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Thread: Izdik has arrived

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    So let me get this straight. If Chris Ivory comes in, starts a few games, then gets hurt for the season, Izdik is a bad GM?

    But if he sticks with his 4th round pick and picks somebody who doesn't make the team, that was better?

    Of course you judge the process. Nobody has perfect drafts. New England's drafts suck year after year and they have signed some bad free agents. But the point is their process to field a winning team works, so none of that matters.

    If the players don't work out, they are not tied to them, so they just move on.

    That is what most of the people criticizing my perspective are not getting. It don't matter if the players work out or not. If they don't, we can easily move on. Izdik used the same scouting department that Bradway and Tanny used before him. They are a pretty good scouting department, talent wise. Bradway raved about Wilson last year, and Kaepernick the year before.

    What has changed is the way the Jets handle business. That is why the GM can be evaluated and you are already starting to see articles praising him.
    I agree with you. I love what I'm seeing. From free agency, to the Revis trade, to the draft. He has done an exceptional job, no question.

    But to answer your question - yes Chris Ivory is an injury risk, Colon is an injury risk, Millner is an injury risk. He certainly has taken some chances, some bigger than others.

    What if Richardson turns out to be The Ghost II?

    You have to judge them on their ability to asses both talent and injury risk.

  2. #62
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    Let's cut to the chase, here.....what has Idzik done so far that HASN"t made the Jets a better team and organization going forward?

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    This is just so illogical and wrong I don't even know where to begin bashing it.

    If all of the players the GM signs and drafts this year are busts, this franchise won't recover for several years.

    A GM is only as good as the players he acquires.

    Results, not the process, are what really matter.

    I don't know why you are not getting this.
    Why won't the franchise recover for several years? You make no sense. We are set up to have boatloads of cap room next year, and at least 10-11 picks. If ALL of these players fail, we still can move on with little drawback except what would be an obvious pitiful 2013 season.

    And this is a professional organization with the SAME scouting department. They have a pretty good rep for talent evaluation. The problem has been not in who they draft, but how the entire team is financially built. We used to sign lots of big name FAs (some of our own as well), usually overpaying. Then in the draft, we would make splashy moves, either overdrafting players, or trading multiple high round picks to move up, or acquire other players.

    That means you are tied to the success of those players as a franchise, b/c if they fail you have no other options.

    This year, we stayed put, and we got a player for every pick we had. We filled out depth, and did it all with bargain basement contracts and draft picks.

    This gives us the ultimate leverage next year to completely remold this team however they see fit. If Geno is good, build around him. If Sanchez shocks the world, and turns it on, so be it, we are in a good trade position.

    So that is why I think it is silly to strictly judge a GM on the players they draft. There is much more to the job then that. Right now, Izdik is re-stocking the team through the draft, signing low key FAs with high upside, and waiting it out til all the dead $ and bad contracts are off the cap (2014).

    So we have seen his approach to FA, resigning his own, and the draft (build depth, BPA). I think it is ok to evaluate the GM based on that. How the players work out involves a lot of outside factors (coach, injuries, etc) then the decision made to take them.
    Last edited by One Eye; 04-29-2013 at 09:36 AM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by section314 View Post
    Let's cut to the chase, here.....what has Idzik done so far that HASN"t made the Jets a better team and organization going forward?
    well said.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by section314 View Post
    Let's cut to the chase, here.....what has Idzik done so far that HASN"t made the Jets a better team and organization going forward?
    LOz...you can tell that before a ball has been snapped?

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    LOz...you can tell that before a ball has been snapped?
    Yes. B/c, as I mentioned earlier, Izdik has built us into a postion of extreme flexibility, cap wise, player wise, etc.

    Next year, we sit on 10-11 picks, a young nucleus of talent, and boatloads of money. Doesn't matter what happens after the ball is snapped.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by section314 View Post
    Let's cut to the chase, here.....what has Idzik done so far that HASN"t made the Jets a better team and organization going forward?
    I don't think anyone is unhappy with his performance to date. Most fans believe idzik's been very good.
    All we're saying is we shouldn't be calling him "great" until we see how some of his picks and pick ups pan out.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelioion View Post
    I agree with you. I love what I'm seeing. From free agency, to the Revis trade, to the draft. He has done an exceptional job, no question.

    But to answer your question - yes Chris Ivory is an injury risk, Colon is an injury risk, Millner is an injury risk. He certainly has taken some chances, some bigger than others.

    What if Richardson turns out to be The Ghost II?

    You have to judge them on their ability to asses both talent and injury risk.
    Again, what if all this comes true. We cut the players and move on b/c they have team friendly deals or are in rookie contracts.

    Now, think of the past. If Santonio got hurt, and Revis, what type of team did we have? It was a joke. Our team was built of a few good players and fill ins. That had to change, and now it has/is.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    Doesn't matter what happens after the ball is snapped.
    Why bother with the games then?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    Lost in the tainted perspective of media pundits and long suffering jet fans is the fact that we can all say now that Izdik is a solid, if not great, GM.

    First, he maneuvered masterfully to get good value for Revis with NO perceived leverage.

    Then he signs quality free agents for low $ and refuses to over pay any of our own free agents regardless of need.

