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Thread: The Current State Of The Jets

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by SAR I View Post
    All that matters is that on the day in 2015 or 2016 that Bill and Tom hang it up we are the one team in the AFC East that's poised to take control of the division, get a home playoff game, be headed in an upwards trajectory.

    We don't need a quick turnaround. We need a smart rebuild. Take 3 years, get a very good core on the lines, find your RB and your QB, be a decent second-place team around 8 or 9 wins, and then be that 11 win team and win the East when the Patriots are no more.

    SAR I
    I agree with building from the inside out on both sides of the ball. I am a big believer in that. The past couple of years we have lost the battle at the LOS.

    My biggest fear is that we get stuck in neutral with Rex for a couple of years. Just reading some of the posts it looks like people are already giving him a built-in excuse b.c of the talent on the team. The problem I have with that is that he was the one that helped cultivate that talent (or lack thereof) and he has no track record of building a team. Our roster has gotten worse under his watch and I do not put all of that on Tanny.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by YJF View Post
    PERCEPTION VS REALITY

    The New York Jets are widely believed to be a losing franchise. As of January 12th 2013, It's been 44 years since the Jets have won a superbowl. There have been many ups and a lot more downs since that ground breaking and league changing championship in 1969. Throughout the 70's and much of the 80's, The Jets became an irrelevant franchise. Very few winning seasons or playoff seasons over the course of two decades. There were slight hiccups along the way where the Jets made an impact and went on runs towards a championship(1982) but there was a lot more losing than winning in those two decades.

    The 90's saw the Jets start off somewhat promising only to fall badly and become a laughingstock by the time 1996 finished. It wasn't until Bill Parcells arrived in 1997, That the Jets would change course and change their culture and become a contender. Since 1997, The Jets have been a respectable and contending franchise. They won their first division title since the merger in 1970 and from 1998 to present day, The Jets have won two division titles and have made the playoffs 7 different times and have made 3 trips to the AFC Championship Game. In the last 16 seasons, The Jets have only 4 non winning seasons. In the era of parody, that measures up pretty well against the other 31 NFL franchises. The Jets transformed from being a laughing stock and irrelevant franchise to being relevant and a legitimate contender. The local and national media would have you believe otherwise but the Jets have been a respectable franchise since 1997.

    BACK TO THE DARK AGES

    This leads me to where I feel this franchise is now headed or currently is. It looks like the Jets have officially reverted back to their losing ways prior to 1997. It's been a long time since the Jets franchise was considered and expected to be awful and that's where they currently stand. The late season collapse of 2011 and the ugliness of 2012 have combined to set this franchise back and downward. It's amazing how far down the team has gone after two magical runs near the mountain top just two years ago. There are a lot of people to blame for the downfall. Poor leadership and team awareness by Rex Ryan. Poor management by Mike Tannenbaum and poor ownership and guidance by Woody Johnson. The run is over. You can not recapture the vibe and aura that the franchise had.

    MOVING FORWARD

    It's hard to gauge what direction the Jets are currently in. Are they retooling or rebuilding? The model for rebuilding is in place, A young roster with a lot of departing veterans. You have uncertainty at key spots like QB and a new leader of football operations in John Idzik. At the same time, The Jets have the same football leader in place in Rex Ryan, the same quality defensive system and a whole new accomplished offensive staff. Rex is coaching for his life in 2013. If the Jets do not have a winning season or make the playoffs. He is gone. He knows it and the entire organization knows it. Rather than begin a complete organizational reset. Woody Johnson has decided to try and take another shot. The problem is that The Jets are not constructed properly to be a legitimate contender. They do not and will not have the neccessary cap room to improve their talent base. They don't have the current talent base to be a legitimate contender. The team is stuck in neutral. If 2013 goes as projected, The Jets will have to reset the entire organization from the coaching staff to the scouting department a year from now. The only person that will remain is John Idzik. Instead of using 2013 to build for 2014. The Jets are putting off the rebuild for another year in the hopes of getting back to where they were. That ship has sailed. Woody failed to realize that or doesn't want to face that reality. By attempting this in 2013, The Jets are pretty much setting themselves up for potentially two more losing seasons in 2013 and 2014. Even if the organization gets things on track, They may not contend until 2015.

    There is always a fine line between realistic and pessimistic. So I know that this thread can be seen in both lights. Probably leaning more towards the pessimistic side. There is something about the way 2012 ended that made me feel like we are back to the way things were before 1997. I hope that I am wrong.
    Hey look at that, a well thought out, easy to read post. That doesn't happen much around here anymore.

    I have a very bad taste in my mouth from this year and keeping Rex is one of the most mind boggling decisions I've seen a football team make in a long time.

    He has done nothing the last two years to deserve this job. I'm not going to list everything again... I just can't understand what Woody is thinking.

