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Thread: 'Bama vs LSU... Chance > Mingo

  1. #21
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    Cooper is better than Chance although they are both great. Cooper is more consistent in pass protection.

    Would rather not draft guard, but if we have 2 picks and Chance/Cooper is there at 13, would have no problem taking them. Both have hall of fame potential.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    why won't mingo bench?
    Mingo is certainly weak in the upper body. You can see it just by his tackling.

    That said, pass rushers are damn near impossible to find. And Mingo has enough strength to take down any QB in the game.


    Mingo has good lower body strength, he actually can hold up decently at the point of attack. He just has so little upper body strength to bring down the carrier however.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    Make sure you mention that you think Eifert will be a HOF TE....
    I like Eifert, but i don't like him that much Escobar and Reed present the best pick/value.

    Thefuture HOF'er i'm presently masturbating to everytime my wife's back is turned - is Seferian-Jenkins. He is the megatron of TEs.

  4. #24
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    Eifert does have hall of fame ability at that position. Unfortunately will come down to whether he has a QB or not.

    Not a fan of Escobar. Doesn't have the long speed and also takes some plays off blocking...

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfan1983 View Post
    Mingo is certainly weak in the upper body. You can see it just by his tackling.

    That said, pass rushers are damn near impossible to find. .
    well there's a bonafide one who played standing up named Jones. He even weighs more than Mingo. How exactly do you justify a guy who's better on every dimension than the Heyward-bay 40?

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    You're a piece of work, Man. But only time will tell. Let's see in a couple of years if Mingo's production is equal to Maybin's or if remains at 240. Re relentless pursuit, Mingo does so while taking great angles. Maybin was famous for circumventing the globe. I'm going to call you DBUST from now on...
    THAT WAS FUNNY.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex View Post
    Again, in the pros, Mingo will not:

    1) Be playing with his hand in the dirt
    2) Be playing strong side end in four and three man fronts

    People want to say he's not "strong." The very fact that he had to play with his hand in the dirt (eliminating build-up speed) and didn't get manhandled by guys who are NINETY pounds heavier than him says something. The guy knows how to use his hands, especially when pass rushing.

    As a pro, he'll be playing in a two point stance outside of the tackle's outside shoulder and he'll be able to use his speed/explosiveness to keep the tackle on his heels.
    Exactly!!

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex View Post
    What is you talkin' about?

    Gholston "dominated" in college. In fact, he has the single season sack record at one of the most prestigious football university's in the country. And if people want to talk about Mingo's production, why does nobody mention he was 2nd in the SEC in overall pressures? Pass rushing means a lot more than pure sack numbers. You're not looking at the whole picture.

    And if you want a guy to come in and dominate right away, you either:

    A) Should hope the 2013 draft magically turns into the 2012 draft where it was top-heavy with several pro-ready prospects ready to dominate.

    B) Want someone like Warmack/Cooper, who while great in their own right, don't play a premium position. (Not that I'm against either of those guys)

    C) Hope that Von Miller or Aldon Smith reenter the 2013 draft.

    The bottom line is that no college player enters the NFL as a finished product. Out of all the potential top 10 picks, EVERY PLAYER has something you can nitpick.
    Aldon Smith was hardly a finished product coming out of college. And I keep remembering Adrian Peterson, who was viewed as fragile after the collarbone break and drifted down in the draft. As you said, this is a crapshoot even under the best of circumstances. There are usually no more than one or two players each year that are genuinely foolproof from college to pro's.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    well there's a bonafide one who played standing up named Jones. He even weighs more than Mingo. How exactly do you justify a guy who's better on every dimension than the Heyward-bay 40?
    Upside. Question is whether Jones has peaked, has the intensity and desire to move up to the next level, and isn't a production product of his system at Georgia. Not to mention his pro day numbers... I'm looking forward, not back. Mingo is a better athlete and will be a better pro.... IMHO.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    Upside. Question is whether Jones has peaked, has the intensity and desire to move up to the next level, and isn't a production product of his system at Georgia. Not to mention his pro day numbers... I'm looking forward, not back. Mingo is a better athlete and will be a better pro.... IMHO.
    that sounds like long straws and magic beans. Has Jones "peaked"? Will Mingo ever "peak"?? c'mon... we're talking actually game tape, measurable production, technique, instinct, etc... All kinds of questions about Mingo as an OLB.

    i will never forgive this franchise if they take Maybin, sorry, Mingo over Jones, and Jones goes on to light up in PIT. Unforgiveable.

    I think the pick is better used at this point on Warmack/Cooper, but god help us if we took Mingo over Jones.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    that sounds like long straws and magic beans. Has Jones "peaked"? Will Mingo ever "peak"?? c'mon... we're talking actually game tape, measurable production, technique, instinct, etc... All kinds of questions about Mingo as an OLB.

    i will never forgive this franchise if they take Maybin, sorry, Mingo over Jones, and Jones goes on to light up in PIT. Unforgiveable.

