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Thread: My Life Story

  1. #1
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    25/white/male

    I would like to tell my experience thus far to help elaborate where I'm coming from and how I have come to form my views and opinions. Maybe my experience can help you guys understand me better. I'm sure this will be used as fuel by people such as Come Back to NY or whoever, but so what.

    My Father:
    My father grew up poor in Queens a few blocks from Shea Stadium. He was the son of an electrician. As a teenager he was a hippie, he went to Woodstock, protests in Washington D.C., the whole nine yards. He graduated from St. Johns and applied for law school at a new school in Vermont called Green Mountain Law School since it was very hard to get into a well-known established school.

    After Law School he got married to my mother and lived with his cousin for a year and began working for the Democratic Party in Queens. He worked long hours doing $hit work for them trying to get Republicans off the ballot. After saving up enough money he bought a small house in Manhasset, LI. He sold that house after I was born and my mother was pregnant again; we moved to a new house in Brookville, LI (Between Glen Cove and Oyster Bay on the north shore of LI for anyone not familiar.) Brookville was listed as the second wealthiest zip code in America recently. Busta Rhymes got out-bid on my neighborís house. Anyway the point is we were obviously very well off.

    My father continues to do volunteer work for the Democrats in Queens despite the fact that he is a Republican and has voted Republican across the board for as long as I can remember. He votes Republican for one reason only, MONEY. He despises the 30K in property taxes he has to pay every year and he wants his stocks to perform well.

    My Mother:
    Not much of consequence other than she is from a wealthy family in Rochester and was raised Republican as well, but doesn't hold any strong political views.

    Myself:
    Growing up where I did I was very naive. I never really had any strong political views because I lived a sheltered life. I went to private schools my whole life and always considered myself a Republican. When I was 18 I even voted for Dole. (I was off at a $30K/year boarding school in CT and it just seemed right.) I even hung a sign on my dorm room door that said "Don't blame me I voted for Dole." Anyway along came College. I attended George Washington University located 2 blocks from the White House and immediately started dating a girl. She was the president of the young Democrats from her public school in Tennessee. I've been with her ever since and she has opened my eyes to so many things (not just politics.)

    At College I met so many people from different backgrounds and cultures that it really opened my eyes. Most students were receiving some sort of financial aid and actually had to have jobs to support themselves. I hade friends from all over the world, one of my best friends was from Oman. He was able to give me a completely different perspective on everything. (No he was not a crazed Muslim; he loved it here and would have liked to stay.) The summer of my junior year I spent a month traveling around Europe on my own money and got to see all the different cultures over there.

    I started working during College and eventually worked fulltime and went to school part-time and graduated with a BS in Computer Science in 5 years. Once I started making money I voluntarily cut myself off financially from my parents. (There was no falling out; it just felt right to pay for my own rent and expenses.)

    After a year on my own my girlfriend and I decided to buy a house in D.C. After growing up in the suburbs we both wanted to live in the City. We couldn't afford the most affluent neighborhoods of D.C. like Georgetown, Capital Hill, or Cleveland Park (unless we wanted to live in a POS tiny place 20 blocks from a Metro station.) We found a huge place in a poor predominantly black neighborhood 1 block from a brand new Metro station. It is perfect it just needs a lot of modernization since it was built in 1920. Living in this neighborhood has given me even more exposure to how most American's live. While I'm worried about how I'm going to afford an $80K renovation project, my neighbors are worried about how they are going to pay their rent, or when their social security check will come in.

    I am living the American Dream. My household income is over $100K, I own a house at 25 that has skyrocketed in value to over $600K, and I have a great job as a federal contractor. Although I am well off, I realize the factors that led to this. I am able to put things in perspective; most Americans did not have the same privileges as I have. I see the inequalities everywhere and I feel like rather than be selfish like my father I should stand up for my beliefs rather than for my wallet.

    I hope you all enjoyed my little story, and hopefully it will be a benefit rather than something for someone to use as ammo. I feel that I've grown as a person and my political views are based on seeing things from both sides of the tracks. Maybe some of you young Republican's like Mavrik can go through the same sort of transformation. I realize a lot of my posts have been immature, but I am still only 25 and itís easy for me to get caught up in the moment. Share your stories if you like, I think it is helpful to get a perspective.

  2. #2
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 28 2004, 02:28 AM
    [b] Myself:
    Growing up where I did I was very naive. [/b][/quote]
    and it only got worse!

