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Thread: BET Founder: ‘This Country Would Never Tolerate White Unemployment at 14 or 15 %

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trades View Post
    The trillions spent on "stimulus" weren't enough for you?
    Trillions?

    You could say $787 billion. Because that is what the 2009 stimulus bill was. But I’d say half of that was tax cuts. So therefore a pretty small job bill.

    My point was during the great depression money was spent on roads, bridges, dams, national parks, etc...
    And that put people (young men) to work. This time we went with Supply-side recovery. And what that has left us with is "job Creators" hording cash and not creating jobs.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    What exactly is Obama doing? Nothing that I can see to help business. Rather the opposite. I admit I have made a fortune in investments the past couple of years.
    Could you imagine if the Dow was still plummeting like when Obama first took over as President in 2009? The conservatives would be setting up spinoff Fox News stations to talk about Obama being a commie who hates capitalism and he isn't cutting taxes fast enough. Wall St performs well - the conservatives can't say anything positive about Obama so then they go the complete opposite spectrum and say he's a thief.

    No wonder these clowns keep losing elections

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Trillions?

    You could say $787 billion. Because that is what the 2009 stimulus bill was. But I’d say half of that was tax cuts. So therefore a pretty small job bill.

    My point was during the great depression money was spent on roads, bridges, dams, national parks, etc...
    And that put people (young men) to work. This time we went with Supply-side recovery. And what that has left us with is "job Creators" hording cash and not creating jobs.
    The government can't create sustainable jobs. The Auto bailout and stimulus were utter garbage. Giving money so people can stay on unemployment for years is ridiculous. Thinking you are going to start more road crews to put out of work college grads that got degrees in women's studies and psychology to work is laughable. They would rather stay on the dole and go back to school for more useless education.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    Trillions?

    You could say $787 billion. Because that is what the 2009 stimulus bill was. But I’d say half of that was tax cuts. So therefore a pretty small job bill.

    My point was during the great depression money was spent on roads, bridges, dams, national parks, etc...
    And that put people (young men) to work. This time we went with Supply-side recovery. And what that has left us with is "job Creators" hording cash and not creating jobs.
    If that was your point the government jobs program during the great depression didn't work. What it did do was build some great long term infrastructure.

    The war got us out of the great depression not the WPA.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trades View Post
    The government can't create sustainable jobs. The Auto bailout and stimulus were utter garbage. Giving money so people can stay on unemployment for years is ridiculous. Thinking you are going to start more road crews to put out of work college grads that got degrees in women's studies and psychology to work is laughable. They would rather stay on the dole and go back to school for more useless education.
    Giving money to people so they can continue to put shelter over their heads and feed and cloth themselves certainly helps demand which shrinks during a recession. If it continues to shrink hard enough it will destroy private sector jobs at a very fast rate. The extension of unemployment benifits was one of the best things Obama did for the economy. The deal that extended tax breaks for that extension was a complete win/win for both sides of the argument.

    There is no doubt we should have spent more, fortunately the Federal reserve has done a good job of pushing the gas even as the Republicans focus on cutting spending during a weak economic recovery. Pure stupidity for a party that had no problem spending us into oblivion when the economy didn't need it.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    It's a perverse role, to be sure.


    If he was on a Kaiser Roll, we'd move him to the Philly sub thread.


    To the usual suspects on here it is perverse. The lazies think it is perverse to work. Or at least to work that actaully produces something useful.
    Lazy welfare losers. And those on the government dole working 15 hour weeks and getting paid for 35-40.
    Free ride and then complain because they don't get enough in handouts.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by detjetsfan View Post
    Could you imagine if the Dow was still plummeting like when Obama first took over as President in 2009? The conservatives would be setting up spinoff Fox News stations to talk about Obama being a commie who hates capitalism and he isn't cutting taxes fast enough. Wall St performs well - the conservatives can't say anything positive about Obama so then they go the complete opposite spectrum and say he's a thief.

    No wonder these clowns keep losing elections


    I am still waiting to hear what Obama has done to help business. Anyone? Is Bueller here? Mr. Obama has done what to help and stimulate business? Has done what to help blacks get jobs?
    American companies seem to be doing well, especially overseas. For those of you who may be inclined or understand how, please take a look at the top U.S. companies and the number of employess they have as a trend. It is heading downward over the past 5 years. FACT. Any suggestions as to why?