    Finally, the draft. Whether or not these players pan out, here's what we know...

    Izdik stuck to his board regardless of need or media pressure. He was patient and picked great value each round. Nothing splashy, except Smith, and that was too good to be true. He never reached.

    We desperately needed day one contributors. Out of this draft, we got a whopping 4 definite day one contributors (dee, Richardson, winters, Ivory), possibly 5 if Geno starts. Not too mention picking up some solid TE,S, and WR UDFAs to add to a solid draft.

    We certainly gained o line & d line (big fatty) depth, a rb rotation for the next few years, a solid group of QBs, & two defensive building blocks to go with Mo & Coples.

    One other thought: I think Sanchez will be the day one starter and that might be the best thing for everyone. Geno gets to learn. Sanchez rebuilds his rep & trade value, and we may get something for him at the end of the year too.
    It's IDZIK! Not Izdik! Gosh, get his name right at least.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelioion View Post
    I don't think anyone is unhappy with his performance to date. Most fans believe idzik's been very good.
    All we're saying is we shouldn't be calling him "great" until we see how some of his picks and pick ups pan out.
    for the record, my original post never called him great. It said ...

    Lost in the tainted perspective of media pundits and long suffering jet fans is the fact that we can all say now that Izdik is a solid, if not great, GM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by chesapeakejet View Post
    It's IDZIK! Not Izdik! Gosh, get his name right at least.
    lol. one day.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    Why bother with the games then?
    What does having cap flexibility have to do with games?

  14. #74
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    Idzik has been very good so far and has restored my faith in this team after a couple of grim seasons.

    I liked our draft and off-season transactions, but the best two things he has done are:

    1) Handled the media
    2) Handled Rex - we haven't heard a peep out of his dumb mouth. Just coach the def Rex.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by section314 View Post
    Let's cut to the chase, here.....what has Idzik done so far that HASN"t made the Jets a better team and organization going forward?
    Trade Revis

    Draft Richardson when we used past two first rounders on other D-Linemen who are also neither NTs nor edge rushers

    Draft Winters in the 3rd, another small school tackle converting to guard (ala Ducasse) when there were good WRs on the board who could be targets for Geno (Allen, Bailey, others)

    Trade a 4th round pick to take Ivory, an RB who can't play a full season

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    Why won't the franchise recover for several years? You make no sense. We are set up to have boatloads of cap room next year, and at least 10-11 picks. If ALL of these players fail, we still can move on with little drawback except what would be an obvious pitiful 2013 season.

    And this is a professional organization with the SAME scouting department. They have a pretty good rep for talent evaluation. The problem has been not in who they draft, but how the entire team is financially built. We used to sign lots of big name FAs (some of our own as well), usually overpaying. Then in the draft, we would make splashy moves, either overdrafting players, or trading multiple high round picks to move up, or acquire other players.

    That means you are tied to the success of those players as a franchise.

    This year, we stayed put, and we got a player for every pick we had. We filled out depth, and did it all with bargain basement contracts and draft picks.

    This gives us the ultimate leverage next year to completely remold this team however they see fit. If Geno is good, build around him. If Sanchez shocks the world, and turns it on, so be it, we are in a good trade position.

    So that is why I think it is silly to strictly judge a GM on the players they draft. There is much more to the job then that. Right now, Izdik is re-stocking the team through the draft, signing low key FAs with high upside, and waiting it out til all the dead $ and bad contracts are off the cap (2014).

    So we have seen his approach to FA, resigning his own, and the draft (build depth, BPA). I think it is ok to evaluate the GM based on that. How the players work out has a lot more to do then who made the decision to draft them.
    If he is a poor talent evaluator, it does not matter how much cap space the team has, how many picks they have, how he sticks to his draft board.

    I don't care about process of roster building if all of the pieces he finds are trash.

    Tanny is gone, not because his process was flawed but because the picks and signings did not work out. If Sanchez, Ducasse, Pace, McKnight etc. were as good as they hoped, this would be a playoff team this year.

    MT failed to bring in the talent. If Idzik fails to bring in winning talent, no matter how he does it, he will be fired too. That is a stone cold fact.

    Approach means nothing. There is no correct way to build a team.
    Last edited by TheMikeIsHot; 04-29-2013 at 09:47 AM.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    What does having cap flexibility have to do with games?
    Picks and cap flexibility are wonderful.

    But ultimately meaningless unless you pick the right players.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    Picks and cap flexibility are wonderful.

    But ultimately meaningless unless you pick the right players.
    another way to look at it is this - if the jets kept tanny, what would he have likely done?

    - re-sign revis for 15M per year with guarantees
    - draft cordarelle patterson in the first round
    - kept greene, not trade for ivory, draft a rb in early in the draft
    - not fortify the O-line like idzik did, stubbornly maintaining that ducasse can o it
    - not draft geno b/c he's going with sanchez till the end

    is that a better situation than the jets are in now?

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2 View Post
    Picks and cap flexibility are wonderful.

    But ultimately meaningless unless you pick the right players.
    That's some deep stuff.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by chesapeakejet View Post
    It's IDZIK! Not Izdik! Gosh, get his name right at least.
    Perhaps that's his wife's nickname for him

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