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Thread: Should The Jets Fire Rex Ryan? Both Sides Of The Debate

  1. #1
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    Should The Jets Fire Rex Ryan? Both Sides Of The Debate

    Right now as the Jets continue their slide down into the basement of the AFC East (and FRANKLY the NFL) and into the joke book of every pundit with ASSpirations of making the Jets the BUTT of their jokes, it seems ********* and anyone else with an opinion on the Jets are either at odds or confused as to who is to blame and who if anyone needs to be fired after the season. I think the majority of ********* undoubtedly believes that Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum can no longer escape blame for the failures of this team and has to be relieved of his General Manager duties as soon as possible. I for one certainly agree with that opinion and you probably won’t find too many people rushing to defend Tannenbaum as his FAILURESS are evident and glaring at this point. The difference in opinions regarding the blame within ********* primarily exist when discussing what faults, if any, does HC Rex Ryan play in the Jets FAILURES and if he deserves to be fired. Let’s quickly examine both sides of the argument here and determine which viewpoint, if any, holds more weight/validity than the other to determine if the Jets are better off simply parting pays with Rex Ryan or giving him another off season to try to fix what is wrong with the Jets.


    Why Rex deserves one more season:
    - Rex currently boasts a 36–28 overall record since becoming a head coach which includes 4-2 in the playoffs and 2 trips to the AFC Championship Game in consecutive seasons (2009/2010). That instantly gives him the best playoff record for any head coach in the history of the New York Jets.

    - In 2009 and 2010, the Jets were ranked first and fourth overall in the league in rushing and since Ryan arrived, the Jets defenses have never been ranked lower than sixth overall in the NFL. That’s saying a lot considering the season before Rex arrived, the Jets defense was ranked 29th overall, a vast improvement for the Jets defense to say the least.
    - Rex is working with arguably one of the worst QB situations in the league right now and that’s putting it nicely. Mark Sanchez has struggled to find any kind of positive consistency for this team this season, and some even argue that he has actually been counter-productive, not only for this Jets offense but for the entire Jets team. What makes matters worse is the fact that apparently Sanchez’s backup in Tim Tebow, you know; the QB that the Jets traded a 4th rounder for? has done nothing to gain the trust in the Jets coaching staff, hence the reluctance to even entertain the thought of benching Sanchez for Tebow. That is a problem and that would seemingly make it difficult for any coach to succeed offensively, not just Rex Ryan.

    - It’s widely believed in ********* that Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum hasn’t done much to help Rex personnel wise and that’s a legit argument to say the least. It’s also an argument that speaks for itself as most Rex supporters honestly feels as if Mike Tannenbaum has gradually done Rex Ryan IN with incompetent personnel decisions over the past year and ½.
    Why Rex deserves to be fired:
    2009: 9-7 record. Defeated the Bengals and Chargers in the postseason but lost to the Colts in the AFC Championship
    2010: 11-5 record. Defeated the Colts and Patriots in the postseason but lost to the Steelers in the AFC Championship game.
    2011: 8-8 record. No playoffs
    2012: 4-7 record thus far and no light at the end of the tunnel.
    Simply put; the Jets are moving in the wrong direction LITERALLY. There’s no way anyone can make a legitimate argument that they have seen valid consistent improvement from this Jets team in 3 ½ seasons under Ryan.

    - Rex’s philosophy has FAILED. Rex came onto the job boasting about how he would implement the Ground and Pound philosophy, how the Jets would “pound” their opponent and play great defense. Needless to say; this philosophy has been anything BUT successful and that’s putting it mildly to be honest. Rex’s outdated offensive philosophy has not only been a failure but it’s partly responsible for the inadequate development Mark Sanchez has received since being drafted by the Jets in 2009.

    - Jets defense has ranked no lower than 6th overall since becoming the head coach but does it even feel like it? Rex Ryan was hired on the notion that he was a “defensive genius” and he DOES deserve credit for turning the Jets defense around in one season. As I stated before, the defensive turnaround from 2008 to 2009 is to be commended but the defense since that time has not made the necessary strides that were expected and in fact the defense has actually regressed. Rex inability to find a pass rusher has been the biggest knock on him thus far and has hurt this Jets defense tremendously considering they play in the same division as the best QB in the NFL. Simply put; in a league in which passing the football effectively and rushing the passer consistently is key, the Jets have FAILED in BOTH of those areas consistently under Rex.

