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Thread: Lets talk 2014 NFL Draft-Jets Targets

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by sec.101row23 View Post
    Again, make a case for any of those guys listed for staying in school. You dont need "proof" to have a discussion of who is coming out in the draft, use common sense, and again feel free to dispute any of those players listed. I would at least have a little respect for you if you made a case for one of those players, but you dont.
    I dont know any of them personally so no I will not make a case for any of them. Some of them have degrees some dont. Some have relationships and friends they dont want to leave. For some money isnt in issue. Many of them will be more popular in school then they will as a pro. For others the thought of maybe winning a NT will keep them in. You dont know who they are listening too or if they even want to go right now. I can only tell you what I see on the field. Are they ready? Most maybe. But I am not them. Your obviously a money guy and dont get why people dont declare. For some it just isnt want they want in the moment. There is no rhyme or reason it is just what they feel. We have gone threw QB, WR, TE, and now RB and it has always been the same on both sides. You seem to think EVERYONE is declaring THIS YEAR. I will always say this yearly never assume anything. We have seen sure shot #1s not declare and that was back before the rookie cap.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamers View Post
    I dont know any of them personally so no I will not make a case for any of them. Some of them have degrees some dont. Some have relationships and friends they dont want to leave. For some money isnt in issue. Many of them will be more popular in school then they will as a pro. For others the thought of maybe winning a NT will keep them in. You dont know who they are listening too or if they even want to go right now. I can only tell you what I see on the field. Are they ready? Most maybe. But I am not them. Your obviously a money guy and dont get why people dont declare. For some it just isnt want they want in the moment. There is no rhyme or reason it is just what they feel. We have gone threw QB, WR, TE, and now RB and it has always been the same on both sides. You seem to think EVERYONE is declaring THIS YEAR. I will always say this yearly never assume anything. We have seen sure shot #1s not declare and that was back before the rookie cap.
    You have no clue what I think or know. I have talked to and met some of these college prospects over the years, mostly the guys from Clemson. I talked to DeAndre Hopkins before last season and talked about this. The money is one reason, but the real reason a guy comes out is because they are ready and they are already considered a top guy at their position and can not seriously raise their draft stock by returning for another year. Plus, they reach free agency a year quicker and a year younger. If a WR or RB is going to be projected in the 3rd round or higher he is coming out. You only risk injury and performance loss by coming back. Trying to go from the 3rd round to the second round is not incentive enough to risk injury. The goal for these guys is to get into the league, play their a$$ off, and get through their 3rd year where they can cash in and sign an extension or reach free agency after their 4th season. So you can really GFY when you say I dont know why people declare or know what I am talking about.

    Again, I never said everyone is declaring, just the guys I listed.
    Last edited by sec.101row23; 11-15-2013 at 05:39 PM.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamers View Post
    I was never high on Lacy. He is having a good year but was still well over rated IMO. I wouldnt have taken him in the 2nd. I would have taken Perkins this year over him. Out side of Gio, Michael was the only other RB last year I thought was worth a 2nd.
    I'm just trying to clarify something. Are you still saying that lacy still isn't even a 2nd rounder in your opinion?

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    I'm just trying to clarify something. Are you still saying that lacy still isn't even a 2nd rounder in your opinion?
    He was a good 2nd rounder for GB who really needed a RB. I just didnt like him for us. I was glad we otped on Ivory rather then reach in the early 2nd last year. He was just never all that good in college and has an odd body shape. Never understood the 1st round talk. People where all up on that RB class and it was the weakest group I had seen in my life. Worth a draft pick but he was never Casey or Lache good. Moves well has a good burst but I never felt he had a all pro up side. I think what you see is what you get with him. He was one of the better RBs last year I never took that away from him. Lacy has stepped it up the last few but I think he was drafted about right. Late 2nd early 3rd was his value. Him and Starks will make a good 1 2 punch. I dont see him ever being a top RB in the league but he can very well be a viable starter like Chester was. If he was in this class he wouldnt be in my top 5 but he'd still likely make my top ten so he was never trash IMO. Im glad we went Geno over RB.