    I'm looking forward to the draft to see the direction Idzik wants to take this. Does he go after a QB early and hope that guy can save this sinking ship?

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by shuler82 View Post
    Welcome back YJF.

    If I was Woody, I wouldn't be judging Rex on W/L in 2013.. He stays if he keeps the locker room, the defense continues to perform, and he stays out of the offense, allowing the OC to open things up, then you keep Rex... assuming Idzik can work with him.

    I just finished posting this in another thread...so I'm going to post it here too. for it is relevant to your point...

    http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...=253470&page=2



    Many here fail to realize...that when Woody set out to search for a new GM NYJ, that he sincerely wanted this individual to work with Rex, to turn the Jets around into being a playoff contender again. This was not a hollow request by Woody. He's not envisioning Rex as automatic HC fodder for 2013 only. But as a still viable part of the Jets formula to attain a Lombardi Trophy. This should be common sense to anyone posting here in this thread.

    Woody is not interested in ridding himself of a HC that got the Jets to two consecutive AFCCGs. He truly believes that given a significant upgrade at GM. Someone that can straighten out the mess on offense. Do a better job at acquiring talent for this team. That Rex can then take the next step, and get the team beyond a CCG, and win a Lombardi Trophy for the NYJ.

    After the Texans-Bengals playoff game ended...the announcer told the listeners that this was now the 22nd straight year that the Bengals failed to win a playoff game. So it dawned on me...Woody probably knows all about playoff failures and frustration...from his good friend Marty Schottenheimer. An HC with a prolific 195 regular season wins. But an HC that will probably never have a bust in Canton...cause Martyball has been a bust in the playoffs. In thirteen playoff appearances...Schotty Sr. only had 5 playoff wins. In just two playoffs...Rex has those two AFCCGs...and 4 playoff wins.

    From the frustrations of HCs like Schotty Sr., and probably from some of his fellow frustrated owners in this league...Woody believes an HC that has had good success in the playoffs...shouldn't be someone you easily cast away. Maybe Bill Pollian...and Korn-Ferry agreed too. Not to mention that Idzik himself may have realized this too. It's not easy to win playoff games in this league. They are precious.

    Idzik is a very smart and capable individual. And he's also very professional too. He's not taking on this job as GM. Nor taking Woody's money under false pretenses either. To think that Idzik will fire Rex...right after the gun sounds, to end the 16th game of the 2013 season, is just not based on any known reality. Is it based on Idzik's professional character or his personality to act this way? Until proven otherwise...I'd have to say no.

    And I don't think an OC like Mornhinweg, is coming to the Jets being told...or is under the impression...that he's nothing more then 2013 OC fodder. Right now...the Jets need to re-establish some kind of credibility among the coaching establishment. After dumping Schotty Jr., and then doing a one and done with Sparano...as OCs NYJ. To then follow this up with another bunch of firings...well it better be definitely based clearly to all...on merit. that's how I see it.

    Realistically...Jets will have another year of misery and losing. Everyone knows this. If Rex and the CS get canned...it won't be based on mere losses. It would have to do with how they handle the team and their jobs. How competitive and how hard Jets play will count for something too.

    Woody ain't stupid...that's why he hired Idzik. And Idzik ain't no dummy either...he knows why Woody hired him...to work with Rex.

    All the above named individuals I've mentioned...are footbal men. They're going to give each other an honest handshake...roll up their sleeves...and make this work. Cause they're professionals in the same football fraternity, that have a respect and passion for this game. And each others professional lives and reputations on the line...as they share a common task.

    Do you honestly think it's otherwise?

    Fans want wins...playoffs...the Lombardi Trophy. And the NYJ brain trust know that. But that doesn't mean that they should succomb to the frustrations of fans. Especially the prepubescent behaving ones...that orgiastically dance to every tune pied piped to them from the rag whinners. For they have their own agenda's at heart...and not what's in the best interests of the NYJ.

    Again...reputations are on the line. Woody's...Rex'...Mornhinweg's...Lee's...etc...and of course Idzik's too. Each and everyone of them wants to get the job done. They know they need to all work together in order to accomplish their goals for success.

    As for me...I'm willing to let things unfold. if Rex and the CS screw it up...then Idzik needs to show them the door. But if they are not part of the problem...then Idzik should be moving forward with them in finding solutions for 2014.

