Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 4567 LastLast
Results 101 to 120 of 133

Thread: Same Sex Marriage

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Why does the "objective and external" have to be "God"?

    Why could it not be some other conceptualization, say, sanctity of life? At it's core, eithout concrete evidence of existence, God is just that, a conceptualization of man. A belief. Faith.

    But Man can faith in other concepts just s easily, and use them as the core of their morality system, and yet still be internally consistent.

    You say you're not saying athiests can't be moral.....and then say, basicly, that without God, there is no such thing as morality.

    I would counter that God is wholely unneeded to formulate an "internally consistent" moral code. It's only needed if you choose one of the existing, pre-frmed, moral codes provided by the various faiths.

    And lets be honest, not a single faith, Judaism included, is actually "internally consistent". Read your old testement recently....if so, and if you (and Judaism) were consistent, you'd be stoning and killing and enslaving people on a daily basis.
    This deserves its own thread - lets stop derailing this one.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    Doggin, we have had theological disagreements before. We are both religious to some degree.
    BUT, the "my religion is better than yours" line is not going to cut it. Here or ever.
    People have different beliefs. Period. Even people of the same religion have different beliefs and values.
    If a person is a pagan or atheist, that's their belief system. As long as they don't have crazy practices like sacrificing virgins or children or harmful acts - ok. I will not criticize religion (Islam has been an exception for me). Based on its practiced and endorsed violence.


    And that's the difference between American civil society and civil law and theosophical debates.

    I'm not religious because my parents were, or for cultural reasons. I'm religious because I sincerely believe, after a lot of investigation and thought, that Judaism is true. That conclusion carries with it certain corollaries - that other religions are false, and that there is a benefit to holding true beliefs and a detriment to holding false ones. I'm not going to go out proselytizing, and I've got not disdain for people of other religions - I just think they're wrong on an important topic.

  3. #103
    Yet no straight man is gonna turn his head from a two female, stripped down, drunken make out session. Haters gonna hate.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by parafly View Post
    The current marriage institution is one consenting adult male and one consenting adult female. With gay marriage the structure of the institution (1 to 1 relationship) stays unchanged while plural marriage would required a restructuring of laws due to a change in the number of entities involved. Of course, it's not impossible to change, but it would come with quite a bit reform.
    Not just reform - a complete reworking. Marriage, as a legal institution, only encompasses two people. It is not, however, gendered; husbands don't have different legal rights as spouses than wives. That's why gay marriage doesn't require a fundamental change of the institution, but plural marriage would.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by HessStation View Post
    Yet no straight man is gonna turn his head from a two female, stripped down, drunken make out session. Haters gonna hate.
    Stop typing and drive, damnit!

  6. #106
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Un-Pleasantville
    Posts
    6,516
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Why does the "objective and external" have to be "God"?

    Why could it not be some other conceptualization, say, sanctity of life? At it's core, eithout concrete evidence of existence, God is just that, a conceptualization of man. A belief. Faith.

    But Man can faith in other concepts just s easily, and use them as the core of their morality system, and yet still be internally consistent.

    You say you're not saying athiests can't be moral.....and then say, basicly, that without God, there is no such thing as morality.

    I would counter that God is wholely unneeded to formulate an "internally consistent" moral code. It's only needed if you choose one of the existing, pre-frmed, moral codes provided by the various faiths.

    And lets be honest, not a single faith, Judaism included, is actually "internally consistent". Read your old testement recently....if so, and if you (and Judaism) were consistent, you'd be stoning and killing and enslaving people on a daily basis.
    Well, the 10 Commandments are very consistent.

    Sure, you could be a secular humanist and acquire a moral code from somewhere, but I'm fairly certain that looking for one in Prog Rock lyrics
    or the scribblings of invert atheist Sci-Fi writers isn't going to turn anything up

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it View Post
    Stop typing and drive, damnit!
    But multitasking is my thing! It's all I have really.

  8. #108
    Bewildered Beast
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    SF via Strong Island
    Posts
    30,496
    Quote Originally Posted by HessStation View Post
    Yet no straight man is gonna turn his head from a two female, stripped down, drunken make out session. Haters gonna hate.
    Excuse me; which thread is this in? I have a vicarious interest in the subject.

  9. #109
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Un-Pleasantville
    Posts
    6,516
    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    Excuse me; which thread is this in? I have a vicarious interest in the subject.
    Buddha was not a man of the collar; I don't even think he wore shirts.

  10. #110
    Bewildered Beast
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    SF via Strong Island
    Posts
    30,496
    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Shift Jet View Post
    Buddha was not a man of the collar; I don't even think he wore shirts.
    Ahh, JSJ; the quicker vicar-upper!


    not Downey soft; but still refreshing.

  11. #111
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Un-Pleasantville
    Posts
    6,516
    Quote Originally Posted by sg3 View Post
    a) yes - an opportunity sadly thrown down the toilet by nominating the Mormon empty suit

    Sent from my SkipEGuHed T999 using Crapatalk 2
    Yeah, that America-hating Mormonism is just the flies on top of the sherbet

    "we" already picked an America-hating Muslim - no place to go but up from there
    Last edited by Jungle Shift Jet; 10-25-2012 at 03:02 PM.

