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Thread: Mark Sanchez will be our #1 QB in 2013

  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    I am with SAR in the 2% of folks that dont blame Sanchez and accept reality and relevance as a Jet fan. I think there is a lot in play here. Most Jet fans (just the nature of NY sports), like Stephen A Smith have an approach of "what have you done for me lately", and if you have failed, time to move forward with somebody else. Remeber Giant fans wanted Eli's head in year 4 right before he caught lightning in a bottle and went on a SB run.

    If you have been a long-sufferring Jet fan with crap QB play between the 80s/90s (exception of 1998 with Vinny), then you welcomed in the relevance of Pennington - I certainly did with open arms. I also hated Tanny for cutting him and bringing in Favre. Then you see Sanchez come in and get us to within 30 mins of a SB, twice in two straight years. I welcome that relevance. Ok yes, he then had 8-8 and 6-10 seasons with absolute crap on his team, thanks to Tanny turning all of our playmakers away.

    Nevermind the QB ratings, I care about wins. He was never going to be Brady or Manning, good luck finding that, it doesnt happen easily. The NFL fan has changed from back i the 80s and 90s of being a decent QB and having a long leash - i blame that on fantasy football. Now everyone wants Brady, Manning or Rodgers, or else you burn him at the stake. Needs to put up unreal stats or else! Ok good luck finding a better alternative. "Matt Flynn rules!" - um, one game? Id rather have a guy who can get us to 30 mins of a SB.

    Jet management is totally to blame for Sanchez' demise, and it ends there. No help or support whatsoever. Remember Sanchez was king of the world and 3-0 as a Jet with Cotchery, Clowney and Stuckey before the Braylon trade. Jet management kept tweaking and tweaking and turning and churning - no chemistry built to help this kid play to his strengths. Brad Smith, Leon Washington and Cotchery were 3 of our biggest playmakers and we dumped them all, and bring in Tebow and Plax and Mason and Schillens, and more garbage.

    Heres to appreciating relevance and being optimistic about Sanchez in 2013, I think if we are smart this offseason, we help surround him and resurrect his career.
    Please tell me what Sanchez actually does WELL for you to have this opinion. Please. No one ever has. All that ever comes up is "he took us to 2 championship games" and "he doesnt have a good supporting cast"

  2. #262
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    hes an exellent playoff QB. give me some weapons to get us through the regular season and into the playoffs, and its a brand new ballgame. he also had a span of most 2-min comebacks by any NFL Qb between years 2 and 3. Yes, this year he sucked. Yes, his ratings suck, i know, blah blah blah.

    give me an alternative - matt flynn? david garrard? everyone who thinks sanchez is garbage has no alternatives....its the same "stephen a smith NY media comments", "he is garbage, the reality of the situation is that." ok what are the alternatives?


    Quote Originally Posted by johnnysd View Post
    Please tell me what Sanchez actually does WELL for you to have this opinion. Please. No one ever has. All that ever comes up is "he took us to 2 championship games" and "he doesnt have a good supporting cast"

  3. #263
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Like replacing Cancer with AIDS. Brilliant.



    Switch one player, the QB, with any of those teams, and we're better.

    Simple as that. We don't need to blow up anything. We need a better QB, running a better offensive system, with a few select new pieces to improve areas of weakness. "Blow it up" is a simpletons answer to a complicated situation.
    In Rex's version of G&P I really don't think you would have seen much of a difference regardless of who the QB was. In years 1&2 when they had a dominant Oline and running game the QB was a game manager , in that role any other QB would look much like Sanchez a caretaker at best.

    In year 3 with the talent declining ( and Mangold injury key) the running game regressed,yet Rex stood by his system , this caused major frustration on the O and a clearly fractured the lockerroom.

    Year 4 speaks for itself,just look at the offensive talent , Montana, Elway and Marino would have struggled to perform with this crap.

    Bottom line Sanchez has never been in a progressive offensive in the NFL. No one can look at his past stats and say he'll suck this year. Sure he has some flaws ( poor pocket awareness, ball security) but these are things that can be overcome by good OC's by using him to his strengths instead of forcing a square peg into a round hole. We don't know what Sanchez is capable of this year no more than we know what Matt Flynn, Matt Moore or any QB that people are clamoring for. The Jets have taken a step forward by bringing in a strong OC , Rex has admitted he needs to step away from the G&P , let's see what Sanchez is capable of in a real offense. If he crashes & burns everyone gets their wish and he's gone next year when the cap hit makes much more sense.

