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Thread: My evaluation of Sanchez...

  1. #1
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    My evaluation of Sanchez...

    As I mentioned in KRL's thread, Sanchez should be evaluated for the complete body of work, under MM, for the first two games, which overall, has been a dramatic improvement, with what we've seen in the last two years.

    Sanchez’s aggregate from two preseason games — 23 of 36 (63.9 percent), 2 interceptions and 2 touchdowns — reflects a quarterback whose accuracy has flourished in the offensive system espoused by the new offensive coordinator, Marty Mornhinweg, but who also remains just as likely to commit a costly mistake, as he did last season, or the season before that.

    Perhaps that will never change about Sanchez, but that is what the Jets are evaluating and will eventually consider as they determine who will start their Sept. 8 season opener against Tampa Bay.
    He's worked about a full game, 23-36, 294 yds, 2 TD's 2 INT's...

    While everyone will only focus on his mistakes, I think he has ALSO shown areas of improvement, and at lease SOME fight for the job, to improve, show that he can fight through fan outrage, and does seem to be progressing well in MM's new offense.

    The irony, last night's game, Sanchez started fast, had a great first quarter, then had a poor 2nd quarter, especially the end of the 2nd quarter. So after last week, when Sanchez had the poor start against Detroit, everybody wanted to instead ignore his 10-13, 125 yd performance, but only focus on the bad start and the INT. Last night, he started off great, and had a lull at the mid point and end of the 2nd quarter, before given a chance to rebound in the 3rd quarter, and once again responded favorably.

    I loved the work and fire he showed on the TD drive, the TD to Cumberland, made great reads, threaded several nice passes, and made very good decisions.

    He made some good decisions on screen plays or on plays that didn't evolve well where there wasn't anything available, and he threw the ball into the dirt, good plays, good decisions, good work

    The 2nd quarter, obviously a different story, off of the fumble recovery, that is just inexcusable. I can defend Sanchez, but not for that, he needs to make better decisions, there were several, he tried to hard to make plays without throwing the ball, I felt he held himself back on a play where had he not gave up and tried to run, he would have had Gates in the back of the EZ for a TD, I can see he's battling himself, to improve on what he's done wrong in the past, but is still not doing the right thing, rushing plays, and not letting them develop, or not rushing plays, not making quick decisions.

    The play where he tucks and runs, he should have extended that just a bit more, for the TD to Gates, he's got t see there is one defender, having to decide on the RB/FB (think it was Bohanon in the flat, and then Gates running a round in the back of the EZ. Then on the final play with 6 secs left, he's got to make a quick decision, see what the defense is giving him, after snap, and see that he has nothing, throw the ball into the ground and have MM give him another play to call, change things up. That series of plays bothered me the most, that and the INT on a bad decision.

    But aside from the end of the 2nd half, and the INT, Sanchez played some of his best ball. It is really a tale of multiple ups, and some downs, the ups were good, and the several downs were bad.

    But taking a step back, understanding that this is the pre-season, a new offense, still working with new players and without key players in Holmes, and not playing with Edwards until the 2nd half, I thought Sanchez overall was pretty good. I realize fans will over dissect the bad plays, but we really should be evaluating the ENTIRE performance, understand that this is pre-season, the team as a whole are working through kinks, timing, and synergy of a new offense.

    Geno DOES deserve HIS shot next week, no question, but he really has to play well, and very well to win the job, otherwise, let him learn, I still think, as of RIGHT now, Sanchez has done enough, and has shown progress to win the job, he's shown flashes of being able to bounce back, despite the negative plays, let's see how he progresses through these lapses under MM and Lee, that is the key, fans won't acknowledge this, especially the Sanchez haters, but I do think Sanchez made positive steps overall, despite the few lapses.

    The key here again, how does Sanchez respond to MM and Lee coaching him through these mistakes, on tape, seeing what Sanchez did wrong and how MM and Lee make their corrections, and how Sanchez responds to those corrections and how he can progress from them under MM and Lee.
    Last edited by Ray Ray19; 08-18-2013 at 02:34 PM.

