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Thread: Sanchez's dead money when he's cut...

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by THE_SOOTHSAYER View Post
    Couldn't be more wrong. The Geno pick shows the team has cut bait on Sanchez. He will never take another snap for this team in practice or game. Even the Jets wouldn't be this inept to keep him around.
    Exactly. Restructuring Brick was the obvious death knell. Mark is costing us 12m this year if we keep him, 17m if we cut him. That 5m that Brick gives us is to allow us to cut or trade Mark. It's a no brainer, they can not keep the previously annointed king with the new king on board. Rex's demeanor in the press conference yesterday was extremely telling. He's very close to Mark (too close IMO), and you could tell he was resigned to the fact that this is not good for Mark.

    Quote Originally Posted by THE_SOOTHSAYER View Post
    Furthermore...this pick also gives Tebow life on the roster. They may keep him now.
    I agree as well, begrudgingly. I think the Jets need to remove this "circus" moniker as soon as possible for the sake of Geno's development. I think purging Sanchez AND Tebow is the only way to do that.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by THE_SOOTHSAYER View Post
    Great stuff. See ya, Mark.
    I don't have any idea what Idzik has planned regarding Sanchez...

    However, what is the harm in keeping him for '13 and seeing if Mornhinweg can "right him" as it could accomplish a few things:

    1) Increase Sanchez's trade value in '14
    2) Allow Smith to sit for a year and learn what's it's like to be a NFL QB on and off the field, especially in NY. In hindsight something the Jets should have done with Sanchez
    3) What's done is done regarding Sanchez's contract/cap for '13
    4) Maybe IF "righted" the Jets are in a position of strength at QB, finally!
    4) If MM can't "right" him he's cut in January...

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by SyracuseJet View Post
    The Jets cleared $5.1 million in cap space with the D'Brick restructure. Take the hit this year and cut Sanchez immediately. It's a lost year anyway so just get it over with. It's not like we are going to go sign a bunch of free agents this year anyway.
    Nah he's much cheaper to let ride the bench.. If Sanchez doesn't want to restructure and help out the jets and allow him freedom to go to crap team for chance to start, let him ride the #3 spot, or make him # 4 that would drive him insane and finally would restructure.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    I don't have any idea what Idzik has planned regarding Sanchez...

    However, what is the harm in keeping him for '13 and seeing if Mornhinweg can "right him" as it could accomplish a few things:

    1) Increase Sanchez's trade value in '14
    2) Allow Smith to sit for a year and learn what's it's like to be a NFL QB on and off the field, especially in NY. In hindsight something the Jets should have done with Sanchez
    3) What's done is done regarding Sanchez's contract/cap for '13
    4) Maybe IF "righted" the Jets are in a position of strength at QB, finally!
    4) If MM can't "right" him he's cut in January...
    +1. The right FOOTBALL move is to keep him this year. Stranger things have happened than seeing a 5th year QB finally start to put things together (see Alex Smith, among many). If they cut him they are still letting the media and outside influences dictate their decisions. And, thus far, I haven't seen Idzik operates that way. Let the chatterers moan about the circus all they want -- it shouldn't matter. As you pointed out, there are a number of reasons that it makes sense to keep Sanchez around and let him compete for the job.

  5. #65
    Bad business if Jets cut Sanchez. Give him a chance to compete for the starting job, put him into an Alex Smith role if he doesn't, and part ways at the end of the season.

    If we throw out Geno Smith week 1 we better have a damn good gameplan built around his skills. Honestly, I'd prefer he sits the whole year and works on the little things that make QBs so successful (footwork, pocket awareness, accuracy, timing, anticipation).

    If I just saved a ton of money by restructuring Brick then I'm looking at the best WR in FA and attempting to sign one to a 2-yr deal where I can take most of the cap hit in year 1. Then, I keep Sanchez around and figure out his role. If he doesn't win the starting job, then address the media and make that clear, and just keep him on the roster. Why lose nearly 5 million in cap space when you absolutely don't have to? I'd seriously be upset with this move from a business standpoint, and from the standpoint that Mark might win the job this year all things considered.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by CoreyWill View Post
    Bad business if Jets cut Sanchez. Give him a chance to compete for the starting job, put him into an Alex Smith role if he doesn't, and part ways at the end of the season.

    If we throw out Geno Smith week 1 we better have a damn good gameplan built around his skills. Honestly, I'd prefer he sits the whole year and works on the little things that make QBs so successful (footwork, pocket awareness, accuracy, timing, anticipation).

