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Thread: Revis' brand and why it has more value than his football ability

  1. #21
    The Jets will look like the biggest joke if they trade him away? What do they look like now? What do they look like if they resign him? As long as the circus master is the H.C., we'll be a joke.

  2. #22
    The Jets will look like the biggest joke if they trade him away? What do they look like now? What do they look like if they resign him? As long as the circus master is the H.C., we'll be a joke.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    The Jets should absolutely resign him NOW, This thread did nothing to sway my opinion. The Jets will look like the biggest joke for trading away their best player if they happen to do that.

    Revis is a player you want on your team no matter what. He's a great presence to have around when you are rebuilding and he puts you over the top when you have a good team around him. He's a big game player that you want on your side when you play in the SB.
    This argument has some validity to it, but to earn big you sometimes have to spend big, and that is what they are looking to do. I'm not too sure how I would feel about the "presence" a Revis supplies, given his propensity for not honoring contracts and negotiating more than others via the media.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    And the money? That's a complete crock of sh*t. Everyone that want to get rid of him because they say he want too much. Your just pissy because your JEALOUS, nothing more, nothing less.
    Who's jealous and pissy? This was an odd statement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    As I already pointed out from a percentage standpoint, if Revis gets the 15 million per he's looking for, that would amount to approximately 12 and change percent of the 123 million dollar salary cap.
    That's a large portion of the cap to dedicate to a position like CB, especially since the Jets are so deficient in other, more impactful positions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    Back in 2000, the Bucs traded for one Keyshawn Johnson. They gave up TWO 1st round draft choices (which automatically means that the compensation from the Bucs for Revis is complete sh*t. Key wasn't even the best WR in football when he got traded. Revis is clearly the BEST.)

    They also gave Johnson 8 year 56 million dollar contract at the time. That was an obscene amount at that time. The salary cap in 2001 was 62 million and change. The 7 million per that Keyshawn got comprised 11 and change percent of their salary cap at that time.
    Apples and...not even oranges, more like potatoes. Key played a significantly more important position and was NOT coming off a major knee injury. The only relevance is that the same two teams are involved. Seriously, I can't believe this comparison even entered your thought process.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    So all of you posters that say he should be traded, well you actually think the team is better off without him. Well, I think that is dumb.
    And you're entitled to that opinion, just as anyone else is regarding said opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    What Revis wants for money is merely relative. You cannot fathom it because you forgot it where 11 years went since the last time somebody got a payday like that. The percentage proves that the amount of money Revis is merely relative and a sign of the times.
    It's not relative, it's very germane to the decision on whether to trade him, as is his past behavior regarding contracts. You can't simple dismiss it because it is your wont. As Ray astutely pointed out in his well thought-out post, this topic is extremely complex with variables that are going to be very, very difficult to justify, no matter what the final decision winds up being.

  4. #24
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    Great post Ray...

    And for those that are advocating re-signing Revis in the neighborhood of like $12 or so million/yr...all I have to ask is ...why?

    Revis IS a great player, probably the best CB in the NFL when healthy...but the CB market has clearly reset. Very good CB's are going on 1 yr deals at like $6 million. The highest paid CB to my knowledge (outside Revis who although slated to 'make' $6 mill this yr is making considerably more on a pro rata basis given his prior bonuses to be accounted for over the length of his contract) is Bailey at like $8 million. Is Revis really worth a 50% premium, or even a 100% premium to other CB's?

    If I'm GM of the Jets, I don't pay Revis over $10 mill/yr...that's what the market dictates..otherwise you're just wasting cap dollars. Even at $10 mill/yr, you're paying a 25% premium over market.

    If TB wants to pay Revis 2X market value, coming off an ACL injury, then I say trade him.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    If you take a step back off the ledge for just a minute, the argument that some have made about trading Revis aren't suggesting that they do so because the Jets are better off without him.

    You can scream your head off all you want, there are two sides of this that make for valid arguments. The point of this thread wasn't to see you regurgitate with your high and mighty stance that it would be dumb to trade Revis, it factors in both sides of the story, and presents an angle not really discussed, and that is Revis' value beyond his ability as a football player, and why Revis is taking the stance he is, because he can, and his brand has enabled that platform. On the other hand, the Jets have taken this into account, but are working both sides, the side to keep him but not at the level he is seeking, and if they are going to trade him, to maximize that compensation because of the value he would bring another team, especially a small market team, and factoring the business side of any trade.
    Ray, you simply aren't understanding what I am saying.

