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Thread: It's Easier to Get Welfare Than to Work

  1. #1
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    It's Easier to Get Welfare Than to Work

    I know there are a lot of you that dismiss Stossel because you just don't like him. I thought this was a good article and an even better segment on last week's show since he had the bureaucrat in charge of NYC training centers on for counter point. I find her experience appalling.



    It's Easier to Get Welfare Than to Work

    John Stossel|Oct. 3, 2012 12:00 pm
    There are no jobs!" That is what people told me outside a government "jobs center" in New York City.

    To check this out, I sent four researchers around the area. They quickly found 40 job openings. Twenty-four were entry-level positions. One restaurant owner told me he would hire 12 people if workers would just apply.

    It made me wonder what my government does in buildings called "job centers." So I asked a college intern, Zoelle Mallenbaum, to find out. Here's what she found:

    "First I went to the Manhattan Jobs Center and asked, "Can I get help finding a job?" They told me they don't do that. 'We sign people up for food stamps.' I tried another jobs center. They told me to enroll for unemployment benefits."

    So the "jobs" centers help people get handouts. Neither center suggested people try the 40 job openings in the neighborhood.
    My intern persisted:

    "I explained that I didn't want handouts; I wanted a job. I was told to go to 'WorkForce1,' a New York City program. At WorkForce1, the receptionist told me that she couldn't help me since I didn't have a college degree. She directed me to another center in Harlem. In Harlem, I was told that before I could get help, I had to come back for an 8:30 a.m. 'training session.'"

    Our government helps you apply for handouts immediately, but forces you through a maze if you want to work.

    "WorkForce1's website says to arrive 30 minutes early, so I did," Zoelle said. "A security guard told me the building was closed. At 9:15, Workforce1 directed 30 of us into a room where we were told that WorkForce1 directs candidates to jobs and provides a resource room with 'free' phone, fax and job listings and helps people apply for unemployment insurance and disability handouts. This seemed like the only part of the presentation when people took notes.

    "One lady told me that she comes to WorkForce1 because it helps her collect unemployment. One asked another, 'What do you want to do?' The second laughed, 'I want to collect!' One told me, 'I've been coming here 17 months; this place is a waste of time.'

    "Finally, I met with an 'adviser.' She told me I lacked experience. I know this. I asked for any job she thought I was qualified for, and she scheduled an interview at Pret, a food chain that trains employees. At Pret, I learned that my 'interview' was just a weekly open house, publicized on the company's website. Anyone could walk in and apply. Workforce1 offered no advantage. Despite my 'scheduled interview,' I waited 90 minutes before meeting a manager. He told me that WorkForce1 had 'wasted my time, as they always do.' He said, 'They never call, never ask questions.' He prefers to hire people who seek out jobs on their own, like those who see Pret ads on Craigslist.'"

    My intern learned a lot from this experience. Here are her conclusions:

    • It's easier to get welfare than to work.
    • The government would rather sign me up for welfare than help me find work.
    • America has taxpayer-funded bureaucracies that encourage people to be dependent. They incentivize people to take "free stuff," not to take initiative.
    • It was easier to find job openings on my own. The private market for jobs works better than government "job centers."

    Yet now New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg wants to expand Workforce1, claiming that it helps people "find real opportunities." I bet he never sends people in to find out whether they really do.

    Once politicians figured out that welfare creates dependency and hurts poor people, they (logically) assumed that employment services and job training would help. Job training does help—when employers do it. But government does everything badly.

    GeorgiaWork$, a state program in that state, provided such poor training that only 14 percent of trainees were hired.

    The Comprehensive Employment Training Act (CETA) operated more like a commercial for government handouts. It launched door-to-door food stamp recruiting campaigns, and gave people free rides to welfare offices.

    America now has 47 federal jobs programs. They fail. Yet politicians want more. They always want more.

  2. #2
    Stossel is my favorite investigative journalist bar none. His analysis here of "government jobs programs" is spot on. His stuff on school choice and teacher evaluations is also right on the money.

  3. #3


    What a load!!!! No mention about the corporate WELFARE which is worse than the paltry handouts to the people!!!!!!!!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post
    No mention about the corporate WELFARE which is worse than the paltry handouts to the people!!!!!!!!
    Those paltry handouts have sentenced generation after generation of the same family to a grim existance in public housing with no hope, ambition or incentive to change. Virtual subhumans on the fringe of society.

    And the libs love it just like that.

    Yeah, corporate welfare is much worse.



  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post


    What a load!!!! No mention about the corporate WELFARE which is worse than the paltry handouts to the people!!!!!!!!
    What is this corporate welfare you speak of? Are we talking about the 500 Million Solyndra got or the 1.2 Billion for Solar Fun? Both are now bankrupt by the way. Is it the subsidy Obama created for wind power turbines. The turbines are now made in China by the way. GE shifted all production of their wind turbines to China two years ago. I guess no one thought of making the subsidy contingent on the item having been made in the USA. Whoops. Or is there some other corporate welfare you were referring to?

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    To check this out, I sent four researchers around the area. They quickly found 40 job openings. Twenty-four were entry-level positions. One restaurant owner told me he would hire 12 people if workers would just apply.

