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Thread: Could Sanchez Be Suffering From Unkown Injury? ***GOOGLE RESEARCH INVOLVED***

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Kentucky Jet View Post
    He never had a cannon for an arm. It was OK but not great. On occasion he got off a great pass with great velocity. But his feet had to be set properly. He does not do it nearly as much but he can still wing it when he sets his feet. I just do not think he is as talented as we all first thought! IMO he is incapable of picking up a team and bringing it to the finidsh line with any degree of consistency. He has happy feet and it ruins any chance of greatness , I think. His pocket presence is horrible too.
    I think he sucks to be honest. He doesn't have the fundamentals to adjust much in times of stress either. But I do think there is a chance (again no certainty, since it's not like I have access to his medical records or anything) that a shoulder injury could be part of the reason why he's regressed or just hasn't progressed at all. There are a litany of other reasons why he's horrible too, but the shoulder injury could be a dark horse reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by star95 View Post
    There was talk of him going under the knife during those off seasons of greeting some kind of scope done. But it is all is his head not arms at all. How do you explain having free rushers coming in at him all the time? He never throws his receivers open and when they are he never hits them.
    He definitely has his short comings, that's for sure. He's not great at picking up blitzes nor is he all that good at hot routes. But could his indecisiveness be partially caused by an injury where he lost velocity? Loss of velocity means he has to rely more on his football acumen, which might be lacking to begin with. It also forces him to adjust his mentality on the field, as WRs need to be MORE open for him to fit into a window at lesser velocity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath View Post
    He stinks. Stop driving yourself crazy trying to find reasons why. We have moved on and Geno will be the qb this year. Stop wasting time on Sanchez. We have turned the page and you should as well.
    I'm not a Sanchize guy at all, infact the whole thread originated when I was going to make a post about the difference of having a strong armed QB like Geno in the pocket and how it makes a difference for WRs and how it can open up windows that otherwise may not exist. But when I looked up velocity numbers at the combine, Sanchez rated out better, which surprised me, and spurred this thread. I think Geno wins the competition anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    the most damning thing to me is that his screen passes aren't even accurate. chad had a real weak arm but could still get those screens to his guys.

    the biggest issue with sanchez was that he was drafted way too high. if he played for a school like kansas he'd have been a 3rd or 4th rounder and nobody would be disappointed with his career arc, it would have been expected.
    Yeah, he's really not accurate to begin with, and sucks at screens. But he also wasn't that great at screens at USC either I believe. I think Sanchez benefited from having stud talent and OL around him at USC, which gave him all the time in the world. A lot of the highlights he had, he was just rolling around in the pocket or rolling out of the pocket without a lot of pressure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kotch View Post
    The "bum shoulder" theory doesn't explain Sanchez's inability to diagnose the pass rush pre-snap, nor does it justify his failing to see open receivers down field.

    Ergo, it isn't the problem.
    Well I'm not saying this is his only problem nor that getting his shoulder fixed will turn him into Brees. He has plenty of shortcomings in other areas. My whole point is that, the shoulder injury and the decline in velocity could be a reason as to why he's failed to improve and why he may never reach the potential he had being the top 5 pick, because his main tool isn't the same as it was before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Savage69 View Post
    Chaddy cakes pass got a ticket for going too slow in the fast pass lane..
    I think a few guys didn't even bother throwing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vinny Testaverde's Niece View Post
    You can't separate physical and mental issues the way people are trying to do in this thread. If you lose physical ability you lose confidence along with it, and try to compensate. Accuracy can suffer. There is little doubt that Mark's arm got injured and we can probably pinpoint the games- there have been steady whispers about it - the Jaguar game where the team was winning and he should have been benched, and the Baltimore game where Ngata speared him. Wayne Hunter should never have been 'protecting' a franchise QB.
    Exactly, I think physical ailments can wreck havoc on mental aspects of the game. Similar to how players coming back from say ACL injuries at first are scared to cut, or knee injuries are scared to jump at first. But in their cases, the problem is fixed, so it's just a matter of getting re-acclimated. But if the injury isn't fixed, and he knows he can't just zip it in like he was able to in the past maybe, then he's going to be gun shy. There is going to be indecisiveness and confusion. You then throw in his inability to read defenses properly, limited accuracy to begin with, and you have one of the worst QBs in the game. And these are traits that we do see from him. We know his velocity isn't nearly the same, so there has to be consequences of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RIJetFan View Post
    Maybe he hurt his arm doing that stupid velocity test. His problem has always been accuracy but I suppose a labrum injury could contribute to that as well.
    I think it plays a part to be honest. I think sometimes he tries to throw the ball too hard and costs himself accuracy. A lot of his throws where he has to zip into an area tend to sail down or up, an indication of overthrowing.

