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Thread: Bellicheck deserves to be in HOF?

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Jones View Post
    LOL what sour grapes in this thread. If Belichick was our coach in either of 2009 or 2010 we would have won at least one Super Bowl, guaranteed.

    He's probably the greatest football genius of all time, maybe second, to Parcells. He has more Super Bowl victories than the Jets have division titles in the last 40 years. He's won the AFCE almost 15 years in a row. He consistently takes teams of average-level talent to Conference Championships and Super Bowl appearances.

    Most BB-hating on this board is pure rationalizing for the fact that Hess screwed him over and forced him away to New England. I can guarantee that if it were Belichick winning the AFCE every year in the Meadowlands instead of Foxboro, nobody on here would complain about his douchebaggery, cheating, or whatever else you come up with.
    Haha hey " Bob jones " you must be the dumbest pats troll ever to walk in JI.. Pretending to be a jets fan, your blew your cover early, 5 posts in.. Your first line is classic retard 101, the rest is bb worshipping expected of a pats troll.. You said if bb was " our coach" ( lol @our) we would have won in either 2009 or 2010? Uhh hello, Rex went further in playoffs then bb both those yrs with a team that had fraction of pats talent on offense.. Ohhh come to think of it, Rex beat bb in foxboro in 2010 so please tell me how the coach with the much better team and home field, who lost to Rex, would have helped is win a Super Bowl? Lol

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleansweep2013 View Post
    How old are you? What time does the little yellow school bus pick you up in the morning? You seem to be a pats troll if you seriously are comparing jets sideline incident to spygate.. And claim " everyone cheats" lol.. Except your not a very smart pats troll either considering you don't know when they make the playoffs
    So what about the Broncos and 49ers cheating to circumvent the salary cap?

    Or do you just ignore that?

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Jones View Post
    LOL what sour grapes in this thread. If Belichick was our coach in either of 2009 or 2010 we would have won at least one Super Bowl, guaranteed.

    He's probably the greatest football genius of all time, maybe second, to Parcells. He has more Super Bowl victories than the Jets have division titles in the last 40 years. He's won the AFCE almost 15 years in a row. He consistently takes teams of average-level talent to Conference Championships and Super Bowl appearances.

    Most BB-hating on this board is pure rationalizing for the fact that Hess screwed him over and forced him away to New England. I can guarantee that if it were Belichick winning the AFCE every year in the Meadowlands instead of Foxboro, nobody on here would complain about his douchebaggery, cheating, or whatever else you come up with.
    Yesterday, every Broncos' drive, other than one, ended in a score. Pure genius.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by detectivekimble View Post
    They were doing a lot more than stealing signals. Just ask Kurt Warner and Marshall Faulk.
    Sure. I'll give those sore losers a call as soon as I watch a replay of Kurt Warner throwing a pick 6 to Ty Law (which Ty HAD to know was coming).

    Will they tell me about the famous walkthrough tape, whose non-existence led the Boston Herald to publish an apology/retraction and to "reassign" the reporter? Or will they have some other explanation for why they choked away the SB to 14 point 'dogs?
    Last edited by AFCEastFan; 01-20-2014 at 02:29 PM.

  5. #65
    The Cowher defense is like one of the steroid guys complaining about being left out of Coopertown because there were other guys using steroids too. That's not a very good argument.

    We likely will never know what teams caught which other teams' signals and which of those teams obtained an advantage through it but the allegation that so many coaches did it is circumstantial evidence that the coaches at least considered it a tactical advantage that could be captured. We will also never know the full extent of how much the Pats coaching staff filmed other teams before 2007 because the tapes were destroyed. That at least raises a fog around the level of success Bellichick fairly reached. Do we necessarily want to see a guy with an asterisk by his name held up as an icon of the game? Maybe not.

    Bellichick is a good coach. How much of the legacy of success is attributable to him over Brady? I believe he would have had a strong team but probably not at the level of success he has enjoyed in NE without Brady. Before I'd call him a HOF coach I'd want to see what he does with a team that doesn't have a HOF QB. He sure didn't drive the Browns to success but that was a long time ago and one would think that he has grown professionally. If he stays in NE after Brady then let's see what that team is like a few years after Brady leaves and he has a team that isn't built around guys looking to play with a HOF QB.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by rex-n-effect View Post
    The Cowher defense is like one of the steroid guys complaining about being left out of Coopertown because there were other guys using steroids too. That's not a very good argument.

