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Thread: A Little Reality Check

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by heymangold View Post
    Do you think it's going to be a good thing for this team to win out, go 9-7, get the 6 seed on the playoffs, then get torn up by the ravens or broncos?
    Making the playoffs would be great. You're a Jets fan and you don't want to make the playoffs? The Giants won the Super Bowl last year at 9-7. We're worse than the Giants. We won't make the Super Bowl. We won't make the playoffs. But we should try.

    After so much time spent at one extreme or another, we're now in the mushy middle of NFL teams, where we can buttfumble it up against the Patriots, drop 50 on the Bills, and contribute to one of the ugliest games in NFL history against the Cardinals. That's just the way it is in the middle.

    We were never bad enough to finish 4-12, and I think that's more than worth the draft spot. We have league average NFL role players in the depth chart and not people who will be bagging groceries in three years. Last two great picks we've had, we've spent them on Mark Sanchez and Vernon Gholston. Mo Wilkerson is quietly a great story this year, I think he grades near the top of the league in his position, and we got him 30th.

    It's not about the playoff push this year, that's not likely to happen. It's about seeing what that depth chart can do for us in the next couple years. Kerley and Wilkinson have been having great years. It would be nice if Hill and Coples picked it up. Maybe we have something in McElroy.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Woo hoo.

    Then we'll be 1-11 against teams that end the year with a winning record since 2010 and that'll make you sleep better at night?

    SAR I
    Funny you blame rex for these losses but not the QB who was actually playing in the games.

    Rex is a buffoon, who IMO should not be here next year, but your schtick of ripping him and "our lack of offensive talent" instead of looking at the most important player on the field and just how terrible he is, wrecks all your credibility.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Funny you blame rex for these losses but not the QB who was actually playing in the games.

    Rex is a buffoon, who IMO should not be here next year, but your schtick of ripping him and "our lack of offensive talent" instead of looking at the most important player on the field and just how terrible he is, wrecks all your credibility.
    Rex Ryan has been very public and very outspoken that he's going to win it in a rebellious manner, he's going to channel the '85 Bears defense and the '59 Packers offense and buck the NFL trend of a powerful airshow.

    This team loses now because our defense is slow and weak and our running game doesn't exist. The quarterback is asked to throw 40 times a game just to move the ball and we're not built for that with such terrible receiving targets.

    I'd be the first to blame the quarterback if I thought he was our biggest issue. He's not. Our defense is a joke and our running game pathetic. Don't ever forget the Patriots contest as that's who this team truly is. Whatever happens in the remainder of this lost season as we play some truly weak teams isn't an indicator of what we are. Don't lose that Thanksgiving feeling.

    As far as your thoughts on "schtick" and "credibility", please read your posts from June, July, and August, tell me what you see.

    SAR I

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Rex Ryan has been very public and very outspoken that he's going to win it in a rebellious manner, he's going to channel the '85 Bears defense and the '59 Packers offense and buck the NFL trend of a powerful airshow.

    This team loses now because our defense is slow and weak and our running game doesn't exist. The quarterback is asked to throw 40 times a game just to move the ball and we're not built for that with such terrible receiving targets.

    I'd be the first to blame the quarterback if I thought he was our biggest issue. He's not. Our defense is a joke and our running game pathetic. Don't ever forget the Patriots contest as that's who this team truly is. Whatever happens in the remainder of this lost season as we play some truly weak teams isn't an indicator of what we are. Don't lose that Thanksgiving feeling.

    As far as your thoughts on "schtick" and "credibility", please read your posts from June, July, and August, tell me what you see.

    SAR I
    Qb isnt the issue? Did you watch the game yesterday? His QB rating was 21 btw and he thew 3 picks in one half. Is that tannebaums fault? Or the oline?

    Any posts you would like to pull from the summer feel free, I was optimistic that Sanchez would show the necessary improvement to make "a leap". I bought into the fact that he had road playoff wins and had shown flashes.

    I thought that having faced the adversity of last year would have hardened him into a true leader who wouldnt make mistakes that killed games. I thought that having a new OC would "take the reins" off him and let him shine.

    However then I allowed my eyes to take over and see that after the buffalo win, he played worse and worse each game. He made the same CRITICAL errors he did as a rookie, and torpedoed games for us, while showing the same lack of fire and leadership ability that he did last year while sunning himself in miami. All culminating in a performance yesterday that was so artocious that it is indescribable.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Rex Ryan has been very public and very outspoken that he's going to win it in a rebellious manner, he's going to channel the '85 Bears defense and the '59 Packers offense and buck the NFL trend of a powerful airshow.

    This team loses now because our defense is slow and weak and our running game doesn't exist. The quarterback is asked to throw 40 times a game just to move the ball and we're not built for that with such terrible receiving targets.

