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Thread: We Lost This Game Because Rex Ryan's Strategy Doesn't Work, Not Mark Sanchez

  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    rex was on espn radio yesterday. he said that sanchez was set to throw the ball to kerley, who was open. but kerley slipped, so sanchez didn't have anyone to throw to. rex actually praised sanchez for taking the loss of yards b/c it forced NE to call a TO. he said that given the circumstances, sanchez did the right thing. now it could be that rex was protecting his qb, but rex did call sanchez out for the bad INT. mostly rex was defending the offensive and defensive playcalling, since those decisions were as big a part of the loss as any mistakes by the players.
    What should Rex have said? "Well, mark actually really almost screwed us there by making the kick increasingly difficult for Nick". Again, that would never happen.

    If the TO was that important, we would have run the ball, stayed in the middle of the field, and not risked an incompletion which would have let the pats keep this valuable TO

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    What should Rex have said? "Well, mark actually really almost screwed us there by making the kick increasingly difficult for Nick". Again, that would never happen.

    If the TO was that important, we would have run the ball, stayed in the middle of the field, and not risked an incompletion which would have let the pats keep this valuable TO
    rex called him out for other decisions, so i figured he was being honest.

    the jets had 2 pass plays down there. kerley slipped and hill dropped one. both plays were well designed and would have put the jets in a great position to win. the play calling wasn't conservative there, they went for the win. you just had a 2nd year wr and a rookie wr mess up.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    rex called him out for other decisions, so i figured he was being honest.

    the jets had 2 pass plays down there. kerley slipped and hill dropped one. both plays were well designed and would have put the jets in a great position to win. the play calling wasn't conservative there, they went for the win. you just had a 2nd year wr and a rookie wr mess up.
    Look, im with you on the playcalling, i honestly dont mind what was called on either play.

    Im just looking at it strictly logically, that we didnt have a lead where killing clock was the main goal, we were tied and on the road. A 10 yard loss is ENORMOUS when you are kicking a FG, especially with the pressure of a game winner. There is simply no statistical explanation for that being a good play by sanchez. If the clock took precedence over yardage in that situation then we would have run the ball or even kneeled on it.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Look, im with you on the playcalling, i honestly dont mind what was called on either play.

    Im just looking at it strictly logically, that we didnt have a lead where killing clock was the main goal, we were tied and on the road. A 10 yard loss is ENORMOUS when you are kicking a FG, especially with the pressure of a game winner. There is simply no statistical explanation for that being a good play by sanchez. If the clock took precedence over yardage in that situation then we would have run the ball or even kneeled on it.
    i think the problem with sanchez's decision is that he kept going backwards. if he ducked down and lost 3 yards, that wouldn't have been such a big deal. but i agree, he lost too many yards. sometimes he tries to do too much, to make the big play, when he should bail quicker by either minimizing the yards lost, protecting the ball or throwing it away. it's as if he's always trying to prove his detractors wrong, and that's when the problems come.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    i think the problem with sanchez's decision is that he kept going backwards. if he ducked down and lost 3 yards, that wouldn't have been such a big deal. but i agree, he lost too many yards. sometimes he tries to do too much, to make the big play, when he should bail quicker by either minimizing the yards lost, protecting the ball or throwing it away. it's as if he's always trying to prove his detractors wrong, and that's when the problems come.
    Totally agree. I actually think his accuracy has improved a lot, as evidenced by the drive sunday when we went 92 yards and he was 9-10.

    The problem is the great QBs make the 1-3 plays a game that affect the outcome and sanchez doesnt. His in game feel is just horrible, which explains his INTs at the end of halfs and his fumbles in the red zone....once you hit FG range, ball security has to be front and center in your mind, especially at the end of the half. That is something that should be ingrained in you by college.

    Also, for whatever reason, his mistakes wind up with disasterous results. You see players like eli.....they have the ball at their own 40, 3rd and long and they throw an INT down the field. Its not a big deal because they would have punted anyway. But look at the insanely high % of sanchez's INTs that are returned for TDs, or come at the end of the half. They result in way too many changes in points, which is what kills us.

    I really worry that at this point, in game feel can no longer be learned and that he simply doesnt have "it"

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Totally agree. I actually think his accuracy has improved a lot, as evidenced by the drive sunday when we went 92 yards and he was 9-10.

