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Thread: An unsophisticated analysis - Sanchez's steady progress 2009 - 2011

  1. #21
    You put Kerley and Hill on the Giants, Saints or Packers and they are Pro Bowlers.

  2. #22
    Good post, although I'd say swapping out Kerley for Cotchery was a downgrade in 2011.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    You put Kerley and Hill on the Giants, Saints or Packers and they are Pro Bowlers.
    Is Hill going to all of a sudden figure out how to catch perfectly thrown balls just because someone else is throwing them?

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Manchez View Post
    Is Hill going to all of a sudden figure out how to catch perfectly thrown balls just because someone else is throwing them?
    He is not even on the list of players with most drops this season. In fact, no Jet is. He has 2 drops this year.....hardly anything to go crazy over.

    http://scores.nbcsports.msnbc.com/fb...e=NFL&rank=232

    The real question should be how many excuses are you going to make for mark Sanchez?
    Last edited by Velocityvirus; 10-10-2012 at 09:03 PM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    He is not even on the list of players with most drops this season.

    http://scores.nbcsports.msnbc.com/fb...e=NFL&rank=232

    The real question should be how many excuses are you going to make for mark Sanchez?
    Did I say that he's had the most drops of anyone this season? No. If he did it would be pretty damn bad because he's barely played yet still managed to drop more than a couple passes that were perfectly thrown including a TD.

    So explain how that is in any way making an excuse for Sanchez super genius

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Manchez View Post
    Did I say that he's had the most drops of anyone this season? No. If he did it would be pretty damn bad because he's barely played yet still managed to drop more than a couple passes that were perfectly thrown including a TD.

    So explain how that is in any way making an excuse for Sanchez super genius
    Your status says it all.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    He is not even on the list of players with most drops this season. In fact, no Jet is. He has 2 drops this year.....hardly anything to go crazy over.

    http://scores.nbcsports.msnbc.com/fb...e=NFL&rank=232

    The real question should be how many excuses are you going to make for mark Sanchez?
    Why even post that? It will be refuted immediately. Jets fans have seen their WRs drop everything all season, keeping Sanchez down. Everyone is failing around Sanchez. Always failing him.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    Your status says it all.
    So you really think the Jets have quality NFL receivers and RB's on the field right now?

  9. #29
    The Jets FO have done some very odd things over the past few seasons. Most NFL teams draft a franchise QB, then immediately start drafting weapons to put around them to help them be successful. The Jets draft "their QB" then literally sit there and ignore the pieces around him and still want him to be succesful.

    Sanchez has his issues, but to think he is solely responsible for our problems is just not being realistic about this teams offensive talent.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by hatnlvr View Post
    The Jets FO have done some very odd things over the past few seasons. Most NFL teams draft a franchise QB, then immediately start drafting weapons to put around them to help them be successful. The Jets draft "their QB" then literally sit there and ignore the pieces around him and still want him to be succesful.

    Sanchez has his issues, but to think he is solely responsible for our problems is just not being realistic about this teams offensive talent.
    That's basically the point I'm trying to make. Sanchez makes mistakes, but he is far from being the biggest problem on the Jets right now. The FO and coaching has not done Sanchez any favors during his development.

    How about at the very least bringing in a proven successful QB coach to teach the kid proper mechanics and how to read a defense correctly. Spend $60 mil on a QB but can't spend the money to coach the GD kid. You stick him with Cavanaugh who has never been successful as a QB or a coach, Rex's master plan to improve the offense is to spend more time in practice running the ball.

    Why is it in training camp other QB's are throwing 30-40 plays, but stats like 5-8 or 6-12 come out of our camp? How the F is anyone supposed to develop like this? The coaching staff here is killing whatever chance any QB on this team would succeed.
    Last edited by Manchez; 10-10-2012 at 09:34 PM.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rah_Rah19 View Post
    Sanchez is a franchise QB. I can't wait to rub it into all the SOJF's faces when he leads us to multiple SB victories.
    For what chain, McDonalds or Wendy's

  12. #32
    It's looking like Sanchez has developed some sort of decent chemistry with kerely, let's hope that can blossom into something productive.

    The fact that our running game is non existant is killing Sanchez. All the pressure is on mark to make plays. If he percivers this season which I hope he will, that is an amazing feat giving the injuries, oline play and the non existant running game

  13. #33
    I posted this elsewhere, but I think it is an interesting statistical comparison. While I do not believe that Sanchez will ever be a "franchise" QB, I continue to be vexed by just how similar Sanchez's numbers are to Eli's at this point of his career.

    QB games att/comp % yards td int fumbles
    Eli Manning 57 987/1805 54.68 11,385 77 64 25
    Mark Sanchez 52 859/1573 54.61 10,525 61 57 20

    The avg/game is eerily identical

    QB att/comp yards td int fumbles
    Eli Manning 17.3/31.7 199.7 1.4 1.1 .4
    Mark Sanchez 16.5/30.2 202.4 1.2 1.1 .4

    I'm not saying Sanchez can be Eli Manning, but he has proven to be clutch, and has had success in the playoffs. Sanchez is not a franchise QB who can win with little talent around him i.e Peyton Manning. But, I'm struck by imagining what things would look like if the QB's switched locker rooms for a few weeks. Would Eli have success with the current Jets. How would Sanchez do with an established OC and a deep talented corps of WR/RBs?