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    "Dramatic improvement"? Sanchez has looked average in two games facing arguably the two worst secondaries (though the Jets ' putrid secondary may have them beat) in the entire NFL. Our receivers are not as bad as the media made them out to be Hill looks good, Edwards and Winslow are serviceable, Cumby looks good and Kerley is Kerley. If we had a real QB we might actually have a shot at being decent this season but Sanchez is going to be benched by week 3 and we will already be in the hole.

    Bench Sanchez and see what Geno and/or Matt Simms can do - not talking preseason I'm talking regular season too. And sign some DB's so our secondary doesn't wind up being a total embarassment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    As I mentioned in KRL's thread, Sanchez should be evaluated for the complete body of work, under MM, for the first two games, which overall, has been a dramatic improvement, with what we've seen in the last two years.



    He's worked about a full game, 23-36, 294 yds, 2 TD's 2 INT's...

    While everyone will only focus on his mistakes, I think he has ALSO shown areas of improvement, and at lease SOME fight for the job, to improve, show that he can fight through fan outrage, and does seem to be progressing well in MM's new offense.

    The irony, last night's game, Sanchez started fast, had a great first quarter, then had a poor 2nd quarter, especially the end of the 2nd quarter. So after last week, when Sanchez had the poor start against Detroit, everybody wanted to instead ignore his 10-13, 125 yd performance, but only focus on the bad start and the INT. Last night, he started off great, and had a lull at the mid point and end of the 2nd quarter, before given a chance to rebound in the 3rd quarter, and once again responded favorably.

    I loved the work and fire he showed on the TD drive, the TD to Cumberland, made great reads, threaded several nice passes, and made very good decisions.

    He made some good decisions on screen plays or on plays that didn't evolve well where there wasn't anything available, and he threw the ball into the dirt, good plays, good decisions, good work

    The 2nd quarter, obviously a different story, off of the fumble recovery, that is just inexcusable. I can defend Sanchez, but not for that, he needs to make better decisions, there were several, he tried to hard to make plays without throwing the ball, I felt he held himself back on a play where had he not gave up and tried to run, he would have had Gates in the back of the EZ for a TD, I can see he's battling himself, to improve on what he's done wrong in the past, but is still not doing the right thing, rushing plays, and not letting them develop, or not rushing plays, not making quick decisions.

    The play where he tucks and runs, he should have extended that just a bit more, for the TD to Gates, he's got t see there is one defender, having to decide on the RB/FB (think it was Bohanon in the flat, and then Gates running a round in the back of the EZ. Then on the final play with 6 secs left, he's got to make a quick decision, see what the defense is giving him, after snap, and see that he has nothing, throw the ball into the ground and have MM give him another play to call, change things up. That series of plays bothered me the most, that and the INT on a bad decision.

    But aside from the end of the 2nd half, and the INT, Sanchez played some of his best ball. It is really a tale of multiple ups, and some downs, the ups were good, and the several downs were bad.

    But taking a step back, understanding that this is the pre-season, a new offense, still working with new players and without key players in Holmes, and not playing with Edwards until the 2nd half, I thought Sanchez overall was pretty good. I realize fans will over dissect the bad plays, but we really should be evaluating the ENTIRE performance, understand that this is pre-season, the team as a whole are working through kinks, timing, and synergy of a new offense.

    Geno DOES deserve HIS shot next week, no question, but he really has to play well, and very well to win the job, otherwise, let him learn, I still think, as of RIGHT now, Sanchez has done enough, and has shown progress to win the job, he's shown flashes of being able to bounce back, despite the negative plays, let's see how he progresses through these lapses under MM and Lee, that is the key, fans won't acknowledge this, especially the Sanchez haters, but I do think Sanchez made positive steps overall, despite the few lapses.

    The key here again, how does Sanchez respond to MM and Lee coaching him through these mistakes, on tape, seeing what Sanchez did wrong and how MM and Lee make their corrections, and how Sanchez responds to those corrections and how he can progress from them under MM and Lee.
    He's simply just below average QB whose ceiling is just mediocrity. 2td and 2 picks in his 5th preseason is NOT GOOD. Those are Rookie numbers.

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    tl;dr: Sanchez looked good, despite a few bad plays, and should win the starting job.

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    I was rooting for Sanchez to seize the job last night......he didn't do it.