    The problem is the great QBs make the 1-3 plays a game that affect the outcome and sanchez doesnt. His in game feel is just horrible, which explains his INTs at the end of halfs and his fumbles in the red zone....once you hit FG range, ball security has to be front and center in your mind, especially at the end of the half. That is something that should be ingrained in you by college.

    Also, for whatever reason, his mistakes wind up with disasterous results. You see players like eli.....they have the ball at their own 40, 3rd and long and they throw an INT down the field. Its not a big deal because they would have punted anyway. But look at the insanely high % of sanchez's INTs that are returned for TDs, or come at the end of the half. They result in way too many changes in points, which is what kills us.

    I really worry that at this point, in game feel can no longer be learned and that he simply doesnt have "it"
    a lot of his issues are when he holds onto the ball too long, waiting for someone to get free. that's when he gets sacked, fumbles or forces a ball. he needs to 'mellow out' and throw the ball away, or have a dumpoff option and use it quicker. every pass can't be a great gain. i wish they used rbs who could catch so sanchez would have extra options.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaSteve View Post
    You're on crack again SAR...
    The defense did anything BUT crap the bed yesterday.

    Now, if you want to talk about shotty QB play, Stephen Hill's drop, Disgusting conservative play calling, then we can talk. The only reason we were in that game was because of our defense.
    You are right! Its about a QB who threw an INT on an underthrown pass when a receiver was wide open ? What about a QB that has no pocket presence and tries to pass when he is being sacked? He has done that before! At least he has not thrown a pick 6 --- yet. He has done that before it seems. This is a team game but so many fans like SAR close their eyes to the horrid play of Suckchez because he is their guy!
    Last edited by Kentucky Jet; 10-23-2012 at 04:57 PM.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Kentucky Jet View Post
    You are right! Its about a QB who threw an INT on an underthrown pass when a receiver was wide open ? What about a QB that has no pocket presence and tries to pass when he is being sacked? He has done that before! At least he has not thrown a pick 6 --- yet. He has done that before it seems. This is a team game but so many fans like SAR close their eyes to the horrid play of Suckchez because he is their guy!
    You couldn't be more wrong. Frankly, I can't think of a more objective Jets Insider member than myself. I've got no Marklove, got no Sanchez posters in my bedroom, no David Wright syndrome.

    What I've seen in his first two seasons and first two postseasons convinced me that he has potential to be great if supported with the right receivers, linemen, and running backs.

    Mark Sanchez is doing a lot with very little right now. He just played his best game in two years and with unfamiliar targets, a porous OL, and a bad running game. He just gave the defense a 3 point lead on the road in a critical, high-pressure, "save the season!" nationally televised game.

    He got us the win; the defense turned it into a loss.

    SAR I

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    You could not possibly be more incorrect.

    The game was tied, why would you EVER make it harder for your team to score go ahead points in order to take a timeout away from the offense. That would never happen. 10 yards on a game winning kick, on the road, out doors is a big deal.

    If the TO was that valuable to take off the Pats plate, we would have run the ball or kneeled down, not attempted a pass.
    This is stupid. A run or a kneel down gives us no chance at a first down. So they called a pass play - but obviously instructed Sanchez to eat the ball rather than risk an incompletion or pick. Which was the right move - an aggressive play call with a conservative execution. If your receiver is open, you throw it and hope you can run out the clock the rest of the way; if not, take the sack, make them burn the time out, and kick the field goal.

    Lastly, the Pats didnt even take their last timeout until there was 5 seconds left and took it ON SECOND DOWN, so clearly they could have spiked the ball there and not even needed a single TO let alone 2.
    Except if they'd had two time outs they would have used one earlier in the drive, giving themselves enough time to take a few shots at the end zone rather than needing to kick on second down. Please tell me you understand this.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    NFL kickers hit approximately 1 in 1.25 (80%) of their kicks of less then 40 yards and approximately 1 in 1.43 (70%) kicks between 40-49.

    So yea, 10% chance to not tie the game AND give the Pats the ball inside our own 50 in order to take away an extra time out.....absolutely the most ridiculous thing I have ever read.
    Again, this is ridiculous. Folk hasn't missed from closer than 50 in a year.