  4. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by PMarsico9 View Post
    During the offseason of 2008 I NEVER wanted Sanchez. I always wanted them to trade for this guy. Washington was shopping him after allowing him a full (Gasp!) 2 years of average QB play. And average QB play is all that incredible defense and o-line would've needed in 2009 to win the Super Bowl.

    If they make that trade then this team wins the Super Bowl in 2009. I have no qualms saying that.

    Instead of Sanchez you get the big, physical, game-manager type QB you wanted and Washington is stuck with Buttchez.

    Then that team is likely good for 10 wins without a defense that is required to play perfect every single down and Thomas Jones could be somewhat healthy by the end of the year. Meaning no DOA when Greene gets hurt in the Colts game.
    I said the same thing!!!!!!

    The only difference was that I didn't dislike Sanchez when he came out. I frankly didn't know enough about him. But I definitely felt that if your draft a RAW ROOKIE QB, with limited college experience, then you have to wait for 3 to 4 years to see what you got!!!!

    If the Jets thought that they were a SB ready team then drafting Sanchez made NO SENSE!!!! NONE!!!!! It is simple....

    No team won a SB while immediately starting a QB having so little college experience; NO ONE!!!!!

    It was then I realized that they, the Jets, had no PLAN!!!!!

    What you posted above is 1000X more coherent then what the Jets actually did!!!!

    It is a disgrace!!!!!
    Last edited by Charlie Brown; 01-28-2013 at 05:11 PM.

  5. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by 56mehl56 View Post
    Bottom line Sanchez has never been in a progressive offensive in the NFL. No one can look at his past stats and say he'll suck this year. Sure he has some flaws ( poor pocket awareness, ball security) but these are things that can be overcome by good OC's by using him to his strengths instead of forcing a square peg into a round hole. We don't know what Sanchez is capable of this year no more than we know what Matt Flynn, Matt Moore or any QB that people are clamoring for. The Jets have taken a step forward by bringing in a strong OC , Rex has admitted he needs to step away from the G&P , let's see what Sanchez is capable of in a real offense. If he crashes & burns everyone gets their wish and he's gone next year when the cap hit makes much more sense.
    Indeed the one time Schotty had Sanchez throwing the ball around and he had those 300 yard games Rex, the offensive guru, came in and shut the offense down!!!

    Rex Ryan as far as the offense goes has been a DISASTER!!!!

  6. #266
    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    most QBs cant do that.

    No QB's can. None of them play defense.

    You are delusional. Mark Sanchez in four seasons has been the sole reason for a win exactly once.

    And no QB these days is winning a Super Bowl without being able to complete 6 out of 10 throws.

    As Ray Lucas has said so eloquently:

    "I can suit up right now, with a screwed up spine, and complete 60% of my passes."

    Of course you can, because if you can't, you suck.

  7. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    hes an exellent playoff QB.
    Based on what?

    The #1 running game and the #1 defense?

    Or his "excellent" playoff game against the Chargers when their All-Pro kicker missed 3 chips shot FG's and he "led" the Jets to victory by going 12/23, 100 yards and an INT?

    Yep, an excellent playoff QB.

  8. #268
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    yep, an excellent QB. He outplayed those guys in the playoffs, and despite the stats, he made huge throws in big drives to lead us to victory. again i ask what is the alternative? nobody can answer. I agree we need to draft a QB, like Nassib, Wilson, or Barkley [insert typical NY fairweather stephen a smith fan...."omg, no, barkley went to USC, therefore he will suck too!"]

    if you want fantasy stats, keeping wishing for rodgers and brady, you will be waiting a long time....enjoy!

    Quote Originally Posted by PatsFanTX View Post
    Based on what?

    The #1 running game and the #1 defense?

    Or his "excellent" playoff game against the Chargers when their All-Pro kicker missed 3 chips shot FG's and he "led" the Jets to victory by going 12/23, 100 yards and an INT?

    Yep, an excellent playoff QB.

  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    hes an exellent playoff QB. give me some weapons to get us through the regular season and into the playoffs, and its a brand new ballgame. he also had a span of most 2-min comebacks by any NFL Qb between years 2 and 3. Yes, this year he sucked. Yes, his ratings suck, i know, blah blah blah.

    give me an alternative - matt flynn? david garrard? everyone who thinks sanchez is garbage has no alternatives....its the same "stephen a smith NY media comments", "he is garbage, the reality of the situation is that." ok what are the alternatives?
    The incrediblly weak playoff argument He's an excellent playoff QB? Well he won 4 games but he played well really in like 1 of them.

