View Poll Results: Do you want the Jets to use either the #9 or #13 pick on a QB?

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  • Yes. We need one now and should take one at the top of the Draft.

    11 14.67%
  • No. Too many other needs and I don't see a QB I like with a Top 13 pick.

    64 85.33%
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Thread: Do you want the Jets to use one of their two 1st Round picks on a QB?

  1. #41
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    Actually I did some checking, and it seems that sines 1970 40 different QBs have started Super bowls. 20 of those were 1st rounders. As far as I can see that means that 50% of all SB QBs were not drafted in the first round. Then there is still the fact that Geno had a fairly high first round grade on our board, and on many others.

    My conclusion is that anyone that thinks Geno will not be good because of his draft position is a Dummie.

  2. #42
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    Why is it plain silly. Your love Tebow was drafted in round one and is the worst piece of garbage in NFL quarterback history

    The draft ends in April....after that that PFW draft guide you place everything on is worthless

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    Actually I did some checking, and it seems that sines 1970 40 different QBs have started Super bowls. 20 of those were 1st rounders. As far as I can see that means that 50% of all SB QBs were not drafted in the first round. Then there is still the fact that Geno had a fairly high first round grade on our board, and on many others.

    My conclusion is that anyone that thinks Geno will not be good because of his draft position is a Dummie.
    Fairly high first round grade ??? So high in fact that we passed on him not once , but twice! 32 other teams decided the same.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by sg3 View Post
    Why is it plain silly. Your love Tebow was drafted in round one and is the worst piece of garbage in NFL quarterback history

    The draft ends in April....after that that PFW draft guide you place everything on is worthless
    Huh?

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnie View Post
    Fairly high first round grade ??? So high in fact that we passed on him not once , but twice! 32 other teams decided the same.
    Yes the Jets considered him at 13. Many other teams did not need a QB. All you have to do is check the draft profiles. He was considered a mid 1st talent by most, and a high 1st by quite a few.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnie View Post
    My point being that all the neophytes on this board hailing G Smith as the second coming of Joe Montana need to calm down a bit .... 32 teams passed on him in the first round ... Some teams twice (jets cough) ... To think that he is going to be Russell Wilson or Drew Brees is plain silly.

    My guess is that when he takes over , he will have a modicum of success because there will be an air of newness until defenses game plan for him.

    Then the mediocrity will set in.
    So that's your guess, and therefore any other scenario, especially him possibly being successful, is "plain silly"?

    I haven't seen anyone here hailing Smith as the next Montana, but I've seen plenty people writing him off before he's even gone through his first training camp. From what I've seen people either say he COULD be good, or that he WILL suck - the naysayers are usually the more definite and closed in their views.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by sg3 View Post
    Russell Wilson -third round

    Joe Montana - third round

    Tom Brady - sixth round

    Kurt Warner - undrafted


    NostraDunnie predicts, though, that if you aren't drafted in the first round, you're destined to be a backup
    Exceptions prove the rule.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by sg3 View Post
    We didn't want to pick Smith with 9 or 13 and we didn't want Idzik to reach for any of the bums (Glennon, Manuel, Nassib et al) in the second.

    Smith at 39 was a great value pick and when he starts and succeeds in 2013 a pick that will be ranked up there with Idzik's third round QB pick for Seattle in 2012
    I actually agree that for the JETS draft, Smith WAS an amazing value pick. There were NO amazing QBs in this class. That being said lets just temper our enthusiasm for a 2nd round/3rd team pick player.

    You would have thought based on SG3s comments that two players were not drafted by the Jets before Smith.
    Last edited by Dunnie; 07-12-2013 at 07:41 PM.

  9. #49
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    I wasn't a fan of Smith and didn't want the Jets to take him.

    That said, he was a consensus first round talent and consensus top QB in the draft and we got him at #39. Lets see what he's got.

    Him being a second rounder is a good thing. It has no bearing on his ability and if he does suck we can cut bait extremely easily. The fact that other teams passed on him means nothing -- every team passed on some of the all time greats multiple times.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Austin View Post
    I wasn't a fan of Smith and didn't want the Jets to take him.

    That said, he was a consensus first round talent and consensus top QB in the draft and we got him at #39. Lets see what he's got.

    Him being a second rounder is a good thing. It has no bearing on his ability and if he does suck we can cut bait extremely easily. The fact that other teams passed on him means nothing -- every team passed on some of the all time greats multiple times.
    Agreed..... Geno in the 2nd was an outstanding pick. If only to make it clear that Mark MUST produce or GTFO.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinny Testaverde's Niece View Post
    Exceptions prove the rule.
    They're not exceptions though. Brady, Brees, Romo, Kaepernick, Wilson, Dalton. Where do you rate these QBs. Rodgers was drafted 24th so he must be much worse than Alex Smith right? I'd say the top 3 QBs in the NFL were all drafted 24th or later. Someone explain this to me. Don't use any big words, I may be a little slow.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    They're not exceptions though. Brady, Brees, Romo, Kaepernick, Wilson, Dalton. Where do you rate these QBs. Rodgers was drafted 24th so he must be much worse than Alex Smith right? I'd say the top 3 QBs in the NFL were all drafted 24th or later. Someone explain this to me. Don't use any big words, I may be a little slow.
    Teams that draft lower, like Green Bay, are usually "better" teams. I believe that they are better developers of raw talent than teams that draft early. I don't always believe that the raw talent is badly judged / over drafted, more that it is badly developed. Many - maybe not all - of the examples above went to teams that developed those players well.

    E.g. What if the Jets picked Marino and Dolphins picked O'Brien? Would the Jets have had the success Miami did, or would the Phins have developed O'Brien better than we did? Or if Smith and Rodgers swapped places?

