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Thread: Stop blaming the 2012 O line

  1. #1

    Stop blaming the 2012 O line

    I keep seeing comments about how bad our Offensive Line was last year when in reality people can't get the 2011 turnstile days out of their minds. Good article adding to PFF's #3 ranking of our O Line last year:

    Under Pressure: The Offensive Line and Mark Sanchez

    Written by Jason Astafan on 29 June 2013.







    The Jets offensive line lost two guards in the offseason, but picked up a couple veterans and multiple draftees in return. [Rob Foldy, USA TODAY Sports]
    Many are ready and willing to blame the offensive line for many of the woes experienced by the New York Jets in 2012. If the offensive line were better, they would have been able to keep quarterback Mark Sanchez upright, out of trouble, and his completion percentage would have been higher as a result.

    Well now, that’s not exactly the case at all. According to Pro Football Focus, the offensive line of the New York Jets has been ranked a top-5 offensive line in three of the last four years, with only 2011 seeing them ranked out of the top-10 (Wayne Hunter as starting right tackle and injuries to Nick Mangold made this possible.)

    2009 and 2010 saw the offensive line ranked as 1st in the league—the years the team made it to the AFC Championship game.
    As for 2012, after sorting out the right tackle situation and utilizing journeyman Austin Howard to replace Wayne Hunter, the team finished with the 3rd ranked offensive line in the league.

    So, if the offensive line was good last year, how is it that the quarterback play was so atrocious? Much of that has to do with the decision making of the quarterback, and for insight into the quarterback’s decision making, I think it’s important to look at how the quarterback handles pressure.

    By the Numbers
    If you take the time to look into a quarterback’s passing numbers under pressure, I feel that you can get a decent look into how well that quarterback makes decisions. Several questions need to be asked of a quarterback under pressure. How often is the quarterback pressured, what’s the quarterback’s completion percentage under pressure, and how often does the quarterback throw the ball away?

    According to Pro Football Focus, Mark Sanchez was pressured on 100 drop backs, or about 29% of his passing attempts, tied for 12th lowest in the league, with Houston’s Matt Schaub. However, despite facing such a low amount of pressure, Sanchez is the most inaccurate quarterback in the league when encountering pressure, completing only 48% of his passes. For comparison, the league average for accuracy when facing pressure is 61%.

    More digging after the jump...
    For greater analysis, let’s compare Sanchez to the quarterback he’s tied with for pressure percentage, Texans quarterback Matt Schaub. That statline is where the similarities between the two end. When looking at the two key figures that would indicate a quarterback’s decision-making under pressure, throw-away percentage and sack percentage, one can see how the two differ immediately.

    Matt Schaub was sacked on 13% of his dropbacks, and threw the ball away when pressured 10.5% of the time. Sanchez, on the other hand, was sacked on 23% of his dropbacks and threw the ball away only 4% of the time. Schaub’s completion percentage under pressure was 66%, versus Sanchez’s league-worst 48.5%. Sanchez is obviously not Matt Schaub, and the Jets don’t have the offensive weapons that the Texans can boast, but I think it speaks volumes of a quarterback who’s willing to throw the ball away versus taking the sack and perhaps placing your team in a negative yardage situation.

    What does this mean?
    Despite having one of the better offensive lines in the league, Sanchez still managed to be ranked 28th for sack percentage in the league, and have a league-worst completion percentage when pressured. Could this be because of the lack of skill players on offense in 2012? Possibly. In an effort to search for open receivers he may have held the ball too long, resulting in a higher sack percentage and lower completion percentage.
    However, the fact that he chose to hold onto the ball and take the sack instead of throwing the ball away and perhaps saving his team some negative yardage, does not give me confidence in his decision making abilities. Will he do better under Mornhinweg’s offense? There are those who think that—yes he can thrive in such an offense. However after four years of Mark Sanchez under center, there are only so many times you can blame the offensive line for his mistakes.