    Now the ball is in Geno's court.....he'll have the same opportunity to get the job next week. Lets hope he can. I fear he won't, so it will be Sanchez' job come week 1

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    Quote Originally Posted by bman View Post
    He's simply just below average QB whose ceiling is just mediocrity. 2td and 2 picks in his 5th preseason is NOT GOOD. Those are Rookie numbers.
    Against the only two Secondaries in the nfl that are worse than the Jets. Sanchez is what he is a decent at best game manager who will turn the ball over no matter. Time to move on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    As I mentioned in KRL's thread, Sanchez should be evaluated for the complete body of work, under MM, for the first two games, which overall, has been a dramatic improvement, with what we've seen in the last two years.
    1) Stepping in dog **** everyday for the next 2 years would be better than the last 2 years of Sanchez's work

    2) Dramatic improvement? You mean from the 36th best QB in football to the 32nd best? What have you been watching?

    3) Unbelievable. Lock, dump, ban, whatever now. This thread will not end well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post
    As I mentioned in KRL's thread, Sanchez should be evaluated for the complete body of work, under MM, for the first two games, which overall, has been a dramatic improvement, with what we've seen in the last two years.



    He's worked about a full game, 23-36, 294 yds, 2 TD's 2 INT's...

    While everyone will only focus on his mistakes, I think he has ALSO shown areas of improvement, and at lease SOME fight for the job, to improve, show that he can fight through fan outrage, and does seem to be progressing well in MM's new offense.

    The irony, last night's game, Sanchez started fast, had a great first quarter, then had a poor 2nd quarter, especially the end of the 2nd quarter. So after last week, when Sanchez had the poor start against Detroit, everybody wanted to instead ignore his 10-13, 125 yd performance, but only focus on the bad start and the INT. Last night, he started off great, and had a lull at the mid point and end of the 2nd quarter, before given a chance to rebound in the 3rd quarter, and once again responded favorably.

    I loved the work and fire he showed on the TD drive, the TD to Cumberland, made great reads, threaded several nice passes, and made very good decisions.

    He made some good decisions on screen plays or on plays that didn't evolve well where there wasn't anything available, and he threw the ball into the dirt, good plays, good decisions, good work

    The 2nd quarter, obviously a different story, off of the fumble recovery, that is just inexcusable. I can defend Sanchez, but not for that, he needs to make better decisions, there were several, he tried to hard to make plays without throwing the ball, I felt he held himself back on a play where had he not gave up and tried to run, he would have had Gates in the back of the EZ for a TD, I can see he's battling himself, to improve on what he's done wrong in the past, but is still not doing the right thing, rushing plays, and not letting them develop, or not rushing plays, not making quick decisions.

    The play where he tucks and runs, he should have extended that just a bit more, for the TD to Gates, he's got t see there is one defender, having to decide on the RB/FB (think it was Bohanon in the flat, and then Gates running a round in the back of the EZ. Then on the final play with 6 secs left, he's got to make a quick decision, see what the defense is giving him, after snap, and see that he has nothing, throw the ball into the ground and have MM give him another play to call, change things up. That series of plays bothered me the most, that and the INT on a bad decision.

    But aside from the end of the 2nd half, and the INT, Sanchez played some of his best ball. It is really a tale of multiple ups, and some downs, the ups were good, and the several downs were bad.

    But taking a step back, understanding that this is the pre-season, a new offense, still working with new players and without key players in Holmes, and not playing with Edwards until the 2nd half, I thought Sanchez overall was pretty good. I realize fans will over dissect the bad plays, but we really should be evaluating the ENTIRE performance, understand that this is pre-season, the team as a whole are working through kinks, timing, and synergy of a new offense.

    Geno DOES deserve HIS shot next week, no question, but he really has to play well, and very well to win the job, otherwise, let him learn, I still think, as of RIGHT now, Sanchez has done enough, and has shown progress to win the job, he's shown flashes of being able to bounce back, despite the negative plays, let's see how he progresses through these lapses under MM and Lee, that is the key, fans won't acknowledge this, especially the Sanchez haters, but I do think Sanchez made positive steps overall, despite the few lapses.