    I'd be the first to blame the quarterback if I thought he was our biggest issue. He's not. Our defense is a joke and our running game pathetic. Don't ever forget the Patriots contest as that's who this team truly is. Whatever happens in the remainder of this lost season as we play some truly weak teams isn't an indicator of what we are. Don't lose that Thanksgiving feeling.

    As far as your thoughts on "schtick" and "credibility", please read your posts from June, July, and August, tell me what you see.

    SAR I
    BTW the defense let up less then 160 yards

    We rushed for 177 and threw 28 passes.

    The reason we were down 6-0 through 3 quarters is your non-at-fault QB was horrendus.

    As for rex's philosophy, find me a coach that says he DOESNT want to play good defense and run the ball well. Just because rex has a big mouth and the NY media routinely touts Ground and Pound, doenst mean the rest of the NFL doesnt want to do the same....they just have QBs who can win if necessary.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    BTW the defense let up less then 160 yards

    We rushed for 177 and threw 28 passes.

    The reason we were down 6-0 through 3 quarters is your non-at-fault QB was horrendus.

    As for rex's philosophy, find me a coach that says he DOESNT want to play good defense and run the ball well. Just because rex has a big mouth and the NY media routinely touts Ground and Pound, doenst mean the rest of the NFL doesnt want to do the same....they just have QBs who can win if necessary.
    True, but they were facing.......wait, who the **** was that guy?

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Translation: We suck. Beating the Cardinals 7-6 is no reason to celebrate.
    SAR I
    along with the victory we celebrate the change of qbs finally.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Qb isnt the issue? Did you watch the game yesterday? His QB rating was 21 btw and he thew 3 picks in one half. Is that tannebaums fault? Or the oline?

    Any posts you would like to pull from the summer feel free, I was optimistic that Sanchez would show the necessary improvement to make "a leap". I bought into the fact that he had road playoff wins and had shown flashes.

    I thought that having faced the adversity of last year would have hardened him into a true leader who wouldnt make mistakes that killed games. I thought that having a new OC would "take the reins" off him and let him shine.

    However then I allowed my eyes to take over and see that after the buffalo win, he played worse and worse each game. He made the same CRITICAL errors he did as a rookie, and torpedoed games for us, while showing the same lack of fire and leadership ability that he did last year while sunning himself in miami. All culminating in a performance yesterday that was so artocious that it is indescribable.
    Throughout the season the majority of Sanchez's mistakes are because the offensive line lets people through to pressure him or receivers are running the wrong routes or can't catch at all. If anything, Mark is guilty of trying to make something happen because nothing else on offense is working. The receivers don't catch, the running backs don't run, and the offensive coordinator is brutal. In many of our games Mark was asked to throw the ball 35 to 45 times, and we are not built for that. It's not Mark Sanchez's fault that we can't run the ball and the offensive line can't block.

    It's not like something magically was going to happen, where all of these lousy scrub players that we knew were on the team since July were suddenly going to become world beaters. When you surround a quarterback with terrible playmakers and then let him get smacked around like a rag doll, he's going to get worse as the season progresses, not better.

    Yesterday was Mark's worst game. I don't know why that surprises you. I don't know why you think he's going to improve this season when he has so little talent around him, has been neglected for years by the front office, and has been given an offensive coordinator who's even worse than Schitty.

    We all agree that Mark is playing badly. That's not the issue. The issue is should he be given another season with the right tools around him and a strong offensive coordinator and a new quarterback coach and see if he can regain the form that we loved so much in the postseason. Finding a franchise quarterback is an impossible task in today's NFL, so if we might have one it's worth seeing that before he goes to some other team and potentially find success there.

    Mark Sanchez 2012 isn't someone you'd want to lead your team. But with that type of low budget talent we surrounded him with, Joe Montana wouldn't of had a good season this year.

    SAR I

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    BTW the defense let up less then 160 yards

    We rushed for 177 and threw 28 passes.

    The reason we were down 6-0 through 3 quarters is your non-at-fault QB was horrendus.

    As for rex's philosophy, find me a coach that says he DOESNT want to play good defense and run the ball well. Just because rex has a big mouth and the NY media routinely touts Ground and Pound, doenst mean the rest of the NFL doesnt want to do the same....they just have QBs who can win if necessary.
    Look, I'm not even going to continue this conversation if you're going to post something as stupid as this.

    1. Yesterday we played the worst quarterback in the NFL, and a team in the middle of an 0-8 train wreck.

    2. Yesterday does not resemble the reason why we lost so many games in the past two years.

    While it's very convenient to talk about only yesterday's game to support your point, it isn't really what's going on here. The defense and the running game stink. That's why we fail, its how a Rex Ryan team is supposed to win, it's how we're built. The quarterback, while playing badly, isn't our biggest issue no matter what yesterday's outcome against a scrub team shows.