    With fans...it's always the next GM...or its the next HC, that's going to be the one to get it done. There's never any patience. That's why this team has been the Circle Jerk Jets. Wandering around for over 43 years...and counting. That's why I hope that what Woody believes will work...will actually work! Or else...it's simply another round of cockeyed optimism with another bunch of saviors...as it always is...in Jets Paradise.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenReaper View Post
    I just finished posting this in another thread...so I'm going to post it here too. for it is relevant to your point...

    http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...=253470&page=2



    Many here fail to realize...that when Woody set out to search for a new GM NYJ, that he sincerely wanted this individual to work with Rex, to turn the Jets around into being a playoff contender again. This was not a hollow request by Woody. He's not envisioning Rex as automatic HC fodder for 2013 only. But as a still viable part of the Jets formula to attain a Lombardi Trophy. This should be common sense to anyone posting here in this thread.

    Woody is not interested in ridding himself of a HC that got the Jets to two consecutive AFCCGs. He truly believes that given a significant upgrade at GM. Someone that can straighten out the mess on offense. Do a better job at acquiring talent for this team. That Rex can then take the next step, and get the team beyond a CCG, and win a Lombardi Trophy for the NYJ.

    After the Texans-Bengals playoff game ended...the announcer told the listeners that this was now the 22nd straight year that the Bengals failed to win a playoff game. So it dawned on me...Woody probably knows all about playoff failures and frustration...from his good friend Marty Schottenheimer. An HC with a prolific 195 regular season wins. But an HC that will probably never have a bust in Canton...cause Martyball has been a bust in the playoffs. In thirteen playoff appearances...Schotty Sr. only had 5 playoff wins. In just two playoffs...Rex has those two AFCCGs...and 4 playoff wins.

    From the frustrations of HCs like Schotty Sr., and probably from some of his fellow frustrated owners in this league...Woody believes an HC that has had good success in the playoffs...shouldn't be someone you easily cast away. Maybe Bill Pollian...and Korn-Ferry agreed too. Not to mention that Idzik himself may have realized this too. It's not easy to win playoff games in this league. They are precious.

    Idzik is a very smart and capable individual. And he's also very professional too. He's not taking on this job as GM. Nor taking Woody's money under false pretenses either. To think that Idzik will fire Rex...right after the gun sounds, to end the 16th game of the 2013 season, is just not based on any known reality. Is it based on Idzik's professional character or his personality to act this way? Until proven otherwise...I'd have to say no.

    And I don't think an OC like Mornhinweg, is coming to the Jets being told...or is under the impression...that he's nothing more then 2013 OC fodder. Right now...the Jets need to re-establish some kind of credibility among the coaching establishment. After dumping Schotty Jr., and then doing a one and done with Sparano...as OCs NYJ. To then follow this up with another bunch of firings...well it better be definitely based clearly to all...on merit. that's how I see it.

    Realistically...Jets will have another year of misery and losing. Everyone knows this. If Rex and the CS get canned...it won't be based on mere losses. It would have to do with how they handle the team and their jobs. How competitive and how hard Jets play will count for something too.

    Woody ain't stupid...that's why he hired Idzik. And Idzik ain't no dummy either...he knows why Woody hired him...to work with Rex.

    All the above named individuals I've mentioned...are footbal men. They're going to give each other an honest handshake...roll up their sleeves...and make this work. Cause they're professionals in the same football fraternity, that have a respect and passion for this game. And each others professional lives and reputations on the line...as they share a common task.

    Do you honestly think it's otherwise?

    Fans want wins...playoffs...the Lombardi Trophy. And the NYJ brain trust know that. But that doesn't mean that they should succomb to the frustrations of fans. Especially the prepubescent behaving ones...that orgiastically dance to every tune pied piped to them from the rag whinners. For they have their own agenda's at heart...and not what's in the best interests of the NYJ.

    Again...reputations are on the line. Woody's...Rex'...Mornhinweg's...Lee's...etc...and of course Idzik's too. Each and everyone of them wants to get the job done. They know they need to all work together in order to accomplish their goals for success.

    As for me...I'm willing to let things unfold. if Rex and the CS screw it up...then Idzik needs to show them the door. But if they are not part of the problem...then Idzik should be moving forward with them in finding solutions for 2014.

    With fans...it's always the next GM...or its the next HC, that's going to be the one to get it done. There's never any patience. That's why this team has been the Circle Jerk Jets. Wandering around for over 43 years...and counting. That's why I hope that what Woody believes will work...will actually work! Or else...it's simply another round of cockeyed optimism with another bunch of saviors...as it always is...in Jets Paradise.

    Great post

  5. #45
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    GreenReaper,

    Good post.

    I just wanted to say that I don't think Rex should be the coach this year, and its not all based off of his W/L record the past two years. I can handle losing, but they have gone backwards in just about every aspect of the game.

    The revolving door of coaches has to stop at some point and they need to stick with someone... I just don't think Rex was the right guy to pick.

    He completely lost the team in 2011 and has never once shown any interest in offense, the most important part of the game. He is a defensive coordinator.

