Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 71

Thread: Do you think we could trade Revis for Von Miller?

  1. #21
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    13,543
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by sdJETSetter View Post
    Wat if we throw in Santoni-HO and Marky Mark for absolutely FREE!?
    I'm not sure any team in the league would trade that package in exchange for nothing. We'd have to sweeten the deal a bit.

  2. #22
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    13,543
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    not necessarily... you're not just talking about a CB, you're talking about a potential GOAT CB and a certain HOF type of talent. he is absolutely as valuable as any pass rusher in the league. why do you think the jets have had top 5 defenses without a natural pass rush? shutdown corners make it very hard to pass. that's why I'm in favor of keeping revis... I think if you can add young pass rushers (the jets have no rush LB's at all) then it turns an already strong pass defense into a potentially dominant defense. we're never going to win it on offense so we might as well try to just do it all through defense like the 02 bucs/05 steelers/00 ravens, etc
    A dominant pass rush can make an average secondary look extraordinary.

    A dominant secondary makes an average pass rush look worse.

  3. #23
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    7,631
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH View Post
    You maybe right, but big bucks can be made without playing out the contract. Just look at big Ben's 102 million dollar contract with 2 years left on the rookie deal. The point is, that there are plenty players that don't play out their rookie contract.
    yes, there are a lot of players that get extensions but that is what they are, they don't rip up the rookie deal and give them more money just like that. the only star player that I know of is Chris Johnson, (besides Revis) and if you don't think Bud Adams is kicking his ass, your wrong.

    It makes a lot of sense cap wise to give a player an extension to his rookie deal as you can spread the signing bonus over the remainder of the rookie deal and over the # of years on the new deal. But Miller with 3 years left and the threat of the tag has a lot less leverage to hold you up than Revis who is on his last year and for whom you just traded the guy you picked 2nd in the entire draft for.

    For instance Miller will probably sign a 3 year extension right now for the tag amount for an OLB of 8.5 a season with 1/2 of it up front. Say 13 mill.
    The Broncos will have a 23 YO OLB tied up for 6 years for a total of 9 mill +26 (new) or 35 mill. they could then spread the 13 mill SB cap hit over all 6 years of the contract. But in the case of Revis, they will be signing a 28 YO
    corner to a 6 year contract for 12 mill a year with at least 24 mill as a SB.
    The cap hit will be twice Miller's and The Broncos will be paying 40% of the cap for Manning and two corners. It just does not make any sense.

  4. #24
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    Never in a million years.

    Pass rushers >>> CBs.

    He is also a 3 down pass rusher who can defend the run. Outside of QB, that might be the most valuable position in football.

    I was dead wrong about him. Thought he would be a bust. He is a fantastic complete player.
    I politely disagree with you on your equation. My set of two equations would be:

    Great Pass Rush>Great corners
    &
    Great Corner> Great Pass rusher

    In other words, having an overall great pass rush as an entire unit is definitely more valuable than having a great cornerback unit. This is because if your pass rush sucks even the best corners in the business will give up big plays if they have to defend for so many seconds.

    However, in my opinion, as a single player, a great cornerback is more important than having a great pass rusher. The reason being is there
    are a few ways to neutralize a great pass rusher; whether it be outright double teaming him, having a tight end to chip him at the line, have a back pick him up too., having plays where the QB rolls out to the other side. But there is no way to neutralize a great corner like Revis. No matter what, he will always be taking away your #1 option regardless if he goes in motion to the other side of the field.

  5. #25
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Boynton Beach, FL
    Posts
    8,914
    Post Thanks / Like
    Denver wouldnt trade miller for revis. U cant be serious.

  6. #26
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    52,055
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    Denver wouldnt trade miller for revis. U cant be serious.
    Broncos are still laughing their ass off at the 4th round pick they got for Tebow.

  7. #27
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,326
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by jetglass View Post

    However, in my opinion, as a single player, a great cornerback is more important than having a great pass rusher. The reason being is there
    are a few ways to neutralize a great pass rusher; whether it be outright double teaming him, having a tight end to chip him at the line, have a back pick him up too., having plays where the QB rolls out to the other side. But there is no way to neutralize a great corner like Revis. No matter what, he will always be taking away your #1 option regardless if he goes in motion to the other side of the field.