    WOW!!!

    40 job openings.



    The USA has a population of 310+ million people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefst2000 View Post
    What is this corporate welfare you speak of? Are we talking about the 500 Million Solyndra got or the 1.2 Billion for Solar Fun? Both are now bankrupt by the way. Is it the subsidy Obama created for wind power turbines. The turbines are now made in China by the way. GE shifted all production of their wind turbines to China two years ago. I guess no one thought of making the subsidy contingent on the item having been made in the USA. Whoops. Or is there some other corporate welfare you were referring to?
    No, i think he means the $10 bullion is tax breaks the oil industry gets. Or he could mean the 8 military bases in Kuwait or perhaps that the Fifth fleet is based in Bahrain.

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    I must have missed how these ideas are mutually exclusive. The article isn't complaining about people on welfare or that welfare exists. It is commentary on the fact the government agencies that in name and mission pretend they are there to help people find work but instead are just pushing people to welfare and food stamps. Can you not understand something so simple as that without making it about your partisan talking points?

    As for the moronic comments on "40 jobs", how about you look at the context of the comment? They are pointing out that a simple walk around the area "they quickly found 40 job openings. Twenty-four were entry-level positions. One restaurant owner told me he would hire 12 people if workers would just apply." Do you get that they didn't say we searched the entire country and only found 40 jobs? There is a difference.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trades View Post
    I must have missed how these ideas are mutually exclusive. The article isn't complaining about people on welfare or that welfare exists. It is commentary on the fact the government agencies that in name and mission pretend they are there to help people find work but instead are just pushing people to welfare and food stamps. Can you not understand something so simple as that without making it about your partisan talking points?

    As for the moronic comments on "40 jobs", how about you look at the context of the comment? They are pointing out that a simple walk around the area "they quickly found 40 job openings. Twenty-four were entry-level positions. One restaurant owner told me he would hire 12 people if workers would just apply." Do you get that they didn't say we searched the entire country and only found 40 jobs? There is a difference.

    Please.

    What jobs?
    A job center in what Neighborhood
    Were there signs out advertising these jobs?
    Is that still done?
    How was all of this job opening stuff done so quickly?
    Talking to a restaurant owner must have consumed time
    Why not post the restaurant name?
    They need 12 workers, ASAP

    Very squishy hard to verify "facts".

    Trades, I believe you wrote that you conducted interviews in the past?
    Please tell us how many resumes were sent in for that one position.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    WOW!!!

    40 job openings.



    The USA has a population of 310+ million people.

    YOU are apparently an example of why some people can not get jobs. Lack of a quality education. In YOUR case, reading comprehension.
    The quote was "around the area" which MEANS a very localized area. There are 10 times that many openings in my area - Charleston SC - which is a small market. In other words he is saying MY LOCALE.
    And of 310mill how many are children, retired etc. YOU are out of touch with reality.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Please.

    What jobs?
    A job center in what Neighborhood
    Were there signs out advertising these jobs?
    Is that still done?
    How was all of this job opening stuff done so quickly?
    Talking to a restaurant owner must have consumed time
    Why not post the restaurant name?
    They need 12 workers, ASAP

    Very squishy hard to verify "facts".
    In the show she gives some more details but she does talk about which job centers, Manhattan and Harlem.

    Also the 4 researchers were sent out in the area of the studio. It is implied. Sorry it wasn't spelled out for you. Yes people still use help wanted signs. I see them in my town all the time. I assume the talked to businesses owners and managers and saw signs. They were researchers, maybe they used Craigslist and/or the newspaper as well. Sorry you find this so hard to believe that there are 40 low level jobs available in Manhattan.

    As for "How was all of this job opening stuff done so quickly?". LOL are you serious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Trades, I believe you wrote that you conducted interviews in the past?
    Please tell us how many resumes were sent in for that one position.
    Yes I have done many interviews. Typically we get about 10 resumes per posting but those are filtered through an agency so we don't see the riff raff that don't come close to our requirements so I am not a good gauge as to the number of applicants per job. Also my area of expertise is IT and we are still at a pretty low unemployment rate. I have heard in the 4% area for this geographical area in IT so it is still a great field to be in. Personally we have hired 4 new people in the last year and they were all very good paying jobs.

    I am sure the great majors of Women\Childrens\Minorities Studies and psychology probably have a lot more applicants for the few positions that are available. There has to be some personal responsibility for finding a job, no? That should include doing your research (searching the web, papers, pounding the streets, networking, job centers), education (choosing a viable field) and attitude (wanting a job, interviewing well, dressing appropriately, presentation such as not covering yourself in tattoos and those ear hole things if you want a corporate job).

