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Thread: 2012 New York Jets Postmortem

  1. #1

    2012 New York Jets Postmortem

    Well, that sucked. No other way to put it.

    No shortage of responsabillity to throw around, top of the organization to the bottom.

    Woody Johnson -- If it's true he forced the Tebow aquisition, it's unacceptable. If there was any pressure to aquire him or (worse) to play him against the coaching staffs wishes, it's unacceptable. We all know more is forced on teams by owners than we fans probably know or realize, but this move will go down in Jets history as one of the least considered, and least effective, at the QB position (or any position) in Franchise history.

    Tanny -- As GM, he had to be strong enough to say no to Tebow is Ryan didn't want him, and the evidence seems to clearly show that Ryan did not want him. Worse, he bears primary responsabillity for drafting Mark Sanchez, and extending Mark Sanchez and thus tying us to a failed QB for another year.

    Rex Ryan -- His loyalty to "his guys" is somethign than can be so good, or so bad, but it's turned out so bad. He stuck with Mark Sanchez far far longer than Sanchez's play warranted. This, above all else, is his failure and responsabillity, and the primary reason he will get fired, if he is.

    Secondly, while he's provided us with a legitimate contender on Defense every year, his total abdication (seemingly) on offense, or worse, his pressure driving our O to be what it is, is inexcusable. He simply had to do more to make our O competative before this season, and clearly he did not. The many inexcusable errors in judgement, playing Tebow as he was played, staying with Sanchez, not using a more rotation-based RB committee till too late, etc, all are problems that cannot be tolerated.

    Rex has certainly shown he can create and manage an elite defense, and I truly believe he's assisted in drafting and eveloping some great talent of Defense. We have a host of growing young talent (wilkerson, Coples, Ellis, etc) and have no doubt that if Rex is retained, our Defense will be good again next year. But the O is a total failure, again, as it's been almost every year under Rex's leadership, and a Head Coach cannot be so singularly one-sided.

    Sparano -- My Dolphins Fan brother was right, he was horrific. Of course, there isn't mcuh he can do with Sanchez.

    Mark Sanchez -- Put simply, he is the worst starting QB in the NFL the past four years, and I reject all the many many excuses now being bandied about to defend him.

    He has no vision, routinely missing open recievers. He has no pocket presense, routinely sitting there till sacked regardless of protection. He fails to feel or see pressure, or to react to it by throwing it away. He is inaccurate to a degree unacceptable in the NFL. he is a living turnover machine, with over 80 turnovers lifetime, and over 50 the past two years. He is almost singlehandedly the cause for our failures in 2011 and 2012.

    Worst of all, he is no leader, as his attitude on the field and off so clearly shows. He cannot rise to overcome adversity. He cannot handle even moderate competition. He is supremely easy to knock out of his game.

    He must go, he must. He is utterly unsalvageable. If we had had even a moderate talent at QB, we're a playoff team in bioth 2011 and 2012, of that I have no doubt whatsoever.

    The Rest -- I am aware of how unpopular this opinion is, especially now, but I do not believe we need to wholesale destroy the rest of this team. Yes, we're weaker at WR than we'd like to be, fine. But I truly believe our O-line is perfectly fine, our trio of backs is acceptable for winning games if used right, and our defense is absolutely fine as it is, with only minor/usual offseason changes and turnover.

    The worst thing I can see coming is a complete changeover/rebuild, destroying this Defense. Soem weak attempt to salvage Sanchez due to previous bad fiscal decisions, and a spurging of draft picks on RB's and WR's that will not fix our problem. The result of such an overhaul is surely a Kotite-like season in 2013 and 2014 and then who knows what beyond.

    If I were Woody Johnson, I would do the following:

    A. I would bench Mark Sanchez, and start Greg McElroy the rest of 2012.

    B. I would play all of my young talent full-time the rest of this season. veterans would be benched in favor of young draft picks and pre-season style heavy evaluation for 2013.