    SAR I

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Throughout the season the majority of Sanchez's mistakes are because the offensive line lets people through to pressure him or receivers are running the wrong routes or can't catch at all. If anything, Mark is guilty of trying to make something happen because nothing else on offense is working. The receivers don't catch, the running backs don't run, and the offensive coordinator is brutal. In many of our games Mark was asked to throw the ball 35 to 45 times, and we are not built for that. It's not Mark Sanchez's fault that we can't run the ball and the offensive line can't block.

    It's not like something magically was going to happen, where all of these lousy scrub players that we knew were on the team since July were suddenly going to become world beaters. When you surround a quarterback with terrible playmakers and then let him get smacked around like a rag doll, he's going to get worse as the season progresses, not better.

    Yesterday was Mark's worst game. I don't know why that surprises you. I don't know why you think he's going to improve this season when he has so little talent around him, has been neglected for years by the front office, and has been given an offensive coordinator who's even worse than Schitty.

    We all agree that Mark is playing badly. That's not the issue. The issue is should he be given another season with the right tools around him and a strong offensive coordinator and a new quarterback coach and see if he can regain the form that we loved so much in the postseason. Finding a franchise quarterback is an impossible task in today's NFL, so if we might have one it's worth seeing that before he goes to some other team and potentially find success there.

    Mark Sanchez 2012 isn't someone you'd want to lead your team. But with that type of low budget talent we surrounded him with, Joe Montana wouldn't of had a good season this year.

    SAR I
    +1000000

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post

    1. Yesterday we played the worst quarterback in the NFL, and a team in the middle of an 0-8 train wreck.

    2. Yesterday does not resemble the reason why we lost so many games in the past two years.
    SAR I
    sanchez couldnt beat them we had to turn to greg mcelroy doesnt say too much for mark sanchez.

  12. #52
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    Nonsense, good QBs talent shines through you can see that they have it, make even sh1tty players a little better through their play.

    This QB made no one look better over his 4 years.

    It's as silly as trying to degrade winning seasons by who a team has beaten. I read where the 72 fins played one of it not the easiest schedule ever and no one whines about it as much as our so called fans do.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Look, I'm not even going to continue this conversation if you're going to post something as stupid as this.

    1. Yesterday we played the worst quarterback in the NFL, and a team in the middle of an 0-8 train wreck.

    2. Yesterday does not resemble the reason why we lost so many games in the past two years.

    While it's very convenient to talk about only yesterday's game to support your point, it isn't really what's going on here. The defense and the running game stink. That's why we fail, its how a Rex Ryan team is supposed to win, it's how we're built. The quarterback, while playing badly, isn't our biggest issue no matter what yesterday's outcome against a scrub team shows.

    SAR I
    I post that, not as an indication of the entire picture, but more as yet another example of your penchant for distorting the truth to fit your argument.

    We can run the ball and while not elite, the defense has been ok. Now, in no way, shape or form am I saying rex hasnt made many mistakes in personnell, (looking at you bart scott), but again our problem is and will be mark sanchez.

    He has more INTs then TDs, that is the lines fault? When he stares down a receiver, pump fakes TO THAT WR and then throws to him, is that the WRs fault?

    When mark is holding a clipboard next season maybe then you can place the blame where it belongs.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    I post that, not as an indication of the entire picture, but more as yet another example of your penchant for distorting the truth to fit your argument.

    We can run the ball and while not elite, the defense has been ok. Now, in no way, shape or form am I saying rex hasnt made many mistakes in personnell, (looking at you bart scott), but again our problem is and will be mark sanchez.

    He has more INTs then TDs, that is the lines fault? When he stares down a receiver, pump fakes TO THAT WR and then throws to him, is that the WRs fault?

    When mark is holding a clipboard next season maybe then you can place the blame where it belongs.
    Well if your assessment has been that Rex should be fired and Sanchez is a good QB wouldn't your argument be this lame?

  15. #55
    Thank you for pointing out the Jets suck.....it was hard grasp on a board filled with rainbows and unicorns.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    I don't go back on any prediction, but I did like you better when you ran away from yours. Funny, we suck for months and you are nowhere to be found. We "win" today and it's like you never left. Nice try.

    Winning is a bad thing if you can't beat elite teams or winning teams because you don't win a Super Bowl if you can't beat elite teams. Can't even win our division if we can't split with an elite team.

    In Year 4 of the Ryan regime, with hand-selected players, indulging in a defense-first-rushing-second philosophy, we should be getting better, not worse.

    Translation: We suck. Beating the Cardinals 7-6 is no reason to celebrate.