    Unless he changes drastically, I see similar results in 2013 and he will be fired. So where does that leave us?

    I feel like right now the Jets are one year away from being three years away, if that makes sense.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    Hey look at that, a well thought out, easy to read post. That doesn't happen much around here anymore.

    I have a very bad taste in my mouth from this year and keeping Rex is one of the most mind boggling decisions I've seen a football team make in a long time.

    He has done nothing the last two years to deserve this job. I'm not going to list everything again... I just can't understand what Woody is thinking.

    I'm looking forward to the draft to see the direction Idzik wants to take this. Does he go after a QB early and hope that guy can save this sinking ship?
    Thanks Mike. Getting the right QB will dictate a lot. My guess is Jets go RB, Pass Rushing LB and QB in the first three picks of their draft. The old perception of not being able to win in the NFL with a rookie QB is not a reality anymore. Teams are contending and winning with rookie QB's all over the place. Even the Jets went far with a rookie QB(Sanchez) and the Ravens did the same with Flacco.

    Logic would dictate that Rex Ryan would want a veteran QB to challenge Sanchez and that he wouldn't have to rely on a 3rd round rookie QB to play and save his job. Problem is that's a crap shoot either way. You don't get great QB's open on the free agent market unless you get lucky(Brees). So really the only way to find a great QB is to draft one and that's a complete crap shoot. Finding that type of QB is hard and even if you get one, It takes awhile before they become great. Players like Luck, Griffin and Wilson still have room for growth and haven't reached greatness yet but they did take their teams to the playoffs.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by YJF;4790438

    There is always a fine line between realistic and pessimistic. So I know that this thread can be seen in both lights. Probably leaning more towards the pessimistic side. [B
    There is something about the way 2012 ended that made me feel like we are back to the way things were before 1997. I hope that I am wrong.[/B]
    YJF, welcome back! You've been missed!

    I agree with this..A few things can happen in '13 to raise hope of optimism...

    Marty Mohnerwigh/David Lee develop a modern offense that suits the Jets talent (we have 6 months to improve that area) and straighten out Sanchez to where his game and confidence are trending upwards and hope is restored that he can be a quality starting NFL QB...

    Idzik lays the law down and tells Rex to shut up and just worry/concentrate on being a HC, not some media comedian/clown, not an asst GM. Just a HC that (with his staff) coach, develop, instill discipline and accountability to his team.

    Idzik, listens to Rex for the type of players his wants, but he relies heavily on his personnel and scouting depts in selecting the players (draft, FA, UDFA)

    Welcome back, YJF!
    Last edited by C Mart; 01-22-2013 at 08:49 PM.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    GreenReaper,

    Good post.

    I just wanted to say that I don't think Rex should be the coach this year, and its not all based off of his W/L record the past two years. I can handle losing, but they have gone backwards in just about every aspect of the game.

    The revolving door of coaches has to stop at some point and they need to stick with someone... I just don't think Rex was the right guy to pick.

    He completely lost the team in 2011 and has never once shown any interest in offense, the most important part of the game. He is a defensive coordinator.

    Unless he changes drastically, I see similar results in 2013 and he will be fired. So where does that leave us?

    I feel like right now the Jets are one year away from being three years away, if that makes sense.
    TMIH...I respect your opinions very much.

    And you and I are not far apart on the most important thing for this team. That is patience and continuity. If Woody fired Rex...then it would've meant that he came to a different consensus ...then the one he now believes in. And I use the word consensus...because I don't think he's been making these moves and decisions in a vacuum.

    What us fans need to realize is that firing Rex...may not be the solution either. All it may mean is another round of HC search and find. Then the Honeymoon...then misery again.

    Woody has done a careful methodical search...that has resulted in the hiring of Idzik.

    So right now...what Jets fans should all hope for...is that Idzik is going to be an excellent GM. Smart and correct in dealing with the tough decisions that he has to make. Whatever the fate of Rex and this CS may be...it's in his hands. And so is the fortunes of the Jets.

    For right now...I would say lets hear Idzik out. Lets get a better idea how he feels about working with Rex and this CS. Most importantly...lets hope we are enthusiastic about his vision and blueprint to bring the Jets a Lombardi Trophy.

    The rock is in Idzik's hands. And I'm guardedly optimistic that he won't fumble it. What he does with the draft. Player cuts. Trades and FA signings. Will give us a better glimpse of what kind of GM NYJ he might be.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenReaper View Post
    I just finished posting this in another thread...so I'm going to post it here too. for it is relevant to your point...

    http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...=253470&page=2



    Many here fail to realize...that when Woody set out to search for a new GM NYJ, that he sincerely wanted this individual to work with Rex, to turn the Jets around into being a playoff contender again. This was not a hollow request by Woody. He's not envisioning Rex as automatic HC fodder for 2013 only. But as a still viable part of the Jets formula to attain a Lombardi Trophy. This should be common sense to anyone posting here in this thread.