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    I am still waiting to hear what Obama has done to help business. Anyone? Is Bueller here? Mr. Obama has done what to help and stimulate business? Has done what to help blacks get jobs?
    American companies seem to be doing well, especially overseas. For those of you who may be inclined or understand how, please take a look at the top U.S. companies and the number of employess they have as a trend. It is heading downward over the past 5 years. FACT. Any suggestions as to why?
    Worker productivity it grew at a very fast pace the last 5 years.

    The extension of unemployment benifits and the tax cuts were absolutely needed to keep demand from tanking further. Worker productivity is already starting to level off and employment is picking up steam. As demand increases and worker productivity slows wages will go up. All good things some as a result of Obama policy some as a result of the natural rebalancing after a recession.

    The problem workers face moving forward is relatively cheap robotics doing less and less complex jobs are going to lead to another big round of labor productivity, high corporate profits coupled with wage losses and rising unemployment. Fortunately as the wealthy class ages they will need people to wipe the drool from their faces.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    It's not that blacks can't make it on their own.
    Yes, Africa is just humming along

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    To the usual suspects on here it is perverse. The lazies think it is perverse to work. Or at least to work that actaully produces something useful.
    Lazy welfare losers. And those on the government dole working 15 hour weeks and getting paid for 35-40.
    Free ride and then complain because they don't get enough in handouts.
    Leave your house and actually interact with the real world every now and then.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Winstonbiggs View Post
    Worker productivity it grew at a very fast pace the last 5 years.

    The extension of unemployment benifits and the tax cuts were absolutely needed to keep demand from tanking further. Worker productivity is already starting to level off and employment is picking up steam. As demand increases and worker productivity slows wages will go up. All good things some as a result of Obama policy some as a result of the natural rebalancing after a recession.

    The problem workers face moving forward is relatively cheap robotics doing less and less complex jobs are going to lead to another big round of labor productivity, high corporate profits coupled with wage losses and rising unemployment. Fortunately as the wealthy class ages they will need people to wipe the drool from their faces.

    Productivity grew because people are afraid of losing their jobs. Unemployment is still well above the GWB era.
    Just saw: since 2008 Walmart has shed 120k jobs despite increasing store count. Volume is up. AT&T, Exxon and a host of other biggies have shed jobs despite increasing sales. GE is head count down. Of the 20 or so companies in which I have a stock position ALL are down on employees, despite all up on sales and profits. Get the most out of the best, the lazy - see ya.
    Lots of places are not into "new" robotics etc. BTW. It's merely cut the dead wood.
    The public sector could use more of that concept.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    Productivity grew because people are afraid of losing their jobs. Unemployment is still well above the GWB era.
    Just saw: since 2008 Walmart has shed 120k jobs despite increasing store count. Volume is up. AT&T, Exxon and a host of other biggies have shed jobs despite increasing sales. GE is head count down. Of the 20 or so companies in which I have a stock position ALL are down on employees, despite all up on sales and profits. Get the most out of the best, the lazy - see ya.
    Lots of places are not into "new" robotics etc. BTW. It's merely cut the dead wood.
    The public sector could use more of that concept.
    Of course the lazy, computers and robotics have nothing to do with it. Invention is merely an after thought.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy® View Post
    Yes, Africa is just humming along


    Africa? What about it? This is the U.S. I could care less about Africa.
    We're talking black Americans. You can follow that line of thought, I hope.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by cr726 View Post
    Leave your house and actually interact with the real world every now and then.

    I do regularly. The people here feel NYers are stupid for getting hosed as they are. Actually more to do here than NY. Been boating lately now that the weather is sunny and 75+.
    Unemployment around this area is actually fairly low. Especially with Boeing and a few other major companies leaving union infested areas and coming to a place with civilized laws. That's why people (smart ones) atre bailing NY, NJ etc and coming here, NC, ALA, TX.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Winstonbiggs View Post
    Of course the lazy, computers and robotics have nothing to do with it. Invention is merely an after thought.

    Mechanization is new? Last 2-3 years? Really? Who knew, what with all the talk of companies minimizing capital investment.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winstonbiggs View Post
    Worker productivity it grew at a very fast pace the last 5 years.

    The extension of unemployment benifits and the tax cuts were absolutely needed to keep demand from tanking further. Worker productivity is already starting to level off and employment is picking up steam. As demand increases and worker productivity slows wages will go up. All good things some as a result of Obama policy some as a result of the natural rebalancing after a recession.

    The problem workers face moving forward is relatively cheap robotics doing less and less complex jobs are going to lead to another big round of labor productivity, high corporate profits coupled with wage losses and rising unemployment. Fortunately as the wealthy class ages they will need people to wipe the drool from their faces.
    Robotics is the future. Until the singularity we will still have to design them at least. Japan is working on drool-wiping robots too so don't count on that as your future.

