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Thread: Holmes NEEDS to be cut today.

  1. #1

    Holmes NEEDS to be cut today.

    Looking at his contract, sure there is alot of dead money.

    However the most important part of that contract is the offsets. The more money Holmes gets this year from another team, the less comes off our cap. Due to EGO of Holmes/Agent there is no way he is taking a min salary anywhere this year.

    I really cant see him taking less then 4-5m anywhere this year especially when Wallace is about to get 12-13 even with Holmes coming off injury. The key is cutting him asap as this is when teams spend the most. The more teams fill their holes the worse for the jets.

    Last Random thought:

    With Pouha gone we are basically a 4-3 team.

  2. #2
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    i'll be happy with a 4-3 record after the first 7 games....NO ONE here can predict what the jets 2013 record will be when we don't even know what the actual squad will look like.



    Quote Originally Posted by KR View Post
    Looking at his contract, sure there is alot of dead money.

    However the most important part of that contract is the offsets. The more money Holmes gets this year from another team, the less comes off our cap. Due to EGO of Holmes/Agent there is no way he is taking a min salary anywhere this year.

    I really cant see him taking less then 4-5m anywhere this year especially when Wallace is about to get 12-13 even with Holmes coming off injury. The key is cutting him asap as this is when teams spend the most. The more teams fill their holes the worse for the jets.

    Last Random thought:

    With Pouha gone we are basically a 4-3 team.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by KR View Post
    Looking at his contract, sure there is alot of dead money.

    However the most important part of that contract is the offsets. The more money Holmes gets this year from another team, the less comes off our cap. Due to EGO of Holmes/Agent there is no way he is taking a min salary anywhere this year.

    I really cant see him taking less then 4-5m anywhere this year especially when Wallace is about to get 12-13 even with Holmes coming off injury. The key is cutting him asap as this is when teams spend the most. The more teams fill their holes the worse for the jets.

    Last Random thought:

    With Pouha gone we are basically a 4-3 team.
    I could be wrong, but I don't think the money comes off of his cap amount. I think the salary counts against the cap, no matter how much another team signs him for.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfreak View Post
    i'll be happy with a 4-3 record after the first 7 games....NO ONE here can predict what the jets 2013 record will be when we don't even know what the actual squad will look like.
    I think he means a 4-3 defensive front, not our record.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    I think he means a 4-3 defensive front, not our record.
    I think he was making a joke (albeit a lame one)

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Batmans A Scientist View Post
    I could be wrong, but I don't think the money comes off of his cap amount. I think the salary counts against the cap, no matter how much another team signs him for.

    If released Holmes will count for $11.5 million in dead money. While that is a high figure the Jets will gain $1 million in cap space. That’s a little power, that one would think is offset by the need to cut Holmes a $7.75 million dollar check. Unlike most of their other contracts, though, Holmes’ guarantee was reported to be of the much weaker variety in that the team receives offset credits if he signs with another club. How does that matter? If the Jets cut him the Jets pay him $7.75 million. He is going to sign with another team. For how much? Considering injury, ineffectiveness in 2011, and a bad reputation around the league $4-$5 million a year would be the most I think he would earn. Since he can’t double dip his max earnings are likely $7.75 million this year. The Jets get credits for salary earned so that $1 million in savings can quickly grow to $4 or $5 million and their cash obligation reduce to $3 or $4 million. That’s power. It renders the $11.25 million base salary worthless .

    What that means is the best financial future for him is tied to staying with the Jets both in 2013 and an opportunity to earn his $9.5 million in 2014. So in my mind the difference between $7.75 and $11.25 immediately comes off the books. Like I said he is going to want the contract to still say he makes his $45 million so you simply roll that $3.75 million into 2015 as a roster bonus. By doing this we don’t touch his 2014 cap number while lowering his 2013 cap charge to $9 million. Now some may say why not just release him. While I could see that point he still is a talent and the Jets do need something on offense in 2013. While I do not think he fits at all in a WCO system maybe you can get something out of him. I look at that as different as Pace’s situation where you could probably replace him with a warm pulse. The dropoff between Holmes to Clyde Gates is huge, no matter how much Holmes mopes around the field.

    Do you want to cut more out of Holmes’ cap? There are two avenues by which we can do that. One of the good things about a player being injured is that you can work with his contract to skirt the salary cap for a season by using in game roster bonuses as a replacement for salary. Holmes was only active for 4 weeks in 2012 so only ľ of the total roster bonus would count on the 2013 cap if the Jets went that route. This is what they did with LaRon Landry last year to save on cap space.

    Now the negative with that move is that I don’t think his side would be as willing to accept a pay reduction since there is danger that the bonus money will not be earned. To make it work you would have to do something that most of the fanbase would be against and that is guarantee an offsetting amount of salary in 2014, a guarantee that would void only upon playing a certain number of games in 2013. How would that work in practice? You would pay him a base salary of $4.3 million in 2013 plus his $250,000 workout bonus. Those salaries are earned regardless of injury. You would convert the remaining $3.2 million into per game roster bonuses worth $200,000 per game in which he is on the gameday active list. Because he was only active 4 games in 2013 only $800,000 of the roster bonuses count towards the Jets 2013 cap with the rest only affecting the cap at the end of the season. This brings his cap charge down to $6.6 million. I could see doing that since the only pain in 2014 is if he doesn’t play 16 games in 2013 because he would be more difficult to cut. The $200,000 per game was just for illustration and you could do any number you want as long as his base salary is at least $840,000 in 2013. I like this idea if he is staying here.