  5. #85
    What would it take to get Bridgewater, Mariotta, Manziel or Hundley? After today's game it's back to the drawing board. This team badly needs a good QB...Defense is almost there.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by AceBoy View Post
    What would it take to get Bridgewater, Mariotta, Manziel or Hundley? After today's game it's back to the drawing board. This team badly needs a good QB...Defense is almost there.
    We're not drafting a QB early. Get over it.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by AceBoy View Post
    What would it take to get Bridgewater, Mariotta, Manziel or Hundley? After today's game it's back to the drawing board. This team badly needs a good QB...Defense is almost there.
    Wait for a better class. We need a better BU not anther project QB. If this was a better class maybe but none of those guys look that good.

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by sec.101row23 View Post
    You have no clue what I think or know. I have talked to and met some of these college prospects over the years, mostly the guys from Clemson. I talked to DeAndre Hopkins before last season and talked about this. The money is one reason, but the real reason a guy comes out is because they are ready and they are already considered a top guy at their position and can not seriously raise their draft stock by returning for another year. Plus, they reach free agency a year quicker and a year younger. If a WR or RB is going to be projected in the 3rd round or higher he is coming out. You only risk injury and performance loss by coming back. Trying to go from the 3rd round to the second round is not incentive enough to risk injury. The goal for these guys is to get into the league, play their a$$ off, and get through their 3rd year where they can cash in and sign an extension or reach free agency after their 4th season. So you can really GFY when you say I dont know why people declare or know what I am talking about.

    Again, I never said everyone is declaring, just the guys I listed.
    I agree for the most part, although Matt Leinart cost himself money staying a year longer. He would have been the first pick had he come out a year earlier.

  9. #89
    Bridgewater and Mariota will be gone and I don't see the hype with hundley at all, especially considering how raw he would be, drafting him in the first round would be very difficult for this team.

    That leaves the possibility of Manziel if he is there or looking at the "2nd tier guys" and it think its that second group where we will look. Just as with Geno, the benefit of a 2nd Round QB is there is a little less hype and barring Geno really turning things around in the last 6 weeks, have an open competition in TC. Personally Id be thrilled with AJ Mcarron as our second round pick. I really don't see how he isn't a legitimate first rounder, especially compared to players like brett hundley.

    He has run a pro-style offense, is tall, has excellent ball security, and understands reads/game situations. I really think we need to spend another high pick on the position and mccarron seems like an excellent fit.

  10. #90
    Bama players scare me.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by bman View Post
    Bama players scare me.
    Joe Namath

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    Bridgewater and Mariota will be gone and I don't see the hype with hundley at all, especially considering how raw he would be, drafting him in the first round would be very difficult for this team.

    That leaves the possibility of Manziel if he is there or looking at the "2nd tier guys" and it think its that second group where we will look. Just as with Geno, the benefit of a 2nd Round QB is there is a little less hype and barring Geno really turning things around in the last 6 weeks, have an open competition in TC. Personally Id be thrilled with AJ Mcarron as our second round pick. I really don't see how he isn't a legitimate first rounder, especially compared to players like brett hundley.

    He has run a pro-style offense, is tall, has excellent ball security, and understands reads/game situations. I really think we need to spend another high pick on the position and mccarron seems like an excellent fit.
    Hundley would be a mistake. He is more raw than Geno and I think a project at best. I personally don't even think he should come out yet, although I suppose he could get drafted high if some GM falls in love with his potential. As you pointed out, we have no shot at Bridgewater or Mariota. Manziel may be there. Gun to my head, I'd say he's our most likely target if we went QB first round because he has such a different skillset than Geno and is a flashy name. Drafting guys like Boyd, Murray or McCarron feel like lateral moves to me. I'd rather see us use early round picks to upgrade the o-line and skill position players, and let Geno have a go at it with a revamped offense.