    If I just saved a ton of money by restructuring Brick then I'm looking at the best WR in FA and attempting to sign one to a 2-yr deal where I can take most of the cap hit in year 1. Then, I keep Sanchez around and figure out his role. If he doesn't win the starting job, then address the media and make that clear, and just keep him on the roster. Why lose nearly 5 million in cap space when you absolutely don't have to? I'd seriously be upset with this move from a business standpoint, and from the standpoint that Mark might win the job this year all things considered.
    There is NO WAY we cut Sanchez. Woody was too cheap to pay revis, you really think he's going to lose 5 mil by cutting Sanchez?? No way he will bury him In the 3 spot. If sanchez really believes the bs he says and thinks he is that good he will re-structure to get out.. Atleast he may be the best #3 qb in the nfl something he better get use to..

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by NDubz View Post
    And don't get me wrong, I'm by no means saying keep him because he deserves another chance. I think he's been (deservingly) destroyed in NY and almost certainly beyond redemption at this point. I just firmly believe that throwing Smith in day 1 on an offense with no talent to help a raw, rookie QB will be detrimental to his development and future success of the team.

    I don't know if the next QB is already on the roster. But I do know that as of tonight there is only one that we have yet to see - IMO only one that MIGHT have a future on the team. I just think its a bad idea to dump Sanchez (this moment) and expect smith to start with this talentless offense.
    Oh , I agree, I've been labeled a Sanchez apologist because IMO he was never developed properly by a DC acting as a HC who had one single mindset when it came to offense (G&P). If Sparano was still here or if Rex sticks to his offensive mentality then the Smith pick would be an absolute total waste.

    The fact that we have MM & David Lee and Rex "claims" he wants a more dynamic offense gives me hope that our current and future QB's have a shot at success.

    Now the million dollar question is what route do they take this year. I agree it could be very dangerous to throw Smith to the wolves until he's comfortable with the WCO and until he's properly developed as a pro NFL QB , something Sanchez was never afforded. So does Sanchez start and Smith gets sprinkled in when ready or does Garrard take the nod , become the mentor for Smith and Sanchez becomes the 3rd QB biding his time for next years release.

    I really can't see them releasing Sanchez and eating all that money, hell they wouldn't even release Tebow and his 2.1 cap hit and he surely was much more of a media circus then Sanchez would be a the #3 QB.

    I know guys here want Sanchez gone w/o question, but it just does not seem to make sense financially and certainly doesn't fit the modus operandi of our owner.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    Jason: Jets Financial Obligations at the QB Position

    Since I know its certainly a big topic of discussion with the New York Jets drafting a QB I wanted to discuss the possibility of cutting the other Jets QBs, though clearly the person on the biggest hot seat is Mark Sanchez.

    Mark Sanchez currently carries a cap charge of $12,853,125 which consists of $8,250,000 in base salary, $4,103,125 in bonus prorations, and a $500,000 workout bonus. The base salary is fully guaranteed with no offset provisions meaning the Jets are on the hook for $8.25 million in cash regardless of whether or not Sanchez plays for the Jets or another team. For the Jets to cut him they have to be willing to pay that money to Sanchez, likely within 30 days of cutting him.

    The dead money cost of cutting Sanchez is $17,153,125, which results in a loss of $4.3 million in cap space. The Jets restructured the contract of LT D’Brickashaw Ferguson on Thursday to create over $5 million in cap space that in theory could have been used during draft weekend in the event the Jets drafted a QB. The restructure was not done after the 1st round so the way the draft unfolded played no part in the restructure. It would have just been preparing for the possibility.

    To save cap room Sanchez could be designated a June 1 cut. If the Jets did that they would defer $4.8 million in dead cap charges to 2014. The Jets would actually gain $500,000 in cap space in 2013 if they made that decision, however with free agency all but finished it is hard to see the benefit of such a move. John Idzik and the Jets may simply be following in the mold of the Indianapolis Colts and Oakland Raiders where they take a year of financial pain to clear the books completely for next season. As I have discussed before the Jets could easily have close to $50 million in cap room next year by proper cap management, which began with the trade of Darrelle Revis.

    Before cutting ties with Sanchez the Jets could look to trade him. The market for 1st round busts has always been there and most teams would be willing to pay somewhere between $2 and $3 million for a player like Sanchez. Compensation would not be much but the Jets could save more money if they did that. If a team was willing to take him for a late draft pick on Saturday at a $2 million salary the dead money would drop to about $15 million in 2013.

    The Jets could also potentially restructure Sanchez’ contract. I cant see Sanchez being amenable to that scenario but it was a move the Jets made in 2006 with Chad Pennington where he was given a chance to compete and to earn his money back via performance. At the time the Jets were looking to start Patrick Ramsey, a 1st round bust of the Redskins, and after the Pennington restructure still drafted Kellen Clemens in the 2nd round. In such a move the Jets would prorate the money they owe Sanchez this year but he would need to take a backup salary from 2014 thru 2016 of $1 to $2 million year.