    The other option is to go all in on Holmes and decide you definitely want him here in 2014. What you do in that case is take the $7.5 million base, reduce it to $840,000 and convert the remaining $6,660,000 to a signing bonus. That reduces his 2013 cap charge to $4.56 million, but it increases his 2014 cap to $12.97 million and his 2014 dead money to $6.94 million. I don’t like either of those numbers. Even if he plays well it puts you right back to square 1 with his contract. I don’t think he is worth the risk of this move even if it means short term health. Im going to aim for a paycut and a “lets play ball” mentality with the contract.

    2013 Savings: $5.9 million in Cap and $3.5 million in Cash
    2014 Savings: $0K Cash and Cap


    http://www.nyjetscap.com/2013_Articl...cap-part2.html

    Cut him today! Let Balt sign him..Good landing spot for him IMO
    Last edited by C Mart; 03-12-2013 at 02:04 PM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfreak View Post
    i'll be happy with a 4-3 record after the first 7 games....NO ONE here can predict what the jets 2013 record will be when we don't even know what the actual squad will look like.
    We are a 1-15 team right now. With some shrewd free agency moves, we could easily turn into a 3-13 team.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    If released Holmes will count for $11.5 million in dead money. While that is a high figure the Jets will gain $1 million in cap space. Thatís a little power, that one would think is offset by the need to cut Holmes a $7.75 million dollar check. Unlike most of their other contracts, though, Holmesí guarantee was reported to be of the much weaker variety in that the team receives offset credits if he signs with another club. How does that matter? If the Jets cut him the Jets pay him $7.75 million. He is going to sign with another team. For how much? Considering injury, ineffectiveness in 2011, and a bad reputation around the league $4-$5 million a year would be the most I think he would earn. Since he canít double dip his max earnings are likely $7.75 million this year. The Jets get credits for salary earned so that $1 million in savings can quickly grow to $4 or $5 million and their cash obligation reduce to $3 or $4 million. Thatís power. It renders the $11.25 million base salary worthless .

    What that means is the best financial future for him is tied to staying with the Jets both in 2013 and an opportunity to earn his $9.5 million in 2014. So in my mind the difference between $7.75 and $11.25 immediately comes off the books. Like I said he is going to want the contract to still say he makes his $45 million so you simply roll that $3.75 million into 2015 as a roster bonus. By doing this we donít touch his 2014 cap number while lowering his 2013 cap charge to $9 million. Now some may say why not just release him. While I could see that point he still is a talent and the Jets do need something on offense in 2013. While I do not think he fits at all in a WCO system maybe you can get something out of him. I look at that as different as Paceís situation where you could probably replace him with a warm pulse. The dropoff between Holmes to Clyde Gates is huge, no matter how much Holmes mopes around the field.

    Do you want to cut more out of Holmesí cap? There are two avenues by which we can do that. One of the good things about a player being injured is that you can work with his contract to skirt the salary cap for a season by using in game roster bonuses as a replacement for salary. Holmes was only active for 4 weeks in 2012 so only ľ of the total roster bonus would count on the 2013 cap if the Jets went that route. This is what they did with LaRon Landry last year to save on cap space.

    Now the negative with that move is that I donít think his side would be as willing to accept a pay reduction since there is danger that the bonus money will not be earned. To make it work you would have to do something that most of the fanbase would be against and that is guarantee an offsetting amount of salary in 2014, a guarantee that would void only upon playing a certain number of games in 2013. How would that work in practice? You would pay him a base salary of $4.3 million in 2013 plus his $250,000 workout bonus. Those salaries are earned regardless of injury. You would convert the remaining $3.2 million into per game roster bonuses worth $200,000 per game in which he is on the gameday active list. Because he was only active 4 games in 2013 only $800,000 of the roster bonuses count towards the Jets 2013 cap with the rest only affecting the cap at the end of the season. This brings his cap charge down to $6.6 million. I could see doing that since the only pain in 2014 is if he doesnít play 16 games in 2013 because he would be more difficult to cut. The $200,000 per game was just for illustration and you could do any number you want as long as his base salary is at least $840,000 in 2013. I like this idea if he is staying here.

    The other option is to go all in on Holmes and decide you definitely want him here in 2014. What you do in that case is take the $7.5 million base, reduce it to $840,000 and convert the remaining $6,660,000 to a signing bonus. That reduces his 2013 cap charge to $4.56 million, but it increases his 2014 cap to $12.97 million and his 2014 dead money to $6.94 million. I donít like either of those numbers. Even if he plays well it puts you right back to square 1 with his contract. I donít think he is worth the risk of this move even if it means short term health. Im going to aim for a paycut and a ďlets play ballĒ mentality with the contract.

    2013 Savings: $5.9 million in Cap and $3.5 million in Cash
    2014 Savings: $0K Cash and Cap


    http://www.nyjetscap.com/2013_Articl...cap-part2.html

    Cut him today! Let Balt sign him..Good landing spot for him IMO
    Solid analysis...well done

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    We are a 1-15 team right now. With some shrewd free agency moves, we could easily turn into a 3-13 team.
    Im starting to think, could be wrong, but starting to think you do not feel our Jets will be good next season.

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