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Thread: The ultimate Revis argument

  1. #1
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    The ultimate Revis argument

    Sure it's one game and time will tell, but I really think Revis is a fascinating example of the changing NFL.

    Having an elite corner is a luxury not a necessity in today's nfl. Revis, to me the best I've ever seen play CB since D. Green, is a luxury. Even if he eliminates one WR, who cares. And he can't even do that anymore b/c of the rule changes. I mean no one can shut down a WR under today's rules.

    So I'm wondering if the whole Revis saga this offseason was more about football schematics then petty past contract squabbles. I think the jets realized dumping your salary cap into the CB position is not smart in today's NFL.

    that's why Idzik didn't blow away any FA CB with a contract offer this off season. Put your cap space on pocket pushers / pass rushers and oline / playmakers. Everything else is a luxury.

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    In today's NFL:

    Elite safety > Elite CB

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    Revis is great. He's also overpaid.

    I'd take him in a second but not at that price, which seems to be exactly what the Jets decided. I'd rather have JJ Watt.

    The Jets started a backup CB and converted Safety yesterday at their two CB positions, and may have found out they actually have a true CB in Allen. We'll see what happens next week in GB but I like having Rex continue to take lemons and make lemonade back there. We don't need an expensive raspberry in Revis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    In today's NFL:

    Elite safety > Elite CB
    I'd disagree, shutdown corners are still worth their weight in gold IMO. Problem is they are as rare as they come... Haden and Peterson are the only two that immediately come to mind. I still think sherman is overrated playing in that secondary/defense, and revis? Who knows

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    Its one game. And against a team that doesn't have 1 dominant WR (not sure that Mike Wallace qualifies). Having Revis (or the old Revis) is a huge asset against the true #1s of the league.

    But, he's still one player though. I didn't see much of the Pats game, but their biggest problem was that they couldn't stop the run, right? Revis ain't helping all that much there, I don't think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    I'd disagree, shutdown corners are still worth their weight in gold IMO. Problem is they are as rare as they come... Haden and Peterson are the only two that immediately come to mind. I still think sherman is overrated playing in that secondary and defense, and revis? Who knows
    No I don't agree. With the ticky tack calls the refs are hellbent on calling this season, it's tough for any CB to cover a WR down the field. If you have an elite safety you can help over the top and you can lay the lumber, which leads to alligator arms later in the game.

    I'm happy our GM is trying to stay ahead of the curve by drafting Pryor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetstream23 View Post
    Revis is great. He's also overpaid.

    I'd take him in a second but not at that price, which seems to be exactly what the Jets decided. I'd rather have JJ Watt.

    +1

    On a play-by-play basis I'd take a terrifying DE/LB over a shut-down CB.

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    I don't see how it's worth paying a CB $12+ million a year.

    Even in his prime, Revis on his best day was still only taking away one player.

    A passrusher like JJ Watt or Robert Quinn disrupts an entire offense. Those are the kinds of guys that you pay the big bucks to on the defensive side of the ball. Guys who can get to the QB and disrupt an entire offensive gameplan.

    You can avoid guys like Revis, Sherman, Haden, and Peterson by simply not throwing in their direction.

    You can't avoid a guy like JJ Watt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    In today's NFL:

    Elite safety > Elite CB
    As talented as Revis is he played his best in Rex's D.. But money was more important so he has what he wanted and will again next year with a new team.. But he better play better then he did against the Fins or the offers for his high priced talent may diminish considerably...

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    Quote Originally Posted by carlito1171 View Post
    No I don't agree. With the ticky tack calls the refs are hellbent on calling this season, it's tough for any CB to cover a WR down the field. If you have an elite safety you can help over the top and you can lay the lumber, which leads to alligator arms later in the game.

    I'm happy our GM is trying to stay ahead of the curve by drafting Pryor.
    I don't disagree that safety play is at a premium right now, but the distinction between the true shutdown CB's is that they can do it clean and not get the flag. Think revis circa 09-11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Untouchable View Post
    I don't see how it's worth paying a CB $12+ million a year.

    Even in his prime, Revis on his best day was still only taking away one player.

    A passrusher like JJ Watt or Robert Quinn disrupts an entire offense. Those are the kinds of guys that you pay the big bucks to on the defensive side of the ball. Guys who can get to the QB and disrupt an entire offensive gameplan.

    You can avoid guys like Revis, Sherman, Haden, and Peterson by simply not throwing in their direction.

    You can't avoid a guy like JJ Watt.
    But just because a dominant DE is more important than a dominant CB, it doesn't mean that a dominant CB isn't valuable. Especially if you use them in a certain way - like Rex does. If running a cover zero at times works towards your advantage, having Revis is invaluable.

    I would take JJ Watt 10x out of 10, but paying $12m for Revis isn't a bad deal for me. Assuming of course, you are getting the Revis you are supposed to get. But, if you are starting an over the hill, overweight NT, Revis ain't gonna do much for your bottom line.