    Such a move really does not benefit either side as Sanchez’ dead money would increase in the future and his caps would still be around $4.5 million a year, too high of a charge for a backup. If the Jets did have offsets in his contract they would have more leeway in a paycut but they have no leverage now.

    Tim Tebow currently carries a cap charge of $2,586,875. The Jets have already explored that trade market and it does not exist. The Jets still owe the Broncos $1,531,875 from last seasons trade so if Tebow is cut that money is shipped to Denver regardless and impacts the Jets salary cap this season.

    The Jets paid David Garrard a $100,000 signing bonus to go along with a non-guaranteed $1 million base salary. If the Jets cut Garrard the only charge is the $100,000 signing bonus. Garrard has not played in the NFL in 2 years and is injury prone which could make the Jets cautious about moving forward with him now. ..Greg McElroy carries minimal cap penalties if released. His dead money is only $32,576.

    While the Jets did carry Pennington, Ramsey, and Clemens in 2006 there would be little to gain from this situation now. Sanchez, if named the starter, would have an incredibly difficult time at home with a newly drafted prospect sitting on the bench. The home crowd was brutal to Sanchez is his last two home games and it got so bad the Jets pulled him against Arizona and did not play him in their home finale against the Chargers opting instead to play McElroy who was not ready for the speed of a NFL game on that day.

    Logically the Jets should release Sanchez on Monday if they cant work a trade out for him on Saturday. It clears the books which is what the Jets are looking to do as they prepare to turn this all around in 2014, the same as the Raiders. John Idzik was around a situation last year where he had a mid priced QB in Matt Flynn, low cost rookie in Russell Wilson, and mid priced veteran in Tarvaris Jackson. That same situation to me would be Tebow, Garrard, and Geno Smith. One player is maintained after the summer and one is released or traded. Of course nothing would surprise me with the Jets and maybe the person to be cut is Tebow and the Jets hope they can still do something with Sanchez rather than to pay him while he plays elsewhere.

    http://overthecap.com/jets-financial...e-qb-position/

    So, my questions are:
    1) If the Jets cut Sanchez before June 1, what are the cap hits this year and in 2014?
    2) If they cut Sanchez after June 1, what are the cap hits this year and in 2014?
    3) If the Jets cut Sanchez after the 2013 season, season what is the cap hit in 2014?

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    I don't have any idea what Idzik has planned regarding Sanchez...

    However, what is the harm in keeping him for '13 and seeing if Mornhinweg can "right him" as it could accomplish a few things:

    1) Increase Sanchez's trade value in '14
    2) Allow Smith to sit for a year and learn what's it's like to be a NFL QB on and off the field, especially in NY. In hindsight something the Jets should have done with Sanchez
    3) What's done is done regarding Sanchez's contract/cap for '13
    4) Maybe IF "righted" the Jets are in a position of strength at QB, finally!
    4) If MM can't "right" him he's cut in January...
    All sound logical thoughts. However, MM is behind the Smith pick, he loves him.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by NYJ37/12 View Post
    All sound logical thoughts. However, MM is behind the Smith pick, he loves him.
    Never said he wasn't...I would hope to gawd he does love him

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by escamoter2 View Post
    Renegotiate and buy him out somehow. We ruined him. A divorce is good for both parties.
    Yes, but no one "ruined" Sanchez except himself.

  12. #72
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    By getting Geno at 39 we save a ton of money and can cut Sanchez and not have a controversy with the media. As long as we meet the Cap for this year we don't need Sanchez on the team.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMJK View Post
    By getting Geno at 39 we save a ton of money and can cut Sanchez and not have a controversy with the media. As long as we meet the Cap for this year we don't need Sanchez on the team.
    I just hearda sound bite of Marks brother agent say Woody had said nothing to us about cutting him trading him or restructuring him so why not restructure at a lower salary give him a fair shot atkeeping his starting spot then cut him at a lower cap hit. JETS news conf at 1pm today

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by joiseyjet View Post
    I just hearda sound bite of Marks brother agent say Woody had said nothing to us about cutting him trading him or restructuring him so why not restructure at a lower salary give him a fair shot atkeeping his starting spot then cut him at a lower cap hit. JETS news conf at 1pm today
    That might work from a Cap perspective. From my personal view I rather watch Geno develop next year with any Sanchez distractions etc. I see your logic though and you make a lot of sense, just not my preferred choice.

  15. #75
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    I too was mystified by the draft choice last night, but sleeping on it, it's starting to make more sense. The key words we keep hearing are BAP and competition. It fits.

    1. Sanchez will get one more shot, but he'll have to win the job from Geno and Garrard. Cut him? I don't understand that logic. We invested a lot into him, and he will have one last shot with a good OC. Period. That's it.

