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Thread: Herm's Top 20 Coaches of All Time

  1. #21
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    Amazing how unappreciated Tom Flores continues to be.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan View Post
    Tony Dungy being on that list is a complete disgrace to the greats up there.

    That man single handedly limited the Colts to one Super Bowl appearance over his tenure the way he coached and schemed that defense. Peyton was good enough on his own to carry whomever the head coach was. See Caldwell, Jim.

    Dungy's inclusion on this list is comparable to Seifert hypothetically making it on there. Complete ignorance.

    Agree with JStream...Holmegren needs to be up there.
    PC is alive and well.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maury77 View Post
    Coughlin? Really?
    For the mere fact he has been almost fired 22x amidst those 2 SB wins, i think TC is at the least knocking on the door of top 20.

  4. #24
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    Wanna know why Tony Dungy is on the list. Does the term "Tampa 2"
    mean anything to anyone.

    Yes, I realize Dungy learn the "Cover 2" from Chuck Knoll, but it was Dungy who came up with the idea to run the middle Lber down the center of the field. Thus the "Tampa 2" was born reshaping the Chuch Knoll "Cover 2".

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by southparkcpa View Post
    PC is alive and well.
    I'm lost. Political correctness is alive and well cuz his kid committed suicide? Or because of the religious show?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    Wanna know why Tony Dungy is on the list. Does the term "Tampa 2"
    mean anything to anyone.

    Yes, I realize Dungy learn the "Cover 2" from Chuck Knoll, but it was Dungy who came up with the idea to run the middle Lber down the center of the field. Thus the "Tampa 2" was born reshaping the Chuch Knoll "Cover 2".
    It's not about coaches who impacted the sport, it's about the best coaches. By your definition, Don Coryell and Buddy Ryan should be top 10.

  6. #26
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by scott dierking II View Post
    Amazing how unappreciated Tom Flores continues to be.
    He went to Seattle in the early 90's and his teams completely sucked. Much like George Seifert, he was not bigger than the sum of the parts. The talent propped him up, not the other way around.

    BTW there is no way in hell Bellichick is a better coach than Paul Brown or Joe Gibbs. I'd put BB at 11.
    Last edited by JoeyStylez; 05-24-2013 at 01:34 AM.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinstar View Post
    Wanna know why Tony Dungy is on the list. Does the term "Tampa 2"
    mean anything to anyone.

    Yes, I realize Dungy learn the "Cover 2" from Chuck Knoll, but it was Dungy who came up with the idea to run the middle Lber down the center of the field. Thus the "Tampa 2" was born reshaping the Chuch Knoll "Cover 2".
    Thank you....

    I came out here and people have such an agenda it is a little sad. How about the fact that Dungy turned a franchise in Tampa that was said to be the worst franchise in all of sports and Dungy turned that whole thing around.

    Indeed up to 60% of Tampa fans credit Dungy for their only SB and not the HC who actually won it in Gruden, even though Dungy wasn't the HC!!!

    Oh and how many SB had the Colts won beofre Dungy got there with Manning? Indeed they had a problem making the playoffs!!!


    It is amazing how the players like Manning have said that Dungy is one of the greatest coaches he has ever been around but JI objective posters can say all manner of coded foolishness!!!

  8. #28
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    I waited to call out posters on this thread because it is a disgrace that people would make say Dungy is a poster child for PC.

    Take a look at some of the football facts:

    Career winning percentage

    Regular season, minimum 100 games
    1. John Madden - .750 (103-32-7), Raiders
    2. Vince Lombardi - .728 (96-34-6), Packers, Redskins
    3. George Allen - .705 (116-47-5), Rams, Redskins
    4. Blanton Collier - .688 (76-34-2), Browns
    5. Don Shula - .676 (328-156-6), Colts, Dolphins
    6. George Halas* - .671 (318-148-31), Bears
    7. Tony Dungy - .668 (139-69-0), Bucs, Colts
    8. George Seifert - .648 (114-62), 49ers, Panthers
    9. Curly Lambeau - .624 (226-132-22), Packers, Cardinals, Redskins
    10. Paul Brown** - .621 (166-100-6), Browns, Bengals