  2. #2
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    Once Wayne Hunter was gone, most Jet Fans were not blaming the O line. In fact , Howard has a chance to be good

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by BRONX JET View Post
    Once Wayne Hunter was gone, most Jet Fans were not blaming the O line. In fact , Howard has a chance to be good
    If Howard can solidify the RT spot and Winters shows enough to start before the end of the year, the Jets should be set on the OL for several years.

    I don't know that the 2012 line was really 3rd in the league. One of the starters from that group is likely to be a backup with his new team, and another is still looking for work. But I think it's also pretty easy to point to RB and QB play as a driver of some of the perceived struggles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenWave View Post
    If Howard can solidify the RT spot and Winters shows enough to start before the end of the year, the Jets should be set on the OL for several years.

    I don't know that the 2012 line was really 3rd in the league. One of the starters from that group is likely to be a backup with his new team, and another is still looking for work. But I think it's also pretty easy to point to RB and QB play as a driver of some of the perceived struggles.
    3rd does seem a bit high. You can strongly argue we,are better at RB, WR, TE and OL than last year (may not be saying much). Now we cross our fingers at QB

  5. #5
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    you have to feel sorry for our OL in 2011 and 2012

    Having to try and block in front of the statistically worst QB in the NFL and watching him accomplish 26 picks and lost fumbles in 2011 and 25 picks and lost fumbles and one buttfumble in 2012 has to be a depressing environment to play in

    Playing in front of Smith in 2013 should yield a huge improvement in both OL and QB play for the Jets

  6. #6
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    We all know we have gotten terrible QB play the past couple of years. But we also had no play makers on offense. Someone to keep the defense honest and back them off the LOS. That made everyone's job harder.

  7. #7
    The fact that the Jets were 26th in average yards per rush had an impact on this also. If the line played so good why was the rushing so bad? Part of that was on the RB's but part of that was on the line too.

    You had lots of bad things going on last year. A change of OC, the loss of Holmes and no real threat at WR, only so-so line play, a skittish quarterback afraid of being hurt. All these factors and more added up to a 6-10 season.


    You could argue that not a whole lot has been done to address these problems in the offseason either. We still don't have solid WR's, the RB's we picked up haven't been fulltime starters anywhere, we're not sure how our line is going to pan out just yet, our FB still can't block, and our TE's are who?

    If things go just right we might be competitive. If things go wrong we'll be one of the worst teams in the NFL. The line is part of that.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by billygreen View Post
    The fact that the Jets were 26th in average yards per rush had an impact on this also. If the line played so good why was the rushing so bad? Part of that was on the RB's but part of that was on the line too.

    You had lots of bad things going on last year. A change of OC, the loss of Holmes and no real threat at WR, only so-so line play, a skittish quarterback afraid of being hurt. All these factors and more added up to a 6-10 season.


    You could argue that not a whole lot has been done to address these problems in the offseason either. We still don't have solid WR's, the RB's we picked up haven't been fulltime starters anywhere, we're not sure how our line is going to pan out just yet, our FB still can't block, and our TE's are who?

    If things go just right we might be competitive. If things go wrong we'll be one of the worst teams in the NFL. The line is part of that.
    "If things go right=Smith"

    "If things go wrong=another year buttfumbled down the toilet"

  9. #9
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    The OL was fine once they FINALLY got rid of Hunter, that sorry sack!

    (assuming this is about Sanchez, just skimmed) Sanchez is the problem. The OL is solid.
    You really couldn't ask for much more.

  10. #10
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    Stop blaming the 2012 o-line???
    NO
    and you can't make me.

  11. #11
    Guys, we have lots of uncertainty here... significant uncertainty. Uncertainty at O-line, uncertainty at RB, uncertainty at WR, uncertainty at TE. The only things we're certain about is our starting QB isn't very good and our FB is terrible.


    That's a lot of uncertainty.


    Now let me ask you: Even with New England's recent problems at TE do they have all this kind of uncertainty to deal with this year? How about any of the better clubs in the NFL? Are they faced with all this uncertainty?


