View Poll Results: Is Gruden Overated

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Thread: Jon Gruden Overated??

  1. #1
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    Jon Gruden Overated??

    At the Raiders, he did pretty well and finished up with a 38-26 record with 2 playoff runs. No Super Bowls. For comparison, Rex is 35-27.

    At the Bucks, Gruden won a Superbowl, but didn't tear it up after that with a record of 57-55.

    Bottom Line: Is he worth all the hype? I say NO!!

  2. #2
    Gruden is the offensive version of Rex. Let that blow your mind!

  3. #3
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    I dont think anyone believes Jon Gruden is a great coach. He won a super bowl with Tony Dungy's guys and struggled when he could not find a qb.

    A great coach is a coach who has a great qb. There is no such thing as a great coach who has a crappy qb.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by SyracuseJet View Post
    Gruden is the offensive version of Rex. Let that blow your mind!
    Gruden can turn our offense into gold.

    Superior football mind on offense, believes in the trenches unlike Martz (best play designer in the league IMO), and develops QBs like a fiend.

    Terrible head coach as his only focus is offense, supreme offensive coach.

    The guy above put it perfectly...an offensive version of Rex.

  5. #5
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    The last 3 Jets HC's have had no HC NLF experience.

    Gruden has NFL HC experience.

    If the Jets do fire Wrecks, I'd be shocked if they go with another HC who has never been a HC in the NFL.

  6. #6
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    never thought he was anything special, and the tampa team he won the superbowl with was a team that dungy built

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyJet80 View Post
    never thought he was anything special, and the tampa team he won the superbowl with was a team that dungy built
    He had the killer instinct when he got close though.

    It was a team Dungy spent ten years building but couldn't win with. Gruden takes it and wins a super bowl with Brad Johnson being the most efficient QB in the league that year if I recall correctly.

    Similarly, Dungy spent 8 years in Indy trying to fit that defense into a Tampa-2 when it had no business trying to be one. Yet he still stumbled his way into a ring because of one of the all time greatest to ever play.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    I dont think anyone believes Jon Gruden is a great coach. He won a super bowl with Tony Dungy's guys and struggled when he could not find a qb.

    A great coach is a coach who has a great qb. There is no such thing as a great coach who has a crappy qb.
    Bill Belicheck went 11-5 with Matt Cassell. MATT CASSELL.

  9. #9
    I had more respect for Gruden before he took the MNF job. The guy's analysis is not impressive for someone who is supposed to be one of the top 5 HCs available to hire.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by halfsharkalligatorhalfman View Post
    I had more respect for Gruden before he took the MNF job. The guy's analysis is not impressive for someone who is supposed to be one of the top 5 HCs available to hire.
    I think I read somewhere that Gruden actually spends as much time during the week as regular coaches in breaking down film in order to prepare for the broadcasts, lol. Could have fooled me. But seriously, he's catering to the masses, you can only get so-indepth.

    His QB Camp segments are very good. It's clear he knows his stuff, even if it doesn't translate well on MNF.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASG0531 View Post
    I think I read somewhere that Gruden actually spends as much time during the week as regular coaches in breaking down film in order to prepare for the broadcasts, lol. Could have fooled me. But seriously, he's catering to the masses, you can only get so-indepth.

    His QB Camp segments are very good. It's clear he knows his stuff, even if it doesn't translate well on MNF.
    Exactly.

    70% of MNF viewers are casual football fans who just root for their team.

    If Gruden, or any analyst for that matter, got too specific with the X's and 0's, they would lose the viewers.

  12. #12
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    Bill Belicheck went 11-5 with Matt Cassell. MATT CASSELL.
    Todd Haley went 10-6, won a division and went to the playoffs with matt cassel.

  13. #13
    If you have Gruden, at least you'll go into camp with 15 qbs. He loves collecting them.

  14. #14
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    whoever says no, is dumb.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by PatsFanTX View Post
    Exactly.

    70% of MNF viewers are casual football fans who just root for their team.

    If Gruden, or any analyst for that matter, got too specific with the X's and 0's, they would lose the viewers.
    That's the obvious money side of it.

    From a game perspective, it also behooves Gruden to not spill anything worth spilling on national TV...he knows how hard it is to come up with even the ablest of edges in an NFL game...he wouldn't want to step on any coach's toes by revealing something even as simple as a unique trap run.

  16. #16
    It's pretty widely recognized that Gruden was in cap hell when he took over at Tampa and this limited what moves he could make. Additionally, Tampa paid a huge price to get Gruden, which took away draft picks that would have helped build the team even more.