    Consecutive playoff berths

    Since 1970
    10 - Tony Dungy (Bucs/Colts, 1999-2008)
    9 - Tom Landry (Cowboys, 1975-83)
    8 - Chuck Noll (Steelers, 1972-79)
    7 - Mike Holmgren (Packers/Seahawks, 1993-99)
    6 - John Madden (Raiders, 1972-77)
    - Bud Grant (Vikings, 1973-78)
    - Bill Walsh (49ers, 1983-88)
    - Marv Levy (Bills, 1988-93)
    - Marty Schottenheimer (Chiefs, 1990-95)
    - Bill Cowher (Steelers, 1992-97)

    Frequency in playoffs

    All-time, minimum 10 coaching seasons
    84.6% - Tony Dungy, 11 of 13 seasons
    80% - John Madden, 8 of 10 seasons
    70.6% - Mike Holmgren, 12 of 17 seasons
    70% - Bill Walsh, 7 of 10 seasons
    70% - Andy Reid, 7 of 10 seasons
    66.7% - Bill Cowher, 10 of 15 seasons
    66.7% - Bud Grant, 12 of 18 seasons
    63.6% - George Seifert, 7 of 11 seasons
    62.5% - Joe Gibbs, 10 of 16 seasons
    62.1% - Tom Landry, 18 of 29 seasons
    61.9% - Marty Schottenheimer, 13 of 21 seasons
    61.5% - Dennis Green, 8 of 13 seasons
    60% - Vince Lombardi, 6 of 10 seasons

    Total seasons in playoffs

    With record and winning percentage
    19 - Don Shula (19-17, .528)
    18 - Tom Landry (20-16, .556)
    13 - Marty Schottenheimer (5-13, .278)
    12 - Chuck Noll (16-8, .667)
    12 - Mike Holmgren (13-11, .542)
    12 - Bud Grant (10-12, .455)
    11 - Tony Dungy (9-10, .474)
    11 - Chuck Knox (7-11, .389)
    11 - Paul Brown (4-8, .333)
    10 - Joe Gibbs (17-7, .708)
    10 - Bill Parcells (11-8, .579)
    10 - Bill Cowher (12-9, .571)
    10 - Steve Owen (2-8, .200)

    Top seven-year runs

    Maximum one per coach, unless the years didn't overlap
    Don Shula - .816 (78-16-4), Colts/Dolphins, 1967-73
    John Madden - .776 (74-20-4), Raiders, 1971-77
    Vince Lombardi - .776 (74-20-4), Packers, 1961-67
    Bud Grant - .776 (76-22), Vikings, 1969-75
    George Halas - .772 (64-14-14), Bears, 1920-26*
    George Seifert - .768 (86-26), 49ers, 1989-95
    Bill Belichick - .768 (86-26), Patriots, 2002-08
    Chuck Noll - .765 (76-23-1), Steelers, 1972-78
    Curly Lambeau - .763 (58-17-3), Packers, 1936-42
    Tony Dungy - .759 (85-27), Colts, 2002-08
    Curly Lambeau - .758 (64-17-10), Packers, 1926-32
    Paul Brown - .756 (63-20-1), Browns, 1950-56**
    Tom Landry - .755 (80-26), Cowboys, 1975-81
    Tom Landry - .750 (73-24-1), Cowboys, 1967-73
    George Allen - .750 (71-22-5), Rams/Redskins, 1967-73
    Bill Walsh - .716 (74-29-1), 49ers, 1981-87
    Mike Ditka - .712 (79-32), Bears, 1984-90