    We likely will never know what teams caught which other teams' signals and which of those teams obtained an advantage through it but the allegation that so many coaches did it is circumstantial evidence that the coaches at least considered it a tactical advantage that could be captured. We will also never know the full extent of how much the Pats coaching staff filmed other teams before 2007 because the tapes were destroyed. That at least raises a fog around the level of success Bellichick fairly reached. Do we necessarily want to see a guy with an asterisk by his name held up as an icon of the game? Maybe not.

    Bellichick is a good coach. How much of the legacy of success is attributable to him over Brady? I believe he would have had a strong team but probably not at the level of success he has enjoyed in NE without Brady. Before I'd call him a HOF coach I'd want to see what he does with a team that doesn't have a HOF QB. He sure didn't drive the Browns to success but that was a long time ago and one would think that he has grown professionally. If he stays in NE after Brady then let's see what that team is like a few years after Brady leaves and he has a team that isn't built around guys looking to play with a HOF QB.
    The Tuna won Bowls with Simms,Hoss and made one with Bledsoe. BB only has had bowl and playoff success with Brady as his QB..

  7. #67
    lets be honest the pats were caught cheating period any other argument is moot. Was any other team caught cheating nope.
    So post spygate which I think was much deeper then stealing signals hence the destruction of eveidence. that alone getting caught cheating akin to fixing games has gotten players banned from baseball for life and they are still banned (shoe-less Joe for instance).
    Look he should have been suspended and fined heavier and wins should have been revoked. And if my aunt had balls she would be my uncle, since the commish has more in common with my aunt then my uncle we are having this stupid ass lame thread. Bellicheat does not belong in the hall of fame alone with Brady or anyone from that team because they cheated and were caught. You kept the wins then forfeit the hall or go to the hall and forfeit the wins...
    And for all the pats fans you root for cheaters suck it it is a fact that you have not won **** post spy gate 8-8 nice but no cigars. that should be a clue to everyone about how they won before hand

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBallhawk View Post
    My point is that everybody cheats, including us. Is it that hard to understand or are you just that stupid?

    So to be clear: Everybody cheats, but the "genius" Bill Belichick was just UNFORTUNATELY caught? A genius was caught cheating? How can this be?

    Do you have any clue about Spygate? Seriously, do you know all the FACTS? Did you know that the Patriots were warned on two separate occasions both in 2003 and in 2005 to stop the videotaping? Just to qualify this point, I will tell you that both the Packers and Titans were also warned in letters from the league. They apparently decided to stop. The Patriots continued to do it through the 2007 season and if you ask some players today, are still doing it. I can't believe people are still this ignorant to the facts of Spygate. I guess if you're getting all your information from ESPN then you know very little about the lengths to which the Patriots went to gain an illegal advantage over their opponents. Read a book or a newspaper. Read quotes from former New England staff members and players and then tell me EVERYBODY was cheating or that it didn't help them.

    And...let's not forget the obvious...hmmm...they got caught!

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBallhawk View Post
    So you're pissed they did a better job at cheating than we did...

    And stop acting like we know everything. Nobody knew the Pats were cheating before they got caught. Nobody knows who else right now is cheating.
    I'm more pissed I forgot who I was dealing with and answered your pointless post. Should have known that it would lead to an every dumber post.

    They did a better job of cheating? Fool, the Jets didn't cheat, can you read?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBallhawk View Post
    My point is that everybody cheats, including us. Is it that hard to understand or are you just that stupid?
    Which logic course told you that if you weren't caught all it means is that you were cheating but weren't caught? You are some kind of special poster

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by AFCEastFan View Post
    Sure. I'll give those sore losers a call as soon as I watch a replay of Kurt Warner throwing a pick 6 to Ty Law (which Ty HAD to know was coming).

    Will they tell me about the famous walkthrough tape, whose non-existence led the Boston Herald to publish an apology/retraction and to "reassign" the reporter? Or will they have some other explanation for why they choked away the SB to 14 point 'dogs?
    Non-existence? It doesn't exist anymore because Goodell destroyed it!

    If there was nothing on those tapes, why did he destroy them?

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by detectivekimble View Post
    Non-existence? It doesn't exist anymore because Goodell destroyed it!

    If there was nothing on those tapes, why did he destroy them?
    Because Goodell is a clown and he couldn't keep his own minions from leaking the tapes to Jay Glazer.