    Quote Originally Posted by njherdfan View Post
    I've never thought that his arm was the problem. When he has a perfect pocket and he can step into his throws, his arm is as good as anyone's. The problem is when he has to move his feet or make any kind of adjustment, his fundamentals are so bad that he throws ducks.
    I think his arm was close to as good as anyone, but I don't think it's the case anymore. Especially at TC, because in these drills, he should be able to step up perfectly fine, but his arm lags behind Geno's by a noticeable margin according to most reports.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vinny Testaverde's Niece View Post
    Of course an injury will affect accuracy. We need not look any further than the end of Favre's season here after he got hurt and didn't tell anyone.
    Yeah that's another example of an injury affecting accuracy and velocity. Although, I don't think it was a cartilage tear with him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    He's not hurt.

    He's simply inaccurate.

    He's also immoble, unaware in the pocket, makes poor decisions and naturally throws a slow lazy ball professional defenders find very easy to pick off. Oh, and he apparently greases his fingers with butter before every game for some crazy fumble-causing reason.

    No excuses. If he sucks, he's should be gone. If he's hurt, he should be gone. Same deal either way.
    He definitely has his shortcomings and he's most likely gone after the season anyway. But I do think part of the decline is from the injury to his shoulder. It exasperates a lot of his problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    Sanchez must be the greatest QB talent ever.

    To read here hes:

    Lived through Shotty. Not his fault he sucked.

    Lived through Sporano. Not his fault he sucked.

    2 systems in 4 years. Not his fault he sucked.

    Rex only sits in on D meeting. Not his fault he sucked.

    Didn't have competition. Not his fault he sucked.

    Had Tebow on roster. Not his fault he sucked.

    WRs the past year sucked. Not his fault he sucked.

    Was coddled. Not his fault he sucked.

    Has been playing injured. Not his fault he sucked.
    There are a ton of excuses for him, but a lot of them are truly just excuses because there is no tangible proof to prove otherwise.

    Schotty went to Bradford, and he improved, so that's a terrible excuse. Tebow one is stupid. Competition one is stupid as well.

    But him being injured and it costing him velocity does have circumstantial evidence. His velocity went from above average to below average, accuracy is lacking, and he's gun shy. All of this can be explained partially by the injury. And there is confirmed reports that he does have a tear in his shoulder, so it's not even speculative about the injury itself. Some of his shortcomings can be interpolated to a shoulder injury.

    I think some in the thread are taking it in the wrong way, as if I'm arguing or making excuses for Sanchez. I don't think he will be the QB and I think he's most likely a backup in the future as well. But, rather than just say he sucks, I think there are credible reasons for him falling off the perch he was on, when he was drafted. I don't think he just woke up one day and didn't know how to play football. I think an injury, combined with his lack of maturity or dedication, added with his limited skills in other aspects of the game contributed to his downfall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dunnie View Post
    This is a well thought out theory ... he has not been the same since the ravens game where he got pummeled ...
    Thanks. Yeah, there is a definite downgrade in his primary skill set, which an injury would explain. I'm not saying let's give him another shot or a medal for playing through injury. But rather than just completely hate the guy, I think the hard hits and injuries took a toll on him.

    For as much as I dislike him for his horrible play, the guy did tough it out as much as he could, and came back after a lot of nasty hits.

    Quote Originally Posted by kdelgado View Post
    Interesting. Regardless of some people in this thread the theory you present has logic behind it. There were moments in his career that he didn't return from and they were physical rather than mental. That Ravens game, he was terrible but he also got crushed. He pinched a nerve, against Jacksonville and I remember thinking that the way he throws long balls looked different after.

    Last year if you watch the bombs he would throw, what once were on a rope darts were now rainbows. It wouldn't surprise me if some damage was revealed post career.

    That said clearly he didn't have the mind to try and get tested or adjust his game. Also he's always inaccurate.
    Thanks. Yeah, I do think those hits could've played a part with the injuries.

    Best example I can think of would be the long TD to Edwards in the Colts playoff game in '09. If you watch it, he pumpfaked and then threw it off his backfoot and hit Edwards in stride like 40+ yards down the field. But if you look at the passes that got intercepted by Peterson in the Arizona game, and the pass that got intercepted by the Pats CB (forgot his name) where Hill was wide open in the end zone, they had a ton of air under it and it just seemed to hang up there forever. I think in both cases, if his shoulder was at 2009 level, there is a much better shot he completes those passes. It still might mean he's a league average QB AT BEST, but I don't think he would've been one of, if not the, worst QB in the league.