  3. #3
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    Section -

    Do you feel guilty for being born an affluent white male? (This is a serious question)

    I promise this isn't a lead-in question and I am not interested in partisan "gotcha!" points so I won't pounce on any "wrong" answer - I am just interested in how you interpret this question.

    Some people can certainly feel "lucky" or "grateful" to be born suchly, others seem to move towards more than that and lean towards guilt over it. Just interested in your personal take, given that you and I seem to come from similar backgrounds (save for the Democratic parents - mine were always, 100% Irish-Catholic GOP lifers who are to the right of the Pope.) I was raised in the burbs in northern NJ (a little town called Mountain Lakes). My parents are both from The Island, and moved out to raise a family. My mom's family was loaded (had live-in servants, etc) and my dad's family was piss-poor...so much so that my grandfather advised my father against marrying my mother because of the income differentials involved.

    My dad paid his way through college, being an RA and doing ROTC at Holy Cross, and served as a Lt. Commander in the Navy during Vietman, had six children (one girl, 5 boys) one of which was autistic, and became a lawyer. My dad actually served with John Kerry in the Navy during Vietnam.

    My father became General Counsel (higest ranking lawyer) for Citicorp 20 years ago and retired from the firm this past year. My mother also became a lawyer and is presently one of the Deputy Attorney Generals for the State of NJ, and works primarily with the Division of Youth Services. I went to a private, Catholic High School, an Ivy League College and currently work for an institutional investment management firm. Like you, my family always had money - I didn't owe a single penny when I graduated from college.

    I am 29, married and own a home in Cohasset, MA. I do not believe in god, however, my wife does and we do go to church every Sunday and I contribute a large % of my income to Catholic Charities - I also play the guitar at mass every so often.

    We do not yet have children, however, we are trying...and frankly, not having much success, which is a whole 'nother depressing story in and of itself. If we are lucky enough to have children (I will 100% adopt if thinsg don't go well) we have agreed to raise them Catholic. (Another long story)

    I am considered a "reactionary" on this board, but I am by far the most "liberal" member of my family. My oppostition to the death penalty and the war on drugs and my (recently articulated) support for gay marriage earn me light-hearted ridicule from family members, including my wife who is VERY conservative (politically - it's not like she doesn't know how to have fun)

    I also am rip-s**t pissed at Bush for his out of control discretionary spending habits and inability to say "no" to any bill, and have also expressed on numerous occasions how embarassed I was with the GOP regarding the Clinton Impeachment fiasco - that was my low-point as a conservative...although Bush's big government experiment is climbing the list rapidly....

  4. #4
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    Come Back to NY: Thanks for that well thought out response. I would expect nothing less.

    [quote][b]Do you feel guilty for being born an affluent white male? (This is a serious question)
    [/b][/quote]

    Jets5ever: Thanks for the response.
    In answer to your question I'm not sure. I don't necessarily think of it in those terms. I feel that I was simply ignorant to how America really works and once I was able to see the world from many different perspectives my views changed. I realize that although I may be well off not everyone is so fortunate and it is not necessarily their fault. I know people who work 10x harder than me struggling to get by. I don't consider myself a bleeding heart liberal; I feel my views are based on giving everyone their fair share of the pie. (No I'm not a socialist either.) For example, Bush's tax cuts are going to save me a lot of money this year because of my income bracket, yet I still want them repealed as they are, in my opinion not for the greater good of the country.

    Here is another example, the first time my girlfriend from Tenn. came to my parents house in NY, guess what was the most surprising thing for her? She couldn't believe the amount of black people who drove nice cars. Where she is from black people drive horrible run down cars. (Also the absence of pick-up trucks was pretty surprising.) Anyway the point is that we shouldn't live in a bubble, even if things seem fine in one area of the country it doesn't mean they are the same everywhere.

    Well I seem to have gone off on a tangent; I hope I answered your question ;)

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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 28 2004, 11:36 AM
    [b] Jets5ever: Thanks for the response. In answer to your question I'm not sure. I feel that I was simply ignorant..... [/b][/quote]
    quit while you're ahead! :P

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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 28 2004, 02:28 AM
    [b] I am living the American Dream. My household income is over $100K, I own a house at 25 that has skyrocketed in value to over $600K, and I have a great job as a federal contractor. Although I am well off, I realize the factors that led to this. I am able to put things in perspective; most Americans did not have the same privileges as I have. I see the inequalities everywhere and I feel like rather than be selfish like my father I should stand up for my beliefs rather than for my wallet.
    [/b][/quote]
    Good for you.

