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Thread: REPORT: Jets move Coples to OLB

  1. #101
    Former DE/OLB Willie McGinest on Ziggy Ansah, Dion Jordan, and the “elephant position”

    Feb 25th, 2013 by Jimmy Kempski.

    On NFL Network this morning, Mike Mayock asked former Pats/Browns DE/OLB Willie McGinest about guys like Dion Jordan and Ziggy Ansah, two players that have been widely discussed as potential Top 10 picks in the 2013 draft. McGinest was listed at 6’5, 270 during his playing days. Ansah is was measured this week at 6’5, 271, and Jordan was measured at 6’6, 248.

    I just thought this was a good job by McGinest, simplifying the roles that Ansah and Jordan could play with whatever team drafts them in April.

    I think this is most relevant to the Eagles and Cowboys, who could put players like this to good use.

    Mayock: ”I love watching the conversion guys, the DEs that are trying to drop and move. Give me a scouting report of Ziggy Ansah and Dion Jordan.”

    McGinest: “Starting with Ansah, here’s a guy who’s big, and his movement is fluid, his hips seem to be good, I heard you say he was a little tight, but he’s a guy that played with his hand in the dirt, that can kind of play that “elephant position.” I played that position coming out. I played a little bit of DE over, under I played OLB and dropped into space. (These drop drills) are important for Ziggy because we’re going to see if he can move in space, if he can get in an out of breaks, turn his hips well.

    Dion Jordan is a freak. He’s explosive, he’s lighter like you said. I don’t know if I would throw 20 pounds on him, depending on what position he’s going to play in the NFL. He could play OLB, I think he’s a little too light to play a true DE position, but he can come off the edge and rush the passer because he has those pass rushing skills. He has covered TEs. He was a receiver his first two years at Oregon, so he has those ball skills that we always talk about, he understands coverages, and he’s comfortable covering guys.

    These two guys look really fluid in these drills, and another guy I want to throw in there is (Illinois DE/OLB Michael) Buchanon. I don’t see him as a DE. He seems like an OLB.”

    Mayock: ”One term I want you to qualify… you talk about the “elephant position.” You’ve been around Pete Carroll to know where that comes from, an you’re a Trojan. Just kind of explain what that means.”

    McGinest: ”The ‘elephant position’ is kind of like a Charles Haley. When Pete (Carroll) came to New England I played (that role). It’s a guy that’s a little bigger, a little heavier than an OLB, but he’s a little lighter than a true DE. You put him in a position where he can take advantage of TEs and tackles and RBs. He’s a guy you can drop in space, but against a TE (as a pass rusher), it’s a mismatch. And you can have him play both – You can have him do a bunch of different things. He doesn’t come off the field. You can have him playing OLB in a 3-4 system, (and if you go) 4-3 he’s one of those guys that can put his hand in the dirt, mangle tight ends and get up the field and pass rush as well.”

    Ansah ran a 4.62 40 today. Jordan ran a 4.53. Both times (unofficial) are very impressive for their size.

    http://bloggingthebeast.com/2013/02/...hant-position/


    The Patriots sent their third-round pick to the Bengals to select Syracuse DE/OLB Chandler Jones (6-5, 266 pounds, 4.82 speed with 35.5-inch arms). He fits the 'elephant' position (a hybrid of DE/OLB), perfectly. It's the position Andre Carter and Mark Anderson played last season. Most scouts think Jones will need a year of development to realize his vast potential, which includes a very good first step off the line.

    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/nf...ports/18848686

  2. #102
    Nice find Cmart, thanks.

  3. #103
    can' wait to see him being out run by all the TE' s in the league. let him play the edge and do what he is built for.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by NYJ37/12 View Post
    Nice find Cmart, thanks.
    No prob..

    I didn't realize the Pats took Buchanan..He was on my radar as a late round pick...


    Quotes from Patriots pick Michael Buchanan

    New Patriots defensive lineman Michael Buchanan spoke to the media shortly after being drafted 226th overall on Saturday

    http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...rom_pat_5.html

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post

    Mayock: ”One term I want you to qualify… you talk about the “elephant position.” You’ve been around Pete Carroll to know where that comes from, an you’re a Trojan. Just kind of explain what that means.”

    McGinest: ”The ‘elephant position’ is kind of like a Charles Haley. When Pete (Carroll) came to New England I played (that role). It’s a guy that’s a little bigger, a little heavier than an OLB, but he’s a little lighter than a true DE. You put him in a position where he can take advantage of TEs and tackles and RBs. He’s a guy you can drop in space, but against a TE (as a pass rusher), it’s a mismatch. And you can have him play both – You can have him do a bunch of different things. He doesn’t come off the field. You can have him playing OLB in a 3-4 system, (and if you go) 4-3 he’s one of those guys that can put his hand in the dirt, mangle tight ends and get up the field and pass rush as well.”


    http://bloggingthebeast.com/2013/02/...hant-position/




    Coples could be a train wreck for opposing offenses.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by RichardTodd27 View Post
    I'm a Rex Ryan fan. But this is one thing I'll never understand. Knowing how important a pass rushing OLB is in the 3-4 defense, why haven't the Jets addressed this position in the draft since hiring Ryan? Not sure who to blame for this.
    They did last season when they drafted Coples, but he wasn't ready. While he clearly came on in the second half of the season. He was non-existent in the first half. This is one of the few instances where the Jets actually did the right thing in developing a young player. They put him in situations which would bolster his confidence and make him understand the he is a physical mis-match against most any NFL player. On the interior line he had fewer responsibilities thereby decreasing his chances of making a mental mistake. Now, they have a player whose confidence in his physical ability is ascending without any baggage on the mental side of the game to slow him down.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by srobjets View Post
    can' wait to see him being out run by all the TE' s in the league. let him play the edge and do what he is built for.
    Eh no that's Eric Smith's job which is vacant and I don't think any replacement could ever be so good at that.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by SONNY WERBLIN View Post
    They did last season when they drafted Coples, but he wasn't ready. While he clearly came on in the second half of the season. He was non-existent in the first half. This is one of the few instances where the Jets actually did the right thing in developing a young player. They put him in situations which would bolster his confidence and make him understand the he is a physical mis-match against most any NFL player. On the interior line he had fewer responsibilities thereby decreasing his chances of making a mental mistake. Now, they have a player whose confidence in his physical ability is ascending without any baggage on the mental side of the game to slow him down.
    +1. I think Ryan may have intended Coples to play the rush position since he scouted him at UNC. The Jets clearly were bringing Coples along slowly last year, even making him come off the bench while starting an inferiorly talented player (Devito). Despite this, Coples still led the team in sacks. Towards the end of the year, you even saw Coples playing in a two point stance.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by detjetsfan View Post
    Eh no that's Eric Smith's job which is vacant and I don't think any replacement could ever be so good at that.
    lol....

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by thshadow View Post
    Can someone explain what the difference is between a 3-4 with a rush linebacker and a 4-3? IOW, if QC is always going to rush, why not call it a 4-3?
    This is the whole issue, it does not matter as much if the guy has his hand on the ground or is standing up than it is the defensive alignment gap responsibilities. I see him in a elephant role where he will line up on the weakside and the Sam will float with the TE, if he goes in motion. If the TE does not go in motion, I see his alignment as either the 6 or 9. more of a 4-3 under approach.

    Rex's 3-4 is similar to Phillips's in that both teams play a one gap- aggressive uo the field at the snap, rather than the 3-4 that is used by Parcells/BB/Mangini/Cowher type that plays more read and react 2 gap.

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