Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 37 of 37

Thread: It's the offense... We need to join the 21st Century

  1. #21
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Staten Island
    Posts
    8,695
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    How can we run a George Jetson offense with Barney Rubble at QB.
    Neither witty nor funny.

    Sanchez has talents as well as faults. As with all players, it is in the best interest of everyone involved that you play to the former and do your best to eliminate or hide the latter. For whatever reason, Rex and the coaching staff do not do this with Sanchez. Why is anybody's guess.

    Maybe we'll find out when Rex and Sanchez are both gone. Make no mistake, Rex will not be successful with this approach, nor will Sanchez. And I say that as someone who was a HUGE Rex supporter.

  2. #22
    Practice Squad
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    398
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetworks View Post
    Rex and his merry band of yes-men are more concerned with imposing their brand of outdated football on this team instead of playing to their personnel's strengths. I know it may pain you and others to admit it, but Sanchez is not without talent and actually excels in certain situations. But this coaching staff is enamored with forcing the issue in an attempt to utilize an offensive philosophy from a bygone era.

    Dump Cavanaugh. Tell Sparano to use a more uptempo pace to the offense and let Sanchez rollout and use play action. Otherwise, trade him and fire Rex as neither will be successful without doing the above.
    Which is? They can't run true, but they have perhaps the worst starting QB in the entire NFL. Are they supposed to air it out with their QB who has the worst completion percentage in the league, and who can't protect the football to save his life?

    What are Rex and Sparano supposed to do? Blame Tannenbaum for the crappy personnel.

    but Sanchez is not without talent

    So is Jamarcus Russell. It's his 4th year. his 'talent' is irrelevant in this point in his career. It's time to see results and production.

    actually excels in certain situations
    When? You mean when he has a top class offensive line, an excellent receiving corps, a dominant running game, and one of the best defenses in the league to keep the team in games?

    And he sure as hell didn't excel in 09 and 2010 even with a great supporting cast around him.

    Fact is even when the situation is perfect (i.e. he has time in the pocket and an open receiver down the field) there's still a good chance he'll screw it up as Sanchez will either not see an open guy or will just fling it 5 feet over his head.

    He missed Holmes for a wide open TD in Pitt this year, threw a duck to Cromartie against the Texans which should have been a TD if he actually led him, and was late finding Hill who had a step on his man against the Pats.

    3 plays in 3 losses this year where he had a clean pocket and open receiver and just misses his guy entirely leaving points on the board. Those plays fall entirely on him he makes those throws and Jets have a legit shot at winning those games.

    Sanchez sure as hell isn't the only problem on the team but he is a putrid QB. His surrounding cast isn't great obviously, but its getting to the point where calling Sanchez mediocre is wildly, wildly, overrating him.

    For all the Rex hate going on the board, it would be nice to see what he could do if he had even an average QB on offense sometime during his tenure here.

  3. #23
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Staten Island
    Posts
    8,695
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by w0mbat View Post
    Which is? They can't run true, but they have perhaps the worst starting QB in the entire NFL. Are they supposed to air it out with their QB who has the worst completion percentage in the league, and who can't protect the football to save his life?
    He has shown a skill for throwing on the run, especially outside the tackles. That also alleviates the problem of contending with the continuous pressure faced by the underperforming OGs in the A gap and the mediocre (at best) blitz pickups by the RB/TEs, to say nothing of the reads by the inexperienced WRs.

    He is also good at play fakes, but since they don't run the ball consistently well as you said, that becomes less effective.

    What are Rex and Sparano supposed to do? Blame Tannenbaum for the crappy personnel.
    That, plus hold some people beneath them accountable. Start with the person responsible for the development of the QB, Cavanaugh. Next, turn to the conditioning personnel that allow players like Mangold to roll out onto the field woefully out of shape (I LOVE Mangold, fwiw). Then tell the QB to put on his big-boy pants and get in someone's face. That would be a start.

    So is Jamarcus Russell. It's his 4th year. his 'talent' is irrelevant in this point in his career. It's time to see results and production.
    Agreed. Kind of hard to do if you don't put him in a position to succeed. Despite stats thrown around to the contrary, there are QBs that are rhythm players. I think most would agree that Sanchez is one of them, so the decision to use the entire play clock to get a play off, to bring in Wildcat plays, to turn over personnel like it's some kind of Madden game and to expect good results is foolish.

    When? You mean when he has a top class offensive line, an excellent receiving corps, a dominant running game, and one of the best defenses in the league to keep the team in games?

    And he sure as hell didn't excel in 09 and 2010 even with a great supporting cast around him.
    And I would argue that if that personnel had remained even remotely static you'd see a markedly better player in Sanchez. The OL is basically the same, yet has underperformed the last two years. The receiving corps, by your argument, is less than excellent now, the running game is middling to poor and the defense is a shell of itself.

    Hard to say whether things would improve, get worse or remain static if what I outlined above isn't the case last year and this. Guess we can never know for sure.