    Alternatives? ANYONE. Seriously. He is the worst starting QB in the NFL. Did you actually watch him play?? He is a horror show.

    You really cannot play worse. He was like below 32nd in both QBR and QB rating as well as Football Outsiders rating. He has had 11 100QB rating games in his careeer- Russell Wilson had 9 in his rookie season.

    It is completely bewildering that any Jets fan could not get physically ill at the though of seeing him start again. Replace him with the 2nd string QB of probably more than half the teams and it would be an improvement.

    He has NO SKILLS, no feel for the game. And he cannot handle the pressure of the game. Any FA signing of any rookie signed would be a viable alternative. Anyone. He is truly that bad.

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by 56mehl56 View Post
    I
    Bottom line Sanchez has never been in a progressive offensive in the NFL. No one can look at his past stats and say he'll suck this year. Sure he has some flaws ( poor pocket awareness, ball security) but these are things that can be overcome by good OC's by using him to his strengths instead of forcing a square peg into a round hole. . If he crashes & burns everyone gets their wish and he's gone next year when the cap hit makes much more sense.
    1. Please do enlighten us as to his strengths because I do not see a single one

    2. He has already crashed and burned about as hard as he can. And you want to give him another shot??? The money should not be the reason, and there is zero justification based on ability.

  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by PatsFanTX View Post
    Based on what?

    The #1 running game and the #1 defense?

    Or his "excellent" playoff game against the Chargers when their All-Pro kicker missed 3 chips shot FG's and he "led" the Jets to victory by going 12/23, 100 yards and an INT?

    Yep, an excellent playoff QB.
    yoffs
    Age is Years-Days Glossary SHARE Embed CSV PRE LINK ?
    Passing Rushing
    Rk Year G# Date Age Tm Opp Result GS Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A Att Yds Y/A TD
    1 2009 17 2010-01-09 23-059 NYJ @ CIN W 24-14 * 12 15 80.0% 182 1 0 139.4 12.13 13.47 3 -2 -0.67 0
    2 2009 18 2010-01-17 23-067 NYJ @ SDG W 17-14 * 12 23 52.2% 100 1 1 60.1 4.35 3.26 1 -1 -1.00 0
    3 2009 19 2010-01-24 23-074 NYJ @ IND L 17-30 * 17 30 56.7% 257 2 1 93.3 8.57 8.40 2 1 0.50 0
    Passing Rushing
    Rk Year G# Date Age Tm Opp Result GS Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A Att Yds Y/A TD
    4 2010 17 2011-01-08 24-058 NYJ @ IND W 17-16 * 18 31 58.1% 189 0 1 62.4 6.10 4.65 1 6 6.00 0
    5 2010 18 2011-01-16 24-066 NYJ @ NWE W 28-21 * 16 25 64.0% 194 3 0 127.3 7.76 10.16 1 -1 -1.00 0
    6 2010 19 2011-01-23 24-073 NYJ @ PIT L 19-24 * 20 33 60.6% 233 2 0 102.2 7.06 8.27 3 6 2.00 0
    6 Games 95 157 60.5% 1155 9 3 94.3 7.36 7.64 11 9 0.82 0
    difficult to read, sorry. I'm sure you can clearly see his all time rate at 94.3, 9 td to 3 int and against NE he posted a 127.3 rating with 3 td's and no picks.
    Last edited by NYJ37/12; 01-28-2013 at 09:32 PM.

  12. #272
    Quote Originally Posted by johnnysd View Post
    1. Please do enlighten us as to his strengths because I do not see a single one

    2. He has already crashed and burned about as hard as he can. And you want to give him another shot??? The money should not be the reason, and there is zero justification based on ability.
    Its hard to see the strengths because with the offense he's been saddled with it would be hard for any QB to shine. But I'll play along, he was very good his first two years when breaking the pocket and on roll outs, he also did this very well at USC . For some reason the Jets wanted him to become more of a pocket passer. I know I read tidbits that Ryan didn't like the way he was taking hits and not sliding down. So they traded his best quality for a pocket passing style and guess what he ended up taking more shots.

    Sanchez the player is definitely lacking confidence right now, he's much more tenative and jittery than he was 2 years ago. A good OC who is renowned for bolstering QB's confidences could be just what the doctor ordered.