    Pretty fair write up, in my opinion, about the situation at Wiki :

    After compiling a 4028 win-loss record (including playoffs) in four seasons with the Raiders, Gruden replaced the fired Tony Dungy as head coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in 2002, via a high-stakes trade that included Tampa Bay's 2002 and 2003 first-round draft picks, 2002 and 2004 second-round draft picks, and $8 million in cash.[10] The trade took place for a number of reasons, including Davis' desire for a more vertical passing attack rather than Gruden's horizontal pass attack, the fact that Gruden's contract would expire a year after the trade, and Davis' uncertainty over whether Gruden was worth as much money as his next contract was sure to pay him.[citation needed] Gruden signed a five-year contract with the Buccaneers worth $17.5 million.[10]

    The Bucs' search had taken more than two months, and had proven to be a major embarrassment to the Buccaneer organization. Tampa Bay had expressed an interest in Gruden, but Davis had originally refused to release him from his contract. The team subsequently interviewed several other coaches and believed a deal was in place with Bill Parcells, before Parcells backed out, reportedly because his choice for General Manager, Mike Tannenbaum, told him not to accept the job because of the salary cap difficulties that Tampa Bay was about to endure. With the franchise's search floundering, the coach they wanted having only one year remaining on his deal, and the immediate hire of Dungy by the Indianapolis Colts, many fans and sports commentators began to openly question if the Bucs had made the right move by dismissing Dungy. Only a big splash hire could quiet the storm, and this may have been the primary motivation for the Bucs to give up as much as they did to acquire Gruden.

    Immediately after arriving in Tampa, Gruden significantly retooled the offense with the addition of numerous free agents. His determination to fix the under-performing offense so often maligned during Dungy's tenure inspired Tampa's defense to another #1 ranking, which helped the team to a 124 season. Both the offense and defense hit their stride in the playoffs; the Buccaneers posted a playoff per-game point differential of 23 points per game in victory, tied with the 1992 Dallas Cowboys for the highest average playoff margin of victory by a Super Bowl winner in the free agency era. Fans were especially satisfied with a victory in the NFC Championship game against the Philadelphia Eagles, the team that had defeated Tampa Bay in the Wild Card round two years running by the combined score of 52-12, and Gruden was especially satisfied with a dominant win over his old team, the Raiders, in Super Bowl XXXVII. Despite the Super Bowl win, there were many, including players on the Buccaneers like Warren Sapp, who attributed Gruden's win primarily to the defense that coach Tony Dungy and defensive coordinator Monte Kiffin had created during Dungy's tenure with the Bucs. Gruden, for his part, publicly and graciously thanked Dungy for his contributions upon accepting the Lombardi Trophy at the Super Bowl XXXVII postgame ceremony.

    His mantra for the 2002 season was "Pound the Rock", a reference to never giving up. Gruden even went as far as to display a large chunk of granite in the locker room, a tactic mimicked by the Jacksonville Jaguars. (Their slogan, "Keep choppin' wood", was tainted when punter Chris Hanson injured his leg on an axe brought in to accompany a large log.) Upon returning to Tampa after winning Super Bowl XXXVII, he led a capacity crowd at Raymond James Stadium in chanting the phrase. However, it seemingly disappeared from the lexicon the following year, and was not aggressively marketed or displayed on stadium video boards.

    In the two years following Gruden's Super Bowl win, the Bucs went 79 and 511 respectively, implying to many Dungy supporters that Gruden had simply taken over a strong team and then driven it into the ground. However, the high draft picks sacrificed by the team to acquire Gruden, along with salary-cap issues and failed draft choices forced upon him by the now-departed Rich McKay (with whom Gruden had a bitter relationship) limited Gruden's ability to field the teams he wanted after that successful Super Bowl-winning season. With no emerging talent in the fold and no money to afford replacements, the team was decimated by injuries to many of the Super Bowl stars, including Joe Jurevicius, Greg Spires, Shelton Quarles,and (cornerback), as well as acrimony with highly-paid veterans such as Sapp, Keyshawn Johnson and Keenan McCardell.

  17. #17
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    John Daly is trying to get him to Fayetteville to FIX the Hogs. Hey are buddies and it is not as far fetched as you think. We have top 5 facilities and are adding more.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazorJet View Post
    John Daly is trying to get him to Fayetteville to FIX the Hogs. Hey are buddies and it is not as far fetched as you think. We have top 5 facilities and are adding more.
    As a graduate of two former SWC foes of the Hogs, I will refrain from making any jokes about Arkansas involving shoes/books/inbreeding. That would be wrong and mean spirited.

    Seriously, you guys can do much better than Gruden. First, I don't think he has ever coached at the college level. Second, the college game is dominated by the Spread Option and he is certainly not an expert on that. While I suspect that he would be a good recruiter, you don't know how he will really do chasing after 17 year old boys (No Sandusky Jokes Please).

    If I was running the place, I would take Sonny Dykes ASAP.

    Both my schools (SMU and UT) might be needing coaches after this season, Gruden wouldn't be in my Top 10 for either job. In fact, I am hoping some rich SMU alum will write a very big check to Mr. Dykes so he will lead us into the Big East.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan View Post
    He had the killer instinct when he got close though.

    It was a team Dungy spent ten years building but couldn't win with. Gruden takes it and wins a super bowl with Brad Johnson being the most efficient QB in the league that year if I recall correctly.

    Similarly, Dungy spent 8 years in Indy trying to fit that defense into a Tampa-2 when it had no business trying to be one. Yet he still stumbled his way into a ring because of one of the all time greatest to ever play.
    Yeah, exactly. Dungy is wildly overrated. When Peyton went down that team sucked. Dungy was never able to install a killer D there either. As others have noted as soon as Dungy left Tampa won a ring.

    As for Gruden hopefully we'll find out. He never seemed to have an overabundance of talent to work with as he made his name in the league as opposed to Rex who had wall to wall talent on defense when he was with the ravens.

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