    Fact is even when the situation is perfect (i.e. he has time in the pocket and an open receiver down the field) there's still a good chance he'll screw it up as Sanchez will either not see an open guy or will just fling it 5 feet over his head.
    I agree that he isn't perfect, but he has shown the ability to make things happen when given the chance, which has not been the case the last two years. He has no consistency at WR and was sabotaged by the FO with Hunter. Not to sound off with all the psychobabble, but guys like O'Brien were ruined by dolts like Cadigan, so we could be seeing the same thing here.

    He missed Holmes for a wide open TD in Pitt this year, threw a duck to Cromartie against the Texans which should have been a TD if he actually led him, and was late finding Hill who had a step on his man against the Pats.
    I don't remember the Holmes one, so I'll take your word for it. The Cromartie throw had too much air under it, but let's keep in mind it was to a CB playing WR with whom he likely doesn't get a whole lot of reps with. Still, a miss is a miss. The Hill throw was awful. So was the drop he had later in the game, so it can be said it cuts both ways, no?

    3 plays in 3 losses this year where he had a clean pocket and open receiver and just misses his guy entirely leaving points on the board. Those plays fall entirely on him he makes those throws and Jets have a legit shot at winning those games.
    Again, I don't remember the Holmes play. I'm pretty sure one of the other plays was not a clean pocket, I'm thinking the Cro one. And again, if Hill makes that catch later in the game, the Jets have a legit shot of winning that game.

    Sanchez sure as hell isn't the only problem on the team but he is a putrid QB. His surrounding cast isn't great obviously, but its getting to the point where calling Sanchez mediocre is wildly, wildly, overrating him.
    I think putrid is too strong. He can certainly be an above-average QB, but will never be one on the Jets, at least not while Rex is here.

    For all the Rex hate going on the board, it would be nice to see what he could do if he had even an average QB on offense sometime during his tenure here.
    For that, you don't need a talented QB, just one that can do what you want, stand in the pocket and make a few first downs. The Jets don't have a pocket, nor do they have a pocket passing, game manager QB.

  4. #24
    All League
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    3,482
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    The only way I would agree with firing Rex is if he refuses to bench Sanchez. That would show he doesn't want to win.

    Sanchez does need to go. That's been obvious for a long time now.
    Idk Maine, they kinda all suck. In fact I think if it's possible, Tebow might be worse the Sanchez... yea kinda hard to imagine, but I feel like that's the case. I am not 100% ready to jettison Rex yet (even if he keeps Sanchez in), but I held out hope for Sanchez... so wtf do i know

  5. #25
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    10,671
    Post Thanks / Like
    21st Century?

    I fear that by the time the Jets join the 21st Century, it will be the 22nd.

  6. #26
    All League
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    3,244
    Post Thanks / Like
    In the land of could've beens:

    Pennington never gets hurt.

  7. #27
    Rookie
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Section 244
    Posts
    754
    Post Thanks / Like
    Its a passing league.

    Get in a offensive inclined head coach with a playbook that prefers a strong aerial attack and acquire a QB (most likely through the draft) that can compently run the offense.


    That's all I want.

  8. #28
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    6,282
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by copernicus View Post
    Rex and the FO do not care about the offense
    Hmmmm Cop I hope you are well and feeling a little better now that the statements about the team are being born out.....
    Last edited by Charlie Brown; 10-28-2012 at 08:42 PM.

  9. #29
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Upper East Side
    Posts
    6,757
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Rexamillion5592 View Post
    Its a passing league.

    Get in a offensive inclined head coach with a playbook that prefers a strong aerial attack and acquire a QB (most likely through the draft) that can compently run the offense.


    That's all I want.
    Exactly. I don't even know what it's like to have a great passing offense.

    I watch other teams who fling the ball around and score 30 points a game and I just don't understand why the Jets are NEVER able to do that. I know landing a stud QB in the draft is hard, but we have to keep trying, and we have to stop hiring defensive coaches (Parcells, Groh, Herm, Mangini, Rex... Give me a guy who friggin' knows how to develop a QB... It's not a coincidence we haven't had a real franchise QB in 40 years.)

    Pennington failed. Try again. Sanchez failed. Time to try again, and time to hire a HC who will give the guy a chance.

  10. #30
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,293
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Austin View Post
    Exactly. I don't even know what it's like to have a great passing offense.

    I watch other teams who fling the ball around and score 30 points a game and I just don't understand why the Jets are NEVER able to do that. I know landing a stud QB in the draft is hard, but we have to keep trying, and we have to stop hiring defensive coaches (Parcells, Groh, Herm, Mangini, Rex... Give me a guy who friggin' knows how to develop a QB... It's not a coincidence we haven't had a real franchise QB in 40 years.)

    Pennington failed. Try again. Sanchez failed. Time to try again, and time to hire a HC who will give the guy a chance.

    I agree, and that is why my choice is Brian Schottenheimer. How can u develop a QB if when he makes mistakes you constantly retard his development by shutting down .Wanna know why Eli is as good as he is.

    Go ahead and ask me.

  11. #31
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Upper East Side
    Posts
    6,757
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    I agree, and that is why my choice is Brian Schottenheimer. How can u develop a QB if when he makes mistakes you constantly retard his development by shutting down .Wanna know why Eli is as good as he is.

    Go ahead and ask me.
    What?