    Then, in the offseason:

    1. Demote Tannenbaum (or fire him outright if he refuses). And fire Terry Bradway. I would hire a more experienced player-personel General manager, there are a number fo possible chocies available at current, although all are somewhat old now.

    2. Fire Tony Sparano. He failed.

    3. Inform Rex Ryan that 2013 will be his final season if the Jets do not make a deep playoff run and a legitimate contender's season. Yes, despite his failings, I keep him one more year (horrificly unpopular, I know).

    4. I would find a way, any way, to remove Mark Sanchez from my roster. If that could not be done, Mark Sanchez would be the listed #3 for the entire 2013 season, and would not be active unless our #1 and #2 were injured.

    5. I would cut Tim Tebow at the end of the Season.

    6. I would look for a strong, pro-offensive-minded O-Co/Asst. Head Coach to come in and fix our Offense. No tricks or twists, just good, solid, NFL-style football. It's fine to be a big fan of running the ball, but we must achieve a legitimate NFL passing Offense to win.

    7. I would look to upgrade at QB, WR, RB, LB (especially pass rusher). I would look to trade Holmes if possible as part of this effort (I know, cap issues make this almost impossible, same as Sanchez).

    8. I would go into 2013 with a more balanced run/pass, ball control offense, with a QB who is not prone to turnovers. A Pennington-esque style Offense even. I would retain the trifecta of Greene/Powell/McKnight, as I believe used correctly this trio can be productive on the ground. If I have to replace one, it's Greene.

    These past two years have been some of the hardest to watch, not because we abjectly pathetic a la Kotite, but because we really had enough IMO to win games and compete, and it was all brought down by our supposed franchise QB, our stubborn and one-sided Head Coach, and the ongoing failure (now years old) on offense.

    So blow it up, if thats whats needed. Fire Tanny. Fire Rex (even if I wouldn't). Absolutely get rid of Sanchez. But by god, please, try and keep that defense....it's all we have right now, it and our talent on O-line. Rebuild the Offense from the ground up as needed, based on the talent on that O-line first, and around what talent we do have.

    I know some folks think this is teh best thing that could happen. I guess we'll see. Grass is always greener, and right now the grass on our side is brown and dead.

    Disgusted still, even now the next day. /spit

  2. #2
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    If Rex stays, Sparano stays. Head coaches do not get to go through 3 OCs in 3 years.

  3. #3
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    If we don't re-sign Landry I will have a conniption.

    I say we trade Revis and Mangold.

    All we need is an average QB. Purchase a mid-level pass rusher and WR.

    We will be in playoffs in 2013 if we get average QB play.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Well, that sucked. No other way to put it.

    No shortage of responsabillity to throw around, top of the organization to the bottom.

    Woody Johnson -- If it's true he forced the Tebow aquisition, it's unacceptable. If there was any pressure to aquire him or (worse) to play him against the coaching staffs wishes, it's unacceptable. We all know more is forced on teams by owners than we fans probably know or realize, but this move will go down in Jets history as one of the least considered, and least effective, at the QB position (or any position) in Franchise history.

    Tanny -- As GM, he had to be strong enough to say no to Tebow is Ryan didn't want him, and the evidence seems to clearly show that Ryan did not want him. Worse, he bears primary responsabillity for drafting Mark Sanchez, and extending Mark Sanchez and thus tying us to a failed QB for another year.

    Rex Ryan -- His loyalty to "his guys" is somethign than can be so good, or so bad, but it's turned out so bad. He stuck with Mark Sanchez far far longer than Sanchez's play warranted. This, above all else, is his failure and responsabillity, and the primary reason he will get fired, if he is.

    Secondly, while he's provided us with a legitimate contender on Defense every year, his total abdication (seemingly) on offense, or worse, his pressure driving our O to be what it is, is inexcusable. He simply had to do more to make our O competative before this season, and clearly he did not. The many inexcusable errors in judgement, playing Tebow as he was played, staying with Sanchez, not using a more rotation-based RB committee till too late, etc, all are problems that cannot be tolerated.