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by SlickBri481 View Post
    Hundley would be a mistake. He is more raw than Geno and I think a project at best. I personally don't even think he should come out yet, although I suppose he could get drafted high if some GM falls in love with his potential. As you pointed out, we have no shot at Bridgewater or Mariota. Manziel may be there. Gun to my head, I'd say he's our most likely target if we went QB first round because he has such a different skillset than Geno and is a flashy name. Drafting guys like Boyd, Murray or McCarron feel like lateral moves to me. I'd rather see us use early round picks to upgrade the o-line and skill position players, and let Geno have a go at it with a revamped offense.
    i wouldn't be surprised if the jets took mccarron. he's the opposite of smith.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamers View Post
    He was a good 2nd rounder for GB who really needed a RB. I just didnt like him for us. I was glad we otped on Ivory rather then reach in the early 2nd last year. He was just never all that good in college and has an odd body shape. Never understood the 1st round talk. People where all up on that RB class and it was the weakest group I had seen in my life. Worth a draft pick but he was never Casey or Lache good. Moves well has a good burst but I never felt he had a all pro up side. I think what you see is what you get with him. He was one of the better RBs last year I never took that away from him. Lacy has stepped it up the last few but I think he was drafted about right. Late 2nd early 3rd was his value. Him and Starks will make a good 1 2 punch. I dont see him ever being a top RB in the league but he can very well be a viable starter like Chester was. If he was in this class he wouldnt be in my top 5 but he'd still likely make my top ten so he was never trash IMO. Im glad we went Geno over RB.
    I really don't understand why you are so hung up on value, especially AFTER the draft has concluded and we have 11 weeks (which isn't that long, but its a decent sample size) of stats to show that Lacy has been an excellent player, so to say he had "early third round value" doesn't really make much sense.

    The same philosophy comes into play when you are saying we should "wait for a better QB class". AJ McCarron would actually be an amazing backup as his floor is a game manager, that works hard, and doesn't turn the ball over. He also happens to come with a pretty high ceiling on top of that, so if the Jets think he can compete as a starter and is the guy they want, why would they not pull the trigger in the 40-50 range and hope he falls to their 3rd round pick? That is absolutely awful risk-reward, especially at the most important position on the field.

    Draft slot projections can give a general guide of how to prepare a teams board, but they serve a lot more purpose for us to debate and mel kiper to report on, then they do actual practice for NFL teams.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglenj View Post
    I really don't understand why you are so hung up on value, especially AFTER the draft has concluded and we have 11 weeks (which isn't that long, but its a decent sample size) of stats to show that Lacy has been an excellent player, so to say he had "early third round value" doesn't really make much sense.

    The same philosophy comes into play when you are saying we should "wait for a better QB class". AJ McCarron would actually be an amazing backup as his floor is a game manager, that works hard, and doesn't turn the ball over. He also happens to come with a pretty high ceiling on top of that, so if the Jets think he can compete as a starter and is the guy they want, why would they not pull the trigger in the 40-50 range and hope he falls to their 3rd round pick? That is absolutely awful risk-reward, especially at the most important position on the field.

    Draft slot projections can give a general guide of how to prepare a teams board, but they serve a lot more purpose for us to debate and mel kiper to report on, then they do actual practice for NFL teams.
    While he is doing a solid Job as a rookie and seems to be finally the dependable RB the Packers were looking for, he has been hardly anything Special. Pretty good but excellent to me is a Stretch. He is averaging 4.0 Yards a carry - That stat tells you he is solid but nothing more.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by DowNY View Post
    We're not drafting a QB early. Get over it.
    Too bad because that's our GREATEST need. GeNO is horrible. You can give a young QB time to grow but you can tell he doesn't have the instincts for the game. Next.............

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Flaming Mo View Post
    While he is doing a solid Job as a rookie and seems to be finally the dependable RB the Packers were looking for, he has been hardly anything Special. Pretty good but excellent to me is a Stretch. He is averaging 4.0 Yards a carry - That stat tells you he is solid but nothing more.
    I really dont think you can look at the 4.0 average and just say thats what the guy is.

    Do you think his 4.0 is skewed at all from his last 2 weeks (averaged 3.0 and 1.9 YPC) playing with his teams 3rd string QB, 2nd string TE and without Cobb?

    Im not saying that Lacy is Adrian Peterson, my point was the guy was taken with the 29th pick of the second round, and the other poster was critiquing his value which is just absurd when you look at the way he has produced so far.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamers View Post
    Wait for a better class. We need a better BU not anther project QB. If this was a better class maybe but none of those guys look that good.
    WHAT?

    Seriously?

  19. #99
    I hope if he falls to us in the second round we take Zach Mettenberger. Reminds me of Schuab who untill this year was playing pretty damn good football.

  20. #100
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    Was just reading up on the receivers.....can one of you draft guys please rank the top 3 of Evans/Lee/Watkins? Seems like Evans just flew up the boards

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