    - Mark Sanchez’s development falls directly on the shoulders of Rex Ryan and anyone believing anything to the contrary isn’t being honest with themselves. Say what you want about Mark Sanchez at this point as he’s warrants the criticism he receives but I don’t think its even debatable at this point that Mark Sanchez has received inadequate and counterproductive development since being drafted by the Jets. From day one Rex put the handcuffs on Mark Sanchez and tried to coach this “Ground and Pound” philosophy into Mark Sanchez and when Sanchez’s rookie mistakes started showing up, Rex went from handcuffs to total LOCKDOWN on Sanchez, implementing Operation Color Coded Wrist Band, a colorful piece of “weaponry” that is only to be used when engaging in the “Play NOT to Lose” warfare. That type of counterproductive development falls squarely on the shoulders of the head coach, NO ONE ELSE. Rex should’ve seen what we ALL saw in that the offensive coaching around Sanchez just wasn’t cutting it and there needed to be a change but instead of doing so, Rex allowed Brian Schottenheimer to take the fall and he was done with it. Rex should’ve fired Matt Cavanaugh and hired a QB coach to come to fix Sanchez’s problems as it was painfully obvious that Cavanaugh+Schotty = FAILURE.


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    http://thejetpress.com/2012/11/27/sh...-the-debate/3/

  2. #2
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    We need a change at the top. That means a new gm needs to be brought in. And any gm who is going to be successful is going to want no part of the baffoon that is rex ryan.

    The main reason that no gm is going to want rex is the un needed scrutiny that big mouth buffoon puts on an organization. Rex's mouth puts everyone under an extreme microscope.

    A gm canidate who has any clue is going to want nothing to do with loudmouth rex ryan.

    Any gm that will take this job and keep rex ryan is a clueless canidate and should not be hired.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CraigFL View Post
    Right now as the Jets continue their slide down into the basement of the AFC East (and FRANKLY the NFL) and into the joke book of every pundit with ASSpirations of making the Jets the BUTT of their jokes, it seems ********* and anyone else with an opinion on the Jets are either at odds or confused as to who is to blame and who if anyone needs to be fired after the season. I think the majority of ********* undoubtedly believes that Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum can no longer escape blame for the failures of this team and has to be relieved of his General Manager duties as soon as possible. I for one certainly agree with that opinion and you probably won’t find too many people rushing to defend Tannenbaum as his FAILURESS are evident and glaring at this point. The difference in opinions regarding the blame within ********* primarily exist when discussing what faults, if any, does HC Rex Ryan play in the Jets FAILURES and if he deserves to be fired. Let’s quickly examine both sides of the argument here and determine which viewpoint, if any, holds more weight/validity than the other to determine if the Jets are better off simply parting pays with Rex Ryan or giving him another off season to try to fix what is wrong with the Jets.


    Why Rex deserves one more season:
    - Rex currently boasts a 36–28 overall record since becoming a head coach which includes 4-2 in the playoffs and 2 trips to the AFC Championship Game in consecutive seasons (2009/2010). That instantly gives him the best playoff record for any head coach in the history of the New York Jets.

    - In 2009 and 2010, the Jets were ranked first and fourth overall in the league in rushing and since Ryan arrived, the Jets defenses have never been ranked lower than sixth overall in the NFL. That’s saying a lot considering the season before Rex arrived, the Jets defense was ranked 29th overall, a vast improvement for the Jets defense to say the least.
    - Rex is working with arguably one of the worst QB situations in the league right now and that’s putting it nicely. Mark Sanchez has struggled to find any kind of positive consistency for this team this season, and some even argue that he has actually been counter-productive, not only for this Jets offense but for the entire Jets team. What makes matters worse is the fact that apparently Sanchez’s backup in Tim Tebow, you know; the QB that the Jets traded a 4th rounder for? has done nothing to gain the trust in the Jets coaching staff, hence the reluctance to even entertain the thought of benching Sanchez for Tebow. That is a problem and that would seemingly make it difficult for any coach to succeed offensively, not just Rex Ryan.

    - It’s widely believed in ********* that Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum hasn’t done much to help Rex personnel wise and that’s a legit argument to say the least. It’s also an argument that speaks for itself as most Rex supporters honestly feels as if Mike Tannenbaum has gradually done Rex Ryan IN with incompetent personnel decisions over the past year and ½.
    Why Rex deserves to be fired:
    2009: 9-7 record. Defeated the Bengals and Chargers in the postseason but lost to the Colts in the AFC Championship
    2010: 11-5 record. Defeated the Colts and Patriots in the postseason but lost to the Steelers in the AFC Championship game.
    2011: 8-8 record. No playoffs
    2012: 4-7 record thus far and no light at the end of the tunnel.
    Simply put; the Jets are moving in the wrong direction LITERALLY. There’s no way anyone can make a legitimate argument that they have seen valid consistent improvement from this Jets team in 3 ½ seasons under Ryan.