    Woody is not interested in ridding himself of a HC that got the Jets to two consecutive AFCCGs. He truly believes that given a significant upgrade at GM. Someone that can straighten out the mess on offense. Do a better job at acquiring talent for this team. That Rex can then take the next step, and get the team beyond a CCG, and win a Lombardi Trophy for the NYJ.

    After the Texans-Bengals playoff game ended...the announcer told the listeners that this was now the 22nd straight year that the Bengals failed to win a playoff game. So it dawned on me...Woody probably knows all about playoff failures and frustration...from his good friend Marty Schottenheimer. An HC with a prolific 195 regular season wins. But an HC that will probably never have a bust in Canton...cause Martyball has been a bust in the playoffs. In thirteen playoff appearances...Schotty Sr. only had 5 playoff wins. In just two playoffs...Rex has those two AFCCGs...and 4 playoff wins.

    From the frustrations of HCs like Schotty Sr., and probably from some of his fellow frustrated owners in this league...Woody believes an HC that has had good success in the playoffs...shouldn't be someone you easily cast away. Maybe Bill Pollian...and Korn-Ferry agreed too. Not to mention that Idzik himself may have realized this too. It's not easy to win playoff games in this league. They are precious.

    Idzik is a very smart and capable individual. And he's also very professional too. He's not taking on this job as GM. Nor taking Woody's money under false pretenses either. To think that Idzik will fire Rex...right after the gun sounds, to end the 16th game of the 2013 season, is just not based on any known reality. Is it based on Idzik's professional character or his personality to act this way? Until proven otherwise...I'd have to say no.

    And I don't think an OC like Mornhinweg, is coming to the Jets being told...or is under the impression...that he's nothing more then 2013 OC fodder. Right now...the Jets need to re-establish some kind of credibility among the coaching establishment. After dumping Schotty Jr., and then doing a one and done with Sparano...as OCs NYJ. To then follow this up with another bunch of firings...well it better be definitely based clearly to all...on merit. that's how I see it.

    Realistically...Jets will have another year of misery and losing. Everyone knows this. If Rex and the CS get canned...it won't be based on mere losses. It would have to do with how they handle the team and their jobs. How competitive and how hard Jets play will count for something too.

    Woody ain't stupid...that's why he hired Idzik. And Idzik ain't no dummy either...he knows why Woody hired him...to work with Rex.

    All the above named individuals I've mentioned...are footbal men. They're going to give each other an honest handshake...roll up their sleeves...and make this work. Cause they're professionals in the same football fraternity, that have a respect and passion for this game. And each others professional lives and reputations on the line...as they share a common task.

    Do you honestly think it's otherwise?

    Fans want wins...playoffs...the Lombardi Trophy. And the NYJ brain trust know that. But that doesn't mean that they should succomb to the frustrations of fans. Especially the prepubescent behaving ones...that orgiastically dance to every tune pied piped to them from the rag whinners. For they have their own agenda's at heart...and not what's in the best interests of the NYJ.

    Again...reputations are on the line. Woody's...Rex'...Mornhinweg's...Lee's...etc...and of course Idzik's too. Each and everyone of them wants to get the job done. They know they need to all work together in order to accomplish their goals for success.

    As for me...I'm willing to let things unfold. if Rex and the CS screw it up...then Idzik needs to show them the door. But if they are not part of the problem...then Idzik should be moving forward with them in finding solutions for 2014.

    With fans...it's always the next GM...or its the next HC, that's going to be the one to get it done. There's never any patience. That's why this team has been the Circle Jerk Jets. Wandering around for over 43 years...and counting. That's why I hope that what Woody believes will work...will actually work! Or else...it's simply another round of cockeyed optimism with another bunch of saviors...as it always is...in Jets Paradise.
    Reaper. That's a well written and well thought out post. I highlighted an area of it in bold writing for a reason.Your post is extremely balanced and it doesn't seem to take sides one way or the other. Bottom line is that the last two seasons have been hugely disapointing for the Jets and the continuation of failure will lead to extreme changes.

    3 straight non winning and non playoff seasons will lead to sweeping changes in my opinion. The Jets have maintained a lot of stability within their organization up until this point. There haven't been a lot of major shakeups since Woody Johnson became the owner.

