especially against the run

    our pursuit on running plays was generally horrible; we were running out of position a lot; on a bit of a separate note, numerous times, Bart Scott would take on the lead blocker when he could have easily just gone after the ball carrier--I know he's supposedly asked to do that lots of times, but why bother when you have a free lane to the RB and can just hit him? Bart was probably the worst one on defense between the pursuit issues and tackling problems; we missed a lot of tackles at the defensive line level; we either just missed or didn't do a good enough job of shedding the blocker before the attempt to tackle the RBs;

    Initially, our defense looked like they had no clue on how to defend the wildcat, as if they had never seen it in practice; they weren't staying in their lanes; they seemed to make adjustments in the 2nd quarter and do better against it;

    We drop Calvin Pace into coverage way more than we should (since he's allegedly our best pass rusher)

    49ers defense is good; against our wildcat they were staying in their lanes from the beginning and just reading and reacting; they also had most of our pass plays completely covered so Mark had nowhere to throw; a lot of that is due to the 49ers only rushing 4 guys most times; even against the run they were good, very disciplined (the opposite of us); i was very impressed with their defense;

    Our offensive line was generally horrible; they could't stop four lineman and had issues run blocking most of the game; the few times they opened a hole, it closed fast or the RB missed it (if i recall, there was one run where the hole was massive and all the RB had to do was keep running straight and he would have had at least 30 yards; instead, after a few yards, he inexplicably decides to run right and hit the defender for no reason--I believe it was Greene--the pic i took of it came out blurry)

    Cumberland was our best player on offense; a couple times he was the anti-Kyle Brady and would keep running for yards after he got hit;

    I thought our secondary played pretty well against the pass generally; Cromartie played really well;

    Alex Smith deserves a hell of a lot of credit; he was throwing accurately; he was constantly audibling (run/pass or run left/right) and he was right basically every time. I would say his audible calls were the biggest reason for their success on offense aside from our tackling issues.

    I generally didn't care about special teams, but on one special teams play, Demario Davis's speed really stood out to me; never saw a LB change direction and out run a returner to a spot and tackle him like that;


    I would be interested to read what other people thought. I know some of you also watch the footage. This may sound strange, but I actually feel better after watching the footage. A lot of our issues don't seem to be coaching and are execution issues. I think the issues on defense can be corrected if the players accept the coaching. The o-line and Green's lack of vision are most concerning to me.
    Great post. I don't think Rex's game-planning is what's killing this defense, its the personnel. Huge gap in talent between ours and the niners defenses. Cromartie would start on their team, who else? Harris?

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    Quote Originally Posted by escamoter2 View Post
    I watched the all-22 footage from the game. Here are my general observations:

    #1 problem with our defense was poor tackling, plain and simple, especially against the run

    our pursuit on running plays was generally horrible; we were running out of position a lot; on a bit of a separate note, numerous times, Bart Scott would take on the lead blocker when he could have easily just gone after the ball carrier--I know he's supposedly asked to do that lots of times, but why bother when you have a free lane to the RB and can just hit him? Bart was probably the worst one on defense between the pursuit issues and tackling problems; we missed a lot of tackles at the defensive line level; we either just missed or didn't do a good enough job of shedding the blocker before the attempt to tackle the RBs;

    Initially, our defense looked like they had no clue on how to defend the wildcat, as if they had never seen it in practice; they weren't staying in their lanes; they seemed to make adjustments in the 2nd quarter and do better against it;

    We drop Calvin Pace into coverage way more than we should (since he's allegedly our best pass rusher)

    49ers defense is good; against our wildcat they were staying in their lanes from the beginning and just reading and reacting; they also had most of our pass plays completely covered so Mark had nowhere to throw; a lot of that is due to the 49ers only rushing 4 guys most times; even against the run they were good, very disciplined (the opposite of us); i was very impressed with their defense;

    Our offensive line was generally horrible; they could't stop four lineman and had issues run blocking most of the game; the few times they opened a hole, it closed fast or the RB missed it (if i recall, there was one run where the hole was massive and all the RB had to do was keep running straight and he would have had at least 30 yards; instead, after a few yards, he inexplicably decides to run right and hit the defender for no reason--I believe it was Greene--the pic i took of it came out blurry)

    Cumberland was our best player on offense; a couple times he was the anti-Kyle Brady and would keep running for yards after he got hit;

    I thought our secondary played pretty well against the pass generally; Cromartie played really well;

    Alex Smith deserves a hell of a lot of credit; he was throwing accurately; he was constantly audibling (run/pass or run left/right) and he was right basically every time. I would say his audible calls were the biggest reason for their success on offense aside from our tackling issues.

