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Thread: Who else was disgusted seeing that Iraqi

  1. #1
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    If this doesn't make you sick to your stomach, I don't know what would.

    This mess in Iraq is out of control. It's been a total disaster and someone has to answer for it.

  2. #2
    Sorry tail, but people don't care. This has become an issue of politics and that's all. Just politics. The body count is irrelevant. All that matters is that we as a nation find a way to justify this war IMHO. I'm not saying I agree, just saying that's what I think it's become. Again, just MY opinion as in individual.

  3. #3
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    Wrong! Lot's of us care.

    And lot's of us know that if we leave now and leave chaos behind, every soldier that has died, will have died in vain. And the blueprint for terrorists will be written: make it tough on American's and they will run with their tail tucked between their legs. To quote bin Laden: [i]"..the paper tiger doesn't have the stomach to fight..."[/i]

    Is that it? Is that what you guys want? Regardless of your opinions of why we are there, we are there. Priority #1 is to finish the job, finish the Baathists and terrorists. Finish it there, or we will fight it here. Liberals compare this to Vietnam, but the only similarity between Iraq and Vietnam is how the liberals want it to end. Just quit.

    I guarantee you that the majority of the soldiers fighting over there would agree that America must stay and fight and they have a lot more at stake than you or I.

    And that's my opinion.

  4. #4
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    Just get our troops out of that damn country already. Just let that country go to ****s!!! Not our problem!!!! :[img]http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'>

  5. #5
    Weeb do you really believe that stable democracy in Iraq is an achievable goal?

    IMO pulling out of Iraq is just delaying the inevitable. Sooner or later religious zealots will take control of that country. It is either gonna be now or 50 years from now when we leave after the wells have dried up. Either way the soldiers who have passed will have died in vein. The way i see it, getting out now saves lives.

  6. #6
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Spirit of Weeb[/i]@Nov 5 2003, 05:37 PM
    [b] I guarantee you that the majority of the soldiers fighting over there would agree that America must stay and fight and they have a lot more at stake than you or I.

    [/b][/quote]
    Guarantee? You have no basis in fact to make such a statement.

    This is a phoney war. It's not about terrorism, never was. So far the Bush rationale for this war has been as fluid as the Iraqi oil.

  7. #7
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Spirit of Weeb[/i]@Nov 5 2003, 09:37 PM
    [b] Wrong! Lot's of us care.





    I guarantee you that the majority of the soldiers fighting over there would agree that America must stay and fight and they have a lot more at stake than you or I.

    [/b][/quote]
    Yes, some civilians care but those pulling the strings don't. It's all about finding ways to get re-elected. I don't doubt for one second that we will get Sadaam, Bin Laden, or both just prior to the election.


    As far as "majority of soldiers support it" there was an order sent down to the troops in the middle east to stop commenting to the press on their personal feeligs because of declining morale and increased animosity. Things have only gotten worse since then so I doubt those feelings have changed for the better.

  8. #8
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan[/i]@Nov 7 2003, 08:47 AM
    [b] Yes, some civilians care but those pulling the strings don't. It's all about finding ways to get re-elected. I don't doubt for one second that we will get Sadaam, Bin Laden, or both just prior to the election.


    As far as "majority of soldiers support it" there was an order sent down to the troops in the middle east to stop commenting to the press on their personal feeligs because of declining morale and increased animosity. Things have only gotten worse since then so I doubt those feelings have changed for the better. [/b][/quote]

    You're wrong. Everyone that I know who is either in or has family in tell me the same thing: they believe in what we're doing and we should not leave until the job is done.

    I also haven't seen one news report where a soldier who has returned or in the hospital suffering an injury has badmouthed either their treatment or the conditions and to a man all said they would return in a heartbeat.

    We're there, we're gonna win and the democrats and liberals aren't going to be successful in their attempts to make this Vietnam 2. If the majority of the public believed that George Bush is sacrificing American lives for political gain, this war would come to a grinding halt. You should be more upset with those politicians that have more to gain by preventing a successful outcome.