    Remember Woody took over when Belicheat resigned as the HC of the NYJ. Parcells remained with the organization for an extra year while Groh coached with essentially the same staff. Then Bill left, Groh was let go and in came The Bradway/Edwards era but Tannenbaum stayed on to run the cap and many of Parcells players were still here. That eventually transitioned into Bradway being demoted but staying in the organization and Tannenbaum taking over with Mangini. Mangini gets fired after 3 years, Mike T stays on and hires Rex. 4 years later, Mike T is gone and Rex stays. There's a pattern here with Woody. No major shakeups and transitions that have familiarity attached to them. Now John Idzik will be here for a year and then transition into a new era next season with Rex being gone. That's where this is headed unless Rex and the coaching staff get things moving in the right direction in 2013.
    Last edited by YJF; 01-22-2013 at 08:21 PM.

  10. #50
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    I'd like to echo...OP...good post! GreenReaper, good post.


    This team is far from done. If we had an average NFL QB performance out of Sanchez in 2012 wed have been in the playoffs again. This is without both Revis and Holmes, and with Keller as a part timer.

    Tanny was fired for putting us in cap hell. If Sanchez was an average NFL QB wed be a playoff team again in 2013. Hes not but our new QB coach is a mechanics guru and out new OC is very very good with QBs.

    Rex is technically the HC. Hell see that his defense is up to par. I say technically because I think our new OC will totally control all aspects of the offense. This will suite Rex to a tee no doubt. Im with Woody, we cant afford to lose Rex.

    I think our new GM will avoid subpar picks like Ducasse in the 2nd and Wilson in the 1st. (both by the way will be serviceable Jets just not worth their draft rank). I think he has HIS vision for the team and will not be unduly swayed.

    So they try to fix Sanchez, bolster McElroy, and bring in some JAG QB for good measure. If one of them steps up were back in the playoff hunt. If not, were still out of cap hell in 2014.

    Anyway, thats my take and Im sticking to it.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by YJF View Post
    Reaper. That's a well written and well thought out post. I highlighted an area of it in bold writing for a reason.Your post is extremely balanced and it doesn't seem to take sides one or the other. Bottom line is that the last two seasons have been hugely dissapointing for the Jets and the continuation of dissapointment will lead to extreme changes.

    3 straight non winning and non playoff seasons will lead to sweeping changes in my opinion. The Jets have maintained a lot of stability within their organization up until this point. There haven't been a lot of major shakeups since Woody Johnson became the owner.

    Remember Woody took over when Belicheat resigned as the HC of the NYJ. Parcells remained with the organization for an extra year while Groh coached with essentially the same staff. Then Bill left, Groh was let go and in came The Bradway/Edwards era but Tannenbaum stayed on to run the cap and many of Parcells players were still here. That eventually transitioned into Bradway being demoted but staying in the organization and Tannenbaum taking over with Mangini. Mangini gets fired after 3 years, Mike T stays on and hires Rex. 4 years later, Mike T is gone and Rex stays. There's a pattern here with Woody. No major shakeups and transitions that have familiarity attached to them. Now John Idzik will be here for a year and then transition into a new era next season with Rex being gone. That's where this is headed unless Rex and the coaching staff get things moving in the right direction in 2013.
    YJF...I have no ego invested in this. Whether Rex ends up staying or is fired is less important to me....then how capable Idzik will be as GM NYJ.

    Idzik is the new architect to build the Jets foundation for success. Hopefully he builds it right. Or else it will crumble down in another heap of failure.

    Woody did hire someone outside of the Jets organizational culture. This...IMO..is a significant step in the right direction. And from what I understand...Idzik has full powers and authority, to carry out his vision. No more catering to anyone's impulsive wants. No more Favre or Tebow shenanigans...to knock Idzik off course from what he wants to accomplish.

    All I wanted this Xmas...was a qualified and capable new GM for the NYJ. The package starts opening...in this Thursday's presser. I hope I'm pleased with what's inside it.

  12. #52
    Very well thought out post, considering it is a view taken from outside the organization.

    I would just like to add, that in the last ten years, when great things were expected from the Jets they seem to disappoint. Yet, when nothing was expected they surprised the hell out of a lot of folks.
    There are many things to correct and it's only Jan, I will hold off making any kind of predictions until after I see how it all comes together. I find it hard to write off a whole season before any of the pieces are even in place. Do I think we are Super Bowl bound, of course not. Do I think we can improve on the the last two seasons, without a doubt !!!
    A great part of that will largely depend on who they bring in to compete with Mark and hopefully beat him out for the starters job. It is my feeling that had we a more season vet behind Mark the last two years our W/L record would have looked much different. I honestly think we might have won 3 to 4 more games this season with a solid back up. For those of you( won't mention names)!who think Mark can be salvaged with our new OC, never going to happen. If 4 seasons of Marks play does not convince you he is not a QB who can carry this team on his shoulders, I honestly don't know what it will take.