    As for those who responded, I think this thread would've gone a bit better if I titled it Anatomy of Failure or something. I think the message that I was trying to get across was lost on some, and misinterpreted as me making excuses for Sanchez. I just wanted to throw out a theory explaining why Sanchez declined that had some proof behind it. Even if it's true, he's never really going to play at a high level for the Jets, because a surgery will knock him out for a year, and the Jets will move on before he comes back. It's not an argument to get Sanchez another shot, just an explanation on my part as to why I think an injury caused him to regress.

  2. #22
    JetsInsider.com Legend
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    The only thing hurt has been the hopes and dreams of Jets fans. And even Dr. Andrews can't fix dat!

  3. #23
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    I thought your thread title was too horrible. Normal horrible can be refreshing for a moment...but...omg.

    Nice job on the thread, though.

  4. #24
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    why are you all so hard headed? how many times do I have to tell you all

    Mark Sanchez time as a Jet QB is finish,fini, over, done, kaput, out.

    THE END.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by jetstream23 View Post
    The only thing hurt has been the hopes and dreams of Jets fans. And even Dr. Andrews can't fix dat!
    Lol, that's true. Probably some irreparable remotes and TV screens too.

    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    I thought your thread title was too horrible. Normal horrible can be refreshing for a moment...but...omg.

    Nice job on the thread, though.
    Thanks. I think someone edited the title, the original was Mark Sanchez- Injured?. Not sure who edited it though. But I figured they did it because maybe it was misleading as to people thinking maybe Sanchez got injured last night or something. A better one probably would've been Anatomy of Failure: Sanchez. Or something to that effect, but it was too early in the morning and I had written way more than I had intended to at that point, lol.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by njherdfan View Post
    I've never thought that his arm was the problem. When he has a perfect pocket and he can step into his throws, his arm is as good as anyone's. The problem is when he has to move his feet or make any kind of adjustment, his fundamentals are so bad that he throws ducks.
    Pretty much this, which is sad because they were never an issue upon his entering the league. His exaggerated stance when throwing the ball is taking away any torquing his hips could provide in throwing the ball, to say nothing of how it lowers his height, increases his release point and doesn't allow for any kind of shifting in the pocket, all of which makes for an inaccurate, turnover-prone QB. IMHO, that falls squarely in the lap of the QB coach (and the QB), so hopefully Lee can get some of that hashed out to where Sanchez will be a viable starter for the near future.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    Sanchez must be the greatest QB talent ever.

    To read here hes:

    Lived through Shotty. Not his fault he sucked.

    Lived through Sporano. Not his fault he sucked.

    2 systems in 4 years. Not his fault he sucked.

    Rex only sits in on D meeting. Not his fault he sucked.

    Didn't have competition. Not his fault he sucked.

    Had Tebow on roster. Not his fault he sucked.

    WRs the past year sucked. Not his fault he sucked.

    Was coddled. Not his fault he sucked.

    Has been playing injured. Not his fault he sucked.
    Schotty was bad, Sparano was worse and Cavanaugh completely abysmal. To deny any of that is foolhardy, imho. That doesn't mean Sanchez gets a free pass, just that there's mitigating circumstances. It's when the two get painted as being mutually exclusive of each other that problems arise. Your post is the perfect example of that. It's not an all/none argument, just like there isn't an all/none solution, Geno Smith cheerleading notwithstanding.

  7. #27
    Sanchez has an injury above his neck

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Win4ever View Post
    Lol, that's true. Probably some irreparable remotes and TV screens too.



    Thanks. I think someone edited the title, the original was Mark Sanchez- Injured?. Not sure who edited it though. But I figured they did it because maybe it was misleading as to people thinking maybe Sanchez got injured last night or something. A better one probably would've been Anatomy of Failure: Sanchez. Or something to that effect, but it was too early in the morning and I had written way more than I had intended to at that point, lol.
    I edited the title since you could not.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisjets23 View Post
    Sanchez has an injury above his neck
    LOL

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisjets23 View Post
    Sanchez has an injury above his neck
    Lol, possibly.

    Although kidding aside, I felt like he has atleast one or two concussions that he hid just from watching games.

    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    I edited the title since you could not.
    Ah I see. Yeah, was wondering who edited it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetworks View Post

    Schotty was bad, Sparano was worse and Cavanaugh completely abysmal. To deny any of that is foolhardy, imho. That doesn't mean Sanchez gets a free pass, just that there's mitigating circumstances. It's when the two get painted as being mutually exclusive of each other that problems arise. Your post is the perfect example of that. It's not an all/none argument, just like there isn't an all/none solution, Geno Smith cheerleading notwithstanding.
    Yeah the Sanchez disaster is a lot of things going wrong at once, and it culminates in one of the worst QBs in the league. I doubt any one thing caused it, but when things pile on, even the foundation can collapse.

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