    If those politicians are successful, many more soldiers and American citizens will die. The paper tiger label will stick and every soldier called into any duty will suffer. The template will be set and terrorists and guerillas will win. "The tougher we make it on Americans, the quicker they will fold."

    George Bush didn't need a war to keep him in office. His tax cuts and economic policy are bringing the economy back. Fighting a war is could be a huge liability to any President, let alone two.

    We are fighting both these wars because it is the right thing to do. One is to punish those responsible for Sept. 11th and the other to prevent it from happening again.

  9. #9
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan+Nov 7 2003, 07:47 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (AirForceJetFan @ Nov 7 2003, 07:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Spirit of Weeb[/i]@Nov 5 2003, 09:37 PM
    [b] Wrong&#33; Lot&#39;s of us care.





    I guarantee you that the majority of the soldiers fighting over there would agree that America must stay and fight and they have a lot more at stake than you or I.

    [/b][/quote]
    Yes, some civilians care but those pulling the strings don&#39;t. It&#39;s all about finding ways to get re-elected. I don&#39;t doubt for one second that we will get Sadaam, Bin Laden, or both just prior to the election.


    As far as "majority of soldiers support it" there was an order sent down to the troops in the middle east to stop commenting to the press on their personal feeligs because of declining morale and increased animosity. Things have only gotten worse since then so I doubt those feelings have changed for the better. [/b][/quote]
    Those that were complaining are a few of the many. Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with.

  10. #10
    [quote][i]Originally posted by RblJet+Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (RblJet @ Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by -AirForceJetFan@Nov 7 2003, 07:47 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin--Spirit of Weeb[/i]@Nov 5 2003, 09:37 PM
    [b] Wrong&#33; Lot&#39;s of us care.





    I guarantee you that the majority of the soldiers fighting over there would agree that America must stay and fight and they have a lot more at stake than you or I.

    [/b][/quote]
    Yes, some civilians care but those pulling the strings don&#39;t. It&#39;s all about finding ways to get re-elected. I don&#39;t doubt for one second that we will get Sadaam, Bin Laden, or both just prior to the election.


    As far as "majority of soldiers support it" there was an order sent down to the troops in the middle east to stop commenting to the press on their personal feeligs because of declining morale and increased animosity. Things have only gotten worse since then so I doubt those feelings have changed for the better. [/b][/quote]
    Those that were complaining are a few of the many. Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    You guys are right, I&#39;m way off base on this one. I&#39;m in no position to speak about people who have gone to or are going to Iraq. My apologies.

  11. #11
    [quote][i]Originally posted by RblJet[/i]@Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM
    [b] Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    Funny thing is, those worthless sh**bags are still doing more than most who sit on their a&#036;&#036;es screaming from the top of their lungs about patriotism and freedom but when it comes down to it, don&#39;t have the b@lls to get up and join to serve. <_<

  12. #12
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan+Nov 11 2003, 10:15 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (AirForceJetFan @ Nov 11 2003, 10:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--RblJet[/i]@Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM
    [b] Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    Funny thing is, those worthless sh**bags are still doing more than most who sit on their a&#036;&#036;es screaming from the top of their lungs about patriotism and freedom but when it comes down to it, don&#39;t have the b@lls to get up and join to serve. <_< [/b][/quote]
    These fools who love the war so much ought to crawl out from under their mousepads and join the ARMY&#33; Come on guys put your lives where your mouth is.

    Stop paying lip service and dollars to patriotism&#33;

    As TR said get in the arena&#33;

  13. #13
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan+Nov 11 2003, 10:15 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (AirForceJetFan @ Nov 11 2003, 10:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--RblJet[/i]@Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM
    [b] Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    Funny thing is, those worthless sh**bags are still doing more than most who sit on their a&#036;&#036;es screaming from the top of their lungs about patriotism and freedom but when it comes down to it, don&#39;t have the b@lls to get up and join to serve. <_< [/b][/quote]
    Yeah, that&#39;s right. Only those eligible to serve or serving should have any say in foreign policy or the defense of our country.

    Using your logic if you personnally are not in Afghanistan or Iraq, or in the military being shot at daily, I guess you have no right to comment either. If you don&#39;t have the b@lls to request transfer to a unit over there or the b@lls to go AWOL, I guess you have no right to scream at the top of your lungs against.

