# Thread: PSL Exodus is coming.....

1. Originally Posted by DUNCCFP
Youre math is off a little bit
8 games, 4 seats, \$125 per seat, \$500 per game, \$4,000 per season.

8 Games = \$4,000 expense
2 Elite Games = \$2,000 income
2 Dog Games = \$500 income

\$4,000 - \$2,500 = \$1,500 to attend remaining 4 games.

\$1,500 / 16 seats = \$94 out of pocket = below face.

I'll still go to half the games, will miss the elite games, will miss the dog games. The Saints come to town too, might be more income for that as an elite game as well.

SAR I

2. Originally Posted by SAR I
8 games, 4 seats, \$125 per seat, \$500 per game, \$4,000 per season.

8 Games = \$4,000 expense
2 Elite Games = \$2,000 income
2 Dog Games = \$500 income

\$4,000 - \$2,500 = \$1,500 to attend remaining 4 games.

\$1,500 / 16 seats = \$94 out of pocket = below face.

I'll still go to half the games, will miss the elite games, will miss the dog games. The Saints come to town too, might be more income for that as an elite game as well.

SAR I
You forgot the preseason = \$1,000. Your invoice is \$5,000.

\$14,000 psl cost over 20 years = \$700 year principal only

plus lost opportunity cost on \$14,000 at 2% = \$280+compounding per year.

Thats \$2,000 per year or \$50 per seat per regular season game.

True cost of \$125 seat is more like \$175

You can afford it though...no reason to defend it.

3. Originally Posted by DUNCCFP
You forgot the preseason = \$1,000. Your invoice is \$5,000.

\$14,000 psl cost over 20 years = \$700 year principal only

plus lost opportunity cost on \$14,000 at 2% = \$280+compounding per year.

Thats \$2,000 per year or \$50 per seat per regular season game.

True cost of \$125 seat is more like \$175

You can afford it though...no reason to defend it.
Preseason is just collateral damage, no different than PSL's, the cost of a hot dog, the price of gas, the GSP tolls.

Whatever the preseason costs each year will be recouped by selling the preseason games at 50% to 60% off plus the growth in PSL value over time.

In down seasons, PSL owners feel some hurt, but it's not \$4,000 of hurt. More like \$1,500. No biggie. If my PSL's go up 2x or 3x, it's all win.

SAR I

4. Originally Posted by SAR I
8 games, 4 seats, \$125 per seat, \$500 per game, \$4,000 per season.

8 Games = \$4,000 expense
2 Elite Games = \$2,000 income
2 Dog Games = \$500 income

\$4,000 - \$2,500 = \$1,500 to attend remaining 4 games.

\$1,500 / 16 seats = \$94 out of pocket = below face.

I'll still go to half the games, will miss the elite games, will miss the dog games. The Saints come to town too, might be more income for that as an elite game as well.

SAR I
Why even bother having the tickets if you already decide a year in advance that you won't be going to any of the Jets "elite" match ups the following year?

5. Originally Posted by The Band
Once the PSL(s) are paid in full, you can simply walk away. You will then lose your PSL(s) and the Jets will have the right to re-sell them to whomever they please. The only commitment any PSL owner made, was to pay for the PSL in full by either paying in full, 5 or 15 year financing. If you chose the 5 or 15, you may be obligated to pay for any "early" payoff fees. Otherwise you will be Scott Free. This is where the defaults will come into play. People will just walk away once the PSL(s) are paid in full. The Jets will have to try and resell them but it won`t be easy for them. No one will want them after knowing whats been, either through witnessing with own eyes or word of mouth, which has been terrible at best from both Jets & Giants fans. Woody will then have to restructure the pricing once again and that will only anger the remaining PSL owners if they don`t get the same deals. It`s a total clusterF for the Jets right now. This is simply not a franchise worthy of PSLs. They share a stadium with a proven winner. It`s been 43, going on 44 years now, where the Jets have done NOTHING in this league. The Jets are NOT worth what Woody may think. The Jets are a \$25(UD), 75(LD) and \$100(Mezz) type of team. Thats it. PSL owners do not get what a true PSL owner should be entitled to. You are supporting the construction of the stadium and that should entitle you to EVERY event being held inside YOUR stadium. You simply don`t get that with the Jets & Giants. You lose out. Not worth it. It`s gonna be interesting to see what Woody can possibly do in the future. I think he is realizing he may have made the biggest mistake by purchasing this team. Just like many of the fans have realized what a mistake it was to purchase these bogus PSLs.
I think you guys are all missing a huge point here:

Once the PSL is paid for in full, Woody & the Jets will gladly take it back upon a default. The paid-for PSL did its job, it paid for construction.
Woody has deep pockets.
Even if he holds it now for 2-3 years, he can re-sell it once the economy is better in 2015 and/or the Team gets good again.

Great wealth lets you make LONG-term decisions that are un-effected by short-term problems.

That is a great scenario for Woody...

6. Originally Posted by Nike
it was a loss but in the long run i won and many of you wont be so lucky to recoup even 50% and thats your choice. i made mine.

in the line of work im in i spent bonus money on those tix and already recouped my loss and then some.

i will not support woody johnson or the jets in person spending a dime until drastic changes are made.

enjoy the game.
Hmm, well, I can only speak for myself and my family, we have 4 in the lowers in 123 right on the isle one step down from the entrance into the section(where I usually sit) and 4 on the 45 in the Chase club. You mention not being lucky enough to recoup even 50% of the psl cost. Well, I went into psl ownership looking to recoup exactly 0% anyway. I bought these to actually go to the game, and have not even attempted to sell a single ticket, just as I haven't sold a ticket since becoming a STH in 2004. Anyone who went into this, especially the high priced club seats, with any idea of "recouping" anything was misguided to put it politely.

The Jets were not trying to put you in business as a ticket broker, they were selling you disposable goods.

I bought tickets that I knew i could afford, and enjoy the game day. Yes, I enjoy it much more when the Jets win, but I get to spend 8 fall Sundays outside, enjoying tailgating (with 2-300 friends) for a few hours and supporting my team. There is good years and bad years, we all know this unless we became Jets fans in 2009, and we knew this when we sent in that psl check for the first time.

7. Originally Posted by SAR I
Absolutely.

In a year that we know is going to be average at best, a PSL owner will do his best to make as much money as possible for the good games to offset the games he winds up going to. Under normal circumstances, I would never miss a Patriots game or Steelers game. I intend to sell each game for 2X face value and thus offset the 6 games I will be attending. 2 of those remaining 6 games will be useless, and I will get 50% of my seat money back.

So of the \$4,000 I'll spend in April, I'll make back \$2,000 on the 2 elite games, and \$500 back on the 2 dog games. It will therefore cost me \$1,500 to attend the remaining 4 games. Which is less than face value. No worries.

SAR I
I don't understand this logic, do you need the money? If so why buy the tix to begin with? If you can't afford them you shouldn't have locked yourself into them. If money is not the problem then why not, ya know, actually go to the games and enjoy them? Why miss the biggest divisional game and perennial conference contender just for a few bucks?

8. Originally Posted by SAR I
Exactly.

Let's say that 10% of all PSL owners got in over their heads, simply can't make the season payments and/or are so upset by the team that they want out of their commitments.

They'll bail out at a very low price which will allow other fans to scoop up the bargains.

And so long as there are at least 2 elite games per year in which a PSL owner can get 2x face value, that alone pays off 25% of the season. If a PSL owner was smart in 2009 he picked seats that could withstand a few bad seasons. I know I did.

SAR I
Actually if a psl owner was smart he would have picked seats he could have afforded and didn't worry about having to "withstand" bad seasons. He would just go to the games and enjoy being there.

This is what makes no sense. I get that once in a while stuff comes up, but generally, if you aren't looking to try to make every game every year, why put up all that capital at once every year buying season tickets? It is a stupid way to try to make money.

