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Thread: Super Typhoon Bopha hits Phillipines; Death Toll likely > 300

  1. #1
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    Super Typhoon Bopha hits Phillipines; Death Toll likely > 300

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/1...-likely-gt-300


    I was a little surprised that no one had written a diary specifically about Typhoon Bopha (if I missed one please let me know), the largest typhoon to hit the Island of Mindanao (second largest of the islands in the Philippines archipelago) in recorded history.

    Super typhoon Bopha smashed into the southern Philippines island of Mindanao early this morning [Tuesday] with estimated sustained winds of 160 mph and torrential, flooding rains. [...]
    The UK Met office says Bopha was the most intense typhoon on record to strike the island of Mindanao. It adds the storm produced 3.6 inches of rain in 6 hours at Malaybalay, a city on the island.[...]

    Bopha just missed being the closest-to-equator category-five equivalent typhoon on record in the western North Pacific Basin (or any other basin, for that matter), reaching that intensity at 7.4 degrees north latitude Monday morning (U.S. time). Only Typhoon Louise in 1964, becoming a category-five equivalent typhoon at 7.3 degrees north latitude, was closer to the equator.
    The most recent death toll from Bopha is rapidly approaching 300 deaths, with may more people still unaccounted for, and thousands made homeless by the storm and the flooding the resulted.

    (NEW BATAAN, Philippines) — Stunned parents searching for missing children examined a row of mud-stained bodies covered with banana leaves while survivors dried their soaked belongings on roadsides Wednesday, a day after a powerful typhoon killed nearly 300 people in the southern Philippines.
    Officials fear more bodies may be found as rescuers reach hard-hit areas that were isolated by landslides, floods and downed communications. [...]

    ... Bopha roared quickly across the southern Mindanao and central regions, knocking out power in two entire provinces, triggering landslides and leaving houses and plantations damaged. More than 170,000 fled to evacuation centers.



    Perhaps we are becoming immune to the magnitude of such storms, or perhaps because the Philippines is half a world away, it doesn't register with many Americans. Still this one tropical storm was far more deadly that Hurricane Sandy, though Sandy hit a far more densely populated area in our Eastern Seaboard. Nonetheless, Typhoon Bopha (also named Pablo) is a devastating tropical of unusual size and wind speed, particularly for a tropical storm so close to the Equator. Most typhoons in the Northwest Pacific appear at higher latitudes. In that sense Bopha does share something with Hurricane Sandy, which struck much farther north than most hurricanes that originate in the Atlantic or the Caribbean. Typhoons and hurricanes close to the Equator are considered extremely rare, much less a Category 5 storm such as Bopha.Typhoon Bopha shares another thing with Hurrican Sandy - both occurred near the end or outside the typical tropical storm season for their respective geographical regions: Sandy in late October and Bopha in early December.


    In any case, Typhoon Bopha is another extreme weather event for 2012, to go with so many others this year: wildfires in Chile, heat waves and severe droughts across the Western and Midwestern US this year, wildfires in the Western US, extreme snowstorms in Eurasia, Japan and Alaska, damaging derecho thunderstorms in the Midwest and Mid-Atlantic regions of the US, flooding and landslides in Brazil, severe storms and flooding in Australia(the most recent in November), the extreme droughts in Africa, specifically the deadly one in the Sahel region, The warmest winter on record in the Continental US to go with one of the coldest on record in Europe, record sea ice loss in the Arctic, record ice melting in Greenland, etc.

    All of these many extreme weather events caused death, destruction and economic losses. Typhoon Bopha is just another example that our "weird" weather is truly global and that to refer to it as "weird" is now an oxymoron. This is our new planetary normal. Yet we continue to pump gigatons of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, the principal driver of climate change, and the reason climate scientists accept that such extreme weather events are linked to climate change and will continue to occur on and ever more regular basis.

  2. #2
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    Without getting into the whole agenda of your post, the wildfire thing is usually the result of overzealous conservation efforts, i.e. attempting to muck with Mother Nature.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetworks View Post
    Without getting into the whole agenda of your post, the wildfire thing is usually the result of overzealous conservation efforts, i.e. attempting to muck with Mother Nature.

    Actually the wild fires had to do with beetles killing off low value (lodge pole pines) trees. The Western states have been removing the dead trees but there are a tremendous amount of dead trees and the wood has very little market value. Some argue that due to the longer warmer summers in the mountains the beetles now have two generations each summer and therefore kill more trees. Also, Pine trees defend themselves by “pitching out” the bugs. They do this by flushing out the bugs with their sap. Problem is in a drought the trees don’t have the sap due to the lack of water.