    Here's a question for you: If Belichick is such a dirtbag cheater who openly flaunts league directives, why would he voluntarily provide Goodell with anything incriminating beyond what he was caught redhanded doing? If there was really something juicy on those tapes besides repeated sequences of the scoreboard, followed by the opposing team calling plays on the sidelines, followed by the play itself, there is no way in hell Belichick would turn them over to the league.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by AFCEastFan View Post
    Because Goodell is a clown and he couldn't keep his own minions from leaking the tapes to Jay Glazer.

    Here's a question for you: If Belichick is such a dirtbag cheater who openly flaunts league directives, why would he voluntarily provide Goodell with anything incriminating beyond what he was caught redhanded doing? If there was really something juicy on those tapes besides repeated sequences of the scoreboard, followed by the opposing team calling plays on the sidelines, followed by the play itself, there is no way in hell Belichick would turn them over to the league.
    Goodell would have made him turn it over anyway so why not act dumb and pretend like you have nothing hide. Also if nothing of importance was on the tapes it wouldn't have mattered if they leaked. It would have cleared the Patriots name, but now they'll always have an * next to those super bowls.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Hollywood Nosebleed View Post
    Goodell would have made him turn it over anyway so why not act dumb and pretend like you have nothing hide. Also if nothing of importance was on the tapes it wouldn't have mattered if they leaked. It would have cleared the Patriots name, but now they'll always have an * next to those super bowls.
    By Goodell do you mean Roger Goodell? I haven't seen any evidence that he can make anybody do anything, let alone Bill Belichick.

    I don't remember reading about an FBI-style raid of the Patriots' offices and the homes of Ernie Adams and Bill Belichick. If that had happened, followed by Goodell destroying the tapes, I'd be riding shotgun on the conspiracy bandwagon. But you really think Goodell could "make" Belichick turn over everything? And you really trust that Belichick would have done that?

    The tapes were leaked (and snippets shown on Fox) and there was nothing on them of importance. So, yes, I agree that it doesn't matter that they were leaked just as it doesn't matter that they were destroyed. And the leaked tapes didn't "clear the Patriots name", they confirmed the very act that the Patriots were penalized for -- videotaping coaches signals from the opposing sidelines during games in which the Patriots were participants.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFCEastFan View Post
    Because Goodell is a clown and he couldn't keep his own minions from leaking the tapes to Jay Glazer.

    Here's a question for you: If Belichick is such a dirtbag cheater who openly flaunts league directives, why would he voluntarily provide Goodell with anything incriminating beyond what he was caught redhanded doing? If there was really something juicy on those tapes besides repeated sequences of the scoreboard, followed by the opposing team calling plays on the sidelines, followed by the play itself, there is no way in hell Belichick would turn them over to the league.
    LOL! He didn't voluntarily provide anything. Where do you get this crap?

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Bleedgreen View Post
    LOL! He didn't voluntarily provide anything. Where do you get this crap?
    Oh, so the Patriots offices and the homes of Belichick and Ernie Adams were raided by NFL security personnel after all? My apologies, I must have missed that.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by AFCEastFan View Post
    By Goodell do you mean Roger Goodell? I haven't seen any evidence that he can make anybody do anything, let alone Bill Belichick.

    I don't remember reading about an FBI-style raid of the Patriots' offices and the homes of Ernie Adams and Bill Belichick. If that had happened, followed by Goodell destroying the tapes, I'd be riding shotgun on the conspiracy bandwagon. But you really think Goodell could "make" Belichick turn over everything? And you really trust that Belichick would have done that?

    The tapes were leaked (and snippets shown on Fox) and there was nothing on them of importance. So, yes, I agree that it doesn't matter that they were leaked just as it doesn't matter that they were destroyed. And the leaked tapes didn't "clear the Patriots name", they confirmed the very act that the Patriots were penalized for -- videotaping coaches signals from the opposing sidelines during games in which the Patriots were participants.
    I'm not talking about a raid, but by not cooperating he could probably fine and suspend them.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by AFCEastFan View Post
    http://espn.go.com/blog/pittsburgh-s...act-of-spygate

    PITTSBURGH -- Bill Cowher has a message for Pittsburgh Steelers fans who think their team was cheated out of a trip to the Super Bowl 10 years ago: Get over it.

    The Steelers were drummed by New England, 41-27, in the 2004 AFC Championship Game at Heinz field, a loss that came under suspicion a couple of years later when the Patriots were caught trying to steal signals and formations by illegally videotaping opposing teams.