    Rex has certainly shown he can create and manage an elite defense, and I truly believe he's assisted in drafting and eveloping some great talent of Defense. We have a host of growing young talent (wilkerson, Coples, Ellis, etc) and have no doubt that if Rex is retained, our Defense will be good again next year. But the O is a total failure, again, as it's been almost every year under Rex's leadership, and a Head Coach cannot be so singularly one-sided.

    Sparano -- My Dolphins Fan brother was right, he was horrific. Of course, there isn't mcuh he can do with Sanchez.

    Mark Sanchez -- Put simply, he is the worst starting QB in the NFL the past four years, and I reject all the many many excuses now being bandied about to defend him.

    He has no vision, routinely missing open recievers. He has no pocket presense, routinely sitting there till sacked regardless of protection. He fails to feel or see pressure, or to react to it by throwing it away. He is inaccurate to a degree unacceptable in the NFL. he is a living turnover machine, with over 80 turnovers lifetime, and over 50 the past two years. He is almost singlehandedly the cause for our failures in 2011 and 2012.

    Worst of all, he is no leader, as his attitude on the field and off so clearly shows. He cannot rise to overcome adversity. He cannot handle even moderate competition. He is supremely easy to knock out of his game.

    He must go, he must. He is utterly unsalvageable. If we had had even a moderate talent at QB, we're a playoff team in bioth 2011 and 2012, of that I have no doubt whatsoever.

    The Rest -- I am aware of how unpopular this opinion is, especially now, but I do not believe we need to wholesale destroy the rest of this team. Yes, we're weaker at WR than we'd like to be, fine. But I truly believe our O-line is perfectly fine, our trio of backs is acceptable for winning games if used right, and our defense is absolutely fine as it is, with only minor/usual offseason changes and turnover.

    The worst thing I can see coming is a complete changeover/rebuild, destroying this Defense. Soem weak attempt to salvage Sanchez due to previous bad fiscal decisions, and a spurging of draft picks on RB's and WR's that will not fix our problem. The result of such an overhaul is surely a Kotite-like season in 2013 and 2014 and then who knows what beyond
    .

    If I were Woody Johnson, I would do the following:

    A. I would bench Mark Sanchez, and start Greg McElroy the rest of 2012.

    B. I would play all of my young talent full-time the rest of this season. veterans would be benched in favor of young draft picks and pre-season style heavy evaluation for 2013.

    Then, in the offseason:

    1. Demote Tannenbaum (or fire him outright if he refuses). And fire Terry Bradway. I would hire a more experienced player-personel General manager, there are a number fo possible chocies available at current, although all are somewhat old now.

    2. Fire Tony Sparano. He failed.

    3. Inform Rex Ryan that 2013 will be his final season if the Jets do not make a deep playoff run and a legitimate contender's season. Yes, despite his failings, I keep him one more year (horrificly unpopular, I know).

    4. I would find a way, any way, to remove Mark Sanchez from my roster. If that could not be done, Mark Sanchez would be the listed #3 for the entire 2013 season, and would not be active unless our #1 and #2 were injured.

    5. I would cut Tim Tebow at the end of the Season.

    6. I would look for a strong, pro-offensive-minded O-Co/Asst. Head Coach to come in and fix our Offense. No tricks or twists, just good, solid, NFL-style football. It's fine to be a big fan of running the ball, but we must achieve a legitimate NFL passing Offense to win.

    7. I would look to upgrade at QB, WR, RB, LB (especially pass rusher). I would look to trade Holmes if possible as part of this effort (I know, cap issues make this almost impossible, same as Sanchez).---I would use McElroy in 2013

    8. I would go into 2013 with a more balanced run/pass, ball control offense, with a QB who is not prone to turnovers. A Pennington-esque style Offense even. I would retain the trifecta of Greene/Powell/McKnight, as I believe used correctly this trio can be productive on the ground. If I have to replace one, it's Greene.