    I listened to what you have to say. I've also gone through all of the options for and against trading him.

    At the end of the day, I always come back to the arguments I've already made.

    He is a great presence to have on the team. Even during the thin years because he sets the example of EXCELLENCE. He sets the example of CONSISTENCY. And YES, he sets the example of going and getting what you think is yours.

    I'm not talking about you Ray, but MANY other posters on this site make that sound like a sin. THAT is a complete crock of sh*t. There's no other way of responding to that.

    What you know, just as well as I do, is that if you are a truly talented individual, in any walk of life for that matter, you would try to make the most out of it.

    Well, here we have Darrelle Revis that KNOWS he's the CB in football, if not the best defender. His agents KNOW he is the best CB in football. Other teams in the NFL KNOW he's the best CB in football. Any knowledgeable fan KNOWS he's the best CB in football.

    So Revis wants to break the bank in his next contract extension.

    Yet, so many on this site think that is wrong.

    You tell me Ray, WTF is wrong with that?! Honestly, I cannot find a damn thing wrong with that. I'm sure you can't either.

    I also already pointed out that the percentage is relative. Key got 11% of the Bucs cap in 2002. They then went on, all the while building a team around him, and living with Key's salary, and WON the SB in 2002.

    So for anyone thinking that we are better off without him, I call nonsense. The percentage checks out. Darrelle Revis checks out as the best, most consistent player that the NYJ have EVER had. It all checks out.

    I also question very highly that getting picks for Revis would make our team better. As you well know, EVERY pick in the NFL draft is a gamble. Vernon Gholston anyone? Unless you are talking about multiple high picls where the likelihood of striking gold is much higher then I say it isn't worth it.

    We are also NOT talking about multiple high picks. As the article clearly states, the Bucs are offering a 1st and 2nd for him.

    Some posters on this site actually think that is appropriate? That's laughable at best.

    Keyshawn Johnson, who wasn't even the best WR in football at that time, went for TWO 1st rounders. NOW, they want to trade the very best CB in football for LESS? How does that make any sense?

    Now, I have others actually harping that WR is actually MORE important than CB. Pretty soon they'll be posting that CB in on the same level of importance as being a Guard in the NFL. Completely insane.

    I've listened to the others constantly harp on the "mevis" crap. When they start posting nonsense like that. That's when it turns into complete stupidity. As though they wouldn't do the very SAME thing if they were as talented as Revis? It's all jealousy. It has to be. There's no other good reason for posting things like that.

    You can say all you want that there are two sides to the story and there is validity to it. Once again, I've listened to them and I think they are completely irrelevant.

    What I will say is this, EVERY team must have a price to get their best players. There's always got to be a price. Yes, Revis has a price. But it's going to take MULTIPLE picks, at the very least TWO 1st rounders IMO. Any talk of anything less is clearly not worth it given the history of big time players in the NFL.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    Ray, you simply aren't understanding what I am saying.

    I listened to what you have to say. I've also gone through all of the options for and against trading him.

    At the end of the day, I always come back to the arguments I've already made.

    He is a great presence to have on the team. Even during the thin years because he sets the example of EXCELLENCE. He sets the example of CONSISTENCY. And YES, he sets the example of going and getting what you think is yours.

    I'm not talking about you Ray, but MANY other posters on this site make that sound like a sin. THAT is a complete crock of sh*t. There's no other way of responding to that.

    What you know, just as well as I do, is that if you are a truly talented individual, in any walk of life for that matter, you would try to make the most out of it.

    Well, here we have Darrelle Revis that KNOWS he's the CB in football, if not the best defender. His agents KNOW he is the best CB in football. Other teams in the NFL KNOW he's the best CB in football. Any knowledgeable fan KNOWS he's the best CB in football.

    So Revis wants to break the bank in his next contract extension.

    Yet, so many on this site think that is wrong.

    You tell me Ray, WTF is wrong with that?! Honestly, I cannot find a damn thing wrong with that. I'm sure you can't either.