    A possible positive effect of all of this is the forests of Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Utah, etc. may become more deciduous like they were during the time of Lewis and Clark.

  4. #4
    Despite the hysterical tone of the quoted article, there is no statistical backing for 2012 being a "worse" year for storms or "severe 'weather' events" than any other in recent times.

    The connection some are trying to make with Climate Change is as weak as weak comes, evidence wise or statistics wise. It's all hype.

    Of course, that never stopped anyone from inflating something for political gain. Because, as we all know, if only we paid a Carbon Tax, this storm in the Philippines would not have occured, right?

    This is our new planetary normal
    No, it's just normal.
    Last edited by Warfish; 12-06-2012 at 08:34 PM.

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    Whatever.

    Ignore the western deserts expanding into the mountain states, ignore the costs of hurricane Sandy and ignore the arctic ice disappearing. Ignore the small western snowpack of last winter.

    That all means nothing! "who you gunna believe Warfish or your own damn LYIN' eyes?"

    It is time for the USA to expand how much water we keep in reserve. It is time to start building regional aqueduct systems. It is time to construct large desalinization plants on the west coast.

    Mother Nature is acting weird and we (and our agriculture industry) depend on her dumping snow in the Rockies every winter. Seems foolish gto me.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Whatever.

    Ignore the western deserts expanding into the mountain states, ignore the costs of hurricane Sandy and ignore the arctic ice disappearing. Ignore the small western snowpack of last winter.

    That all means nothing! "who you gunna believe Warfish or your own damn LYIN' eyes?"

    It is time for the USA to expand how much water we keep in reserve. It is time to start building regional aqueduct systems. It is time to construct large desalinization plants on the west coast.

    Mother Nature is acting weird and we (and our agriculture industry) depend on her dumping snow in the Rockies every winter. Seems foolish gto me.
    Hurf a blurf hysteria.

    Not a single thing you posted is science or proof. It's hysteria and exageration and pure, utter ignorance.

    "Mother Nature" is not acting "wierd" at all, and that phrase itself is laughably primitive.

    "The cost of Sandy"? Sandy was a Cat. 1 Hurricanine. We get 12 of those a year, every year. It track was unlucky, but far from historic or unusual. It's damge is not a reflection of storm, it's a reflection of poorly protected, poorly planned human infrastructure.

    "Lying Eyes", is that like Bitonit claiming that climate change caused the 98 degree day every so often in New York?

    Look, if you want to believe in Climate Change as a Religion, by all means do so. Post like yours are exactly that, a jump from a rational point, to an irrational faith-based viewpoint of superstition, hyperbole and fear.

    Mother nature acting wierd. Lol Buster, thats just too lol for even you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post

    Not a single thing you posted is science or proof. It's hysteria and exageration and pure, utter ignorance.

    The Western Deserts are not expanding?

    Hurricane Sandy didn't cause $60+ billion of damage?

    The arctic ice didn't disappear the last two summers and create a sea lane north of Canada?

    The rocky mountain snowpack wasn't very low last winter?

    I've posted articles showing all these things to be true. While your style of debate is to not post anything, say what I post is false and then call me a name.

    You are awesome. Just keep telling yourself that.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Hurricane Sandy didn't cause $60+ billion of damage?
    What does the amount of damage in today's dollars have to do with the storm in relation fo climate change? Again, Sandy was a Cat. 1 storm on an uncommon, but not that uncommon, path. It was not an unusually strong Hurricaine in any form. It wasn;t even as strong as Gloria in 85'

    If anything, it was an unlucky coincidence/merger with a second storm which had (wait for it) not a single thing to do with climate change in any form whatsoever. The only people who claim so are political-based, not science-based.

    As for the other things, yes, some are happening, some not as much as the hype/hysteria-media claims. So? In either case, simply happening is not proof of man-caused climate change.

    But it's definitely not proof that carbon tax or some wealth redistribution scheme (the ONLY answers I've heard from your side's politicians) can fix it.

    What it comes down to is one side is screaming "END OF THE WORLD" because it was 1 degree warmer today, and demanding we all pay more tax and immediately crush our quality of life to "fix" a problem that is global in nature, poorly understood in terms of cause and effect, and is worth far more for political gain that societal gain.

    Like most Liberals, you do your side, and the issue, a disservice. By clouding the issue with your hype and hysteria, you muddle the argument, and provide ammo for the right to deny your entire climate change position, which is equally bad.
    Last edited by Warfish; 12-06-2012 at 11:22 PM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post

    As for the other things, yes, some are happening,



    We agree that you are wrong and I am right.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    We agree that you are wrong and I am right.
    "I'm bleeding, making me the victor." ~ Wimp Lo, Kung Pow: Enter the Fist.