    - Mark Sanchez’s development falls directly on the shoulders of Rex Ryan and anyone believing anything to the contrary isn’t being honest with themselves. Say what you want about Mark Sanchez at this point as he’s warrants the criticism he receives but I don’t think its even debatable at this point that Mark Sanchez has received inadequate and counterproductive development since being drafted by the Jets. From day one Rex put the handcuffs on Mark Sanchez and tried to coach this “Ground and Pound” philosophy into Mark Sanchez and when Sanchez’s rookie mistakes started showing up, Rex went from handcuffs to total LOCKDOWN on Sanchez, implementing Operation Color Coded Wrist Band, a colorful piece of “weaponry” that is only to be used when engaging in the “Play NOT to Lose” warfare. That type of counterproductive development falls squarely on the shoulders of the head coach, NO ONE ELSE. Rex should’ve seen what we ALL saw in that the offensive coaching around Sanchez just wasn’t cutting it and there needed to be a change but instead of doing so, Rex allowed Brian Schottenheimer to take the fall and he was done with it. Rex should’ve fired Matt Cavanaugh and hired a QB coach to come to fix Sanchez’s problems as it was painfully obvious that Cavanaugh+Schotty = FAILURE.
    You put a lot of time into this thread. You did a nice job.

    But I beg to differ with some things:

    1) The bolded part in your post claims that Rex Ryan hasn't put up any valid consistent improvement since becoming HC. That's wrong. Rex, as you stated, but failed to account for, instantly improved the Jets defense when he came here. He also showed improvement with the team overall as in 2010 their regular season record was 11-5 as compared to their 2009 record which was 9-7. That IS improvement.

    2) There's only so much one person can do in regards to an underperforming QB. Rex Ryan gave Mark Sanchez the best of everything when he was first drafted. He gave him everything a QB could possibly want and more. I believe it aided Mark Sanchez in the early going. It helped him quite a bit and many of us were fooled by those seasons from Mark Sanchez. The fact is, he never got any better even having all of those weapons. So if many fans were fooled into thinking Mark Sanchez was going to become something great, then it is shame on YOU, certainly not shame on Rex.

    The fact is, since a lot of those weapons were taken away from Sanchez, he had the handcuffs taken off, and the CS NEEDED him to make strides. Well, quite frankly after giving him running games and defenses that were among the very best in the league for 2 seasons, he SHOULD have been able to come through for the team after some of those weapons were taken away. You EXPECT your QB to improve after that period.

    Therefore, I think it's a little misguided to imply anything like, Rex didn't do enough for Mark Sanchez. That's a crock of sh*t. He simply didn't have the ability to begin with. Rex is NOT to blame for Mark Sanchez becoming a sh*tty QB. MARK SANCHEZ is to blame for becoming a sh*tty QB.

    Now the fact that Rex continues to have this loyalty to a QB that is clearly done IS Rex's fault. He's ignoring what is best for the team just to be loyal to a kid that doesn't deserve that kind of loyalty. That is why he is at fault.

    And when you say Rex has been stuck with one of the worst QB situations, that implies he had Mark Sanchez forced on him and he couldn't do anything about it. That's not true. It is ALL Rex Ryan's fault that he is in a bad QB situation. No one is stopping Rex Ryan from doing what is best for the team. Benching Mark Sanchez is clearly what is best for the team. Yet, Rex not doing is HIS fault. Furthermore, his unwillingness to even so much as activate Greg McElroy for game day, shows he doesn't even respect the kid. That makes the situation even worse and that is through his own doing.

    3) The defense has become worse during his tenure and that can be nobody's fault except Rex Ryan. We all saw a very capable defense during the preseason. Most of us thought the defense would be ranked in the top 5. That fact that hasn't happened is coaching, The players are there, the coaching just needs to be better.

    The above, by my count is where Rex Ryan has gone wrong. But the rest of the teams faults falls on Mike Tannenbaum. You cannot fault Rex Ryan for having a poor record when you do not give him the players necessary to become a good team. The offense has been seriously neglected during Tanny's reign. He went all in with Mark Sanchez and the fact is, it hasn't worked out.