    I have as much of a right to demand my family be protected by our government as you do not to want it. Since Iraqi bullets aren&#39;t flying at either of us, I guess that makes us pretty much equal.

  14. #14
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Spirit of Weeb+Nov 12 2003, 01:43 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (Spirit of Weeb @ Nov 12 2003, 01:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by -AirForceJetFan@Nov 11 2003, 10:15 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin--RblJet[/i]@Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM
    [b] Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    Funny thing is, those worthless sh**bags are still doing more than most who sit on their a&#036;&#036;es screaming from the top of their lungs about patriotism and freedom but when it comes down to it, don&#39;t have the b@lls to get up and join to serve. <_< [/b][/quote]
    Yeah, that&#39;s right. Only those eligible to serve or serving should have any say in foreign policy or the defense of our country.

    Using your logic if you personnally are not in Afghanistan or Iraq, or in the military being shot at daily, I guess you have no right to comment either. If you don&#39;t have the b@lls to request transfer to a unit over there or the b@lls to go AWOL, I guess you have no right to scream at the top of your lungs against.

    I have as much of a right to demand my family be protected by our government as you do not to want it. Since Iraqi bullets aren&#39;t flying at either of us, I guess that makes us pretty much equal. [/b][/quote]
    Actually Weeb, let me explain something to you. Deploying to the ME is not done on a volunteer basis, if it was I would have gone on the team my unit sent out a few weeks prior to the start of the conflict.

    The way we deploy is by having pre-designated individuals that will deploy if called upon within a certain time frame. At the time of our last deployment I personally was not on that list. Not by choice, it&#39;s just done randomly.

    However, if we are to send any troops prior to Dec. I will be on that team, I will go, and I&#39;ll do my job.

    Nice try though.

  15. #15
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Spirit of Weeb[/i]@Nov 12 2003, 01:43 AM
    [b]
    Yeah, that&#39;s right. Only those eligible to serve or serving should have any say in foreign policy or the defense of our country.

    Using your logic if you personnally are not in Afghanistan or Iraq, or in the military being shot at daily, I guess you have no right to comment either. If you don&#39;t have the b@lls to request transfer to a unit over there or the b@lls to go AWOL, I guess you have no right to scream at the top of your lungs against.

    I have as much of a right to demand my family be protected by our government as you do not to want it. Since Iraqi bullets aren&#39;t flying at either of us, I guess that makes us pretty much equal. [/b][/quote]
    I just don&#39;t understand this type of rationale. It&#39;s kind of like after 9-11 when Chipper Jones said he wished he was serving in the military. Hey Chipper, nobody was stopping you from joining. If I felt as passionately about a cause as so many people claim (not just on this board but day to day) , I would do everything in my power to get behind that cause and do everything I could to contribute to the max instead of sitting around and letting somebody else do it for me. To each his own I suppose. Military life isn&#39;t for just anybody.

  16. #16
    [quote][i]Originally posted by RblJet[/i]@Nov 11 2003, 01:15 AM
    [b] Those are the ones who joined the army for the GI bill of other benefits and are usually worthless s**tbags to begin with. [/b][/quote]
    BTW rbl, just to touch on that statement. I see where you&#39;re coming from because there are a few who don&#39;t want to fight but I can guarantee you that the vast majority of people in the military did not join for love of country, that comes with the time you spend in the military but you really can&#39;t fault them.

    How many armed forces commercials say "come join the Navy, Marines, Air Force, Army, Coast Guard and get your a&#036;&#036; shot off. I&#39;m not saying they should advertise this way, just that the very benifits you&#39;re accusing people of taking advantage of is exactly what the military uses to get them on board.

    HOWEVER...if they are too stupid to take in to account that along with those benifits comes the possiblity of having to go to war then too bad. You&#39;re an adult when you join and you can think for yourself. Its the friggin military.

    As far as those objecting, I think some of that has to do with the fact that people don&#39;t feel like they&#39;re fighting for America. George W. Bush has said himself "we have no evidence that was ties Sadaam to 9-11" and now the hunt for WMD is pretty much forgotten so some feel like they got screwed. I&#39;m sure there are those who would b&#33;tch and moan regardless of the situation but I tend to think that those upset with what they are told have a legit point.