    I also already pointed out that the percentage is relative. Key got 11% of the Bucs cap in 2002. They then went on, all the while building a team around him, and living with Key's salary, and WON the SB in 2002.

    So for anyone thinking that we are better off without him, I call nonsense. The percentage checks out. Darrelle Revis checks out as the best, most consistent player that the NYJ have EVER had. It all checks out.

    I also question very highly that getting picks for Revis would make our team better. As you well know, EVERY pick in the NFL draft is a gamble. Vernon Gholston anyone? Unless you are talking about multiple high picls where the likelihood of striking gold is much higher then I say it isn't worth it.

    We are also NOT talking about multiple high picks. As the article clearly states, the Bucs are offering a 1st and 2nd for him.

    Some posters on this site actually think that is appropriate? That's laughable at best.

    Keyshawn Johnson, who wasn't even the best WR in football at that time, went for TWO 1st rounders. NOW, they want to trade the very best CB in football for LESS? How does that make any sense?

    Now, I have others actually harping that WR is actually MORE important than CB. Pretty soon they'll be posting that CB in on the same level of importance as being a Guard in the NFL. Completely insane.

    I've listened to the others constantly harp on the "mevis" crap. When they start posting nonsense like that. That's when it turns into complete stupidity. As though they wouldn't do the very SAME thing if they were as talented as Revis? It's all jealousy. It has to be. There's no other good reason for posting things like that.

    You can say all you want that there are two sides to the story and there is validity to it. Once again, I've listened to them and I think they are completely irrelevant.

    What I will say is this, EVERY team must have a price to get their best players. There's always got to be a price. Yes, Revis has a price. But it's going to take MULTIPLE picks, at the very least TWO 1st rounders IMO. Any talk of anything less is clearly not worth it given the history of big time players in the NFL.
    The Keyshawn trade, different player, different era. Teams aren't so willing to give up draft picks for players due to the new cap structure of the new CBA.

    But in essence, you make the point of this thread for me with the Keyshawn trade. Keyshawn wasn't the best WR in football, but he was a household name, an extremely marketable player who wore his welcome out of NY, his brand was bigger than he the player, THAT is what TB was going after, in addition to the player, and that is what made the KJ trade good for the Bucs. KJ helped them win a SB, but more importantly, he helped put them back on the map and back in the spotlight, the same exact reason they would be going after Revis.

    I'm well aware of what Revis brings to a team, but the Jets have quality talent at the CB position already. Factor in Cromartie, he's a top CB in the game, the Jets can re-sign Revis, but is it more worth re-signing Revis at 15 million a year, and putting too much money at the CB position, when there are many other holes on the team, or is it worth it to the Jets to go after the future of the team with more top of the draft picks to replenish the roster sooner with top talent? That is a tough decision, for the team, and for fans to consider, and there are arguments that can be made both ways, it's not dumb.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    The Keyshawn trade, different player, different era. Teams aren't so willing to give up draft picks for players due to the new cap structure of the new CBA.

    But in essence, you make the point of this thread for me with the Keyshawn trade. Keyshawn wasn't the best WR in football, but he was a household name, an extremely marketable player who wore his welcome out of NY, his brand was bigger than he the player, THAT is what TB was going after, in addition to the player, and that is what made the KJ trade good for the Bucs. KJ helped them win a SB, but more importantly, he helped put them back on the map and back in the spotlight, the same exact reason they would be going after Revis.

    I'm well aware of what Revis brings to a team, but the Jets have quality talent at the CB position already. Factor in Cromartie, he's a top CB in the game, the Jets can re-sign Revis, but is it more worth re-signing Revis at 15 million a year, and putting too much money at the CB position, when there are many other holes on the team, or is it worth it to the Jets to go after the future of the team with more top of the draft picks to replenish the roster sooner with top talent? That is a tough decision, for the team, and for fans to consider, and there are arguments that can be made both ways, it's not dumb.
    I completely disagree with your thoughts on Cromartie.

    Antonio Cromartie had a legitimately GREAT season last year. Probably the best season he'll ever have.

    The problem with that thinking is that Cromartie is NOT a consistent player. Just as good as last season was, he's also had seasons where he was very average. In other words, he isn't doing what he did last season consistently.

    Quite the contrary with Revis. Revis has been a consistently great player pretty much since 2008.