    “We didn’t lose the game because of any 'Spygate,' because of them having any additional things,” Cowher told 93.7 The Fan on Wednesday. “[If] they’re guilty of anything they’re guilty of arrogance because they were told not to do something but it was something everybody does. They got caught doing it with a camera.”

    Cowher, who coached the Steelers from 1992-2006, said what the Patriots did happened regularly in the NFL before the league allowed coordinators to relay plays to their quarterback and defensive signal-caller via a helmet radio.

    “Stealing someone’s signals was a part of the game and everybody attempted to do that. We had people that always tried to steal signals,” said Cowher, whose 2004 team won 16 consecutive games before losing to the Patriots in the AFC title game. “What happened when we lost that game is they outplayed us. It had nothing to do with stealing signals or cheating or anything else.”

    Cowher, an NFL studio analyst for CBS, interviewed Patriots coach Bill Belichick last week, and he said the two talked extensively afterward, the first time they had done so since they were both NFL assistant coaches.

    Cowher professed his admiration for Belichick and the sustained success he has enjoyed in the salary-cap era.

    The Pittsburgh native also made it clear on Wednesday that he won’t be matching wits against Belichick -- or any other NFL head coach -- anytime soon.

    Cowher reiterated that he has “no interest” in returning to the sideline even though his name has been linked to head-coaching vacancies every year since he retired from the Steelers in January 2007.

    Cowher, who went 149-90-1 and won a Super Bowl in 15 seasons with the Steelers, acknowledged that he has received his share of inquiries about returning to coaching.

    “It’s flattering but it never gets very far,” Cowher said. “If I ever want to get back into coaching I should be calling teams they shouldn’t be calling me. That’s when you know you really want to do it.”
    Look, BB cheated. He broke the rules. Even after he was warned by the NFL, he broke them again. So he cheated. The NFL admitted to this by fining him and his team.
    For me, those 3 SB victories will always have an * beside them and that is becasue he broke a rule, and had an unfair competitive advantage over his opponents.
    The fact that the NFL muzzled up the investigation only proves that they didn’t want for anyone to find out how long he was cheating for it then would have put the integrity of the sport into question. So the fact that no inquiry ever was done, simply adds layers of ambiguity and conspiracy. Regardless whether you believe that the NFL shut everyone up is unimportant , he cheated.
    What surprises me is how no one, i i really mean no one, from the coaching fraternity has ever said anything about spygate. Why is this so? Are they afraid to speak up? Doesn’t any coach out there think that what he did was wrong?
    I’ve concluded that perhaps all coaches try and cheat, some way, some how.
    I guess it’s part of the game after all.
    ps, here’s an “oldie but a goodie” enjoy

    http://www.opposingviews.com/i/sport...thout-cheating

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by canadianjetsfan View Post
    Look, BB cheated. He broke the rules. Even after he was warned by the NFL, he broke them again. So he cheated. The NFL admitted to this by fining him and his team.
    That's the same reasoning that Don 'Cheat' Shula used when he cried for asterisks when the Pats were going for 19-0. The funniest part is that the senile old fart had forgotten that his Dolphins were also fined and lost a 1st round pick for cheating.

  20. #80
    Clearly baseball holds rules, and HOF much more sacred than NFL. They won't even let guys in if rumored to take roids.. To me that's overboard..


    In the NFL, if player fails PED test and is suspended no big deal when he comes back.. In baseball that player has the failed test cloud over his head for rest of his career.. They won't even let the great Pete rose in HOF because he bet on baseball when he was a mgr.. In bb case, spygate was clearly it was 1 of the biggest cheating scandals in history of NFL.. Goodell went to bat for pats by destroying evidence or punishment would have been more severe..

    I just think it's ironic, pre spygate bb looked like a genius in the playoffs.. Post spygate playoffs, which happen to be 8 appearances since hae resulted in no Super Bowls.. Even having Tom Brady, and being in a easy division which helped them achieve division, top seeds, home field advantage for majority of those 8 yrs.. Yet bb would lose to underdogs, teams that weren't expected to beat them..

    To me if a coach like Rex can take a 5th or 6th seed on road and tear through top seeds in playoffs like pats, colts, ect.. That's much more impressive than winning division.. So clearly pats have had the talent on the field, but has a coach who doesn't have any tricks up his sleeve in playoffs.. Most great coaches win in playoffs if given a good team, and all time great qb like Brady.. No way would a great coach lose 8 out of last 8 playoff appearances.. When the stakes are at their highest, post spygate, bb is outcoached..

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