    What's worse is Tanny has not added any decent talent on offense in some time. It's his fault our OL is not performing like we'd expect. He let two great talents in Alan Faneca and Damien Woody go and he did nothing to try and fill those holes created. He drafted Shonn Greene who has been a major disappointment. He drafted Vladimir Ducasse who has been nothing better than a BUST.

    So IMO at least the blame probably falls more on Tanny's shoulders than it does Rex's. They are both to blame certainly.

    And Woody is NOT to blame at all for these problems. Anyone who says anything otherwise is just making sh*t up in their heads. Tanny and Rex touch base with Woody Johnson daily AS THEY SHOULD. I mean, after all, he does own the f*cking team. However, Woody has just asked to be kept in the loop. He hasn't been meddling with the team as so many here like to claim. That's absurd.

  4. #4
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    You cannot fault Rex Ryan for having a poor record when you do not give him the players necessary to become a good team.
    Im ok with this line of thinking but in that case, you cant blame sparano either. If rex stays, tony stays.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    Im ok with this line of thinking but in that case, you cant blame sparano either. If rex stays, tony stays.
    It's funny because I have been defending Sparano on here & getting killed for it.
    On one hand all the fans agree that Tanny & Rex have ignored the offense, correct?

    Everyone here agrees that after losing Holmes for the season our WRs are the worst group in the league, correct?

    So, with all that lets look at the RBs. Most fans here believe that Shonn Greene would not even be a starter on 30 other teams in this league, correct?

    Plus we all know that McKnight is a terrible blocker & has problems holding onto the ball,
    Correct?

    Keller missed 5 games & Cumberland also missed a few, correct?

    Our best receiver is a slot guy that should be a 3rd reciever on this team in Kerley, correct?

    Bilal Powell has actually been a nice surprise & going forward would probably make a nice change of pace, 3rd down type of back, correct?

    Many times this year, it has been a jail break on our QB where sometimes he hasn't even been able to get to his 3rd step in his drop before he was under pressure, correct?

    It's common knowledge that Sanchez ranks 30th out of 32 QBs, has the most redzone picks in the NFL & probably leads the league in fumbles, passes thrown 10 yards over players heads, passes directly in their facemask, passes 2 inches from the turf, passes to far past the sideline, well you get my point.

    Knowing all this, how is it really possible to evaluate Sparano?

    We were in position in New England to win the game if Hill didn't have stone hands.
    We were even in the Houston game & needed someone, ANYONE to make a freaking play on offence, plays were there but Sanchez MISSED THEM ALL!

    Killing Sparano & calling him a moron is ridiculous when you consider the roster he's working with on offence. If he can get this band of vagabonds to win their next 5, he should be in freaking canton!

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    Keeping the head coach and dumping the GM handicaps the next GM and the owner's time of judgment of the new GM due to every year the current coach stays under the new GM, the owner is hamstrung from properly judging the new GM.

    Regardless, I bet we end up with Bill Polian keeping Rex and hiring Norv Turner as OC next year and this team being dreadful.

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    Sometimes change is not good

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    I agree that things aren't going well, but is coaching really the major problem? It is, for the most part, the players. Not nearly enough playmakers for an NFL team (especially offense). Anyone who knows football can tell you that.

    Rex has shown when he had better talent he could get the team places. Rex's defenses are always great, though not so much this year. Run D is 30, but pass D can still play. But 2011 #5, 2010 #3 and 2009 #1. If you think Rex just forgot how to coach since last season, well think again.

    If the Jets give up on Rex after only 4 seasons and a plus-.500 winning percentage, they will be looking for their 5th head coach of the Woody Era. That ain't good at all. Look at the teams with success -- Giants, Steelers, Pats, Packers, even the Eagles (until this season, but it's obvious after that long Reid and Philly need to split). Those owners were patient with their coaches and it paid off. Do those teams go the playoffs every year? No. And they don't make knee jerk reactions and fire everyone when they don't. Would any of the coaches of those teams take a team with this lack of talent and have them in the playoffs? Not a chance.

    Was Gary Kubiak a good coach at the beginning? The Texans owner saw something despite the struggles (worse struggles than the Jets, btw). Then they started to improve the roster and BAM! One of the best teams in the league.

    Why can't the Jets re-tool the roster but stick with Rex? 4 years is not enough to prove yourself -- especially for a team with this little talent.

    The Jets don't need to get rid of Rex just yet. They need stability in the coaching staff, but someone who has a great football mind making personnel decisions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NYJ37/12 View Post
    Sometimes change is not good
    I agree. This however is not one of those times.