    I&#39;m just trying to see everybodys side of the situation. Things aren&#39;t always as black and white as some tend to think.

  17. #17
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan[/i]@Nov 12 2003, 10:02 AM
    [b] I just don&#39;t understand this type of rationale. It&#39;s kind of like after 9-11 when Chipper Jones said he wished he was serving in the military. Hey Chipper, nobody was stopping you from joining. If I felt as passionately about a cause as so many people claim (not just on this board but day to day) , I would do everything in my power to get behind that cause and do everything I could to contribute to the max instead of sitting around and letting somebody else do it for me. To each his own I suppose. Military life isn&#39;t for just anybody. [/b][/quote]
    Some people have physical handicaps. Do they have no right to demand an active military?

    Many women can&#39;t serve in direct combat. Do they have no right to demand an active military?

    Some of the population is elderly. Do they have no right to demand an active military?

    Some served in peace time and retired safe and sound. Do they have no right to demand an active military?

    Some had the opportunity to join in peace time and choose other ways to support their families. Do they have no right to demand an active military?

    This liberal premise that if you didn&#39;t serve, you have no right to comment, is pure and utter nonsense and like everything else, a smokescreen to cloud the issues.

    How many civilians support one soldier in the field? I guess those civilians supporting but not taking the bullets have no right to support the war.

    Does the fact that Pat Tillman of the Cardinals left a contract for millions of &#036; and fame to enlist and fight for his country sway your opinion of the war? If he made a statement that the war is right and all those against are Chicken-Doves, would that make it fact?

    When one can&#39;t debate a point and has to resort to name calling, that&#39;s when they should know their position is weak.

  18. #18
    Weeb, maybe you should read my post again before commenting only this time pay attention to what I said and not see it how you want to. my EXACT statement was "I would do everything in my power". If somebody falls in to any of the categories you mentioned then serving is obviously not within their power but there are other ways they can help no matter how little it may seem. However, for those who are able bodied and of age but refuse to lay it on the line to defend their way of life while at the same time tyring to second guess or criticize those who serve honorably while questioning the motives of their leadership is a little bit odd to me. As I said word for word in the beginning of my post "I don&#39;t understand this type of rationale" but respectfully...to each his/her own.

  19. #19
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by AirForceJetFan[/i]@Nov 12 2003, 01:29 PM
    [b] Weeb, maybe you should read my post again before commenting only this time pay attention to what I said and not see it how you want to. my EXACT statement was "I would do everything in my power". If somebody falls in to any of the categories you mentioned then serving is obviously not within their power but there are other ways they can help no matter how little it may seem. However, for those who are able bodied and of age but refuse to lay it on the line to defend their way of life while at the same time tyring to second guess or criticize those who serve honorably while questioning the motives of their leadership is a little bit odd to me. As I said word for word in the beginning of my post "I don&#39;t understand this type of rationale" but respectfully...to each his/her own. [/b][/quote]
    Then we&#39;re even, because I don&#39;t understand how someone that calls themselves AirForceJetFan can not see how either of these wars are justified and necessary.

    I didn&#39;t say easy, I said justified.

  20. #20
    Weeb, initially I supported this entire effort because I believed it when i was told Sadaam had ties to 9-11. I would have liked more evidence but I didn&#39;t think our prez would send people to die without real proof.

    I also believed that WMD existed in the mass stockpiles that were reported by the administration but it&#39;s having common sense that has allowed me to second guess these claims. I won&#39;t get in to it again but I stated on another thread that blind faith is what leads political followers to look foolish when they refuse to acknowledge that something wrong was done.

    I&#39;m not afraid to admit it. I believed the reports at first but now that we have admitted no ties to 9-11 and no WMD stockpiles/immediate threat to US from Iraq, I can say I was wrong.

    What worries me is this...if Iraq did posess WMD and we knew what they had, and how much they had of it as announced in the state of the union how the hell did we allow the Iraqui intel. agencies to outsmart ours in moving them out of country without being detected? Not a good thing.

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