    I think we should keep our expectations very low and be very happy if things go our way. That's the kind of year this will be.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by billygreen View Post
    Guys, we have lots of uncertainty here... significant uncertainty. Uncertainty at O-line, uncertainty at RB, uncertainty at WR, uncertainty at TE. The only things we're certain about is our starting QB isn't very good and our FB is terrible.
    I agree that there is a lot of uncertainty on the offense, but can you tell me why you think Tommy Bohanon is terrible?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by MykePM View Post
    I agree that there is a lot of uncertainty on the offense, but can you tell me why you think Tommy Bohanon is terrible?
    last year, unbelievably, we were occasionally using the useless Timmy at FB. Tommy or just about any human being would be an upgrade over that

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman Harris View Post
    The OL was fine once they FINALLY got rid of Hunter, that sorry sack!

    (assuming this is about Sanchez, just skimmed) Sanchez is the problem. The OL is solid.
    You really couldn't ask for much more.
    NO the Jets oline gave up 48 sacks throwing the football the sixth less time in the NFl. They were the 28th rank offense in the NFl. They replaced two /fifths of the oline (if Oline was that good would that have happened or would the Oline coach had been replaced).

    Anyone who actually believes the Jets had the third ranked oline than you will probably believe just about anything. What next Sanchez is better than Joe Flacco and Eli Manning.
    Last edited by Raider9175; 07-01-2013 at 12:48 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raider9175 View Post
    NO the Jets oline gave up 48 sacks throwing the football the sixth less time in the NFl. They were the 28th rank offense in the NFl. They replaced two /fifths of the oline (if Oline was that good would that have happened).

    Anyone who actually believes the Jets had the third ranked oline than you will probably believe just about anything. What next Sanchez is better than Joe Flacco and Eli Manning.
    S
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raider9175 View Post
    NO the Jets oline gave up 48 sacks throwing the football the sixth less time in the NFl. They were the 28th rank offense in the NFl. They replaced two /fifths of the oline (if Oline was that good would that have happened).

    Anyone who actually believes the Jets had the third ranked oline than you will probably believe just about anything. What next Sanchez is better than Joe Flacco and Eli Manning.
    Good LORD you are a dumbass.

    And BTW- your sig is TOTALLY making fun of you. LOLZ!

  17. #17
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    I love when Raider90210 comes here, reads numbers or rankings and tells us we're so much worse. There's always a reason why. Didn't pass much, played bad defenses. Always the dumb ass explanation.

    And amazingly the opposite is always true with the Raiders. They're always much better than what the numbers say their units are.

    How does that always happen?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    I love when Raider90210 comes here, reads numbers or rankings and tells us we're so much worse. There's always a reason why. Didn't pass much, played bad defenses. Always the dumb ass explanation.

    And amazingly the opposite is always true with the Raiders. They're always much better than what the numbers say their units are.

    How does that always happen?
    Okay Do you honestly think that the Jets offense line was top ten even. There isn't anything you can point to to justify that ranking.(pulling team names out of a hat isn't the best way to judge the top olines) So just because the oline might have been the best thing going for the worse offense in all of football , doesn't mean it was any good. The numbers don't lie.

    Whats next your going to tell me the Butt fumble never happened either. Btw stay on topic as were talking about Jets oline bogus rankings.
    Last edited by Raider9175; 07-01-2013 at 01:01 PM.

  19. #19
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    Yeah the line was so good that Izdik let two of the starters walk, used two draft picks and signed two free agents. PFF isn't some supreme source of football analysis

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Raider9175 View Post
    NO the Jets oline gave up 48 sacks throwing the football the sixth less time in the NFl. They were the 28th rank offense in the NFl. They replaced two /fifths of the oline (if Oline was that good would that have happened or would the Oline coach had been replaced).

    Anyone who actually believes the Jets had the third ranked oline than you will probably believe just about anything. What next Sanchez is better than Joe Flacco and Eli Manning.
    No, but he is better than anything the Raiders have on their roster!!!
    Last edited by TebowCan'tThrow; 07-01-2013 at 01:36 PM.

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