    As far as crashing and burning that distinction should be placed solely on Rex's misguided love of the G&P style. That offensive philosophy is the root of all that ails the Jets offense.

    You say there's zero justification for Sanchez as starter based on ability, so who's your alternative Flynn (is 1 game a justification), Matt Moore really , McElroy. It makes logical sense to start Sanchez this year any other QB who may make a difference will be too much of a detriment to the cap.

  13. #273
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    Thank you. It's clear the guy can play in the moment, especially w a cast around him. Yes, he sucked this season, I know.

    Quote Originally Posted by NYJ37/12 View Post
    yoffs
    Age is Years-Days Glossary SHARE Embed CSV PRE LINK ?
    Passing Rushing
    Rk Year G# Date Age Tm Opp Result GS Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A Att Yds Y/A TD
    1 2009 17 2010-01-09 23-059 NYJ @ CIN W 24-14 * 12 15 80.0% 182 1 0 139.4 12.13 13.47 3 -2 -0.67 0
    2 2009 18 2010-01-17 23-067 NYJ @ SDG W 17-14 * 12 23 52.2% 100 1 1 60.1 4.35 3.26 1 -1 -1.00 0
    3 2009 19 2010-01-24 23-074 NYJ @ IND L 17-30 * 17 30 56.7% 257 2 1 93.3 8.57 8.40 2 1 0.50 0
    Passing Rushing
    Rk Year G# Date Age Tm Opp Result GS Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Rate Y/A AY/A Att Yds Y/A TD
    4 2010 17 2011-01-08 24-058 NYJ @ IND W 17-16 * 18 31 58.1% 189 0 1 62.4 6.10 4.65 1 6 6.00 0
    5 2010 18 2011-01-16 24-066 NYJ @ NWE W 28-21 * 16 25 64.0% 194 3 0 127.3 7.76 10.16 1 -1 -1.00 0
    6 2010 19 2011-01-23 24-073 NYJ @ PIT L 19-24 * 20 33 60.6% 233 2 0 102.2 7.06 8.27 3 6 2.00 0
    6 Games 95 157 60.5% 1155 9 3 94.3 7.36 7.64 11 9 0.82 0
    difficult to read, sorry. I'm sure you can clearly see his all time rate at 94.3, 9 td to 3 int and against NE he posted a 127.3 rating with 3 td's and no picks.

  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by 56mehl56 View Post
    You say there's zero justification for Sanchez as starter based on ability, so who's your alternative Flynn (is 1 game a justification), Matt Moore really , McElroy. It makes logical sense to start Sanchez this year any other QB who may make a difference will be too much of a detriment to the cap.
    Why continue to start a failed QB??? I do not get the logic. There are many viable alternatives because almost anyone will be better.

  15. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    I just realized, today, that this is absolutely how this offseason is going to pan out.

    Cutting him is out, he's too expensive under any projected cap-hit-scenario-projection I've read.

    Trading him is out, for much the same reason (and because no one else wants to pay him).

    So that means we're keeping him.

    And if we're keeping him, he is not going to be the #2. He's just not.

    Mark Sanchez is going to get another full year to win or lose as a Jet, fan reaction be damned. In a new Morning-Whig System that depends heavily on a timely, accurate, quick-reading Quareterback.

    Dreams (of some) for Flynn, or Alex Smith, or Moore, or any of the various lolJag's in the "related to Morning-Whig or new QB Coach" thread are just that, dreams.

    At most, and journeyman will be brought in to replace Tebow (maybe) as the #2, and "challenge" Sanchez, i.e. not challenge him at all.

    And Mark will be our opening day Starter at QB.

    Worse, I think there is every possabillity we could open the 2013 season with BOTH Sanchez AND Tebow on the roster.
    Morningweg has helped far worse QB's. They'll bring in Smith and let them fight it out. It will make for great theater in training camp.

  16. #276
    Sanchez's replacement is coming soon...
    He will not be able to beat this new QB out...
    Who that is...

  17. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by 56mehl56 View Post
    In Rex's version of G&P I really don't think you would have seen much of a difference regardless of who the QB was. In years 1&2 when they had a dominant Oline and running game the QB was a game manager , in that role any other QB would look much like Sanchez a caretaker at best.

    In year 3 with the talent declining ( and Mangold injury key) the running game regressed,yet Rex stood by his system , this caused major frustration on the O and a clearly fractured the lockerroom.

    Year 4 speaks for itself,just look at the offensive talent , Montana, Elway and Marino would have struggled to perform with this crap.