    It probably didn't make sense for the Jets to pursue Revis this year at that price - for $$$ purposes and of course history. But, if our QB situation was a little different and we were legit contenders, I'd have no problem shelling out that money, especially considering we had it. I think the price of a CB has moderated somewhat after the stupid Aso deal. But having an elite CB is a very good thing. Sherman didn't get challenged at all. That's not a coincidence, no matter what McCarthy says.
    Last edited by crasherino; 09-08-2014 at 01:12 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Untouchable View Post
    I don't see how it's worth paying a CB $12+ million a year.

    Even in his prime, Revis on his best day was still only taking away one player.

    A passrusher like JJ Watt or Robert Quinn disrupts an entire offense. Those are the kinds of guys that you pay the big bucks to on the defensive side of the ball. Guys who can get to the QB and disrupt an entire offensive gameplan.

    You can avoid guys like Revis, Sherman, Haden, and Peterson by simply not throwing in their direction.

    You can't avoid a guy like JJ Watt.
    You can scheme around passrushers also it's the same difference, you're just taking away weapons from the offense and forcing them out of their usual gameplan

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    Quote Originally Posted by crasherino View Post
    But just because a dominant DE is more important than a dominant CB, it doesn't mean that a dominant CB isn't valuable. Especially if you use them in a certain way - like Rex does. If running a cover zero at times works towards your advantage, having Revis is invaluable.

    I would take JJ Watt 10x out of 10, but paying $12m for Revis isn't a bad deal for me. Assuming of course, you are getting the Revis you are supposed to get. But, if you are starting an over the hill, overweight NT, Revis ain't gonna do much for your bottom line.

    It probably didn't make sense for the Jets to pursue Revis this year at that price - for $$$ purposes and of course history. But, if our QB situation was a little different and we were legit contenders, I'd have no problem shelling out that money, especially considering we had it. I think the price of a CB has moderated somewhat after the stupid Aso deal. But having an elite CB is a very good thing. Sherman didn't get challenged at all. That's not a coincidence, no matter what McCarthy says.
    That's the thing though...you aren't getting a guy like Revis or Sherman for $12 million anymore.

    The top CB's are now getting paid in excess of $14 million a year. And with the new emphasis on defensive holding and PI...how is it worth it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    I don't disagree that safety play is at a premium right now, but the distinction between the true shutdown CB's is that they can do it clean and not get the flag. Think revis circa 09-11
    2 things.

    1. 09-11 much different then today's rules. Especially this year.

    2. The point is that even with Revis and Darrell Green in their primes, without a pass rusher or dominant front seven it's going to be a long day for the DEF.

    Now put Revis on Den or Sea or a team with a strong front 7 and now you have a DEF. Prob is at $12 mill you don't have room for the playmakers you need up front and on off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    You can scheme around passrushers also it's the same difference, you're just taking away weapons from the offense and forcing them out of their usual gameplan
    A great CB may take away your best W/R but a great passrusher may take away your QB for the season with the right legal hit..

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    Quote Originally Posted by One Eye View Post
    2 things.

    1. 09-11 much different then today's rules. Especially this year.

    2. The point is that even with Revis and Darrell Green in their primes, without a pass rusher or dominant front seven it's going to be a long day for the DEF.

    Now put Revis on Den or Sea or a team with a strong front 7 and now you have a DEF. Prob is at $12 mill you don't have room for the playmakers you need up front and on off.
    Team with a strong front 7... Like the jets?

  17. #17
    I'd pay an elite CB big money, but only if they are the ballhawking, playmaker type (ie Sherman). Physical man-to-man covers aren't nearly as valuable as they used to be due to rule changes. However, a guy who can create turnovers and make big plays is extremely valuable, no matter what the rules might be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage69 View Post
    A great CB may take away your best W/R but a great passrusher may take away your QB for the season with the right legal hit..
    You still need multiple passrushers to get pressure on the QB, for example look how ineffective a guy like aldon smith is when he doesn't have a guy like justin smith to play next to

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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    Team with a strong front 7... Like the jets?
    Lol. Well played my friend. Well played.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cant wait View Post
    I'd disagree, shutdown corners are still worth their weight in gold IMO. Problem is they are as rare as they come... Haden and Peterson are the only two that immediately come to mind. I still think sherman is overrated playing in that secondary/defense, and revis? Who knows
    Yeah, Rex could run so much off his ability to erase a #1 WR. Maybe he just can't do that anymore. Wallace had some success. When Revis was at the top of his game, no one even threw towards him. 7 catches for 81 yards was unheard when Shavar was here. 11 targets? Teams will take notice. And he'll have to chase around Cordarelle Patterson next week in Minnesota.
    Maybe he should've tried to negotiate a long-term deal after all. No tears for him from me.

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