The more you talk about being smart and able to sell tickets and get money back, and about how terrible the gameday experience is between tailgaters and it being too noisy in the stadium, you sound like you aren't really a great fan and should be sitting at home instead. And you definitely don't sound like the baller you want everyone to think you are, more like a 70k millionaire actually. Just sayin'.

9. Originally Posted by SAR I
Preseason is just collateral damage, no different than PSL's, the cost of a hot dog, the price of gas, the GSP tolls.

Whatever the preseason costs each year will be recouped by selling the preseason games at 50% to 60% off plus the growth in PSL value over time.

In down seasons, PSL owners feel some hurt, but it's not \$4,000 of hurt. More like \$1,500. No biggie. If my PSL's go up 2x or 3x, it's all win.

SAR I
There's no growth in PSL value over time. When the Jets move to a new stadium the value of the PSL is zero. Demand between now and then may make the value go up, but the laws of supply and demand dictate that it is priced as an option with no value at expiration. If you sell before a new stadium is built or moved to, then you can recoupe, offset or make a profit depending on demand.

It should be looked at an upfront cost of the seat amortized over time.

10. Originally Posted by Baddniss
I think you guys are all missing a huge point here:

Once the PSL is paid for in full, Woody & the Jets will gladly take it back upon a default. The paid-for PSL did its job, it paid for construction.
Woody has deep pockets.
Even if he holds it now for 2-3 years, he can re-sell it once the economy is better in 2015 and/or the Team gets good again.

Great wealth lets you make LONG-term decisions that are un-effected by short-term problems.

That is a great scenario for Woody...
Not so. The \$ amount of psl money collected only paid for less tha half of the stadium cost. The incremental price increase of the seats over 20 years collects more than double that amount. Woody needs to sell tickets to pay of the loans.

11. Some folks have gone to all of the games - perhaps missing one every now and again due to unavoidable circumstances - for many years. And some of these folks enjoy live football and the game day experience. So going to all or nearly all of the games every year became just sort of a thing those folks did every year.

PSLs made sense for folks like these, who will continue to go to all or nearly all of the games for as long as they can based on age, health, financial situation, other major life events, etc.

12. Originally Posted by Jetfan16
Why even bother having the tickets if you already decide a year in advance that you won't be going to any of the Jets "elite" match ups the following year?
He's going to those matchups and he will proudly pay and thats his choice.

13. Originally Posted by Jetfan16
Why even bother having the tickets if you already decide a year in advance that you won't be going to any of the Jets "elite" match ups the following year?
This is why the "MATH" doesnt make sense.

If you are a fan that can afford a great seat, love the team, and want the best possible entertainment expense then you would never sell the elite games.

At the end of the day, this thread is no different then the "its not mark sanchez's fault" thread....SAR (Same Annoying Rhetoric) gets his joliles causing arguments on a message board.

If he really was simply happy with his PSL, there would be no need to defend the "value" of it, as to a PSL owner, with money to burn, the value is meaningless, they can afford it, enjoy it, end of story.

Instead he tries to defend that a PSL is "invesment gold" when in reality, it shouldnt matter to him.

Worst poster in this forum by far.

14. Originally Posted by DUNCCFP
You forgot the preseason = \$1,000. Your invoice is \$5,000.

\$14,000 psl cost over 20 years = \$700 year principal only

plus lost opportunity cost on \$14,000 at 2% = \$280+compounding per year.

Thats \$2,000 per year or \$50 per seat per regular season game.

True cost of \$125 seat is more like \$175

You can afford it though...no reason to defend it.
It`s not the cost that hurts, it`s the embaressing way this org. has been run lately .the only reason for going to the game on Sunday is every JET FAN who owns a Sanchez JERSEY should throw them on the field as soon as they kick off on Sun. UPPER LEVEL, MIDDLE LEVEL & LOWER LEVEL all at once that would be a site worth seeing!

15. Originally Posted by Jetfan16
Why even bother having the tickets if you already decide a year in advance that you won't be going to any of the Jets "elite" match ups the following year?
Economics.