  13. #53
    Lot's of passion in this thread. We have been losing too long here. Great post GR btw

  14. #54
    I can guarantee that Woody Johnson would not hire a GM that came to an interview saying that there would be a 3 year rebuilding project before the Jets will be back in the playoffs. I can almost guarantee that Idzik layed out a plan to get younger and faster and more athletic and make the playoffs at the same time.

    Either a player is part of the solution or not. I believe the Jets have quite a good base of younger players that are part of the solution. Yes they need their franchise QB and more talent and speed on offense and a pass rusher and outside linebacker. All of this is attainable. The Colts went from 2-14 to what 11-5 ?

    With proper management and coaching and the GM doing a good job in the draft and free agency and maybe a trade here or there this team could very well do a 180 and be back in the playoffs next season. Super Bowl - no way.
    Getting the right QB is the most important part of this whole equation.

    With the hiring of Idzik and Mornhenwig I think the Jets have given themselves a chance. A chance to do a 180 and change on the run and win 9 to 10 games next season.

    I certainly hope so!

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    YJF, welcome back! You've been missed!

    I agree with this..A few things can happen in '13 to raise hope of optimism...

    Marty Mohnerwigh/David Lee develop a modern offense that suits the Jets talent (we have 6 months to improve that area) and straighten out Sanchez to where his game and confidence are trending upwards and hope is restored that he can be a quality starting NFL QB...

    Idzik lays the law down and tells Rex to shut up and just worry/concentrate on being a HC, not some media comedian/clown, not an asst GM. Just a HC that (with his staff) coach, develop, instill discipline and accountability to his team.

    Idzik, listens to Rex for the type of players his wants, but he relies heavily on his personnel and scouting depts in selecting the players (draft, FA, UDFA)

    Welcome back, YJF!
    Thanks CMart. I appreciate the kind words.

    There's a lot of wishful thinking there and I will join along wishing right with you. There's that level of optimism attached to the buildup for each season. Last year, Schottenheimer was gone. Sparano was supposed to be some disciplinarian type that would get the Jets back to smashmouth football. Tebow was going to push Mark Sanchez to get better and be a great replacement for Brad Smith on the offense. Rex was going to learn from his mistakes and be a better leader of the team.

    This year, The mantra is that the Jets are going to be an attacking style team on both sides of the ball. That they there going to be more aggressive and unpredictable on the football field. That was Rex's message at the season ending press conference. This team is going to finally reflect Ryan's personality according to Rex.

    At the end of the day, It's about the direction and getting the right talent to fit that direction. Hiring Marty Mornhinweg and David Lee fits the idea of having a big play and unpredictable offense. Marty is excellent with QB's and his offense is QB friendly. He needs the right guy to execute it. Until proven otherwise, Mark Sanchez isn't the right guy. The Jets have no game breakers right now on offense. That can change for the better. It's up to the scouting department and the GM to get them. On defense, The Jets have a great young d-line and an excellent trio of corners. They still need better team speed and a dynamic play maker in the front 7 preferably a pass rusher. So at the end of the day, It's all about getting the talent. Can the Jets get the right players in one year to make 2013 work.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnails View Post
    WOW! You came back to us. I missed you, glad to see you here.
    +1

    Good to see you, YJF!

  17. #57
    Great to have you back YJF. Your well thought out posts have been sorely missed around here. I think the fan base around this site will not stomach another season of Mark Sanchez as our QB - As Jets fans we've given him the benefit of the doubt based on his potential after seasons 1 and 2. . We've seen enough of his lack of talent , failure of progression and inability to lead his team and function even given the obvious deficiencies at receiver/TE this season. So... obtaining a RB/ TE and pass rusher and S if Landry doesn't re-sign are all gravy, but first and foremost Im hoping the current cast of new coaches have plans to move MS to backup QB- noone will likely take him off our hands completely..Bring in Matt Flynn or prototype QB or draft a rookie in first two rounds of this years draft. That will at least bring some well needed optimism back to the core fan base.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenReaper View Post
    TMIH...I respect your opinions very much.

    And you and I are not far apart on the most important thing for this team. That is patience and continuity. If Woody fired Rex...then it would've meant that he came to a different consensus ...then the one he now believes in. And I use the word consensus...because I don't think he's been making these moves and decisions in a vacuum.

    What us fans need to realize is that firing Rex...may not be the solution either. All it may mean is another round of HC search and find. Then the Honeymoon...then misery again.

    Woody has done a careful methodical search...that has resulted in the hiring of Idzik.

    So right now...what Jets fans should all hope for...is that Idzik is going to be an excellent GM. Smart and correct in dealing with the tough decisions that he has to make. Whatever the fate of Rex and this CS may be...it's in his hands. And so is the fortunes of the Jets.

    For right now...I would say lets hear Idzik out. Lets get a better idea how he feels about working with Rex and this CS. Most importantly...lets hope we are enthusiastic about his vision and blueprint to bring the Jets a Lombardi Trophy.