    The key here again, how does Sanchez respond to MM and Lee coaching him through these mistakes, on tape, seeing what Sanchez did wrong and how MM and Lee make their corrections, and how Sanchez responds to those corrections and how he can progress from them under MM and Lee.
    I'll buy some of that.

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    He definitely seems to have improved his accuracy and thus his yardage totals (or at the very least MM has put him in a better position to succeed and given him easier looks.) I expected he'd improve under MM who obviously knows how to develop a passing game.

    That said, KRL's post still points out the obvious -- that his biggest weakness is still devastating ill timed turnoevers and he still seems to be making those.

    I still hope Geno seizes the job but if he's not playing better than Sanchez is playing now I'm coming around to the idea of letting him carry a clipboard for awhile. Frankly the offensive line play, running game, and defense in the preseason have tempered my expectations on the whole enough that I'm thinking a bit longer term anyway.

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    I just want to ask one question, as I know you are arguably the biggest sanchez supporter out there.

    You say the "good" that he has shown. Both TDs to Cumberland were where he was WIDE open (and in one case the defender fell down). The throw to Kerley in Detroit (one of his other top 5 or so best plays so far) the defender fell down. He had a nice throw to braylon last night (caught over his head) and one completion to braylon that was an awful throw that braylon basically caught off his feet.

    After being under quite a bit of pressure in detroit, he was virtually untouched except for one sack last night, which he held the ball for 5.5 seconds (yes I rewound the tv and counted).

    So my question is this - havent we lowered the bar way too much for a true starting caliber NFL QB, to say that he "played well" when all he did was hit a few wide open receivers from a clean pocket? Even third stringers in the NFL are the absolute TOP of their profession, and should be able to hit cumberland on both of those routes in their sleep.

    I hear ya about dissecting the negative plays, but what about praising mediocrity?

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    I am one to be critical of Sanchez the past 2 years especially last year, but I think we should give credit where credit is due...His accuracy is MUCH improved. His decision making at times is suspect, but overall I think he played pretty well. I don't care how horrible the secondary he played was. Its funny when he throws a pick Sanchez haters say he sucks, then when leads a TD drive its against a bad secondary.......

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    Sanchez did look sharper in his passes and decision making in quite a few drives. Let's hope we can win a few games with his INTs. They don't have to be killers but we need to see steady improvement or the season will be lost.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bman View Post
    He's simply just below average QB whose ceiling is just mediocrity. 2td and 2 picks in his 5th preseason is NOT GOOD. Those are Rookie numbers.
    This is what most analysts are saying as well. He is way below average..... I.e. 34 th ranked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    I just want to ask one question, as I know you are arguably the biggest sanchez supporter out there.

    You say the "good" that he has shown. Both TDs to Cumberland were where he was WIDE open (and in one case the defender fell down). The throw to Kerley in Detroit (one of his other top 5 or so best plays so far) the defender fell down. He had a nice throw to braylon last night (caught over his head) and one completion to braylon that was an awful throw that braylon basically caught off his feet.

    After being under quite a bit of pressure in detroit, he was virtually untouched except for one sack last night, which he held the ball for 5.5 seconds (yes I rewound the tv and counted).

    So my question is this - havent we lowered the bar way too much for a true starting caliber NFL QB, to say that he "played well" when all he did was hit a few wide open receivers from a clean pocket? Even third stringers in the NFL are the absolute TOP of their profession, and should be able to hit cumberland on both of those routes in their sleep.

    I hear ya about dissecting the negative plays, but what about praising mediocrity?
    So Sanchez should apologize for Cumberland being wide open? What about when Pats have WR's open all over the field and Brady doesn't get touched should Brady apologize for that too ? I dont get your point...ever QB has bad throws the WR's get paid the catch the ball and make tough catches too....You can look at it as praising mediocrity...but I look at it as improvement

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfine350z View Post
    I am one to be critical of Sanchez the past 2 years especially last year, but I think we should give credit where credit is due...His accuracy is MUCH improved. His decision making at times is suspect, but overall I think he played pretty well. I don't care how horrible the secondary he played was. Its funny when he throws a pick Sanchez haters say he sucks, then when leads a TD drive its against a bad secondary.......
    I agree. I don't get some of these criticisms -- if he completes a long TD some posters can only say "the guy was wide open" or "that defense sucks." Well he made a smart decision and good throw based in our offense (which finally seems to have an OC who knows how to develop a passing game.) I don't see why that criticism has any validity.