    I thought this was a great article.
    http://www.cnbc.com/id/100592545
    The Robot Reality: Service Jobs Are Next to Go


    If you meet Baxter, the latest humanoid robot from Rethink Robotics – you should get comfortable with him, because you'll likely be seeing more of him soon.



    Rethink Robotics released Baxter last fall and received an overwhelming response from the manufacturing industry, selling out of their production capacity through April. He's cheap to buy ($22,000), easy to train, and can safely work side-by-side with humans. He's just what factories need to make their assembly lines more efficient – and yes, to replace costly human workers.



    But manufacturing is only the beginning.



    This April, Rethink will launch a software platform that will allow Baxter to do a more complex sequencing of tasks – for example, picking up a part, holding it in front of an inspection station and receiving a signal to place it in a "good" or "not good" pile. The company is also releasing a software development kit soon that will allow third parties – like university robotics researchers – to create applications for Baxter.



    These third parties "are going to do all sorts of stuff we haven't envisioned," says Scott Eckert, CEO of Rethink Robotics. He envisions something similar to Apple's app store happening for Baxter. A spiffed-up version of the robot could soon be seen flipping burgers at McDonalds, folding t-shirts at Gap, or pouring coffee at Starbucks.



    "Could [Baxter] be a barista?" asks Eckert. "It's not a target market, but it's something that's pretty repeatable. Put a cup in, push a button, espresso comes out, etc. There are simple repeatable service tasks that Baxter could do over time."


    Companies might not need to wait for a more advanced version of Baxter – MIT already has a BakeBot that can read recipes, whip together cookie dough and place it in the oven. The University of California at Berkeley has a robot that can do laundry and fold T-shirts. Robot servers have started waiting tables at restaurants in Japan, South Korea, China and Thailand – and just last week, a robot served Passover matzah to President Obama during his trip to Israel.



    "Every year, machines are getting more capable of doing low-level tasks," says Professor Seth Teller, a robotics researcher at MIT's Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Lab.



    The Great Job Transformation

    Many experts worry about what robots in the service sector could do to employment. The national unemployment rate remains at 7.7 percent – not remotely close to the 4.7 percent unemployment in 2007 before the recession. Job growth isn't expected to return to pre-recession levels until 2017, and the recent sequestration could easily derail it. Manufacturing has already shed nearly 6 million jobs since 2000.



    "When machines and robots start taking over service sector jobs, that's when we'll really start to notice," says Martin Ford, robotics expert and author of The Lights In the Tunnel: Automation, Accelerating Technology and the Economy of the Future. "If you're making hamburgers or Starbucks drinks, that's really just high manufacturing."



    What's worrisome to Ford is that these jobs have been offering a huge safety net to the middle class. They're jobs he calls "the jobs of last resort." When someone can't find a salaried job, they look for lower-paying service jobs to get by – and because the jobs typically have a high turnover rate, they're more likely to be available. Think of all the college graduates who take jobs as cashiers or baristas before they find salaried work. If those jobs were to vanish, those workers would be forced to file for unemployment instead."



    Retail and service industries are the largest employers in the U.S., accounting for nearly 20 percent of total employment in 2011, according to the latest data available from the BLS. The retail sector employs nearly 14.8 million people, with Walmart employing 10 percent of them. On top of that, one in five retail workers are the sole income earners in their household. The U.S. restaurant industry employs 9.5 million people, and nearly 50 percent of all adults have worked in the restaurant industry at some point in their life, according to a 2012 report from the Workforce Strategies Initiative at the Aspen Institute. Compare these numbers to the tech job "boom" at companies like Facebook, Apple, Amazon and Google – and you get a mere 190,000 people.



    Restaurant work also supports aging boomers as they transition out of the workforce – 12 percent of restaurant workers are 55 and older. "Many older Americans have fallen back on jobs in the restaurant industry, as they seek to transition to a new career or are simply unable to find other work," write the authors of the Aspen Institute report.



    Robot Lifeguard to Debut on Connecticut Beach

    This summer, lifeguards at one Connecticut beach will be getting an assist from a robot known as Emily, which can reach a troubled swimmer far faster than a lifeguard. Ryan Hanrahan reports.