  12. #112
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Un-Pleasantville
    Posts
    6,516
    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    Ahh, JSJ; the quicker vicar-upper!


    not Downey soft; but still refreshing.
    Know whut can be refreshing, espeshully after a long hot day?

    Being a man of the cloth, without actually bein' a "man of the cloth"

    Aye, there's the rub!

    PS Didja know why the team formerly known as the Jints colors are Black and Orange? Fascinating. Me, I believe the "Jints" came from Italian ex-pats pronouncing it as they would in their native tongue.
    Last edited by Jungle Shift Jet; 10-25-2012 at 03:03 PM.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    Excuse me; which thread is this in? I have a vicarious interest in the subject.
    I'm not completely sure. I may just be trolling the **** out of this one.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by 21st Amendment View Post
    While I'm frustrated myself with his leadership, I think you are underestimating the division in today's congress. There are very few moderates. Look the Republicans in Indiana kicked Dick Lugar to the curb because he wasn't conservative enough, and I don't think anyone really considers him a moderate. Now they are stuck with the new rape guy. The same thing happened countless times the last 3 years, in Delaware, Alaska, Colorado. Because of it the Republicans have zero change to win back the Senate.


    Off topic. Booker vs. Christie 2013? Apparently Booker will announce a decision before the New Year.
    Newark needs Booker and NJ needs Christie. I like Booker a lot but him running in 2013 would be a shame.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it View Post


    And that's the difference between American civil society and civil law and theosophical debates.

    I'm not religious because my parents were, or for cultural reasons. I'm religious because I sincerely believe, after a lot of investigation and thought, that Judaism is true. That conclusion carries with it certain corollaries - that other religions are false, and that there is a benefit to holding true beliefs and a detriment to holding false ones. I'm not going to go out proselytizing, and I've got not disdain for people of other religions - I just think they're wrong on an important topic.

    You are an honorable person. BUT, your theory of absolutism is dangerous. That concept has led to religious strife and hatred. Many religions, especially Judaism, have suffered because of the "I'm right, you're wrong" religious thinking.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    You are an honorable person. BUT, your theory of absolutism is dangerous. That concept has led to religious strife and hatred. Many religions, especially Judaism, have suffered because of the "I'm right, you're wrong" religious thinking.
    Yes, if only Jews had opened their minds to look at the positive side of Nazism it would have saved them a boatload of trouble.

    (BTW, religion IS absolutism. Please list for me the religions that don't feel they are right and others are wrong.)

  17. #117
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    13,842
    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    Yes, if only Jews had opened their minds to look at the positive side of Nazism it would have saved them a boatload of trouble.

    (BTW, religion IS absolutism. Please list for me the religions that don't feel they are right and others are wrong.)
    Daoism?

  18. #118
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Posts
    13,842
    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it View Post
    This deserves its own thread - lets stop derailing this one.
    it does.


    It's an interesting conversation. I would like to ask how any religion can be "objective" (and, by that, I would assume not "subjective") as the ethos would have derived from the society that created the dogma in question?

  19. #119
    Bewildered Beast
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    SF via Strong Island
    Posts
    30,496
    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Shift Jet View Post
    Know whut can be refreshing, espeshully after a long hot day?

    Being a man of the cloth, without actually bein' a "man of the cloth"

    Aye, there's the rub!

    PS Didja know why the team formerly known as the Jints colors are Black and Orange? Fascinating. Me, I believe the "Jints" came from Italian ex-pats pronouncing it as they would in their native tongue.
    My father RIP knew all the teams from back then(before the NFL); his father was with Standard Oil in New Jersey and played with the NY Giants football club. The days of wedges, and guys running into the line to get pummelled half to death. This game was the place for grads of military schools like West Point etc. They were always in a pile; "proving how tough you are" seemed to be the point.


    Quote Originally Posted by HessStation View Post
    I'm not completely sure. I may just be trolling the **** out of this one.
    Dammit!

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    Yes, if only Jews had opened their minds to look at the positive side of Nazism it would have saved them a boatload of trouble.

    (BTW, religion IS absolutism. Please list for me the religions that don't feel they are right and others are wrong.)

    Even YOU are smarter than this.
    Nazism is not and never was a religion. Nor was communism. Or cannibalism. Or mass murder and rape.
    Many religions including Judaism have varying degrees of belief and practice. Reform, conservative, Orthodox. And specific branches - Hassidic etc. They do not all agree.
    Catholics do not all agree. Nor do various Protestant sects.
    Many Catholics (and it IS Catholic doctrine) believe ANY person of good will and practice can achieve salvation regardless of religion.
    There is more than one path. The world's largest religion (by a wide margin), Catholicism, therefore does not believe it is the only correct religion. Point: me.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us