    I want a coach with a track record of developing QBs.

    Schottenheimer's track record is one of a guy who has failed repeatedly to develop QBs.

  12. #32
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,293
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Austin View Post
    What?

    I want a coach with a track record of developing QBs.

    Schottenheimer's track record is one of a guy who has failed repeatedly to develop QBs.
    Who has he failed to develop.

    Brees
    Pennington
    Favre
    Clemens
    Sanchez

    Who did he not develop.

    By the way, don't u wanna know why Eli is as good as he is?

  13. #33
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Upper East Side
    Posts
    6,757
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    Who has he failed to develop.

    Brees
    Pennington
    Favre
    Clemens
    Sanchez

    Who did he not develop.

    By the way, don't u wanna know why Eli is as good as he is?
    He didn't develop Brees. Brees was run out of town and didn't become elite until he got together with Sean Payton.

    Pennington was better under Hackett and Sparano than he was under Schotty. He had the best year of his career the year after he left Schotty.

    Favre had an MVP caliber year after he left Schotty, and clearly Schotty didn't develop s--t as Favre won 3 MVPs before he met the guy.

    Clearly Schotty didn't develop Sanchez or Clemens as they both were/are awful.

    Eli is great because he was a super-talented elite QB prospect who was drafted 1st overall and panned out like everyone thought he would. He was lucky to go to a good organization that drafted well and put him in a position to become the elite QB he is today.

    I don't know if you're just trolling but what you're saying makes no sense.

  14. #34
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    5,039
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    The only way I would agree with firing Rex is if he refuses to bench Sanchez. That would show he doesn't want to win.

    Sanchez does need to go. That's been obvious for a long time now.
    Wow---you ignore all of Rex's other shortcomings and concentrate on his refusal to bench Sanchez. I would fire his sorry arse for being a defensive coordinator who is playing head coach. Unless you give Rex top notch defensive pro-bowlers--he is very average---as a defensive coordinators.

  15. #35
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Posts
    7,078
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    I agree, and that is why my choice is Brian Schottenheimer. How can u develop a QB if when he makes mistakes you constantly retard his development by shutting down .Wanna know why Eli is as good as he is.

    Go ahead and ask me.
    Wait, you want Shotty hired as the HC?

    What has he ever done to deserve that job? What has he ever done to deserve an OC job?

    He has never developed a QB... in fact, QBs improve after he leaves. His track record is terrible.

  16. #36
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    10,671
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by PMarsico9 View Post
    In the land of could've beens:

    Pennington never gets hurt.
    Or Vinny's Achilles didn't explode in '99.

    That's all we're reduced to : A Lifetime of What-if scenarios.

  17. #37
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    6,293
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Austin View Post
    He didn't develop Brees. Brees was run out of town and didn't become elite until he got together with Sean Payton.

    Pennington was better under Hackett and Sparano than he was under Schotty. He had the best year of his career the year after he left Schotty.

    Favre had an MVP caliber year after he left Schotty, and clearly Schotty didn't develop s--t as Favre won 3 MVPs before he met the guy.

    Clearly Schotty didn't develop Sanchez or Clemens as they both were/are awful.

    Eli is great because he was a super-talented elite QB prospect who was drafted 1st overall and panned out like everyone thought he would. He was lucky to go to a good organization that drafted well and put him in a position to become the elite QB he is today.

    I don't know if you're just trolling but what you're saying makes no sense.
    Eli is an elite QB because he was allowed to fail. It has been posted adnausium on this site how Eli and Sanchez has similiar stats and the same point in their careers. During that time, did Eli's HC tell his coordinator to dummy down the passing game so Eli could stop making mistakes ?

    The biggest difference between Eli and Sanchez is this. Eli even when he was bad, displayed the talent to put the Giants on his back, something Sanchez has never done.

    As far as who Schotty did or did not develop, all i was wondering is where is/was the talented QB he was allowed to develop.

    Brees was allowed to tess the free agent market, but was playing decent in San Diego prior to his injury

    Pennington was shot when Schotty became his OC,yet won comeback player of the year his 1st yr under Schotty.

    Favre came to the Jets and took over the starting job without ever playing 1 preseason game or practicing with the team in the summer or in camp.

    Clemens is well Clemens.

    Sanchez, now that is all shotty. But is it really.When ever Schotty tried to give Sanchez his offense, he failed but instead of allowing this kid to atleast workout his issues, the HC asked that the offense be dummied down to protect his QB.

    Maybe i am trolling, or just maybe i speak the truth.

    I never believed Sanchez would be a good pro and has said so adnausium. I made no secret about my preference for Josh Freeman to be the choice at QB for this franchise. I saw in him, the same tools i saw in Jay Cutler. Freeman has displayed the ability to put the Bucs on his back even if it was only for 1 non playoff season.

    Both Freeman and Sanchez were drafted the same yr, but would the Bucs trade Freeman for Sanchez today.

    A franchise QB needs to be allowed to make mistakes while displaying franchise-like ability.In 3+ years, Mark Sanchez has shown neither. Worse,his HC is his biggest supporter and greatest stumbling block.

    Both men need to be shown the nearest highway out of the metro area.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us