    Regular-season wins

    Seasons in parentheses. Note Dungy's win pct. is third on this list.
    328 - Don Shula (33), 328-156-6, .676
    318 - George Halas (40), 318-148-31, .671
    250 - Tom Landry (29), 250-162-6, .605
    226 - Curly Lambeau (33), 226-132-22, .624
    200 - Marty Schottenheimer (21), 200-126-1, .613
    193 - Chuck Noll (23), 193-148-1, .566
    190 - Dan Reeves (23), 190-165-2, .535
    186 - Chuck Knox (22), 186-147-1, .558
    172 - Bill Parcells (19), 172-130-1, .569
    166 - Paul Brown (21), 166-100-6, .621
    161 - Mike Holmgren (16), 161-111, .592
    158 - Bud Grant (18), 158-96-5, .620
    154 - Joe Gibbs (16), 154-94, .621
    151 - Steve Owen (23), 151-100-17, .595
    149 - Bill Cowher (15), 149-90-1, .623
    146 - Mike Shanahan (15), 146-98, .598
    143 - Marv Levy (17), 143-112, .561
    139 - Tony Dungy (13), 139-69, .668
    138 - Bill Belichick (14) 138-86, .616
    131 - Hank Stram (17), 131-97-10, .571
    130 - Weeb Ewbank (20), 130-129-7, .502


    Yea Dungy didnt do anything as a HC, it all has to do with PC run amuck!!

    No objective fan could possibly think Dungy was a great HC!!

    Sickness

    Good Grief!!!

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Brown View Post
    I waited to call out posters on this thread because it is a disgrace that people would make say Dungy is a poster child for PC.

    Take a look at some of the football facts:

    Career winning percentage

    Regular season, minimum 100 games
    1. John Madden - .750 (103-32-7), Raiders
    2. Vince Lombardi - .728 (96-34-6), Packers, Redskins
    3. George Allen - .705 (116-47-5), Rams, Redskins
    4. Blanton Collier - .688 (76-34-2), Browns
    5. Don Shula - .676 (328-156-6), Colts, Dolphins
    6. George Halas* - .671 (318-148-31), Bears
    7. Tony Dungy - .668 (139-69-0), Bucs, Colts
    8. George Seifert - .648 (114-62), 49ers, Panthers
    9. Curly Lambeau - .624 (226-132-22), Packers, Cardinals, Redskins
    10. Paul Brown** - .621 (166-100-6), Browns, Bengals

    Consecutive playoff berths

    Since 1970
    10 - Tony Dungy (Bucs/Colts, 1999-2008)
    9 - Tom Landry (Cowboys, 1975-83)
    8 - Chuck Noll (Steelers, 1972-79)
    7 - Mike Holmgren (Packers/Seahawks, 1993-99)
    6 - John Madden (Raiders, 1972-77)
    - Bud Grant (Vikings, 1973-78)
    - Bill Walsh (49ers, 1983-88)
    - Marv Levy (Bills, 1988-93)
    - Marty Schottenheimer (Chiefs, 1990-95)
    - Bill Cowher (Steelers, 1992-97)

    Frequency in playoffs

    All-time, minimum 10 coaching seasons
    84.6% - Tony Dungy, 11 of 13 seasons
    80% - John Madden, 8 of 10 seasons
    70.6% - Mike Holmgren, 12 of 17 seasons
    70% - Bill Walsh, 7 of 10 seasons
    70% - Andy Reid, 7 of 10 seasons
    66.7% - Bill Cowher, 10 of 15 seasons
    66.7% - Bud Grant, 12 of 18 seasons
    63.6% - George Seifert, 7 of 11 seasons
    62.5% - Joe Gibbs, 10 of 16 seasons
    62.1% - Tom Landry, 18 of 29 seasons
    61.9% - Marty Schottenheimer, 13 of 21 seasons
    61.5% - Dennis Green, 8 of 13 seasons
    60% - Vince Lombardi, 6 of 10 seasons

    Total seasons in playoffs

    With record and winning percentage
    19 - Don Shula (19-17, .528)
    18 - Tom Landry (20-16, .556)
    13 - Marty Schottenheimer (5-13, .278)
    12 - Chuck Noll (16-8, .667)
    12 - Mike Holmgren (13-11, .542)
    12 - Bud Grant (10-12, .455)
    11 - Tony Dungy (9-10, .474)
    11 - Chuck Knox (7-11, .389)
    11 - Paul Brown (4-8, .333)
    10 - Joe Gibbs (17-7, .708)
    10 - Bill Parcells (11-8, .579)
    10 - Bill Cowher (12-9, .571)
    10 - Steve Owen (2-8, .200)