    SAR I
    Exactly. This whole team is garbage. Led by a buffoon who answers to an *******.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post

    This team loses now because our defense is slow and weak and our running game doesn't exist.
    This team is not as bad as you think it is SAR on defense.

    The running game has shown hope, especially with Powell running the rock. But I agree; a solid RB draft is needed over the next two years. A mid round pick and a high round pick. If you want to run the ball, you have to constantly be drafting players and getting projects via UDFA.

    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Our defense is a joke pathetic.
    I think you are just overreacting here SAR. You are thinking this team should be the 86' Bears because of Rex Ryan's boasting. This defense is pretty good right now, and can be made elite again. I have mentioned how I think it could be with three-four simple moves next year:
    1) Switch to a base 4-3. With Coples, Wilkerson, Ellis, Pouha, Devito, and Harrison, this should be a no-brainer. By doing so, we eliminate Bart Scott, keep Harris in the middle (because we have to thanks to his contract), move Davis to the outside which is more natural.
    2) Draft an OLB. In fact, in my mocks, I have the Jets drafting two OLB's in the first three rounds. Next season, I would be drafting DE's. The Giants have shown you can never draft enough good pass rushers. NEVER.
    3) Trade Revis. Cromartie has shown he can ball.....Kyle Wilson has shown he cannot. Lankster has shown well playing the slot, as has Trufant. Both are good role guys. Aaron Berry was a 1st round pick. He should be able to contribute. Revis is expendable, if for no other reason his contract is going to strap this team. By trading him, and taking a player like Desmond Trufant, this defense could be downright scary in a season and a half.

    I'm all for tinkering with the Defense, and then focusing a bit on Offense. I like Kerley and Hill for what they do, but I think we need the following on Offense:
    Bona-fide #1
    RB
    Pass-catching TE
    Guard
    RT
    QB

    The defense has been deflated the past 16 odd games because of our offense. I think this defense is not that far from being great again, but I think you are looking at a solid draft and 1-2 FA pick-ups, and a solid 2014 draft to get back in the saddle. This offense has been neglected too long.


    SAR I[/QUOTE]

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by njherdfan View Post
    This is a fantastic post. In the 2010 season, I think the Jets had the best roster in the NFL with the exception of QB. At the other 21 positions, the Jets were great. Now, the Jets are an average, at best, team that can feast on bad teams but is SIGNIFICANTLY worse than teams that are championship caliber.

    My worst fear is that the Jets finish 8-8 or 9-7, and we hear "look how well we did despite missing our two best skill position players!!!" This Jets team is not good. The -68 point differential doesn't lie, and if we keep the same people in charge, and bring back Sanchez next season, I think things will be even worse. Generally, teams need to bottom out in a season in order to get good draft picks and cap room etc. I was hoping that would occur this season for the Jets, but it seems like it will happen next year instead, when the Jets play a significantly more difficult schedule (NFC South, AFC North). I was hoping that it would happen this season instead, but we're going to be forced to watch a sub-par team this season, and in all probability, a bad team next season before any real changes are made.
    Great post. Next season will be when we bottom out, although that may be a good thing because the 2014 draft looks to have a couple elite QB prospects and maybe we'll be in line to take one of them. Next year's schedule looks far harder on paper given the divisions we'll be playing. If we somehow finish 2nd in the division, that will only add to the difficulty of the schedule. The short term prospects of this team are not very bright. Just good enough to beat the bad teams, but not even competitive with the contenders. Kind of mired in mediocrity until we can dump Sanchez, replace the front office, dump some cap space, and probably start over at head coach. All that has to wait until 2014 sadly.

  19. #59
    so let me guess, the jets beat the better teams like the ravens or patsies or steelers and then lose to the doltphins and bills and bungles. what does that get them? a sub 500 record too. the point is to succeed a team needs to beat the low teams consistently and then go 500 against the better teams. that formula makes the playoffs every year. thus far the jets came awful close to beating both the texans and the patsies. what if their luck turned and those games were wins? what then?

    the bottom line is rex and the jets aren't nearly as bad as many are making them out to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    Exactly.

    There's nothing worse than having a team you need to root against to ultimately get them to be better, but that's where we are right now.

    SAR I

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by sameoldjets View Post
    so let me guess, the jets beat the better teams like the ravens or patsies or steelers and then lose to the doltphins and bills and bungles. what does that get them? a sub 500 record too. the point is to succeed a team needs to beat the low teams consistently and then go 500 against the better teams. that formula makes the playoffs every year. thus far the jets came awful close to beating both the texans and the patsies. what if their luck turned and those games were wins? what then?

    the bottom line is rex and the jets aren't nearly as bad as many are making them out to be.
    Since the "can't wait!" playoff victory over the Patriots, the Jets are 1-11 against teams that end the season with a winning record.

    Last time I checked, that isn't .500.

    SAR I

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