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    I was really impressed the way he started the game. Confident, sharp, on target. The he Sanchezed it up. The INT was bad, but what really bothered me was his inability to get a TD from the 3 yard line after the turnover. On that 3rd down when the clock expired he had absolutely no awareness. In short, he looked like a rookie. The dude is just way too inconsistent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    I just want to ask one question, as I know you are arguably the biggest sanchez supporter out there.

    You say the "good" that he has shown. Both TDs to Cumberland were where he was WIDE open (and in one case the defender fell down). The throw to Kerley in Detroit (one of his other top 5 or so best plays so far) the defender fell down. He had a nice throw to braylon last night (caught over his head) and one completion to braylon that was an awful throw that braylon basically caught off his feet.
    So what if the receiver was wide-open, isn't the job of the QB to find the right guy in the play, make the right read and find the wide open play? How could anybody kill Sanchez for doing that? I mean jeez, now you're just looking for crap to throw at him. What about the pass to Hill on the opening drive, he threw that ball on a rope, threaded it between 3 defenders and put it where only Hill can make a play, why doesn't he get credit for a throw like that? I acknowledged some of his mistakes, willing to accept not every pass was well thrown, he did make some bad throws, but c'mon, be fair.

    After being under quite a bit of pressure in detroit, he was virtually untouched except for one sack last night, which he held the ball for 5.5 seconds (yes I rewound the tv and counted).

    So my question is this - havent we lowered the bar way too much for a true starting caliber NFL QB, to say that he "played well" when all he did was hit a few wide open receivers from a clean pocket? Even third stringers in the NFL are the absolute TOP of their profession, and should be able to hit cumberland on both of those routes in their sleep.

    I hear ya about dissecting the negative plays, but what about praising mediocrity?
    I offered an opinion on his overall performance, good and bad, it hasn't been all perfect, but can we not let him try to correct these mistakes? Is this not the pre-season? Is this not a new offense, a new OC in MM a new QB coach in Lee? Can we not give Sanchez a chance to work through this, just like every other QB in the league is doing in the pre-season? Is every QB across the league on top of their game? Have they all come out and performed in mid-season form, even the GOOD QB's of the league in the pre-season? By highlighting Sanchez' stats, should we NOT give CREDIT to Sanchez for putting up GOOD stats, EVEN in the pre-season, where most QB's are NOT doing this?

    AGAIN, Sanchez HAS made mistakes, he made brutal mistakes at the end of the 2nd QTR yesterday, I acknowledge this, but why can't we evaluate everything, and why can we not be fair and understand that this is STILL the pre-season, and a new offense, and give Sanchez a chance to respond under MM? The key here being, new offense, new OC and QB coach, I want to see if Sanchez can build on what he has done, and progress the right way.

    That said, I'm ready for Geno to get his chance, no problem, I full accept this, looking forward to it even, hoping he comes out like gangbusters next week, but be FAIR, remove your hate and remembrance of the last two years, forget last year, evaluate Sanchez on these last two games as if you never saw him play before, that is how we SHOULD be evaluating him to SOME degree, new offense, new OC, new QB coach, pre-season!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonhomme Richard View Post
    I was really impressed the way he started the game. Confident, sharp, on target. The he Sanchezed it up. The INT was bad, but what really bothered me was his inability to get a TD from the 3 yard line after the turnover. On that 3rd down when the clock expired he had absolutely no awareness. In short, he looked like a rookie. The dude is just way too inconsistent.
    +1

    That was worse. INTs happen every now and then, but the failure to score from the 3 was inexcusable.

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    Sanchez sucks, end of story

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    Sanchez, when he is on, is a decent QB....however, it seems as though he is his own worst enemy and kills drives, confidence and morale so quickly. I keep asking myself, what do i need to see in Geno to justify the switch. I think I would be willing to see mediocrity with a potential for improvement (i.e., rookie learning the system) and ball security. If he starts against the Giants and plays like that, I would want him to be our starter. The turnovers kill me.

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