    Top seven-year runs

    Maximum one per coach, unless the years didn't overlap
    Don Shula - .816 (78-16-4), Colts/Dolphins, 1967-73
    John Madden - .776 (74-20-4), Raiders, 1971-77
    Vince Lombardi - .776 (74-20-4), Packers, 1961-67
    Bud Grant - .776 (76-22), Vikings, 1969-75
    George Halas - .772 (64-14-14), Bears, 1920-26*
    George Seifert - .768 (86-26), 49ers, 1989-95
    Bill Belichick - .768 (86-26), Patriots, 2002-08
    Chuck Noll - .765 (76-23-1), Steelers, 1972-78
    Curly Lambeau - .763 (58-17-3), Packers, 1936-42
    Tony Dungy - .759 (85-27), Colts, 2002-08
    Curly Lambeau - .758 (64-17-10), Packers, 1926-32
    Paul Brown - .756 (63-20-1), Browns, 1950-56**
    Tom Landry - .755 (80-26), Cowboys, 1975-81
    Tom Landry - .750 (73-24-1), Cowboys, 1967-73
    George Allen - .750 (71-22-5), Rams/Redskins, 1967-73
    Bill Walsh - .716 (74-29-1), 49ers, 1981-87
    Mike Ditka - .712 (79-32), Bears, 1984-90

    Regular-season wins

    Seasons in parentheses. Note Dungy's win pct. is third on this list.
    328 - Don Shula (33), 328-156-6, .676
    318 - George Halas (40), 318-148-31, .671
    250 - Tom Landry (29), 250-162-6, .605
    226 - Curly Lambeau (33), 226-132-22, .624
    200 - Marty Schottenheimer (21), 200-126-1, .613
    193 - Chuck Noll (23), 193-148-1, .566
    190 - Dan Reeves (23), 190-165-2, .535
    186 - Chuck Knox (22), 186-147-1, .558
    172 - Bill Parcells (19), 172-130-1, .569
    166 - Paul Brown (21), 166-100-6, .621
    161 - Mike Holmgren (16), 161-111, .592
    158 - Bud Grant (18), 158-96-5, .620
    154 - Joe Gibbs (16), 154-94, .621
    151 - Steve Owen (23), 151-100-17, .595
    149 - Bill Cowher (15), 149-90-1, .623
    146 - Mike Shanahan (15), 146-98, .598
    143 - Marv Levy (17), 143-112, .561
    139 - Tony Dungy (13), 139-69, .668
    138 - Bill Belichick (14) 138-86, .616
    131 - Hank Stram (17), 131-97-10, .571
    130 - Weeb Ewbank (20), 130-129-7, .502


    Yea Dungy didnt do anything as a HC, it all has to do with PC run amuck!!

    No objective fan could possibly think Dungy was a great HC!!

    Sickness

    Good Grief!!!
    By those stats, Bud Grant was a great coach. He wasn't.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyStylez View Post
    He went to Seattle in the early 90's and his teams completely sucked. Much like George Seifert, he was not bigger than the sum of the parts. The talent propped him up, not the other way around.

    BTW there is no way in hell Bellichick is a better coach than Paul Brown or Joe Gibbs. I'd put BB at 11.
    When you win two Super Bowls with Jim Plunkett as your Quarterback, you're doing something right.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    By those stats, Bud Grant was a great coach. He wasn't.
    I'm not old enough to remember Bud Grant (I was about 5 when he stopped coaching). But, I don't recall many people thinking that Bud Grant wasn't a great coach. He is in the Pro Football HOF after all.

  12. #32
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    REX RYAN should be number 1.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by chirorob View Post
    How about Weeb Ewbank?

    Won titles with 2 different teams in 2 different leagues.
    Agreed on Weeb. In addition to SBIII, his big achievements were with the Unitas Colts in the late '50s.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    By those stats, Bud Grant was a great coach. He wasn't.
    Excellent point!!!