    I generally didn't care about special teams, but on one special teams play, Demario Davis's speed really stood out to me; never saw a LB change direction and out run a returner to a spot and tackle him like that;


    I would be interested to read what other people thought. I know some of you also watch the footage. This may sound strange, but I actually feel better after watching the footage. A lot of our issues don't seem to be coaching and are execution issues. I think the issues on defense can be corrected if the players accept the coaching. The o-line and Green's lack of vision are most concerning to me.
    1) Pace in coverage - Rex said a couple of weeks ago he's the best he's seen in coverage..

    2) Cumberland? As a Receiver ok, but how was his blocking?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shahataman View Post
    Great post. I don't think Rex's game-planning is what's killing this defense, its the personnel. Huge gap in talent between ours and the niners defenses. Cromartie would start on their team, who else? Harris?
    i think Bowman might have the edge on Harris. Landry might start, i dont know who their strong safety is.

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    I love how he gets toasted, but Smith over throws the ball 3x and Kyle decides to emphatically signal no catch and waggle his finger "no". What a joke.

    What even pissed me off more is after this debacle, in a post game interview he's laughing and said oh I'll pay WR after being asked about Santonio.

    He doesn't get it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by escamoter2 View Post
    I watched the all-22 footage from the game. Here are my general observations:

    #1 problem with our defense was poor tackling, plain and simple, especially against the run

    our pursuit on running plays was generally horrible; we were running out of position a lot; on a bit of a separate note, numerous times, Bart Scott would take on the lead blocker when he could have easily just gone after the ball carrier--I know he's supposedly asked to do that lots of times, but why bother when you have a free lane to the RB and can just hit him? Bart was probably the worst one on defense between the pursuit issues and tackling problems; we missed a lot of tackles at the defensive line level; we either just missed or didn't do a good enough job of shedding the blocker before the attempt to tackle the RBs;

    Initially, our defense looked like they had no clue on how to defend the wildcat, as if they had never seen it in practice; they weren't staying in their lanes; they seemed to make adjustments in the 2nd quarter and do better against it;

    We drop Calvin Pace into coverage way more than we should (since he's allegedly our best pass rusher)

    49ers defense is good; against our wildcat they were staying in their lanes from the beginning and just reading and reacting; they also had most of our pass plays completely covered so Mark had nowhere to throw; a lot of that is due to the 49ers only rushing 4 guys most times; even against the run they were good, very disciplined (the opposite of us); i was very impressed with their defense;

    Our offensive line was generally horrible; they could't stop four lineman and had issues run blocking most of the game; the few times they opened a hole, it closed fast or the RB missed it (if i recall, there was one run where the hole was massive and all the RB had to do was keep running straight and he would have had at least 30 yards; instead, after a few yards, he inexplicably decides to run right and hit the defender for no reason--I believe it was Greene--the pic i took of it came out blurry)

    Cumberland was our best player on offense; a couple times he was the anti-Kyle Brady and would keep running for yards after he got hit;

    I thought our secondary played pretty well against the pass generally; Cromartie played really well;

    Alex Smith deserves a hell of a lot of credit; he was throwing accurately; he was constantly audibling (run/pass or run left/right) and he was right basically every time. I would say his audible calls were the biggest reason for their success on offense aside from our tackling issues.

    I generally didn't care about special teams, but on one special teams play, Demario Davis's speed really stood out to me; never saw a LB change direction and out run a returner to a spot and tackle him like that;


    I would be interested to read what other people thought. I know some of you also watch the footage. This may sound strange, but I actually feel better after watching the footage. A lot of our issues don't seem to be coaching and are execution issues. I think the issues on defense can be corrected if the players accept the coaching. The o-line and Green's lack of vision are most concerning to me.

    EDIT: i didn't waste my time talking about Kyle Wilson since his issues were already discussed in other threads

    Thank you for this, Wish more people would do it for us folks who have no rewind. Sounds like Rex should show 49ers game tape and show them how its done instead of going over their own shlt tape of what not to do. Be good if this 2 day soul searching voyage was in 49ers film land. Kyle Wilson just doesn't have the awareness to play the ball and cover his defender at same time, that's why he never turns his head around cuz he'll lose the defender. He also go's right for the wide receiver he's covering and puts his hands on him on a run play, when the running back is bouncing towards him to the outside instead of going after the ball carrier. He blocks himself out of the play, it drives me nuts. I don't know if he's told to do that so the WR doesn't block someone else to let LB or S get him but I never seen Revis doing that patty cake bullshlt. He was our best tackler. I also never seen Revis finger wagging anyone EVER even though he's the only one who should. You would think someone would say something to him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by escamoter2 View Post
    I watched the all-22 footage from the game. Here are my general observations:

    #1 problem with our defense was poor tackling, plain and simple, especially against the run

    our pursuit on running plays was generally horrible; we were running out of position a lot; on a bit of a separate note, numerous times, Bart Scott would take on the lead blocker when he could have easily just gone after the ball carrier--I know he's supposedly asked to do that lots of times, but why bother when you have a free lane to the RB and can just hit him? Bart was probably the worst one on defense between the pursuit issues and tackling problems; we missed a lot of tackles at the defensive line level; we either just missed or didn't do a good enough job of shedding the blocker before the attempt to tackle the RBs;

    Initially, our defense looked like they had no clue on how to defend the wildcat, as if they had never seen it in practice; they weren't staying in their lanes; they seemed to make adjustments in the 2nd quarter and do better against it;

    We drop Calvin Pace into coverage way more than we should (since he's allegedly our best pass rusher)

    49ers defense is good; against our wildcat they were staying in their lanes from the beginning and just reading and reacting; they also had most of our pass plays completely covered so Mark had nowhere to throw; a lot of that is due to the 49ers only rushing 4 guys most times; even against the run they were good, very disciplined (the opposite of us); i was very impressed with their defense;

    Our offensive line was generally horrible; they could't stop four lineman and had issues run blocking most of the game; the few times they opened a hole, it closed fast or the RB missed it (if i recall, there was one run where the hole was massive and all the RB had to do was keep running straight and he would have had at least 30 yards; instead, after a few yards, he inexplicably decides to run right and hit the defender for no reason--I believe it was Greene--the pic i took of it came out blurry)

    Cumberland was our best player on offense; a couple times he was the anti-Kyle Brady and would keep running for yards after he got hit;

    I thought our secondary played pretty well against the pass generally; Cromartie played really well;

    Alex Smith deserves a hell of a lot of credit; he was throwing accurately; he was constantly audibling (run/pass or run left/right) and he was right basically every time. I would say his audible calls were the biggest reason for their success on offense aside from our tackling issues.

    I generally didn't care about special teams, but on one special teams play, Demario Davis's speed really stood out to me; never saw a LB change direction and out run a returner to a spot and tackle him like that;


    I would be interested to read what other people thought. I know some of you also watch the footage. This may sound strange, but I actually feel better after watching the footage. A lot of our issues don't seem to be coaching and are execution issues. I think the issues on defense can be corrected if the players accept the coaching. The o-line and Green's lack of vision are most concerning to me.

    EDIT: i didn't waste my time talking about Kyle Wilson since his issues were already discussed in other threads
    great post
    disagree about bart scott though. thought he did a great job of plugging the holes

    david harris - overrated. not just saying this after this lost but he is just slow. dont know how else to put it

    the athleticism from our safeties are pretty amazing. landry needs to play smarter and not just rely on his abilities. more than a few times, took very bad lines

    our dline is not stout. pouha is just very average. devito too
    like to see ellis and coples play some more. coples extremely raw. stands up too much

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOne View Post
    great post
    disagree about bart scott though. thought he did a great job of plugging the holes

    david harris - overrated. not just saying this after this lost but he is just slow. dont know how else to put it

    the athleticism from our safeties are pretty amazing. landry needs to play smarter and not just rely on his abilities. more than a few times, took very bad lines

    our dline is not stout. pouha is just very average. devito too
    like to see ellis and coples play some more. coples extremely raw. stands up too much
    Love David Harris, but this was by far the worst game of his career. He just played like crap. The whole defense did except for Cro really. I think this is an aberration for Harris. As for Bart, he's good at taking on blockers and pass rushing. However, like I said, why take on a blocker for no reason if you have a clear line to the ball carrier. That's a football IQ issue to me or just an IQ issue. Again, he may be doing what was instructed, but you have to adapt to what you see out there on the field. Also, if we are dropping Pace in coverage, let's blitz more with Bart.

    Totally agree on Landry. I now know what it's like to have safety like Ed Reed who can absolutely fly to the ball. He does need to fix his lines though.

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    Still can't believe that Davis didn't kill us. I think that was b.c they ran the ball at will.

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    not to state the obvious but one thing that is missing from last season and before is leonhard. he called the defensive signals and the only other guy who has them down is eric smith.

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