    Bull****. Want to know how to neutralize Revis ? have your WR run a freaking route and have Revis drop in to cover him. Guess what ? That still leaves you with other WRs and RBs to either catch the ball or run the ball.

  8. #28
    All League
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    2,838
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by PatsFanTX View Post
    Broncos are still laughing their ass off at the 4th round pick they got for Tebow.
    How do you know this?

  9. #29
    All League
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    2,838
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    Bull****. Want to know how to neutralize Revis ? have your WR run a freaking route and have Revis drop in to cover him. Guess what ? That still leaves you with other WRs and RBs to either catch the ball or run the ball.
    ???

  10. #30
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,326
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH View Post
    ???

    The point is that even the great Darelle Revis, the best shutdown corner in the NFL, can only cover 1 receiver at a time. Last I checked, that would leave 2, 3 or 4 other receivers and a RB or two to defend against as well.

  11. #31
    All League
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    2,838
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    The point is that even the great Darelle Revis, the best shutdown corner in the NFL, can only cover 1 receiver at a time. Last I checked, that would leave 2, 3 or 4 other receivers and a RB or two to defend against as well.
    But your not neutralizing him. It could be said that for the receiver he is covering. your taking their number 1 option out of the equation.

  12. #32
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    9,927
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by southside View Post
    That would be sweet.
    Yes, that would be pretty cool

  13. #33
    Practice Squad
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH View Post
    But your not neutralizing him. It could be said that for the receiver he is covering. your taking their number 1 option out of the equation.
    Also the problem with just taking the number 1 out of the equation is so many teams do not have a true number 1 ,but three number 2s. Giants,Packers,Saints etc. Many good wide outs however it is a waste of Revis talent to shut out just one of them and this year it did not seem Revis was very comfortable playing zone

  14. #34
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,874
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH View Post
    But your not neutralizing him. It could be said that for the receiver he is covering. your taking their number 1 option out of the equation.
    yeah if anything a shutdown corner like revis forces you to gameplan around him, knowing your #1 weapon will not be in the game and also frees up the safeties to do other things since they won't need to give help in coverage around him

  15. #35
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    Bull****. Want to know how to neutralize Revis ? have your WR run a freaking route and have Revis drop in to cover him. Guess what ? That still leaves you with other WRs and RBs to either catch the ball or run the ball.
    Okay. Now go trying to tell some of the top teams in the league the following:

    1. Texans- Go win the game without Andre Johnson the entire game.
    2. Giants- Go win the game without Victor Cruz the entire game.
    3. Patriots- Go win the game without Wes Welker the entire game.
    4. Ravens- Go win the game with Anquan Boldin the entire game.
    5. Falcons- Go win the game game without Roddy White the entire game.

    Can those top teams still win without their top threats above? Yea, sure, but you just made it a ton more difficult for them and you greatly increased your chances of winning.

    There's a reason a team like the Cowboys havent been relevant for so long even with the best pass rusher in the game.

    That's why its ludicrous that people think you cant win a super bowl with your best player being a CB. We were right there two years in a row and certainly had the talent to win it all, just a play here and there cost us.

    First year Shonn Greene's injury cost us against the Colts, and the next year ridiculously horrendous coaching cost us against the Steelers by being totally unprepared for having the QB's headset break.

  16. #36
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,326
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH View Post
    But your not neutralizing him. It could be said that for the receiver he is covering. your taking their number 1 option out of the equation.
    Depends on how you look at it. The other team would be sacrificing their #1, but they'd be taking your best defender out of every play, and forcing the remaining 10 guys on defense to come up with stops.

    This is why, in my view, it doesn't make sense to spend that much of a teams salary cap on a single CB, no matter how good he is.