    2. Geno will fail with this offense right off the bat if thrown into the fire, and possibly be ruined as well. You must GROOM him. Unless, he comes in, picks up the offense, and clicks on all cylinders, then you HAVE to hand him the keys. But don't RUSH the kid. We've ruined a few QBs throwing them into the fire and then saying they suck hen they mess up already. *COUGH SANCHEZ COUGH*

    3. Tebow seemingly cannot be traded, so we either gets cut or we use him as a RB-that-can-sometimes-throw (like the Pats would do) and enough of this lining up at QB nonsense. And we don't want to cut him because the Pats WOULD pick him up and use him like that. I wanted him to be a RB-who-could-sometimes-throw last year and it never happened because of our unimaginative offense that we had. All of this, "HE'S A DISTRACTION BECAUSE HE'S POPULAR/HE'S AN OUTSPOKEN CHRISTIAN AND I HATE THOSE PEOPLE/HE SUCKS BECAUSE HE CAN'T THROW* crap is just crap. Use him as a RB and all the people shut up.

    So, if we can't trade any of these guys, we'll likely be doing some cutting. McElroy (only got 1 chance?), Tebow (Unless converted to a RB), Garrard (We JUST signed him!), Sanchez (a LOT invested into him)... a log jam.... And no matter who is the QB, we still need a TE, maybe another decent WR and OL.
    Last edited by ChrisChrusher#40; 04-27-2013 at 01:44 PM.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndianaJet View Post
    It will only cost us a little more than 4 million extra to cut him this year

    Even if he's on the roster the 12 million cap charge is essentially dead money anyway. He's not seeing the field.

    Why even have him on the roster creating controversy and distraction.

    Just take the hit and cut him now.
    It boils down to this:

    If we keep him we could make him inactive. Then the only question to be asked is whether it is worth $4M to have an additional roster spot open for another player.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    I don't have any idea what Idzik has planned regarding Sanchez...

    However, what is the harm in keeping him for '13 and seeing if Mornhinweg can "right him" as it could accomplish a few things:

    1) Increase Sanchez's trade value in '14
    2) Allow Smith to sit for a year and learn what's it's like to be a NFL QB on and off the field, especially in NY. In hindsight something the Jets should have done with Sanchez
    3) What's done is done regarding Sanchez's contract/cap for '13
    4) Maybe IF "righted" the Jets are in a position of strength at QB, finally!
    4) If MM can't "right" him he's cut in January...
    Agree 100%!! I agree he's done here but I just Don't see the harm in keeping him around this year. It doesn't seem like there's anything to be gained by letting him go right now.

    Worst case scenario; he starts while Smith develops and we have a different QB in 14.

    Best case; he actually plays decently/average and MAYBE could have some trade value. The team still moves on in 14 with a new QB and HOPEFULLY some offensive playmakers for the new guy to work with.

  18. #78
    So the general consensus is to keep Sanchez and I think that is the best move. Creating over 4 million in dead money, whether it be this year or next, is a terrible business decision for any NFL team. Sanchez WILL NOT BE A DISTRACTION because if he doesn't win the job, then you just keep him around for a year as a backup and make that clear.

    The only thing that puts the doubt in my mind is the Brick restructure, but you don't just create more dead money than you need. If Garrard gets hurt I'd still rather Sanchez than McElroy (I want Geno Smith groomed for a year).

  19. #79
    I'm in the minority in the sense that I still believe Sanchez can be a decent QB..................but not here. The relationship between Sanchez and the fans and media has grown toxic. If he wins the starting job this season Jets fans will be screaming for his head. It's to the point where he is beyond hated. He would have to be just about perfect to redeem himself, and let's face it he's just never going to be. The best opportunity for Mark would be to go back someone up in a smaller media city. KC, SD, AZ, CLE, etc....

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMJK View Post
    By getting Geno at 39 we save a ton of money and can cut Sanchez and not have a controversy with the media. As long as we meet the Cap for this year we don't need Sanchez on the team.
    But that doesn't eliminate the controversy, it very well could fuel it. Right now Sanchez is pretty universally regarded with the media as trash. But how many are going to knock the Jets for at least starting the season with Sanchez for the sake of developing a raw rookie.

    If you cut Sanchez, start Smith day one and he looks horrible in a talentless offense. I can imagine the media - "THE CIRCUS THAT IS THE JETS DAMAGES ROOKIE QB BY STARTING HIM ON OFFENSE WITH NO TALENT"
    No way dumping Sanchez avoids controversy IMO

    Now again, I don't care if you cut Sanchez as long as its not for the sake of expecting Smith to start right away. I keep my expectations realistic for this season... Hell, I don't really care if Tebow starts, as long as its not Smith from the get go.

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