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    No decent GM is going to come on board and inheret Rex...Rex dug his own grave....if Tanny goes then Rex has to go too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetster View Post
    It's funny because I have been defending Sparano on here & getting killed for it.
    On one hand all the fans agree that Tanny & Rex have ignored the offense, correct?

    Everyone here agrees that after losing Holmes for the season our WRs are the worst group in the league, correct?

    So, with all that lets look at the RBs. Most fans here believe that Shonn Greene would not even be a starter on 30 other teams in this league, correct?

    Plus we all know that McKnight is a terrible blocker & has problems holding onto the ball,
    Correct?

    Keller missed 5 games & Cumberland also missed a few, correct?

    Our best receiver is a slot guy that should be a 3rd reciever on this team in Kerley, correct?

    Bilal Powell has actually been a nice surprise & going forward would probably make a nice change of pace, 3rd down type of back, correct?

    Many times this year, it has been a jail break on our QB where sometimes he hasn't even been able to get to his 3rd step in his drop before he was under pressure, correct?

    It's common knowledge that Sanchez ranks 30th out of 32 QBs, has the most redzone picks in the NFL & probably leads the league in fumbles, passes thrown 10 yards over players heads, passes directly in their facemask, passes 2 inches from the turf, passes to far past the sideline, well you get my point.

    Knowing all this, how is it really possible to evaluate Sparano?

    We were in position in New England to win the game if Hill didn't have stone hands.
    We were even in the Houston game & needed someone, ANYONE to make a freaking play on offence, plays were there but Sanchez MISSED THEM ALL!

    Killing Sparano & calling him a moron is ridiculous when you consider the roster he's working with on offence. If he can get this band of vagabonds to win their next 5, he should be in freaking canton!


    It's going to be funny when the Jets win their next 3 games and are back in the playoff hunt. It's a long shot to make it, but I think they get back to 7-7 and we'll see what happens from there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kennyo7 View Post
    I agree. This however is not one of those times.
    I heard the list this morning from Paolantonio for possible coaching replacements for Philly, not one guy impressed me. Id rather have Rex.

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    I heard the list this morning from Paolantonio for possible coaching replacements for Philly, not one guy impressed me. Id rather have Rex.
    We need to get jay gruden at all costs. Have you been paying attention on whats hes doing in cincy? Hes ressurected their offense, groomed a young qb into a budding superstar and has great bloodlines. Hes a great, young offensive mind and you want to keep this loudmouth buffoon around who thinks pounding it up the middle with shonn greene on every play is a way to score points.

    Wake up people!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    We need a change at the top. That means a new gm needs to be brought in. And any gm who is going to be successful is going to want no part of the baffoon that is rex ryan.

    The main reason that no gm is going to want rex is the un needed scrutiny that big mouth buffoon puts on an organization. Rex's mouth puts everyone under an extreme microscope.

    A gm canidate who has any clue is going to want nothing to do with loudmouth rex ryan.

    Any gm that will take this job and keep rex ryan is a clueless canidate and should not be hired.
    +1

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    Rex Ryan is not a head coach. Nor is he a defensive coordinator. He just isn't cerebral enough for those jobs, doesn't know the Xs and Os, isn't thorough enough. His comfort zone is hands on with a subset of players. Really, he's a defensive line coach.

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    Get a real GM first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NYJ37/12 View Post
    I heard the list this morning from Paolantonio for possible coaching replacements for Philly, not one guy impressed me. Id rather have Rex.
    +1

    There aren't any great options out there if they did fire Rex. Cowher is not coming to the Jets. Gruden wants to coach in college. I'm always fearful of the so-called "hot assistants."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    We need to get jay gruden at all costs. Have you been paying attention on whats hes doing in cincy? Hes ressurected their offense, groomed a young qb into a budding superstar and has great bloodlines. Hes a great, young offensive mind and you want to keep this loudmouth buffoon around who thinks pounding it up the middle with shonn greene on every play is a way to score points.

    Wake up people!!!!
    Rex was the next great coordinator not too long ago.

    I would to see this thing play out over the next five games, then make a constructive opinion.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by detjetsfan View Post
    Get a real GM first.
    who??

    We all loved Tanny. Does the guy deserve a pass for one bad year? Just asking, dont explode.

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    Rex was the next great coordinator not too long ago.
    I wouldnt say that. He intervied for the ravens and dolphins job and didnt get either of them.

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