    I think the pick is better used at this point on Warmack/Cooper, but god help us if we took Mingo over Jones.
    What are you going to do when Mingo is a Jet next thursday?

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    why won't mingo bench?
    Why does bench press matter?

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    well there's a bonafide one who played standing up named Jones. He even weighs more than Mingo. How exactly do you justify a guy who's better on every dimension than the Heyward-bay 40?

    Forget 40 times, Jones just doesn't have great edge speed. Even though he's strong, he's not strong enough to make up for it.

    I like Jones... But only as a 10 sack upside type of guy. He'll get 10 sacks if everything goes right. He's just not quick enough around the edge. That doesn't mean he's a bad pick, it's just that he doesn't have great player upside.

    Jones is good against the run though. That is pretty valuable. 3 down OLB.


    And the hand in the dirt vs the standing up debate is stupid. 90% of the time that position is rushing the passer. It's the only thing that matters in terms of money. Everything else is bonus. The stupid people think Gholston failed because of the position change. Gholston failed because he didn't have edge speed, and he didn't have the want-to. Jones has the want to, no question. Question is whether he has the physical traits necessary.

    I understand the negative thought on Mingo. He's one of the tougher guys to figure out. Sometimes I think Maybin, and sometimes I think Jason Taylor. I think Mingo has better hips than Maybin, and I also know that Mingo probably won't have a good 1st year in the NFL. WHen Mingo gets a bit stronger and figures out the technique, he's going to be very interesting to watch. He absolutely wants to make an impact on games.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex View Post
    Why does bench press matter?
    Because OLB/DE are not WR's or CB's. Upper body strength is a factor like a ton of other things. In of itself is it super important? No but a bigger factor is why is the player avoiding that standard test?

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
    Because OLB/DE are not WR's or CB's. Upper body strength is a factor like a ton of other things. In of itself is it super important? No but a bigger factor is why is the player avoiding that standard test?
    Because he's weak in the upper body.

    It shows on tape and is a surprise to nobody who watches the guy.

    Mingo can hold the point though and that is the case because he has a strong lower body and core. Getting off blocks isn't great and making a tackle on a running back isn't his strength right now.


    But what makes him potentially special is that speed off the edge. Few players have it... And offensive tackles will struggle to keep up with it.

    And if you go by his batted passes, it's clear the guy has good instincts too.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    that sounds like long straws and magic beans. Has Jones "peaked"? Will Mingo ever "peak"?? c'mon... we're talking actually game tape, measurable production, technique, instinct, etc... All kinds of questions about Mingo as an OLB.

    i will never forgive this franchise if they take Maybin, sorry, Mingo over Jones, and Jones goes on to light up in PIT. Unforgiveable.

    I think the pick is better used at this point on Warmack/Cooper, but god help us if we took Mingo over Jones.
    RichCimini Rich Cimini
    On media conference call, Mike Mayock of NFL Network says he likes Mingo for #Jets at 9. If not Mingo, he sees a grd, Warmack or Cooper.

    Hey, Mikey likes him... Mingo isn't Maybin and you know it. Whether Jones will hit a ceiling is of course speculation. But something tells me he'll be an under-achiever as a 1st round pick. Pretty much everything we are predicting is long straws and magic beans right now.

  17. #37
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    One thing that fly way under the radar with Mingo is his ability to stop the read option, the new thing sweeping the NFL. 2 years ago against Oregon it was his assignment, Lamichael James 18 carries 60 yards, 3.0 avg, this year against Manziel who tore through the rest of the SEC, 17 carries for 27 yards.

    Les Miles called him the perfect read option defender

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfan1983 View Post
    Because he's weak in the upper body.

    It shows on tape and is a surprise to nobody who watches the guy.

    Mingo can hold the point though and that is the case because he has a strong lower body and core. Getting off blocks isn't great and making a tackle on a running back isn't his strength right now.


    But what makes him potentially special is that speed off the edge. Few players have it... And offensive tackles will struggle to keep up with it.

    And if you go by his batted passes, it's clear the guy has good instincts too.
    i think mingo at 9 is a great pick.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woody56 View Post
    What are you going to do when Mingo is a Jet next thursday?
    This is beginning to remind me a lot of "Paradis, Melvin Ingram's the pick - get used to it" from last year when I said Coples was going to be a Jet..

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradis View Post
    This is beginning to remind me a lot of "Paradis, Melvin Ingram's the pick - get used to it" from last year when I said Coples was going to be a Jet..
    Not saying it for sure, but it surely does seem it is narrowed down to OLB or G. For OLB it's between Mingo and Jordan and Jordan probably won't be there or Cooper and Warmack.

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