    Also, lower drafting teams usually have better surrounding talent and less pressure for rookies to perform straight away.

    Of course, this all falls apart a bit when it come to high second rounders, as they're picked by those not so good teams again.

  13. #53
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    For the record - I wanted no part of Smith at #9 or #13. When it came to our second round pick though, I thought it was a pick we HAD to make, as the benefit outweighed the risk IMO. A lot of the 2nd rounders I wanted went just before our pick anyway (e.g. Cyprien, Ertz).

    As said before by a lot of posters, if a second rounder flames out, or becomes nothing more than a backup, it's not a big deal. But if he takes off and plays well, you win big. Especially at QB - you have to take a risk. I was fine with us drafting Sanchez, as we needed a QB; the fact he hasn't panned out doesn't make it a bad pick, as we had to take the chance.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnie View Post
    My point being that all the neophytes on this board hailing G Smith as the second coming of Joe Montana need to calm down a bit .... 32 teams passed on him in the first round ... Some teams twice (jets cough) ... To think that he is going to be Russell Wilson or Drew Brees is plain silly.

    My guess is that when he takes over , he will have a modicum of success because there will be an air of newness until defenses game plan for him.

    Then the mediocrity will set in.
    I'd just like to point out that Sanchez was an underclassman when he was drafted. If I posted all the underclassman QB that have been drafted you'll see a list of scrubs with few exceptions. I'm talking guys like Couch, Leaf, Todd Marinovich, JaMarcus Russell, Young, Rick Mirer, and Andre Ware here. Pretty much ALL of the biggest QB busts sense 1990 have been underclassman. Despite success stories in guys like Flacco, Ryan, and Stafford in resent years it is obvious the bust factor on underclassman QB is still huge. From 1990-2007 you really only saw like 3 good Underclassman QBs. In that same time frame we saw the most success out of 2-3 round QBs. Guys like Plummer, Griese, Brees, and Schaub. My point on this is just because Geno is a 2nd rounder and Sanchez is a 1st doesnt mean Sanchez was the better prospect. Underclassman have a way of fooling even good GMs. We where fooled it is that easy. 2-3 round QB is a low gamble with well still a pretty high pay out if you want to compare success stories. I think the last 5-6 years teams have been stupid with taking too many WC or just small QBs in the 2nd. You cant put guys like Pat White and Croyle in the same light as most 1st round QBs. If anything Geno is more of a Stewart or Carter and quite honestly I'll take that at this point. The ones taken to be an actually QB havent bombed nearly as bad as some of those underclassman and a LOT of them are at least viable BUs. Which is what you want in a 2nd round QB. To think your getting a better chance at a franchise QB in Mark then Geno at this point is just silly.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnie View Post
    Fairly high first round grade ??? So high in fact that we passed on him not once , but twice! 32 other teams decided the same.
    The only reason we passed on Geno at 9 and 13 is because Idzik stuck to his draft board and took two players that the Jets had ranked in their top 4. Geno, while not ranked in the top 4, was ranked high enough to consider taking at 13 despite Richardson, the Jets 4th ranked player in the draft.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesR View Post
    Teams that draft lower, like Green Bay, are usually "better" teams. I believe that they are better developers of raw talent than teams that draft early. I don't always believe that the raw talent is badly judged / over drafted, more that it is badly developed. Many - maybe not all - of the examples above went to teams that developed those players well.

    E.g. What if the Jets picked Marino and Dolphins picked O'Brien? Would the Jets have had the success Miami did, or would the Phins have developed O'Brien better than we did? Or if Smith and Rodgers swapped places?

    Also, lower drafting teams usually have better surrounding talent and less pressure for rookies to perform straight away.

    Of course, this all falls apart a bit when it come to high second rounders, as they're picked by those not so good teams again.
    It's a well thought out argument, but it doesn't explain the other 50% that were high draft picks that went on to become great. Brady, and Brees were both picked by terrible teams anyway. Like I said it's a crap shoot. You take a QB with the arm talent, as low as you can get him, and hope he works out.

    I was listening to the draft on the radio, and they cut to a game right around pick 34. My friend texted me about Geno, and my first question was did we trade up, or did we get him at 39. I was very happy we didn't trade up, and happy to have Geno, but mostly happy with Idzik.

    I also agree with Dreamers. The numbers don't lie, and QBs with three full years starting in college, are a way better investment.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    It's a well thought out argument, but it doesn't explain the other 50% that were high draft picks that went on to become great. Brady, and Brees were both picked by terrible teams anyway. Like I said it's a crap shoot. You take a QB with the arm talent, as low as you can get him, and hope he works out.

    I was listening to the draft on the radio, and they cut to a game right around pick 34. My friend texted me about Geno, and my first question was did we trade up, or did we get him at 39. I was very happy we didn't trade up, and happy to have Geno, but mostly happy with Idzik.

    I also agree with Dreamers. The numbers don't lie, and QBs with three full years starting in college, are a way better investment.
    If you compare how long Mark has played QB (5 years total) with how long Geno has (4 years IIRC?) it's not a lot different. Sure, Sanchez has played in the pros, but in terms of overall playing time Geno isn't at that much of a disadvantage.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesR View Post
    For the record - I wanted no part of Smith at #9 or #13. When it came to our second round pick though, I thought it was a pick we HAD to make, as the benefit outweighed the risk IMO.
    +9999999999

    I personally liked EJ Manual better heading into the draft ... but didn't want him early in the 1st either.

    I think both EJ &/or Geno were excellent value at mid 2nd round ... & with our QB position train wreck ... I agree, the pick HAD to be made

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