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    No, i think he means the $10 bullion is tax breaks the oil industry gets. Or he could mean the 8 military bases in Kuwait or perhaps that the Fifth fleet is based in Bahrain.
    Please watch the following as it perfectly demonstrates your qualifications to discuss where American bases should be located:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_daP1...eature=related

    As far as the 10billion oil subsidy number you just stated the actual number is 2.8 billion. A drop in the bucket compared to the tens of billions wasted on now bankrupt green energy companies. Regardless Romney has already stated that the oil industry subsidy is a goner as part of his corporate tax reform plan.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    No, i think he means the $10 bullion is tax breaks the oil industry gets. Or he could mean the 8 military bases in Kuwait or perhaps that the Fifth fleet is based in Bahrain.
    Breaks the Oil Industry alone gets, or breaks all businesses and industries get?

    Is a tax break the same as a direct subsidy, for example, the billions spent on Green Energy/Green Jobs Companies, amnay of whom have now failed?

    It's an interesting question.....is allowing someone or some thing to keep more of the money IT made the same "welfare" as the Government cutting a check to someone who did not earn it, after taking it away from those who did? Is that equivalent forms of "welfare"?

    OH, and as for the fifth fleet.....isn't the President the Commander in Chief? With a penstroke, he can remove the fifth fleet and place it wherever he wishes. So is it Obama's fault the fifth fleet is where it is then?

  14. #14

    Top 20 defense contractors

    Defense contractors are facing a market that on the macro level is contracting. The budget-cutting knives are out for military spending, and no contractor is immune. In fact, the biggest names in the market – Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics and Raytheon – have all gone through rounds of layoffs, buyouts and other moves to reduce costs and streamline operations.

    But even in a market that overall might be shrinking there are bright spots.
    First, there is the sheer size of the market. The contractors on the 2011 Washington Technology Top 100 did $84.6 billion in prime defense contracts during fiscal 2010. The annual rankings analyze government procurement data in areas of information technology, systems integration, engineering services and professional services.

    Even a reduction of 10 percent would still leave one of the largest markets in the world.

    A second bright spot is the fact that there are pockets of growth within the defense market. And here is where you see many of the top players investing resources. These areas include cybersecurity, command and control systems, health IT, cloud computing and intelligence systems.

    The rush toward these markets is driving many companies to make acquisitions to bolster their portfolios and you see the shedding of business units that are in less attractive segments of the market.

    Below is a list of the top 20 defense contractors, derived from the 2011 Washington Technology Top 100 list, based on their 2010 defense contract revenue.

    Rank Top Defense Companies
    (follow links for complete company profiles)
    Defense Revenue
    (2010)
    1 Lockheed Martin Corp.
    $10,888,633,000
    2 Northrop Grumman Corp.
    $8,212,891,000
    3 Boeing Co.
    $5,051,984,000
    4 General Dynamics Corp.
    $4,576,415,00
    5 Raytheon Co.
    $4,095,309
    6 KBR Inc
    $3,546,554,000
    7 L-3 Communications Corp.
    $3,332,433,000
    8 Science Applications International Corp.
    $3,280,980,000
    9 DynCorp International Inc.
    $2,398,874,000
    10 Hewlett-Packard Co.
    $2,344,325,000
    11 Booz Allen Hamilton
    $2,344,325,000
    12 CACI International Inc.
    $2,059,613,000
    13 Harris Corp.
    $1,993,623,000
    14 Computer Sciences Corp.
    $1,828,670,000
    15 ITT Corp.
    $1,808,674,000
    16 Fluor Corp.
    $1,742,216,000
    17 BAE Systems Inc.
    $1,381,184,000
    18 Dell Inc.
    $1,263,236,000
    18 ManTech International Corp.
    $1,167,928,000
    20 United Technologies Corp.
    $1,121,492,000
    http://defensesystems.com/articles/2...ntractors.aspx

    800 Military bases around the world. For what? Protect Europe from the Russians? Wars in the MENA to protect the OIL gopoly?

    Corporate WELFARE is much more an abuse to the American taxpayers

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post
    http://defensesystems.com/articles/2...ntractors.aspx

    800 Military bases around the world. For what? Protect Europe from the Russians? Wars in the MENA to protect the OIL gopoly?

    Corporate WELFARE is much more an abuse to the American taxpayers
    The "Whisper" is getting louder.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post
    http://defensesystems.com/articles/2...ntractors.aspx

    800 Military bases around the world. For what? Protect Europe from the Russians? Wars in the MENA to protect the OIL gopoly?

    Corporate WELFARE is much more an abuse to the American taxpayers
    So then why would you be for Obama instead of Ron Paul? Paul is the only one that firmly stated he would cut defense and subsidies.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Trades View Post
    So then why would you be for Obama instead of Ron Paul? Paul is the only one that firmly stated he would cut defense and subsidies.
    How many times do I have to state that I am for Ron Paul? I have been for Dr. Paul since 2007

    He had the process changed on his candidacy by the r's many times this year so he could not get out of the primary.

    Romney is not a choice. Obama is a known factor at this point.

    The corporate WELFARE for the MIC is outrageous and needs to be trimmed. All of that spending is not for DEFENSE. Moreover, some of that DEFENSE spending is not for the DEFENSE of America.

  18. #18
    The problem is they would have to WORK, they would rather sit on asses and collect a check! It is easy to be a slug!

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by MnJetFan View Post
    The problem is they would have to WORK, they would rather sit on asses and collect a check! It is easy to be a slug!

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