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Thread: A Successful NFL Organization Has the following;

  1. #1

    A Successful NFL Organization Has the following;

    1. An effective owner who hires the right GM, offers resources and gets the f*** out of the way. He trusts his football men to make the decisions and practices patience because stability is paramount for a successful organization.

    2. An effective General Manager who understands the cap AND how to evaluate talent. He builds his team through the draft and uses free agency to supplement only. He hires a solid scouting staff and then choices a coach based on his vision of what type of team would be successful.

    3. An effective Coach who understands the game and understands how to motivate his players. He is an effective leader of men who can read the pulse of his team. He picks a solid staff that compliments his vision for the type of team he wants. He also understands the media and how to use it to motivate his team when necessary.

    4. An effective Quarterback who is a leader and a winner. Beyond having the necessary tools to succeed (a given) he must be intelligent and work hard. He must also fit the system and offensive philosophy that the coach strives for.

    Owner, GM, Head Coach, QB; they are the most important positions in an NFL organization. Everything else flows from them. To have all of the above is to have a formula for long term competitive success. At present time, the Jets have exactly none of the above. Its why we are currently a dumpster fire.
    Last edited by intelligentjetsfan; 12-21-2012 at 10:07 AM.

  2. #2
    Pretty well said.

  3. #3
    You can live without the owner and even the coach. The most important pieces of an NFL team are the GM and the QB. If you have those the coach really just has to be competent and the owner needs to be quiet.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    1. An effective owner hires the right GM, offers resources and gets the f*** out of the way. He trusts his football men to make the decisions and practices patience because stability is paramount for a successful organization.

    2. An effective General Manager understands the cap AND how to evaluate talent. He builds his team through the draft and uses free agency to supplement only. He hires a solid scouting staff and then choices a coach based on his vision of what type of team would be successful.

    3. An effective Coach understands the game and understands how to motivate his players. He is an effective leader of men who can read the pulse of his team. He picks a solid staff that compliments his vision for the type of team he wants. He also understands the media and how to use it to motivate his team when necessary.

    4. An effective Quarterback is someone who is a leader and a winner. Beyond having the necessary tools to succeed (a given) he must be intelligent and work hard. He must also fit the system and offensive philosophy that the coach strives for.

    At present time, the Jets have exactly none of the above. Its why we are currently a dumpster fire.
    Revise #2 to say a coach that recognizes that the media is not in any shape or form a part of the team. The media should be treated the same way as the looney uncle, recognized that he is there but not included in family business.

  5. #5
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    Pretty effective post.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    You can live without the owner and even the coach. The most important pieces of an NFL team are the GM and the QB. If you have those the coach really just has to be competent and the owner needs to be quiet.
    There are few things that destroy an organization more then an owner who thinks he is a personnel man (see Jerry Jones) or places making money ahead of building a winning franchise (see Woody Johnson). An owner does not need to do much to be a part of a winning team; just offer resources, hire the right personnel men and then get the **** out of the way. Seen and not heard.

    As for head coach, you do not need the greatest coach in history but you do need a damn good one. Name a team that has won super bowls and sustained long term success that had an average head coach.
    Last edited by intelligentjetsfan; 12-21-2012 at 10:18 AM.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    There are few things that destroy an organization more then an owner who thinks he is a personel man (see Jerry Jones) or places making money ahead of building a winning franchise (see Woody Johnson). An owner does not need to do much to be a part of a winning team; just offer resources, hire the right personel men and then get the **** out of the way. Seen and not heard.

    As for head coach, you do not need the greatest coach in history but you do need a damn good one. Name a team that has won super bowls and sustained long term success that had an average head coach.
    Colts? Ravens? Steelers (Cowher. Can't wait to hear all the rah rah Cowher walks on water blah blah... Steelers fans were killing him before Roethlisberger and the refs handed him a Superbowl)? Green Bay?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    You can live without the owner and even the coach. The most important pieces of an NFL team are the GM and the QB. If you have those the coach really just has to be competent and the owner needs to be quiet.
    Disagree.

    The Owner sets the tone and the attitude. Successful franchises have owners, usually for long tenures, who demand competence and class from their players and management, including Coaches.

    An owner like Woody, who basically spent his Daddy's money to buy a team and doesn't have a clue how to manage anything let alone a complex human organization and who has a dysfunctional personal life himself is doomed to repeat those patterns in his team: poorly managed and dysfunctional.

    "Birds of a feather" is an old expression...and for a good reason.

    Think of the Mara's, Rooney's and Kraft's as examples.
    Last edited by NYCFan; 12-21-2012 at 10:24 AM.

  9. #9
    Continuity in the organization is also key. Constant change is a sign of a team / owner that doesn't know what he's doing.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    Colts? Ravens? Steelers (Cowher. Can't wait to hear all the rah rah Cowher walks on water blah blah... Steelers fans were killing him before Roethlisberger and the refs handed him a Superbowl)? Green Bay?
    Which of the following coaches were not good?