    Teller at MIT argues that economic disruption from technology is nothing new – we've seen it before with inventions like the cotton gin, the automobile, and the personal computer. "One way to frame this is robots are taking human jobs away, but technology has, throughout history, transformed the nature of human jobs," he says. "As machines get more capable, they take on functions that were previously performed by people. There's a displacement, certainly, but we're still seeing this transformation play out, so you just don't know whether there's going to be a net gain or a loss [of jobs]."



    According to Teller, Baxter and other robots could create jobs in new industries we haven't even envisioned yet. The PC, for example, eliminated plenty of jobs while creating millions of others. And he has a point – Baxter is creating some jobs. Rethink Robotics employs 85 people at their Boston headquarters that would've never existed without Baxter – though most are high-level engineers, designers and salespeople.


    At the factories that are buying Baxter, employers now create robot "managers" to oversee Baxter. Baxter is also made in the U.S., and Rethink employs some 100 people in factories and distributors – though in an ironic twist, they're already planning to use Baxter to help build Baxter.



    As robots move into other sectors and the home, Teller says the job opportunities are abundant. Robot IT and maintenance personnel, designers and salespeople for robot accessories, software, and apps, and robot security developers are just a few examples. "If personal robots are the next thing and everyone wants one in their house, doing the laundry and unloading the dishwasher, we're talking about another decade of massive economic activity," says Teller.



    The PC, however, also created a decade of economic wealth – but the wealth has largely stayed at the top. Facebook, Apple, Amazon and Google don't employ many people, relatively speaking, but they have about 6.25 percent of the market cap of all U.S. companies. Yes, PCs have created IT jobs and software developers, but the tech industry is small compared to retail and restaurant industries. Computer and mathematical jobs make up about 3 percent of the labor force, according to the BLS, and require advanced degrees and years of training. Will the U.S.'s higher education system be prepared for massive retraining? Will service employees have the time and resources to learn new skills? Will enough high-skill jobs be available for them? No one is quite sure where they'll go when robots like Baxter push them out.



    Erik Brynjolfsson, director of the MIT Center for Digital Business and co-author of Rise Against the Machine, has been warning economists about the coming job disruption for years. "Technology doesn't automatically lift the fortunes of all people," Brynjolfsson said recently to a crowd at Wharton University in San Francisco. "Profits [in the U.S.] have never been higher, innovation is roaring along, GDP is high, but job creation is lagging terribly, and the share of profits going to labor is at a 60-year low. This is one of the most important issues facing our society."



  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winstonbiggs View Post
    If that was your point the government jobs program during the great depression didn't work. What it did do was build some great long term infrastructure.

    The war got us out of the great depression not the WPA.
    No. I’m saying trillions were not spent to put people to work in the 2007 to 2010 recession. I am also saying that during the great depression when 20+% of white men were unemployed the government spent a lot of money to put many of them to work with the CCC and WPA etc.

    I do not disagree with you that WWII and the massive Government spending and Government control of the economy ended the depression.

    I also agree that building/fixing infrastructure is a great thing to do when unemployment is high, wages are low and the infrastructure is crumbling. It needs to be done. Seems like a no brainer. Ignoring it wont make it better.

  18. #38
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    What can the gov't do? Either way no gov't created jobs are permanent. Let's assume that these people actually want to work. There are only so many roads to pave and brides to paint. Eventually they would have to get a real world job. And there aren't as many jobs for a multitude of reasons including the poor economy. The stimulus didn't work. Were we going to go into a depression without it? I don't think so. But even if it did prevent one, we were left with what will be a decade-long poor economy that teeters on recession.

    It is not the gov't responsibility to guarantee people jobs. It is there responsibility to foster an atmosphere where jobs are created and available. Welfare, food stamps, free cell phones etc, are just pacifiers. And sadly people are more than happy to be pacified. The gov't is what keeps them in poverty.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy® View Post
    Yes, Africa is just humming along
    lol... somebody had to do it.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by palmetto defender View Post
    Mechanization is new? Last 2-3 years? Really? Who knew, what with all the talk of companies minimizing capital investment.
    Guess what I went to the supermarket yesterday and there were only 3 lanes run by cashiers instead of the 20 in 2008 when the economy tanked, 5 years ago. I have a phone that has 100X the data capability than the phone I had in 2008. I have also replaced my computer and upgraded my accounting software 3 times. I'm also able to have very inexpensive meetings with my vendors all over the world on my laptop while having coffee in my backyard at almost any time day or night.

    I used to have to fly around the world about 3 to 4 times a year. Now I go once a year to kick the tires.
    Last edited by Winstonbiggs; 04-03-2013 at 10:21 AM.

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