  11. #11
    Here you go Buster. Save you the effort of copy-pasting the latest hype about severe weather.

    (CNN) -- This past week saw severe weather in many parts of the world that took dozens of lives and left behind serious damage.

    Here's a look at some of the extreme weather stories covered by CNN's global affiliates, including a typhoon in the Philippines and a tornado in New Zealand.

    Unlikely typhoon in the Philippines

    Typhoon Bopha devastated the Compostela Valley region in the southern Philippines early this week. At least 148 people have died and thousands of homes have been destroyed, according to TV5. Typhoons are uncommon in the Bopha region. Watch the video above to see how the storm knocked down power lines.

    Tornado strikes near Auckland

    A tornado ripped through the outskirts of Auckland, New Zealand's largest city, killing three people and leaving more than 200 people injured, according to TVNZ. About 150 homes were left without power.

    Flooding in Argentina's capital

    Heavy rains in the Argentinian capital of Buenos Aires left two people dead, forced evacuations and flooded nearly 9 million acres of farmland, Canal 9 said. See some of the most serious flooding in the video above.

    Hard to see in Chinese province

    Dense fog in the province of Sichuan caused heavy traffic and temporary highway closures in southwestern China. In some areas, visibility was reduced to less than 200 meters. Check out the fog in the video above from CCTV.

    Poland's winter wonderland

    Seven centimeters of snow fell in the city of Lublin on Monday. The snow brought with it temperatures of minus 1 degree Celsius (30 degrees Fahrenheit). In the nearby town of Bialystok, nine cars collided, causing one injury. See the snow in the video above, courtesy of TVN.
    Tornados, Floods, Fog and Snow. There horrible new never seen before, seriously has never happened EVA weather evens have convinced me.

    Please tax my carbon, and send those taxes to Al Gore. He'll know what to do with them.

    Next up, an article that will claim 1/4 inch of rain is "severe weather" and any day with a temperature over 75 degrees is prrof of man-caused cliamate change.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Here you go Buster. Save you the effort of copy-pasting the latest hype about severe weather.



    Tornados, Floods, Fog and Snow. There horrible new never seen before, seriously has never happened EVA weather evens have convinced me.

    Please tax my carbon, and send those taxes to Al Gore. He'll know what to do with them.

    Next up, an article that will claim 1/4 inch of rain is "severe weather" and any day with a temperature over 75 degrees is prrof of man-caused cliamate change.
    What is this fog thing of which you speak? I have never heard of it before. Must be mother nature acting weird.

    Human's lyin' eyes and common sense! ROFLMAO See it never happened before!!!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    The Western Deserts are not expanding?

    Hurricane Sandy didn't cause $60+ billion of damage?

    The arctic ice didn't disappear the last two summers and create a sea lane north of Canada?

    The rocky mountain snowpack wasn't very low last winter?

    I've posted articles showing all these things to be true. While your style of debate is to not post anything, say what I post is false and then call me a name.

    You are awesome. Just keep telling yourself that.

    Hey, weather/climate has never been better in South Carolina. A pleasure. No snow, hurricanes or tornadoes (not bad ones anyway).
    For those living in areas susceptible - move. Live on an earthquake faultline, cliff hill overhang or side of an active volcano? Not too bright either.

  14. #14
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    Here ya go Busterbot:


    Extreme weather & superstition

    By RALPH B. ALEXANDER
    Last Updated: 11:05 AM, December 10, 2012
    Posted: 11:01 PM, December 9, 2012

    Superstorm Sandy. Parching drought across North America. A scorching midsummer heat wave in the Midwest. All these weather extremes are telltale signs that CO2 causes climate change, according to global warmists.

    Indeed, the global climate-change nomenklatura gathered last week in Doha, Qatar eagerly (if grimly) cited Typhoon Bopha, which had just wreaked carnage in the Philippines, as the latest proof.

    But it’s not. The link between extreme weather and global warming has as much scientific basis as the pagan rite of human sacrifice to ensure a good harvest.

    Yes, the supposed connection between unusual weather events and global warming is often taken as self-evident.

    It’s even been propounded in scientific papers — but not persuasively. A recent paper from Goddard Institute for Space Science chief James Hansen, for example, was quickly debunked by climate scientists on both sides of the global-warming debate.

    No, the main fodder for the claim is its repetition by climate amateurs, such as New York Times columnist Paul Krugman.

    The fact is that anomalous weather events, such as hurricanes, heat waves, floods, droughts and killer tornadoes, show no long-term trend whatsoever over more than a century of reliable data. Weather extremes have occurred from time immemorial, long before industrialization boosted the CO2 level in the atmosphere.

