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Thread: Obamacare's winners and losers

  1. #1
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    Obamacare's winners and losers

    I thought this article pretty much sums up the liberal view on everything. It was fine as long as someone else had to pay the bill.

    My favorite quote:"Of course, I want people to have health care," Vinson said. "I just didn't realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally."

    http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_24248486/obamacares-winners-and-losers-bay-area#


    Obamacare's winners and losers in Bay Area

    Cindy Vinson and Tom Waschura are big believers in the Affordable Care Act. They vote independent and are proud to say they helped elect and re-elect President Barack Obama.

    Yet, like many other Bay Area residents who pay for their own medical insurance, they were floored last week when they opened their bills: Their policies were being replaced with pricier plans that conform to all the requirements of the new health care law.

    Vinson, of San Jose, will pay $1,800 more a year for an individual policy, while Waschura, of Portola Valley, will cough up almost $10,000 more for insurance for his family of four.

    "Welcome to the club," said Robert Laszewksi, a prominent health care consultant and president of Health Policy and Strategy Associates in Virginia.For years, the nation has been embroiled in the political rhetoric of "Obamacare," but this past week the reality of the new law sank in as millions of Americans had their first good look at how the 3 1/2-year-old legislation will affect their pocketbooks.

    This much quickly became clear:
    As state- and federal-run health insurance exchanges debuted across the country offering a range of prices for different tiers of insurance coverage, the new online marketplaces -- which represent the centerpiece of Obamacare -- could greatly benefit more than 40 million Americans who now lack coverage. But an additional 16 million -- who buy individual health insurance policies on the open market -- are finding out that their plans may not comply with the new law, which requires 10 essential benefits such as maternity care, mental health care and prescription drug coverage.

    In California, 1.9 million people buy plans on the open market, according to officials with Covered California, the state's new health insurance exchange. And many of them are steaming mad.

    "There's going to be a number of people surprised" by their bills, said Jonathan Wu, a co-founder of ValuePenguin, a consumer finance website. "The upper-middle class are the people who are essentially being asked to foot the bill, and that's true across the country."

    Covered California spokesman Dana Howard maintained that in public presentations the exchange has always made clear that there will be winners and losers under Obamacare.

    "Some people will see an increase who are already on the individual market purchasing insurance," he said, "but most people will not."

    Covered California officials note that at least 570,000 of the 1.9 million people who buy their own insurance should be eligible for subsidies that will reduce their premiums.

    Even those who don't qualify for the tax subsidies could see their rates drop because Obamacare doesn't allow insurers to charge people more if they have pre-existing conditions such as diabetes and cancer, he said.

    People like Marilynn Gray-Raine.
    The 64-year-old Danville artist, who survived breast cancer, has purchased health insurance for herself for decades. She watched her Anthem Blue Cross monthly premiums rise from $317 in 2005 to $1,298 in 2013. But she found out last week from the Covered California site that her payments will drop to about $795 a month.
    But people with no pre-existing conditions like Vinson, a 60-year-old retired teacher, and Waschura, a 52-year-old self-employed engineer, are making up the difference.

    "I was laughing at Boehner -- until the mail came today," Waschura said, referring to House Speaker John Boehner, who is leading the Republican charge to defund Obamacare."I really don't like the Republican tactics, but at least now I can understand why they are so pissed about this. When you take $10,000 out of my family's pocket each year, that's otherwise disposable income or retirement savings that will not be going into our local economy."

    Both Vinson and Waschura have adjusted gross incomes greater than four times the federal poverty level -- the cutoff for a tax credit. And while both said they anticipated their rates would go up, they didn't realize they would rise so much.

    "Of course, I want people to have health care," Vinson said. "I just didn't realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally."

    A frustrated Vinson went on the Covered California site to see what she would pay for the same policy if she lived in Los Angeles or Sacramento. She discovered she would save at least $100 monthly.

    According to data compiled by ValuePenguin, Santa Clara County, San Mateo County, San Francisco as well as Santa Cruz, Monterey and San Benito counties have some of the highest health insurance rates in the state. Covered California officials say that in addition to the higher cost of living here, more hospitals in the Bay Area are owned by hospital groups that can demand higher rates because of the lack of competition.

    Not all of the sticker shock can be blamed on Obamacare.