In years when the Jets are going to be weak, I will selectively go to games. My family and I will have a good time, cheer our hearts out. But I deliberately chose my seat selection so that in seasons like this, I can sell what I need to to recoup as much money as I can.

SAR I

16. Originally Posted by TGJoe
I don't understand this logic, do you need the money? If so why buy the tix to begin with? If you can't afford them you shouldn't have locked yourself into them. If money is not the problem then why not, ya know, actually go to the games and enjoy them? Why miss the biggest divisional game and perennial conference contender just for a few bucks?
I have four kids, all under the age of 14.

Dad has spent the last 15 years missing their soccer games, ballet rehearsals, baseball games, football games so that he can indulge himself and watch the Jets play. In a season where I think the Jets will not be very good, I don't need to go to 8 games and miss 8 weekends of my children's activities. 4 weekends is enough.

SAR I

17. Originally Posted by TGJoe
Actually if a psl owner was smart he would have picked seats he could have afforded and didn't worry about having to "withstand" bad seasons. He would just go to the games and enjoy being there.

This is what makes no sense. I get that once in a while stuff comes up, but generally, if you aren't looking to try to make every game every year, why put up all that capital at once every year buying season tickets? It is a stupid way to try to make money.

The more you talk about being smart and able to sell tickets and get money back, and about how terrible the gameday experience is between tailgaters and it being too noisy in the stadium, you sound like you aren't really a great fan and should be sitting at home instead. And you definitely don't sound like the baller you want everyone to think you are, more like a 70k millionaire actually. Just sayin'.
I go through the effort to attend live football games so long as my team is competitive, is under the right leadership, is headed in the right direction. Based on what I know now, if Rex Ryan and the clown show comes back again next season, I will be selling seats to at least four games next year. I can watch it on TV, I don't need to see this sh-t show live.

You sling hash, bub. Don't begin to understand my financial situation. You spend your football Sundays trying to make \$10. Lecture somebody else.

SAR I

18. Originally Posted by DUNCCFP
There's no growth in PSL value over time. When the Jets move to a new stadium the value of the PSL is zero. Demand between now and then may make the value go up, but the laws of supply and demand dictate that it is priced as an option with no value at expiration. If you sell before a new stadium is built or moved to, then you can recoupe, offset or make a profit depending on demand.

It should be looked at an upfront cost of the seat amortized over time.
There aren't enough first row mezzanine seats available to satisfy demand. What cost me \$4,000 in 2009, will be worth \$8,000-\$10,000 by the half-life of the stadium.

Somewhere out there is a 12-year-old boy who in 13 years will be making a nice salary and wants consistent season tickets to Jets games. I'm not planning on selling, but if the need arises I'm confident I will make out well on my PSL outlay.

SAR I

19. Originally Posted by SAR I
I have great seats. \$125 face value immediately adjacent to \$200 Club Seats. Row 1. Gate closest to parking and the train. Green parking pass.

SAR I
That's wonderful, but it doesn't answer the question.

Given the production the field, with the team out of the playoffs, who in their right mind would even pay face?

20. Originally Posted by eaglenj
This is why the "MATH" doesnt make sense.

If you are a fan that can afford a great seat, love the team, and want the best possible entertainment expense then you would never sell the elite games.

At the end of the day, this thread is no different then the "its not mark sanchez's fault" thread....SAR (Same Annoying Rhetoric) gets his joliles causing arguments on a message board.

If he really was simply happy with his PSL, there would be no need to defend the "value" of it, as to a PSL owner, with money to burn, the value is meaningless, they can afford it, enjoy it, end of story.

Instead he tries to defend that a PSL is "invesment gold" when in reality, it shouldnt matter to him.

Worst poster in this forum by far.
Here we go again with an ignorant poster assuming he knows what motivates me.

I post my feelings on Mark Sanchez because that's honestly what my point of is. I'm being honest about my season-ticket intentions in a down-year because those are my honest feelings on the subject.

If you don't like what I post, stop reading it. Stop responding to it. You wish you could.

SAR I

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