    Tony Dungy
    Bill Cowher
    Brian Billick
    Mike McCarthy/Mike Holmgrem

    An argument can be made that Billick was just a guy. Other then that, all of the other coaches won a lot of games and division titles. None of them (other then possibly Billick) could be considered average.

  11. #11
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    a good owner.

    All starts there.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    There are few things that destroy an organization more then an owner who thinks he is a personnel man (see Jerry Jones) or places making money ahead of building a winning franchise (see Woody Johnson). An owner does not need to do much to be a part of a winning team; just offer resources, hire the right personnel men and then get the **** out of the way. Seen and not heard.

    As for head coach, you do not need the greatest coach in history but you do need a damn good one. Name a team that has won super bowls and sustained long term success that had an average head coach.
    Tony Dungy.

    I see exactly what you're saying, and Peyton's Colts are by far the exception and not the rule, but you asked for an example

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    Which of the following coaches were not good?

    Tony Dungy
    Bill Cowher
    Brian Billick
    Mike McCarthy/Mike Holmgrem

    An argument can be made that Billick was just a guy. Other then that, all of the other coaches won a lot of games and division titles. None of them (other then possibly Billick) could be considered average.
    None of them were "not good", I just think they were all overrated. A coach is only as good as the team he fields. All of these coaches had alot of success due to the players they fielded. The GM is most important IMO. If that happens to be the coach as well then obviously that coach carries far more value. But I've only really seen 2 coaches in the past 20 years coach up an otherwise mediocre team to greatness. Belicheck in 2002, and Coughlin now twice. Lovie Smith has also done a heck of a job with some of his Bears team in the past. Hell he got to a SB with Rex Grossman as his QB. But it just goes to my point, I think you need a competent HC, not necessarily a great one. You NEED a great GM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan View Post
    Tony Dungy.

    I see exactly what you're saying, and Peyton's Colts are by far the exception and not the rule, but you asked for an example
    I admit that I am not the biggest Dungy fan, as a coach. But you would have a hard time making the argument that he was not a good coach or was average.

    His record is as follows;

    139 wins
    69 losses
    1 super bowl win
    11 playoff appearences
    6 division titles

    I understand that a lot of that was with an assist from Peyton Manning (although he did have success in Tampa as well) but that is not the resume of an average head coach.

    Anyway, its a good debate and makes for an interesting discussion.

  15. #15
    I blame Parcells' ego.

    Belichick was poised to take over our franchise but because Parcells wanted to stay on in some capacity to overlook what Belichick would do and scared him off in the process. He knew Belichick was going to have success his second time around as an HC and Parcells wanted to ride that success gravy train.

    Had Belichick taken over our franchise, it could be us with multiple SBs instead of the Pats.

    FU Parcells.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    I admit that I am not the biggest Dungy fan, as a coach. But you would have a hard time making the argument that he was not a good coach or was average.

    His record is as follows;

    139 wins
    69 losses
    1 super bowl win
    11 playoff appearences
    6 division titles

    I understand that a lot of that was with an assist from Peyton Manning (although he did have success in Tampa as well) but that is not the resume of an average head coach.

    Anyway, its a good debate and makes for an interesting discussion.
    Fair enough. Then I'll take it from a different angle.

    Caldwell replaced Dungy, promptly won 14 straight games and only lost the other two because he sat Peyton, and got his team to the super bowl. The following year, Peyton goes down, and they win two games.

    Re: Dungy in TB, I think that's the perfect example of why he can't be counted upon. He built a stacked defense predicated on a cover 2 scheme, but those teams left a lot to be desired. In comes Gruden, and in his first year, he wins the superbowl with that same defense and an underwhelming QB.

    I don't have much respect for Dungy. He played much too conservative a defense, and had he realized what he had to work with on D with that pass rush, and understood that Peyton can hold a game ALL by himself as long as the defense wins it, I believe he wouldn't have left at least one superbowl on the table, if not two.

  17. #17
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    Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.

    Owner detachment has nothing to do with success. We saw the meddling Steinbrenner Mark Cuban and Jerry Jones all win to name just a few. Kraft tampered to get BB.

    This is 2013 not 1923, every NFL owner is loaded, so resenting Woody's $ out of a losers envy is dumb - Mara and Rooneys of today are rich inheritors and didnt live the Horatio Alger story

    There are plenty of jerk QBs that scream at and throw their colleagues under the bus who win and plenty of nice guys who never grab the brass ring.

    The NY media is Giants-centric for eternity. We'll just have to deal, the Nets were in the finals 2 years running, the suburban hockey teams won etc. and got bupkus coverage. Bob Raissman and Gary Myers etc. who hate the Jets will find any way they can to sh1t on the Jets.

    **********

    The SOJF-styled point(s), or lack thereof trying to be made is that if Woody leaves the team alone (no Tebow or other players he might want) gets a more "football oriented" GM than Tannenbaum (whatever that means after working in football for decades) a coach who doesnt "embarrass" himself like Ryan, or a better QB than Sanchez then SB wins will follow.