    Health care inflation costs routinely increase at least 4 percent annually, said Ken Wood, a senior adviser for Covered California. Those increases, he noted, are due to an aging population and the rising costs of new medical technology and drugs, among other factors.

    But Wood, Wu and others also said premiums will rise as a result of people getting better insurance under the new law, which requires most Americans, with few exceptions, to buy health insurance no later than March 31, or pay a minimum $95 annual penalty.

    The law's intent is to cover people who are now uninsured by making insurance accessible to everybody. But that means rates will rise for many because sick and healthy people will now be charged the same premium.

    Adding a required list of 10 essential benefits to all plans is also significant. A study published last year in the journal Health Affairs said more than half of Americans who had individual insurance in 2010 were enrolled in plans that would not qualify because they didn't meet all the new requirements.

    Wood likened these mandates to the higher cost of buying cars today that must have safety features like air bags and anti-lock brakes.

    The law also will often make some policies more expensive because it limits out-of-pocket expenses to $6,350 annually for an individual and $12,700 for a family. In addition, the law restricts the minimum and maximum premiums that people can be charged based on their age.

    Now, a 64-year-old can be charged almost five times more than a 21-year-old. Beginning Jan. 1, it will be a 3-1 ratio.

    Those explanations, however, don't completely satisfy Waschura and Vinson.

    "I'm not against Obamacare," Waschura said. "It's just the initial shock. I'm holding out hope that there will be a correction over a handful of years."

    But to Gray-Raine, the breast cancer survivor from the East Bay, that correction has already come.

    "Obamacare is a huge step in the right direction for those of us without employer coverage," she said, adding that she hopes everyone will "join in and make this new legislation a success for all."

  2. #2
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    As a CPA....from what I can see early on from clients and their experiences is it sums up like this.


    Private sector workers and those self employed making between 50K and up are screwed.

    Generally if you work for the government you are exempt and there is no problem.

    The private sector middle class is getting hurt badly.

    That's what I see so far.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trades View Post
    I thought this article pretty much sums up the liberal view on everything. It was fine as long as someone else had to pay the bill.

    My favorite quote:"Of course, I want people to have health care," Vinson said. "I just didn't realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally."[URL="http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_24248486/obamacares-winners-and-losers-bay-area#"]
    In my experience, there are two types of people who deeply support social welfarism/redistribution/communism-lite.

    1. People who will personally benefit (or at worst, will not lose anything). I.e. the "screw the rich, make them pay!" types.

    2. A select group of the extremely rich or extremely well-educated, who despite having benefitted to a massive degree by their own skill and efforts, decide (after they've made it) that "everyone should share" and who support policies that redictribute mostly from the Middle-Class to the Lower-Middle-Class and Lower Class economicly. Mid-Grade Communism, High-Grade Capitalism.

    They're both easy to test.

    Ask a liberal student if they'd like to pay an extra $20,000 per year in student debt for school so 10 poor kids can also attend their school (where 2 of them will share their dorm room).

    Ask a Limo Liberal Professor at that same school if he'd accept $50,000/year and room and board in a standard student dorm, so the school could admit 10 poor children that otherwsie couldn't attend.

    Again, most supporters of collectivist policies only support them knowing they will not suffer personally, but cam hoist that suffering onto some group they dislike instead.

  4. #4
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    LOL. Are Nancy Pelosi's face lifts covered?

  5. #5
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    Wonder why my health care costs increased more per year prior to Obama.

    Must be magic.

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    She needs mental work, facelift on a ass still an ass.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Wonder why my health care costs increased more per year prior to Obama.

    Must be magic.
    Still waiting to hear how your signing up through your State exchange worked out, and what your personal savings from pre-ACA to post-ACA is projected to be.

    After all, given everything you've said over the years, I can only assume you've signed up, right? Big supporter of this that you are with an employment policy that was clearly not meeting your young families needs.

    You're going to be our resident expert on the ACA in practice, would be good to hear how the process has worked for you in real terms.

  8. #8
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    I'm just gonna pay the penalty fee every year.

    F*ck this noise

  9. #9
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    FROM a frined on FB. THIS is what Obamacare is doing to the self employed.


    I'm 53, in great health (as far as I know anyway). Just got my BCBS renewal. It went from $247.44/month to $486.42/month. That's a 96.7% increase. Plus my coverage dropped all the way to only 50% after I meet my deductible.