    However other knowlegable commentators on Grant disagree. For in point of fact there is an article that just came out less than three days ago on this very point. Lets look at it what it has to say shall we...


    http://www.dailynorseman.com/2013/5/...-rank-all-time


    "There are many people that discount Grant's accomplishments as a head coach simply because he never won a Super Bowl. Those people tend to be really ignorant and stupid, and possess very little actual football knowledge. The facts are that the Vikings won nearly two-thirds of their games with Grant on the sideline, and they won 11 divisional championships in 18 seasons. They also brought home one National Football League championship and three National Football Conference championships."

    Ummm somehow I am going to go with this writer and the football HOF on this one sport!!!!

    Good Grief!!!!
    Last edited by Charlie Brown; 05-24-2013 at 10:51 AM.

  15. #35
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    Vermeil, Levy, Dungy, and Marty Schottenheimer are Top 20 but no Dan Reeves?

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetrider View Post
    Vermeil, Levy, Dungy, and Marty Schottenheimer are Top 20 but no Dan Reeves?
    I agree and how about Jimmy Johnson!!!

    No way IMO Dungy is better than Johnson!!!!
    Last edited by Charlie Brown; 05-24-2013 at 10:59 AM.

  17. #37
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    If I was a former NFL coach, and I was asked to formulate a list of the top 20 NFL coaches of all time, I would include myself.

    The fact that Herm didn't, to me, indicates a certain lack of self-esteem, possibly even self-loathing. And the fact that he included his buddy Tony Dungy indicates to me that Herm has an inferiority complex.

    Herm needs to get back into coaching, and get himself on his own list.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Brown View Post
    I agree and how about Jimmy Johnson!!!

    No way IMO Dungy is better than Johnson!!!!
    Good point. I forgot all about Johnson.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Express View Post
    If I was a former NFL coach, and I was asked to formulate a list of the top 20 NFL coaches of all time, I would include myself.

    The fact that Herm didn't, to me, indicates a certain lack of self-esteem, possibly even self-loathing. And the fact that he included his buddy Tony Dungy indicates to me that Herm has an inferiority complex.

    Herm needs to get back into coaching, and get himself on his own list.
    I disagree. If anything, naming yourself is a sure sign of inferiority. Self promotion is a sure sign of insecurity. Your peers should speak on your behalf. You shouldn't need to draw attention to yourself in anything you do in life. If you do, you're asking to be recognized.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetrider View Post
    Vermeil, Levy, Dungy, and Marty Schottenheimer are Top 20 but no Dan Reeves?
    I think Reeves is hurt because he only won 1 division title (and wnet to the SB, admittedly) once he left Denver, there is a belief that Elway is the Reeves reason had success in Denver.

    Vermeil won divisons with 3 different teams and went to SB 2 different teams, like Reeves.

    I'm not sure what Reeves has done to make him a "higher ranked coach" then Levy.

    Schottenheimer is a really hard coach to rank. He's really an incredible regular season coach... but his playoff record is something you can't ignore. To be 4-6 at home in the playoffs is really unacceptable,and it's enough games to be a trend.

    Dungy, is dumped on for similar reasons as Reeves (He won because of Manning, Monte Kiffen built his defense). I'm not really sure the criticism is fair, since the Colts defense was significantly better when he came on and Manning had not won a playoff game in his 1st 4 seasons, until Dungy got there. At TB he really was the HC when the team rebuilt a broken franchise, but he was more successful the Reeves at Denver.

    Dungy does have a bit of the Schottenheimer issue (though he was 6-2 at home, and won a SB, but didn't go to a 2nd SB, which is the biggest mark against him).

    It's been said upthread some, but the guy that's ahead of Schottenheimer and should be here, IMO, is Holmgren. Maybe Cowher, who I think is overrated, but went to 2 Super Bowls and won 9 divisions in 15 years. 8-5 at home isn't great, but the SB run in 2006 pushed him ahead of Schottenheimer.
    Last edited by Batmans A Scientist; 05-24-2013 at 12:46 PM.

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