    These past two years have been some of the hardest to watch, not because we abjectly pathetic a la Kotite, but because we really had enough IMO to win games and compete, and it was all brought down by our supposed franchise QB, our stubborn and one-sided Head Coach, and the ongoing failure (now years old) on offense.

    So blow it up, if thats whats needed. Fire Tanny. Fire Rex (even if I wouldn't). Absolutely get rid of Sanchez. But by god, please, try and keep that defense....it's all we have right now, it and our talent on O-line. Rebuild the Offense from the ground up as needed, based on the talent on that O-line first, and around what talent we do have.

    I know some folks think this is teh best thing that could happen. I guess we'll see. Grass is always greener, and right now the grass on our side is brown and dead.

    Disgusted still, even now the next day. /spit
    Good post, especially the stuff in bold

  5. #5
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    We will contend in 2013.
    No, no, no! We need to do this the right way.

    2013 = new gm, new coach, young players. We finish 2-14 and get the #1 pick in the draft.

    2014 = 5-11. Young guys get a ton of experience and we get more high draft picks.

    2015 = The Brady decline is in full force and we now have the young guns to field a playoff football team again.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    If Rex stays, Sparano stays. Head coaches do not get to go through 3 OCs in 3 years.
    Then, no joke, I will not. No f**king way I watch Sparano for another year. He is not a qualified OC. Not by a mile.

    But it's moot, anyway. Rex and all his coaches are toast.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    If we don't re-sign Landry I will have a conniption.

    I say we trade Revis and Mangold.

    All we need is an average QB. Purchase a mid-level pass rusher and WR.

    We will be in playoffs in 2013 if we get average QB play.
    But we won't be a SB contender until we find a franchise QB. That should be priority #1. Yes, getting a mid-level QB will make us a playoff contender and make the team more watchable, but we won't be a 12-13 win team until we can get an elite player at the QB position. The team needs to swing and swing and swing again until we get one.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    But I truly believe our O-line is perfectly fine, our trio of backs is acceptable for winning games if used right, and our defense is absolutely fine as it is, with only minor/usual offseason changes and turnover.
    Good post and I agree with above.

    I'd also throw Revis into the discussion. I'm OK with trading him for N1 WR or legit veteran QB or draft picks.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlickBri481 View Post
    But we won't be a SB contender until we find a franchise QB. That should be priority #1. Yes, getting a mid-level QB will make us a playoff contender and make the team more watchable, but we won't be a 12-13 win team until we can get an elite player at the QB position. The team needs to swing and swing and swing again until we get one.
    I completely agree. I just don't think there are any franchise QBs in this draft or on other rosters. I think that shooting for an average QB in 2013 is the best way to go.

    Bring in an average veteran. Draft a QB in 3rd or 4th and have a three way competition with McElroy in camp.

    Hopefully 2014 has some better prospects and we can shoot for a franchise QB then. But I agree about keep getting QBs until we find one. Most of all, we need a regime that knows offense.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by RaoulDuke View Post
    Good post and I agree with above.

    I'd also throw Revis into the discussion. I'm OK with trading him for N1 WR or legit veteran QB or draft picks.
    Can we really get value for him coming off his injury?

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    If we don't re-sign Landry I will have a conniption.

    I say we trade Revis and Mangold.

    All we need is an average QB. Purchase a mid-level pass rusher and WR.

    We will be in playoffs in 2013 if we get average QB play.
    Trade Mangold? Why? You just open up a gaping hole on the oline.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    I completely agree. I just don't think there are any franchise QBs in this draft or on other rosters. I think that shooting for an average QB in 2013 is the best way to go.

    Bring in an average veteran. Draft a QB in 3rd or 4th and have a three way competition with McElroy in camp.

    Hopefully 2014 has some better prospects and we can shoot for a franchise QB then. But I agree about keep getting QBs until we find one. Most of all, we need a regime that knows offense.
    Well even if Rex survives this year, given cap constraints and huge question mark at QB for 2013, it seems headed towards non-playoff season and Rex won't survive that. So at some point probably in the near future, a new regime will be here.