    Cro is a very good player, but he is also the best of the rest. Darrelle Revis is in a class all by himself.

    While we are on the subject of money invested in one position, why not trade Cro? His value has probably never been higher. He could quite possibly get us another 1st day pick. And by trading him it would get our percentage of salary invested in one position much more in line with standards.

    Meanwhile, Kyle Wilson IMO is an up and coming player and deserving of the number 2 CB spot. Why not elevate Wilson to number 2. Resign Revis for big bucks. Gain an extra pick this season or next for Cro and use the draft to take another young CB?

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by southparkcpa View Post
    MEVIS is great no doubt...would love to be able to keep him.


    He's actually so much better than people credit him for. He's a GREAT open field tackler as well as shut down corner.


    Problem is....

    He'll just hold out again in 2 years though.
    Sad but true. I think its best that we trade him while we can. If we drag our feet we risk losing him for nothing at the end of the season. Then we will be ridiculed for not doing the right thing when we had the chance.
    Last edited by Kentucky Jet; 03-23-2013 at 04:14 PM.

  9. #29
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    I think we need to accept the fact that team Revis astutely pressed for, and received current market value when Al Davis almost single handed sent the CBs market off into outer space. After all this is a business and Revis wanted market value as the best CB in football at that time. Fair enough.

    That was a very different time for a variety of reason not least of which was that some teams (including the Jets) were willing to bet on never-ending year over year increases in the team salary cap to bail them out of poor contract decisions. **gong** Some here argued at the time that this was a stupid position for the Jets to adopt.

    Even if we set aside for the moment questions about Revis' current physical condition and the prospect for his future durability, we know the market for CBs has "reset" as others have astutely pointed out. Aso has been cut from an awful contract. I wonder if team Revis understands and accepts that the shoe is on the other foot this time around with respect to the current market value for CBs.

    I suspect not.
    Last edited by EM31; 03-23-2013 at 04:44 PM.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    I completely disagree with your thoughts on Cromartie.

    Antonio Cromartie had a legitimately GREAT season last year. Probably the best season he'll ever have.

    The problem with that thinking is that Cromartie is NOT a consistent player. Just as good as last season was, he's also had seasons where he was very average. In other words, he isn't doing what he did last season consistently.

    Quite the contrary with Revis. Revis has been a consistently great player pretty much since 2008.

    Cro is a very good player, but he is also the best of the rest. Darrelle Revis is in a class all by himself.

    While we are on the subject of money invested in one position, why not trade Cro? His value has probably never been higher. He could quite possibly get us another 1st day pick. And by trading him it would get our percentage of salary invested in one position much more in line with standards.

    Meanwhile, Kyle Wilson IMO is an up and coming player and deserving of the number 2 CB spot. Why not elevate Wilson to number 2. Resign Revis for big bucks. Gain an extra pick this season or next for Cro and use the draft to take another young CB?
    Jesus you jump to conclusions and hyperbole with every post.

    My mentioning of Cromartie was not to suggest he is Revis, or just as good.

    He did have a great year last year, he's also a player that is maturing both on the field, and from most indications, off of it. With maturity, comes consistency for a lot of players, there is no reason right now to think that won't continue for Cro, and he also wont command 10-15 million per year.

    You continue to provide credence to the argument that trading Revis SHOULD be an option as opposed to no option, when you factor a player like Wilson. I think you're right, Wilson did emerge when made a starter, he was an up an down player in the slot playing the nickel role, he seemed much more comfortable, and gained confidence when moved in a starting role on the outside.

    Trading Cro, while it may sound good, doesn't solve the problem re-signing Revis at his extremely high asking price, nor would trading Cro give back the compensation the Jets would get trading Revis, which is why the Jets and teams even consider trading a player of his caliber.
    Last edited by Ray Ray19; 03-23-2013 at 04:54 PM.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    If you take a step back off the ledge for just a minute, the argument that some have made about trading Revis aren't suggesting that they do so because the Jets are better off without him.