    Oh, and btw, all kickers in the NFL have attempted 132 kicks between 40-49 yards this season. They've missed 23 - meaning they are hitting them at an 83% clip. http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/pl...GoalsMade40_49

    So much for your stats

  11. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by JetinHuntersville View Post
    On the sack that almost killed their chance to foce OT, what the hell is he thiking. I know PopWarner players who know better then to hold onto a ball there.
    I'm no Sanchez apologist, but throwing the ball away there would have saved the Patriots a timeout. Taking the sack made the Pats burn one.

  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    You couldn't be more wrong. Frankly, I can't think of a more objective Jets Insider member than myself. I've got no Marklove, got no Sanchez posters in my bedroom, no David Wright syndrome.

    What I've seen in his first two seasons and first two postseasons convinced me that he has potential to be great if supported with the right receivers, linemen, and running backs.

    Mark Sanchez is doing a lot with very little right now. He just played his best game in two years and with unfamiliar targets, a porous OL, and a bad running game. He just gave the defense a 3 point lead on the road in a critical, high-pressure, "save the season!" nationally televised game.

    He got us the win; the defense turned it into a loss.

    SAR I
    Keep dreaming SAR....the sky will be blue in your world one day too....

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it View Post
    This is stupid. A run or a kneel down gives us no chance at a first down. So they called a pass play - but obviously instructed Sanchez to eat the ball rather than risk an incompletion or pick. Which was the right move - an aggressive play call with a conservative execution. If your receiver is open, you throw it and hope you can run out the clock the rest of the way; if not, take the sack, make them burn the time out, and kick the field goal.

    Except if they'd had two time outs they would have used one earlier in the drive, giving themselves enough time to take a few shots at the end zone rather than needing to kick on second down. Please tell me you understand this.
    Eat the ball? Did that look like what he was doing AT ALL? He got pulled down by his ankles.

    The best passers in the league dont complete 70% of their throws, so every time you drop back there is a 30-40% chance it will be an incompletion, so how could they care about the clock if that was the play they called.

    This isnt my opinion, its is factual math. An opposing teams timeouts are worth less then 10 yards of field position on a game winning kick, that is a fact.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it View Post
    Again, this is ridiculous. Folk hasn't missed from closer than 50 in a year.

    Oh, and btw, all kickers in the NFL have attempted 132 kicks between 40-49 yards this season. They've missed 23 - meaning they are hitting them at an 83% clip. http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/pl...GoalsMade40_49

    So much for your stats
    Sweet sample size, less then half of one season.

    By your math, you can correct my previous statement about 30-40% chance of an incompletion and take it 47% since this season sanchez is completing only 53% of his passes.....

    Thats smart odds.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    You couldn't be more wrong. Frankly, I can't think of a more objective Jets Insider member than myself. I've got no Marklove, got no Sanchez posters in my bedroom, no David Wright syndrome.

    What I've seen in his first two seasons and first two postseasons convinced me that he has potential to be great if supported with the right receivers, linemen, and running backs.

    Mark Sanchez is doing a lot with very little right now. He just played his best game in two years and with unfamiliar targets, a porous OL, and a bad running game. He just gave the defense a 3 point lead on the road in a critical, high-pressure, "save the season!" nationally televised game.

    He got us the win; the defense turned it into a loss.

    SAR I
    And that's the WHOLE POINT no matter how many EXCUSES other fans here have for that sorry sack of crap D-Linemen/Linebackers/Secondary.....

    Fans here just REFUSE to give the Defense the PROPER blame for BLOWING IT LATE as usual. And it's not a one-time thing either.....IT'S HAPPENED A LOT since Rex's Tenure began!



    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaSteve View Post
    Keep dreaming SAR....the sky will be blue in your world one day too....
    Well at least the sky is supposed to be blue.

    Wonder what the sky looks like in your world.
    Last edited by Vin; 10-23-2012 at 07:57 PM.

  16. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    It's we're now coming up on two years since we've beaten a team that ends the season with a winning record, just beating the scrubs and losing to the decent teams time and time again.