    The rock is in Idzik's hands. And I'm guardedly optimistic that he won't fumble it. What he does with the draft. Player cuts. Trades and FA signings. Will give us a better glimpse of what kind of GM NYJ he might be.


    Welcome back YJF ... +1 to this reply to you



    Ljr

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeJam Football View Post
    I can guarantee that Woody Johnson would not hire a GM that came to an interview saying that there would be a 3 year rebuilding project before the Jets will be back in the playoffs.
    --Draft well (Warmack in rd 1, get speed at LB in rds 2 and 3 and another big Guard in rd 4 (Bailey or Warford))

    --Sign cheap, under the radar FA's that can contribute right away (Ramses Barden (if no Bray) and Brian Leonard (can catch out of backfield and is better blocker than Hilliard & Conner)

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by YJF View Post
    PERCEPTION VS REALITY

    The New York Jets are widely believed to be a losing franchise. As of January 12th 2013, It's been 44 years since the Jets have won a superbowl. There have been many ups and a lot more downs since that ground breaking and league changing championship in 1969. Throughout the 70's and much of the 80's, The Jets became an irrelevant franchise. Very few winning seasons or playoff seasons over the course of two decades. There were slight hiccups along the way where the Jets made an impact and went on runs towards a championship(1982) but there was a lot more losing than winning in those two decades.

    The 90's saw the Jets start off somewhat promising only to fall badly and become a laughingstock by the time 1996 finished. It wasn't until Bill Parcells arrived in 1997, That the Jets would change course and change their culture and become a contender. Since 1997, The Jets have been a respectable and contending franchise. They won their first division title since the merger in 1970 and from 1998 to present day, The Jets have won two division titles and have made the playoffs 7 different times and have made 3 trips to the AFC Championship Game. In the last 16 seasons, The Jets have only 4 non winning seasons. In the era of parody, that measures up pretty well against the other 31 NFL franchises. The Jets transformed from being a laughing stock and irrelevant franchise to being relevant and a legitimate contender. The local and national media would have you believe otherwise but the Jets have been a respectable franchise since 1997.

    BACK TO THE DARK AGES

    This leads me to where I feel this franchise is now headed or currently is. It looks like the Jets have officially reverted back to their losing ways prior to 1997. It's been a long time since the Jets franchise was considered and expected to be awful and that's where they currently stand. The late season collapse of 2011 and the ugliness of 2012 have combined to set this franchise back and downward. It's amazing how far down the team has gone after two magical runs near the mountain top just two years ago. There are a lot of people to blame for the downfall. Poor leadership and team awareness by Rex Ryan. Poor management by Mike Tannenbaum and poor ownership and guidance by Woody Johnson. The run is over. You can not recapture the vibe and aura that the franchise had.

    MOVING FORWARD

    It's hard to gauge what direction the Jets are currently in. Are they retooling or rebuilding? The model for rebuilding is in place, A young roster with a lot of departing veterans. You have uncertainty at key spots like QB and a new leader of football operations in John Idzik. At the same time, The Jets have the same football leader in place in Rex Ryan, the same quality defensive system and a whole new accomplished offensive staff. Rex is coaching for his life in 2013. If the Jets do not have a winning season or make the playoffs. He is gone. He knows it and the entire organization knows it. Rather than begin a complete organizational reset. Woody Johnson has decided to try and take another shot. The problem is that The Jets are not constructed properly to be a legitimate contender. They do not and will not have the neccessary cap room to improve their talent base. They don't have the current talent base to be a legitimate contender. The team is stuck in neutral. If 2013 goes as projected, The Jets will have to reset the entire organization from the coaching staff to the scouting department a year from now. The only person that will remain is John Idzik. Instead of using 2013 to build for 2014. The Jets are putting off the rebuild for another year in the hopes of getting back to where they were. That ship has sailed. Woody failed to realize that or doesn't want to face that reality. By attempting this in 2013, The Jets are pretty much setting themselves up for potentially two more losing seasons in 2013 and 2014. Even if the organization gets things on track, They may not contend until 2015.

    There is always a fine line between realistic and pessimistic. So I know that this thread can be seen in both lights. Probably leaning more towards the pessimistic side. There is something about the way 2012 ended that made me feel like we are back to the way things were before 1997. I hope that I am wrong.
    You sound very pessimistic indeed. Woody has already made the changes that needed to be done. The dark ages of 2011 and 12 are in the past! Idzik will repair the cap and get the jets the players they need hopefully this year! A team that has Revis,Cro,Wilk,Coples,Davis,Landry,Holmes,Keller,H ill,Edwards,Mangold,Brick and decent RB's and a solid ST core seems like a team that has talent to me.

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