    You can scream your head off all you want, there are two sides of this that make for valid arguments. The point of this thread wasn't to see you regurgitate with your high and mighty stance that it would be dumb to trade Revis, it factors in both sides of the story, and presents an angle not really discussed, and that is Revis' value beyond his ability as a football player, and why Revis is taking the stance he is, because he can, and his brand has enabled that platform. On the other hand, the Jets have taken this into account, but are working both sides, the side to keep him but not at the level he is seeking, and if they are going to trade him, to maximize that compensation because of the value he would bring another team, especially a small market team, and factoring the business side of any trade.
    So much win in this post. I don't mean this in some sort of parenting sort of way (cause I am pretty young lol), but if this is you post banning this board has a lot to look forward to. I appreciate the positive outlook, this board has plenty of people to remind us that the team stinks, but still being realistic in assessing the situations. AMAZING post and response.

  12. #32
    When is the "brand" trophy awarded?

    Stupidest thread ever.

    Do what you have to do win football games. Thats what builds your brand.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    When is the "brand" trophy awarded?

    Stupidest thread ever.

    Do what you have to do win football games. Thats what builds your brand.
    Right.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    When is the "brand" trophy awarded?

    Stupidest thread ever.

    Do what you have to do win football games. Thats what builds your brand.
    About the same time the cheating trophy comes out..

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by HuntinJet View Post
    Who did we get with those picks?

    Johnson was traded on April 12, 2000 to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers for two first round draft choices (12th Shaun Ellis and 27th Anthony Becht overall) in the 2000 NFL Draft.Soon after Johnson arrived in Tampa Bay, they signed him to a 8-year, $56 million contract extension with the Buccaneers that made him the highest-paid wide receiver in the NFL

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    When is the "brand" trophy awarded?

    Stupidest thread ever.

    Do what you have to do win football games. Thats what builds your brand.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    When is the "brand" trophy awarded?

    Stupidest thread ever.

    Do what you have to do win football games. Thats what builds your brand.
    But we went to 2 AFC Championship games. please don't wake us up from the dream

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainejet View Post
    The Jets should absolutely resign him NOW, This thread did nothing to sway my opinion. The Jets will look like the biggest joke for trading away their best player if they happen to do that.

    Revis is a player you want on your team no matter what. He's a great presence to have around when you are rebuilding and he puts you over the top when you have a good team around him. He's a big game player that you want on your side when you play in the SB.

    And the money? That's a complete crock of sh*t. Everyone that want to get rid of him because they say he want too much. Your just pissy because your JEALOUS, nothing more, nothing less.

    As I already pointed out from a percentage standpoint, if Revis gets the 15 million per he's looking for, that would amount to approximately 12 and change percent of the 123 million dollar salary cap.

    Back in 2000, the Bucs traded for one Keyshawn Johnson. They gave up TWO 1st round draft choices (which automatically means that the compensation from the Bucs for Revis is complete sh*t. Key wasn't even the best WR in football when he got traded. Revis is clearly the BEST.)

    They also gave Johnson 8 year 56 million dollar contract at the time. That was an obscene amount at that time. The salary cap in 2001 was 62 million and change. The 7 million per that Keyshawn got comprised 11 and change percent of their salary cap at that time.

    So all of you posters that say he should be traded, well you actually think the team is better off without him. Well, I think that is dumb.

    What Revis wants for money is merely relative. You cannot fathom it because you forgot it where 11 years went since the last time somebody got a payday like that. The percentage proves that the amount of money Revis is merely relative and a sign of the times.
    Your passion is admirable but you are wrong, IMO.


    NO ONE cares what Revis makes. it is how his salary HURTS the team. to call us jealous is short sighted. EVERY NFL player out earns 99 percent of the country.
    We don't care. We want what's best for the entire team.



    if we can get a 1st and a 3rd... He should go. I LOVE him as a player. He is a freak. But he is a prima Dona extraordinaire.

    I hope we can keep him, that he settles for say 12 mil a year.

    If not, so it goes.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    lol! Now that's funny..

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    I don't think Revis is worth much from a marketing standpoint. What has he done? A couple of Dick's commercials. Yeah, he has sold a few jerseys for Woody. But at the end of the day he is just a CB. He has little intrinsic value for the Jets. If we ever had a QB that was a star (a la Namath) then I think it would be a much different scenario. Revis should be paid based on what they think he is worth to them on the field.

    If they can't sign him for a deal they can live with then they need to trade him for the best offer. Letting him play this year without extending or trading would be foolish IMO.


    You can't be serious?

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