  17. #37
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,326
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by jetglass View Post
    Okay. Now go trying to tell some of the top teams in the league the following:

    1. Texans- Go win the game without Andre Johnson the entire game.
    Really ? Andre Johnson has 32 catches and a whopping 2 TDs right now and the Texans are 6-2. Just as a comparison, Jeremy Kerley has more yards and the same number of TDs.

    Now, let's look at the Texans 2nd leading receiver, Owen Daniels. He has 1 less catch than Johnson, and only 28 fewer yards, but 2 more TDs.



    2. Giants- Go win the game without Victor Cruz the entire game.
    The Giants beat Carolina with Cruz having 42 yards and no TDs. They beat SF with Cruz only having 58 yards. They beat Dallas with Cruz having only 23 yards receiving.


    3. Patriots- Go win the game without Wes Welker the entire game.
    The Pats beat Tenn with Welker having 14 yds, they beat us when he only had 66 yards, and they beat St. Louis when he had 48 yards.

    In the games they lost this year, he had 95 yards against AZ, 142 against Baltimore and 138 against Seattle.



    Can those top teams still win without their top threats above? Yea, sure, but you just made it a ton more difficult for them and you greatly increased your chances of winning.

    There's a reason a team like the Cowboys havent been relevant for so long even with the best pass rusher in the game.
    The reason why the Cowboys haven't been relevant is largely due to Jerry Jones and his stupidity in selecting coaches.



    That's why its ludicrous that people think you cant win a super bowl with your best player being a CB. We were right there two years in a row and certainly had the talent to win it all, just a play here and there cost us.
    Really ? Please tell me that last time a team has won a SB with a top "shut down" corner who commanded such a large percentage of the team's overall salary cap.

    Seriously, make a list of the tp 5 "shutdown corners" in the NFL over the past 10 years and tell us how many of them have SB rings on their fingers.


    BTW, I seem to recall that we had the best "shutdown corner" in the NFL last year and we managed to go 8-8 and miss the playoffs. So much for the importance of a shutdown corner.



    Don't get me wrong. I'm not against having a shutdown corner, even the best in the league. That is, as long as you don't have to pay too high a price, and your left with plenty of salary cap to ensure that you have stronger players across your team.
    Last edited by Demosthenes9; 11-05-2012 at 12:12 AM.

  18. #38
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    7,631
    Post Thanks / Like
    solid post, Demosthenes9. The pats also beat the Eagles in the SB without Ty Law, when law was at the top of his game. DEs are in most every single play whether a run or a pass. The guy Revis is covering may be a target 15 times a game. Corners are highly valued by the NFL or they would not be paid so much. But IMO I rather have an impact DE than an Impact corner.
    Last edited by patman; 11-05-2012 at 07:09 AM.

  19. #39
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    8,385
    Post Thanks / Like
    Sure. Right after we can trade Revis for Aaron Rodgers. I guess we'll have to think about which is the better move.

  20. #40
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    19,458
    Post Thanks / Like
    Like I said before, Revis is a great player. Nobody plays their position better than he plays his. Not sure if there is a bigger praise to give than that. He is a better CB than Rodgers is a QB.

    BUT.

    No HC, OC or QB fears Revis. They respect his tremendous ability but they simply ignore him and attack our defense elsewhere. We have seen this happen over the years. Teams can still pass the ball on us even with Revis dominating their #1 receiver.

    You cannot ignore an elite pass rusher. They can impact every single play. They must be accounted for. Ware, Peppers, JPP, Watt, etc are all feared by opposing offenses. They can wreck a game. Revis is not going to wreck a game for an opposing offense.

    We are built wrong on defense. But since Rex inherited Revis he decided to tailor the defense to him. IMO any coach who can build a defense from scratch would start with a 3 down pass rusher.

    Actually we are built wrong on both sides of the ball. The NFL in 2012 is about QBs and guys who can disrupt QBs. You have a QB and surround him with weapons then on defense you get guys that can attack the QB. We share a stadium with a team that has the perfect blueprint.

    I believe Revis will fully recover from this injury. And I hope that this injury might help us keep him at a reasonable price. But I do not think we should move heaven and earth to keep him. Not when we have so many other holes.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us