    Here are the reasons (and this is in writing - I quoted it verbatim) for the huge increase:
    1. No preferred rates based on gender or health status (so if I weighed 700 lbs, smoked, and had a life threatening job my premium would be the same)
    2. New essential health benefits
    3. Coverage available for everyone
    4. New taxes and fees

    Please forgive me if I'm having a hard time seeing the benefits of the "affordable" health care act.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Untouchable View Post
    I'm just gonna pay the penalty fee every year.

    F*ck this noise
    This is what I'm hearing from many people. Then, if a medical situation ever arises, just pick up insurance on the exchanges because you can't be turned down for any pre-existing conditions.

    Will this really work?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by parafly View Post
    This is what I'm hearing from many people. Then, if a medical situation ever arises, just pick up insurance on the exchanges because you can't be turned down for any pre-existing conditions.

    Will this really work?
    NO..the penalty will also be based as a percentage of income.

  12. #12
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    Cindy Vinson and Tom Waschura are big believers in the Affordable Care Act. They vote independent and are proud to say they helped elect and re-elect President Barack Obama.


    "I was laughing at Boehner -- until the mail came today," Waschura said, referring to House Speaker John Boehner, who is leading the Republican charge to defund Obamacare."I really don't like the Republican tactics, but at least now I can understand why they are so pissed about this. When you take $10,000 out of my family's pocket each year, that's otherwise disposable income or retirement savings that will not be going into our local economy."



    "Of course, I want people to have health care," Vinson said. "I just didn't realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally."


    1. Oh, now you get it. Why? Because before this, you believed Dem bullsh1t?
    2. Both of you can GFY.

    azzholes. serves them right for being gullible dooshes

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by quantum View Post
    Cindy Vinson and Tom Waschura are big believers in the Affordable Care Act. They vote independent and are proud to say they helped elect and re-elect President Barack Obama.


    "I was laughing at Boehner -- until the mail came today," Waschura said, referring to House Speaker John Boehner, who is leading the Republican charge to defund Obamacare."I really don't like the Republican tactics, but at least now I can understand why they are so pissed about this. When you take $10,000 out of my family's pocket each year, that's otherwise disposable income or retirement savings that will not be going into our local economy."



    "Of course, I want people to have health care," Vinson said. "I just didn't realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally."


    1. Oh, now you get it. Why? Because before this, you believed Dem bullsh1t?
    2. Both of you can GFY.

    azzholes. serves them right for being gullible dooshes
    No...
    "I'm not against Obamacare," Waschura said. "It's just the initial shock. I'm holding out hope that there will be a correction over a handful of years."
    They still don't get it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by southparkcpa View Post
    NO..the penalty will also be based as a percentage of income.
    In 2014, the fine to remain uninsured is $95 per person (up to a family maximum of $285, or 1 percent of family income, whichever is greater).

    But the penalty will increase more than sevenfold in the next two years, with the fine running as much as $695 per person by 2016. The family maximum would be as high as $2,085 (or 2.5 percent of family income, whichever is greater).

    Still, less than premiums of most plans

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    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    In 2014, the fine to remain uninsured is $95 per person (up to a family maximum of $285, or 1 percent of family income, whichever is greater).

    But the penalty will increase more than sevenfold in the next two years, with the fine running as much as $695 per person by 2016. The family maximum would be as high as $2,085 (or 2.5 percent of family income, whichever is greater).

    Still, less than premiums of most plans
    Is this accurate? Seems as though a single person would never pay the $95, they'd have to be making below the poverty line, in which case they would qualify for a waiver of all penalty, yes?

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    Just like other entitlements someone else foots the bill, for the 20 to 30 % who pay nothing. Another govt. screwup.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MnJetFan View Post
    Just like other entitlements someone else foots the bill, for the 20 to 30 % who pay nothing. Another govt. screwup.
    Hate to break it to you but even before the affordable care act, someone else foots the bill for the 20-30% who pay nothing

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    But this was supposed to cost less at least according to the President or was that another lie?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kennyo7 View Post
    Hate to break it to you but even before the affordable care act, someone else foots the bill for the 20-30% who pay nothing
    That's only half the story, and you know it. Many things simply were not available to you if you were not insured before the AMA.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by kennyo7 View Post
    Hate to break it to you but even before the affordable care act, someone else foots the bill for the 20-30% who pay nothing
    So you are saying that this solves nothing but for some reason prices are doubling now. Sounds like something that we really need.

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