    For that matter, even if there had been an uptick in extreme weather, the claim that global warming’s the cause would have to contend with the inconvenient truth that global temperatures haven’t risen for the last decade or more.

    Extremes are a natural part of our climate, which constantly changes and is rarely stable for extended periods. In fact, weather extremes are the “old normal,” not a “new normal,” as UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon proclaimed in Qatar.

    Why can’t so many rational, well-educated people understand this simple fact? The answer may be superstition.

    Superstition, which is rooted in fear and thought to emanate from the reptilian portion of our brains, has been part of the human psyche ever since the emergence of self-awareness in early mankind. Since then, we humans have learned to speak, write, read and live together in comparative peace. But we’re still superstitious.

    Superstition about the weather in particular is hardly surprising, given the awesome power of nature. Witnessing storms, lightning and even the daily rising and setting of the sun surely induced fear and wonder in primitive cultures. The same fear and wonder are what warmists exploit today in linking weather extremes to global warming.

    Scholars tell us that weather superstition often found expression in ritual human sacrifice. The Mayans, for instance, tossed victims into a limestone sinkhole to appease the rain god Chaac.

    And it’s only a few centuries since superstition over the climate led to intensive witch hunts and widespread executions, usually by burning, for witchcraft.

    University of Chicago economist Emily Oster demonstrated in 2004 that the most active era of witchcraft trials in Europe coincided with the Little Ice Age. Since then, other researchers have argued that chilly weather may have precipitated the Salem witch trials in the 1690s — one of the coldest periods of that epoch.

    It was widely believed during the late Middle Ages that witches were capable of controlling the weather with their magic powers, and thus cause storms that could destroy harvests and hobble food production.

    Things aren’t so different now. The same predisposition for superstition that caused medieval populations to fear and hunt witches can explain today’s hysteria over extreme weather. The present temperature trend is a good example. Global warmists constantly ignore the trend, labeling the flattening or even slight decline in global temperatures since 2001 or earlier as a “hiatus.”

    Our obsession with weather extremes has reached such heights that it has become a knee-jerk reaction for climate-change alarmists to ascribe any unusual weather event at all to global warming. So they tell us that heat waves, floods, harsh winters, dust storms — even wildfires — are all the result of man-made CO2. But a check of records from, say, the 1930s or the 1950s, when the CO2 level was much lower than now, reveals that such events are nothing new.

    Climate-change skeptics might be regarded as modern-day witches because they think that global warming comes from natural forces. However, it’s superstitious alarmists, who believe that extreme weather originates in our CO2 emissions and who have a dread of impending disaster, who are really the witches.

    Ralph B. Alexander is a physicist and the author of “Global Warming False Alarm.”

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    Hey, weather/climate has never been better in South Carolina. A pleasure. No snow, hurricanes or tornadoes (not bad ones anyway).
    For those living in areas susceptible - move. Live on an earthquake faultline, cliff hill overhang or side of an active volcano? Not too bright either.
    Cept for the drought

    http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/monitor.html

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by quantum View Post
    Here ya go Busterbot:


    Climate-change skeptics might be regarded as modern-day witches because they think that global warming comes from natural forces. However, it’s superstitious alarmists, who believe that extreme weather originates in our CO2 emissions and who have a dread of impending disaster, who are really the witches.

    Ralph B. Alexander is a physicist and the author of “Global Warming False Alarm.”




    The man thinks "Global Warming" is occurring.

    So do i.


    I just propose we take some rational steps to insure the USA has enough water. Prepare our "low-lying" population centers for what may come. To me this is clearly a common sense response to the issue. It is also an approach that moves to remedy some of the issues that are occurring that both left and right can agree on.

  17. #17
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    So if I say "Crazy people think the earth is flat because God squeezed this planet", it really means the earth is flat for an entirely different reason?


  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    I just propose we take some rational steps to insure the USA has enough water.
    Such as?

    Prepare our "low-lying" population centers for what may come.
    How?

    To me this is clearly a common sense response to the issue.
    If you can provide a computer model that predicts, to a high degree of accuracy, what the sea level in New York will be in say, 2025, and the specifics of the U.S. climate overall in that year (avg. temps, sea levels elsewhere, weather repurcussions in specificity, etc) and be mostly right.....then I'd agree with you.

    No such computer model has a proven record of success thus far.

    Making large, wholesale sociateal and economic changes, and engaging in large-scale international wealth redistribution, without such a track record of success is unjustified. Prove the science with acurate predictive models and a record of success after success, without ignoring or failing to account for all the varaibles, and you will have an unassailable argument.
    Last edited by Warfish; 12-13-2012 at 02:00 PM.

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