    Since the day he got here Rex Ryan has preached that our success will be on a shut-down defense and a ground-and-pound rushing attack. Despite little regular season success in his first three years, he stuck to this strategy, unwilling to bend, unwilling to roll with the changes in the NFL. Still thinking we can emulate the 1985 Bears defense and the 1959 Packers offense and go all the way. Mike Tannenbaum buys-in, so he spends all the good draft picks on defense, thinking Rex can mold questionable rookies into league powerhouses.

    Yesterday followed the Rex Ryan 2010 script to a tee with one glaring exception- the offense is left with no playmakers to bail the defense out of another 4th quarter collapse. With players like Braylon Edwards, Santonio Holmes, Plaxico Burress, and Ladanian Tomlinson we were able to survive the defensive failures against the likes of the Browns, Lions, Broncos, Texans, and Colts in 2010 and remain somewhat competitive early in 2011. But in late 2011 and 2012, those days are over. The defense continues to let us down when it matters most, the running game gets stuffed when it matters most, Mark Sanchez doesn't have a supporting aerial cast to win the game late.

    Yesterday's disaster is on the defense. They sh-t the bed with 1:30 remaining, sh-t the bed the very next drive in OT. Mark Sanchez did a very good job with the crap tools he has and until he gets more receiving options we're going to continue to suffer against good teams who can make plays in crunch time where we can't.

    SAR I
    I respect all your post up until now. How in the hell did Rex Ryan get in the game to play QB? I didn't see Ryan Fumble the ball and the game away. Dude we lost that game because Mark Sanchez dont have the ability to win games come crunch time. I am tired of getting flack about our QB, tired of this dude regression of Jet football. We Need a change. Sanchez has got to go!

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by TechJet View Post
    I respect all your post up until now. How in the hell did Rex Ryan get in the game to play QB? I didn't see Ryan Fumble the ball and the game away. Dude we lost that game because Mark Sanchez dont have the ability to win games come crunch time. I am tired of getting flack about our QB, tired of this dude regression of Jet football. We Need a change. Sanchez has got to go!
    DID YOU SEE THE JETS -EFENSE NOT GET IT DONE WHEN THEY ABSOLUTELY HAD TO AT THE END? DID YOU?

    Mark could've been better...true....BUT Rex's TRADEMARK when he got here has ALWAYS been about the Defense and it has FAILED, PERIOD.

    It has failed time after time after time. As much as I dislike SAR's posts in general, he does bring up a valid point that Rex's defenses have almost always given up that Late score in the 4th quarter when his "vaunted" Defense had to make a stop(and didn't). Even in 2010 when Mark actually had real weapons(and a running game) to throw to, Rex's defenses have FAILED. The difference was that Mark(remember him?) was able to bail them out.

    But no one wants to hear that. They want to listen to themselves bleat like lambs about Sanchez-has-to-go....WAAAAH WAAAH WAAH!
    Last edited by Vin; 10-23-2012 at 08:57 PM.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Vin View Post
    And that's the WHOLE POINT no matter how many EXCUSES other fans here have for that sorry sack of crap D-Linemen/Linebackers/Secondary.....

    Fans here just REFUSE to give the Defense the PROPER blame for BLOWING IT LATE as usual. And it's not a one-time thing either.....IT'S HAPPENED A LOT since Rex's Tenure began!
    The Defense has blown a lot of leads during Rex's tenure because, frankly, he has overachieved with mostly average talent. Besides Revis, who's now on IR, who are the superstars on this unit? You have good players like Pouha and Devito (who Rex and Pettine transformed from JAG's into good players). Slow aging linebackers like Scott and Pace who were never that great even in the primes of their careers. Oh and no real pass rushing threat.

    So when a legendary QB like Brady has his back to the wall he will easily get the ball down the field for a game tying FG.

    The fact that our defense was top 5 in 2009 and 2010 with one legit superstar and the rest of the roster being ok players and even a couple duds (Smith and Leonhard) was an incredible accomplishment by Rex.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by detjetsfan View Post

    The fact that our defense was top 5 in 2009 and 2010 with one legit superstar and the rest of the roster being ok players and even a couple duds (Smith and Leonhard) was an incredible accomplishment by Rex.
    ....and the fact that our defense is headed for Bottom 5 in 2012 with no legit superstars and less talent on the roster than he inherited is an incredible failure by Rex.

    SAR I

  20. #160
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    coaches dont play the game, players do

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