    I really don't know the answers to these questions, and continue to believe that Sanchez's ceiling is just to be an above average NFL QB (and IMO every team should be on the constant search for a true franchise QB), but the stat comparison with Eli in conjunction with the thought as to how they would do if they switched teams I think is food for thought.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by SONNY WERBLIN View Post
    I posted this elsewhere, but I think it is an interesting statistical comparison. While I do not believe that Sanchez will ever be a "franchise" QB, I continue to be vexed by just how similar Sanchez's numbers are to Eli's at this point of his career.

    QB games att/comp % yards td int fumbles
    Eli Manning 57 987/1805 54.68 11,385 77 64 25
    Mark Sanchez 52 859/1573 54.61 10,525 61 57 20

    The avg/game is eerily identical

    QB att/comp yards td int fumbles
    Eli Manning 17.3/31.7 199.7 1.4 1.1 .4
    Mark Sanchez 16.5/30.2 202.4 1.2 1.1 .4

    I'm not saying Sanchez can be Eli Manning, but he has proven to be clutch, and has had success in the playoffs. Sanchez is not a franchise QB who can win with little talent around him i.e Peyton Manning. But, I'm struck by imagining what things would look like if the QB's switched locker rooms for a few weeks. Would Eli have success with the current Jets. How would Sanchez do with an established OC and a deep talented corps of WR/RBs?

    I really don't know the answers to these questions, and continue to believe that Sanchez's ceiling is just to be an above average NFL QB (and IMO every team should be on the constant search for a true franchise QB), but the stat comparison with Eli in conjunction with the thought as to how they would do if they switched teams I think is food for thought.
    The problem is that most QBs with that kind of start do not succeed. Eli Manning is an anomaly.

  15. #35
    The thing I would love to see on tape is how often the ball is "on" the WR and he doesnt fight for position or for the ball resulting in a breakup or drop.

    Watching both Cruz and Nicks, it is SO apparent how aggressive they are when the ball is closing in on them. Part of it is nicks' size, but both him and cruz literally attack the ball so that the DB cant close and knock it away.

    Our guys (and a huge part is inexperience) let the ball come to them, which gives the DBs an extra split second to knock it away.

    I am not sold on sanchez at all, especiall after his fumbles the last 2 weeks (hilliard saved him on it vs Houston) and end of half turnovers, but....Sanchez is currently 77 of 159 and would need approx 95 completions to be a 60% passer. That is 18 in 5 games - ask yourselves how many balls have been outright dropped or that were "catchable" but werent completions for whatever reason. There are easily 10-12 plays that arent his fault whatsoever.

    He isnt playing well, but its not all on him.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    You put Kerley and Hill on the Giants, Saints or Packers and they are Pro Bowlers.
    No they are not.

  17. #37
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    Yes, the completion % is way down. The Sanchez haters can blame him all they want. However, when I watch a guy (who by all accounts works hard and studies hard) throwing the ball to a spot where his receiver is supposed to be, it's hard to put the blame on him instead of someone like Clyde Gates or Jason Hill (or Santonio dogging a route). Those misses make him look bad, which only makes his misthrows seem worse. I don't think we'd be complaining about the occasional overthrow if his WRs were there to actually catch the ball when they are supposed to be in a spot. I can think of at least four balls in the Texans game that were that way. It's sad, the dearth of talent we have at WR and RB.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Batmans A Scientist View Post
    The problem is that most QBs with that kind of start do not succeed. Eli Manning is an anomaly.
    http://pfref.com/tiny/jAG30

    My point in more detail

    2000 to 2012,
    QBs in their 1st to 4th season (combined),
    age 28 or younger,

    Pass Completion between 50% and 57%
    more than 1000 Pass attempts

    Aaron Brooks
    Alex Smith
    Kyle Boller
    Eli Manning
    Joey Harrington
    Mark Sanchez
    Derek Anderson

    Alex Smith has developed into a serviceable QB after 7 seasons, Eli Manning has developed into a star, but the other QBs didn't. The more likely path is Harrington or Boller and not Eli Manning.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Batmans A Scientist View Post
    The problem is that most QBs with that kind of start do not succeed. Eli Manning is an anomaly.
    Add to the anomaly of Eli Manning: Alex Smith, John Elway, Steve Young, Drew Brees, Jim Kelley, Phil Simms, and many other QB's who didn't exactly light it up or carry their teams on their backs in their 1st 3-4 years in the league. There are 3 HOF QB's and a 1st ballot HOF QB just right there that would have never done jack s h i t if no one gave them more than 3-4 years to develop. They all also had more college experience and better offensive coaching than Sanchez as well.

    Look he may not ever develop into a great QB, but giving up on him with the personnel and coaching he's had so far is not a smart move, especially when you consider that he's getting paid this year and next no matter what...

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Velocityvirus View Post
    He is not even on the list of players with most drops this season. In fact, no Jet is. He has 2 drops this year.....hardly anything to go crazy over.

    http://scores.nbcsports.msnbc.com/fb...e=NFL&rank=232

    The real question should be how many excuses are you going to make for mark Sanchez?
    You do know he hasnt played every game right?

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