  13. #13
    I know this is not a popular choice but all year the one guy that comes to mind is Polian.

    People on here have used the excuse that he was only good because he had Manning, he's built three teams, Bills, Panthers, Colts.

    My feeling about Polian is that he's a no nonsense guy that doesn't waver. The biggest problem with this Jets organization as it stands is that there isn't one guy making "FINAL" decisions based on what they see.

    You build a team BACK UP by strengthening it's core. I agree that you don't go into a draft thinking that if you draft all skill players you'll be good team (Lions anyone).

    Jets need to continue to get the Oline at it's optimum!
    DBrick was a wall last night. Mangold needs to step it back up! but the foundation is there & for a new QB to have success in a low risk, high % offense, we need a really strong line.

    The defense is good enough to be a "playoff" defense, especially with the return of Revis.
    The missing pc has been a bona fide pass rusher. Lets pray this is the draft we get that guy.
    With the amount of contracts coming off the books next year & 2014, next year should be a draft that is all about building a strong Oline & getting the LBs we need.
    All the late picks can be offensive flyers, or "potential" if you will.

    Finally the QB. After what we witnessed this year no one would argue that Sanchez is DONE as the starting QB for the NY Jets.
    Many people here believe that Mark & his agent will not redo a contract to get out of dodge, I don't believe that at all.
    One look at his face & you can tell he's tired.
    Jets will have to eat some of his contract but I do see a scenario that moves him out of NY.
    Make it clear that he is the backup. End of story. Someone mentioned the players association getting involved? Seriously?
    He was by far the worst QB in the league this year other than that dude in Arizona.
    He's a cancer on the Jets right now.
    He is an incredibly selfish player! 5 more TOs! 2 in the last 5 minutes on FIRST DOWN!
    Throw the ball away & live for another play!
    He can't do it!
    Throws off his back foot, lobs into triple coverage, he couldn't even hit Greene on a simple 6 yard throw to a wideopen RB without throwing BEHIND HIM!
    I have watched football for many, many years, & I have to say, that was the worst showing by a QB that I have ever seen.
    We had 18 yards passing in the 1st half I think.
    He couldn't even make a simple throw to Cumberland without making him have to go low & dig it up.
    Sar keeps telling us it's the team around him.
    I say that if Macelroy had been the starter & had every camp rep, Jets would be in the playoffs.
    5 TOs in a must win game!
    Parcells would have benched him after the 2nd pick.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borgoguy View Post
    Then, no joke, I will not. No f**king way I watch Sparano for another year. He is not a qualified OC. Not by a mile.

    But it's moot, anyway. Rex and all his coaches are toast.
    Before last night's game, I'd have disagreed with you on this.

    But I agree now. After the Cardinals game there was a report that Woody wanted McElroy to start. Rex went with Sanchez, and it cost us a shot at the playoffs. Cimini tweeted that when approached by reporters after the game, Woody said he wouldn't speak until after the season ended. To me that sounds like he's going to do a whole lot of firing on Black Monday.

    Tanny, Rex, and the entire coaching staff are done.
    Last edited by Sourceworx; 12-18-2012 at 11:09 AM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
    Trade Mangold? Why? You just open up a gaping hole on the oline.
    He is trending downwards, is not the leader we need him to be on offense and has some trade value. The difference between the great Centers and the average ones is not a large one.

    I don't think it will ever happen given the cap #, but it is just another example of us placing valuable resources in positions that non-essential IMO. Mangold and Harris are perfect examples.

    BTW, this is not b.c of the snap, I blame Sanchez for that.. Last year he was out of shape and this year he is not getting the push he used to get in years past and his pass blocking is not as good.

  16. #16
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    This begins and ends with the change of GM. Once a new GM is in retained then everyone and I do mean everyone serves at his pleasure until their contracts are up or until he decides to let them go.

    None of this change the GM but keep this guy or that guy rubbish.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetster View Post
    I know this is not a popular choice but all year the one guy that comes to mind is Polian.