    Why not just say you think what the Jets are doing has failed, and the owner aside, change most of the organization and personnel in place today. It'd be more honest to say that, but remember here is no magic formula for winning-ATL seemingly has all of the elements cited but may NEVER win.
    Last edited by Jungle Shift Jet; 12-21-2012 at 11:33 AM.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    Which of the following coaches were not good?

    Tony Dungy
    Bill Cowher
    Brian Billick
    Mike McCarthy/Mike Holmgrem

    An argument can be made that Billick was just a guy. Other then that, all of the other coaches won a lot of games and division titles. None of them (other then possibly Billick) could be considered average.
    McCarthy is a terrible coach. I mean truly terrible. He is like a worse version of Andy Reid once the ball is kicked off. He's so clueless he continues to stick with a kicker this season (Crosby) that is as bad of a kicker as I've ever seen at the pro level. Without Rodgers, he'd have been canned long ago and not given a second chance. And despite that he has a HoF caliber QB, he still cannot figure out how to put out a team that can either pass block or run the ball with even slight effectiveness.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Shift Jet View Post
    Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.

    Owner detachment has nothing to do with success. We saw the meddling Steinbrenner Mark Cuban and Jerry Jones all win to name just a few. Kraft tampered to get BB.

    This is 2013 not 1923, every NFL owner is loaded, so resenting Woody's $ out of a losers envy is dumb - Mara and Rooneys of today are rich inheritors and didnt live the Horatio Alger story

    There are plenty of jerk QBs that scream at and throw their colleagues under the bus who win and plenty of nice guys who never grab the brass ring.

    The NY media is Giants-centric for eternity. We'll just have to deal, the Nets were in the finals 2 years running, the suburban hockey teams won etc. and got bupkus coverage. Bob Raissman and Gary Myers etc. who hate the Jets will find any way they can to sh1t on the Jets.

    **********

    The SOJF-styled point(s), or lack thereof trying to be made is that if Woody leaves the team alone (no Tebow or other players he might want) gets a more "football oriented" GM than Tannenbaum (whatever that means after working in football for decades) a coach who doesnt "embarrass" himself like Ryan, or a better QB than Sanchez then SB wins will follow.

    Why not just say you think what the Jets are doing has failed, and the owner aside, change most of the organization and personnel in place today. It'd be more honest to say that, but remember here is no magic formula for winning-ATL seemingly has all of the elements cited but may NEVER win.
    Even Crazy Al Davis has Lombardi's..

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Shift Jet View Post
    Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.

    Owner detachment has nothing to do with success. We saw the meddling Steinbrenner Mark Cuban and Jerry Jones all win to name just a few. Kraft tampered to get BB.

    This is 2013 not 1923, every NFL owner is loaded, so resenting Woody's $ out of a losers envy is dumb - Mara and Rooneys of today are rich inheritors and didnt live the Horatio Alger story

    There are plenty of jerk QBs that scream at and throw their colleagues under the bus who win and plenty of nice guys who never grab the brass ring.

    The NY media is Giants-centric for eternity. We'll just have to deal, the Nets were in the finals 2 years running, the suburban hockey teams won etc. and got bupkus coverage. Bob Raissman and Gary Myers etc. who hate the Jets will find any way they can to sh1t on the Jets.

    **********

    The SOJF-styled point(s), or lack thereof trying to be made is that if Woody leaves the team alone (no Tebow or other players he might want) gets a more "football oriented" GM than Tannenbaum (whatever that means after working in football for decades) a coach who doesnt "embarrass" himself like Ryan, or a better QB than Sanchez then SB wins will follow.

    Why not just say you think what the Jets are doing has failed, and the owner aside, change most of the organization and personnel in place today. It'd be more honest to say that, but remember here is no magic formula for winning-ATL seemingly has all of the elements cited but may NEVER win.
    Jerry Jones won because he hired Jimmy Johnson and let him run the team initially. Since Johnson left Jones has become an even bigger buffoon thinking that he is a personnel man with his binders on draft day . Real football fans understand that he is killing the team (Galloway for two first round picks anyone?). Also, It is foolish to compare the owning an NFL team with the Yankees or an NBA team. In baseball, Steinbrenner could meddle every day but as long as he could still outspend most teams by over 100 Million he would acquire the best players and the team would still compete for a championship year after year. In the NBA the players run the league so if you own one or two excellent players you will contend year after year as well.

    Your management structure in the NFL is much more important because there are 53 players on a roster so packing an all-star team wont work or be feasible due to the salary cap (see the pre-Shannahan redskins). Your owner needs to put in place a solid football structure and then leave them alone to do their jobs (see New England, Pittsburgh and the Giants).

    By the way, Atlanta does not have all of the elements that I listed above; the head coach has not proven to be anything special to this point.
    Last edited by intelligentjetsfan; 12-21-2012 at 12:27 PM.

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