    Bottom line Sanchez has never been in a progressive offensive in the NFL. No one can look at his past stats and say he'll suck this year. Sure he has some flaws ( poor pocket awareness, ball security) but these are things that can be overcome by good OC's by using him to his strengths instead of forcing a square peg into a round hole. We don't know what Sanchez is capable of this year no more than we know what Matt Flynn, Matt Moore or any QB that people are clamoring for. The Jets have taken a step forward by bringing in a strong OC , Rex has admitted he needs to step away from the G&P , let's see what Sanchez is capable of in a real offense. If he crashes & burns everyone gets their wish and he's gone next year when the cap hit makes much more sense.
    Do you know why the Jets don't run a progressive offense? It's because Sanchez, to date, has not shown the ability to do so. Running the ball, theoretically speaking, should make it easier for the quarter back. Teams routinely stack the box against the Jets because they know he can't beat them. Can you imagine if some defenses routinely stacked the box against a team like the Packers? They would get torched.

    I have seen QB's around the league do better with less than Sanchez has.

    Maybe his lack of starting QB experience, at the collegiate level, has a contributing factor to his mediocre play.With that said, starting on a team that has a an elite O line,stout defense, solid running game and special teams should have been ideal. That type of support limits the responsibilities of the QB.

    I'm not suggesting that he can't improve, but if he does, he has a long road ahead of him.
    Last edited by Tonetime86; 01-29-2013 at 03:32 AM.

  18. #278
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    You make some valid points but his past two years showed that he has only gotten worse....it's crazy to think he can be a starting QB after the 2012 season.....if I somehow turns it around in 2013 (I'm confident he won't) then it will be one of the few times that I was glad I am wrong. Te alternative can actually be a new veteran QB or even a draft pick....absurd to think that another QB cannot come in under the new offensive system and flourish.



    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    hes an exellent playoff QB. give me some weapons to get us through the regular season and into the playoffs, and its a brand new ballgame. he also had a span of most 2-min comebacks by any NFL Qb between years 2 and 3. Yes, this year he sucked. Yes, his ratings suck, i know, blah blah blah.

    give me an alternative - matt flynn? david garrard? everyone who thinks sanchez is garbage has no alternatives....its the same "stephen a smith NY media comments", "he is garbage, the reality of the situation is that." ok what are the alternatives?

  19. #279
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    The most I will agree on is him having to fight for the starting QB kob...I am glad the Jets made that clear early....they have NOT said tht he was the 2013 starting QB.



    Quote Originally Posted by JetItalia View Post
    yep, an excellent QB. He outplayed those guys in the playoffs, and despite the stats, he made huge throws in big drives to lead us to victory. again i ask what is the alternative? nobody can answer. I agree we need to draft a QB, like Nassib, Wilson, or Barkley [insert typical NY fairweather stephen a smith fan...."omg, no, barkley went to USC, therefore he will suck too!"]

    if you want fantasy stats, keeping wishing for rodgers and brady, you will be waiting a long time....enjoy!

  20. #280
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    You again make some good points but the overall proof is what we saw in regards to his individaul play....the man is an NFL QB but not a starter in my opinion.....there is no way the Jets will just give him the job in 2013...if he somehow earns it then good for him...and hopefull the Jets....we cannot got through another year with that pathetic offense...the defense played their asses off...if the Jets O can even be in the top 12 things can turn around quick. They won 6 games and should have won more if not for Sanchez.



    Quote Originally Posted by 56mehl56 View Post
    Its hard to see the strengths because with the offense he's been saddled with it would be hard for any QB to shine. But I'll play along, he was very good his first two years when breaking the pocket and on roll outs, he also did this very well at USC . For some reason the Jets wanted him to become more of a pocket passer. I know I read tidbits that Ryan didn't like the way he was taking hits and not sliding down. So they traded his best quality for a pocket passing style and guess what he ended up taking more shots.

    Sanchez the player is definitely lacking confidence right now, he's much more tenative and jittery than he was 2 years ago. A good OC who is renowned for bolstering QB's confidences could be just what the doctor ordered.

    As far as crashing and burning that distinction should be placed solely on Rex's misguided love of the G&P style. That offensive philosophy is the root of all that ails the Jets offense.

    You say there's zero justification for Sanchez as starter based on ability, so who's your alternative Flynn (is 1 game a justification), Matt Moore really , McElroy. It makes logical sense to start Sanchez this year any other QB who may make a difference will be too much of a detriment to the cap.

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