    People on here have used the excuse that he was only good because he had Manning, he's built three teams, Bills, Panthers, Colts.

    My feeling about Polian is that he's a no nonsense guy that doesn't waver. The biggest problem with this Jets organization as it stands is that there isn't one guy making "FINAL" decisions based on what they see.

    You build a team BACK UP by strengthening it's core. I agree that you don't go into a draft thinking that if you draft all skill players you'll be good team (Lions anyone).

    Jets need to continue to get the Oline at it's optimum!
    DBrick was a wall last night. Mangold needs to step it back up! but the foundation is there & for a new QB to have success in a low risk, high % offense, we need a really strong line.

    The defense is good enough to be a "playoff" defense, especially with the return of Revis.
    The missing pc has been a bona fide pass rusher. Lets pray this is the draft we get that guy.
    With the amount of contracts coming off the books next year & 2014, next year should be a draft that is all about building a strong Oline & getting the LBs we need.
    All the late picks can be offensive flyers, or "potential" if you will.

    Finally the QB. After what we witnessed this year no one would argue that Sanchez is DONE as the starting QB for the NY Jets.
    Many people here believe that Mark & his agent will not redo a contract to get out of dodge, I don't believe that at all.
    One look at his face & you can tell he's tired.
    Jets will have to eat some of his contract but I do see a scenario that moves him out of NY.
    Make it clear that he is the backup. End of story. Someone mentioned the players association getting involved? Seriously?
    He was by far the worst QB in the league this year other than that dude in Arizona.
    He's a cancer on the Jets right now.
    He is an incredibly selfish player! 5 more TOs! 2 in the last 5 minutes on FIRST DOWN!
    Throw the ball away & live for another play!
    He can't do it!
    Throws off his back foot, lobs into triple coverage, he couldn't even hit Greene on a simple 6 yard throw to a wideopen RB without throwing BEHIND HIM!
    I have watched football for many, many years, & I have to say, that was the worst showing by a QB that I have ever seen.
    We had 18 yards passing in the 1st half I think.
    He couldn't even make a simple throw to Cumberland without making him have to go low & dig it up.
    Sar keeps telling us it's the team around him.
    I say that if Macelroy had been the starter & had every camp rep, Jets would be in the playoffs.
    5 TOs in a must win game!
    Parcells would have benched him after the 2nd pick.

    The book on Polian is that he would never come here because he doesn't take criticism too well. Look at the markets he was in - pretty much cupcake territory compared to what he can expect here in NY.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    He is trending downwards, is not the leader we need him to be on offense and has some trade value. The difference between the great Centers and the average ones is not a large one.

    I don't think it will ever happen given the cap #, but it is just another example of us placing valuable resources in positions that non-essential IMO. Mangold and Harris are perfect examples.

    BTW, this is not b.c of the snap, I blame Sanchez for that.. Last year he was out of shape and this year he is not getting the push he used to get in years past and his pass blocking is not as good.

    He is not the tough SOB Mawae was. Pretty hard to live up to though.
    I've def soured on the whole line, but you can't change it all at once.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    If we don't re-sign Landry I will have a conniption.

    I say we trade Revis and Mangold.

    All we need is an average QB. Purchase a mid-level pass rusher and WR.

    We will be in playoffs in 2013 if we get average QB play.

    The Jets would have made the playoffs last year and this year as well with just average, mediocre QB play.

    Rex has his flaws deserves to be criticized for sticking with Sanchez for so long, but it'd be nice to see what he could do as a coach without being handicapped by having the worst starting QB in the league
    Last edited by w0mbat; 12-18-2012 at 12:23 PM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by w0mbat View Post
    Rex has his flaws and deserves to be criticized for sticking with Sanchez for so long, but the Jets would have made the playoffs last year and this year as well with just average, mediocre QB play.
    By now, Drew Stanton would have been cemented in as our starter for Wildcard Weekend. I can't imagine how hard Stanton is laughing watching this mess from afar.

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