    The courage to amass such wealth and priviledge while you bite the hand that feeds you (Uncle Sam) makes you quite the hero with your leftist friends.

    You know, if you posted something like: "My income was $100k working in a cushy job, but I gave it all up to work in a homeless shelter..." or "My home is worth $600k, but I sold it, gave the profits to Greenpeace. I now live in a trailer that I share with a homeless family..." I may have more respect for your position.

    So, you live in a $600k house. Pretty big. How do you heat it or cool it? How do you light it?

    Face it, your bashing "rich Republicans" holds as much water as Babs Streisand telling me to conserve energy and dry my clothes on a clothesline.

    Guess it's just about the oil.

  7. #7
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Spirit of Weeb+Jan 28 2004, 05:03 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (Spirit of Weeb @ Jan 28 2004, 05:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 28 2004, 02:28 AM
    [b] I am living the American Dream. My household income is over &#036;100K, I own a house at 25 that has skyrocketed in value to over &#036;600K, and I have a great job as a federal contractor. Although I am well off, I realize the factors that led to this. I am able to put things in perspective; most Americans did not have the same privileges as I have. I see the inequalities everywhere and I feel like rather than be selfish like my father I should stand up for my beliefs rather than for my wallet.
    [/b][/quote]
    Good for you.

    The courage to amass such wealth and priviledge while you bite the hand that feeds you (Uncle Sam) makes you quite the hero with your leftist friends.

    You know, if you posted something like: "My income was &#036;100k working in a cushy job, but I gave it all up to work in a homeless shelter..." or "My home is worth &#036;600k, but I sold it, gave the profits to Greenpeace. I now live in a trailer that I share with a homeless family..." I may have more respect for your position.

    So, you live in a &#036;600k house. Pretty big. How do you heat it or cool it? How do you light it?

    Face it, your bashing "rich Republicans" holds as much water as Babs Streisand telling me to conserve energy and dry my clothes on a clothesline.

    Guess it&#39;s just about the oil. [/b][/quote]
    Weeb...be patient....part II of this cliffhanger is when and why he now hates America. ;)

    BTW: I&#39;m sure his pappy is proud to be called selfish in public by the son he brought up...

  8. #8
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    SectionRow, it&#39;s called "white man&#39;s guilt," and your admitted naivete facilitated your indoctrination, hook line and sinker. As long as you seem to have an interest in learning why things are the way they are, why not take some time researching Lip-Service Liberals who claim to fight for the common man, but in reality do nothing but foster generation after generation of welfare families -- conditioned to be "taken care of" by just-enough-to-get-by handouts and bloated, bass-ackwards govt. programs. Liberals do NOTHING to truly help the bottom rung of society -- rather they exert tremendous energies to keep the status quo down there. Unfortunately, one of the things liberal democrats do so well is successfully (and untruthfully) blame conservative Republicans for the mess. It&#39;s a perfect scheme...as long as the downtrodden have no hope -- and as long as the Republicans can be blamed for it -- the dems can count on those votes.

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    [quote][b]It&#39;s a perfect scheme...as long as the downtrodden have no hope -- and as long as the Republicans can be blamed for it -- the dems can count on those votes.
    [/b][/quote]

    Or as long as the poor are un-educated, illegal aliens, or convicted of a crime; the Republicans have nothing to worry about from them. They can continue to get rich on the backs of the poor, and remain in office.

    [quote][b]You know, if you posted something like: "My income was &#036;100k working in a cushy job, but I gave it all up to work in a homeless shelter..." or "My home is worth &#036;600k, but I sold it, gave the profits to Greenpeace. I now live in a trailer that I share with a homeless family..." I may have more respect for your position.

    So, you live in a &#036;600k house. Pretty big. How do you heat it or cool it? How do you light it?

    Face it, your bashing "rich Republicans" holds as much water as Babs Streisand telling me to conserve energy and dry my clothes on a clothesline.
    [/b][/quote]

    You are right it would be more honerable to give up all my worldly possesions, but as you know that is far fetched for most people. D.C. has a very high cost-of-living. I have to pay my mortgage and other bills. I have a lot of major renovations I have to pay for. My girlfriend has thousands of dollars in student loans we need to pay off. So even though I make a lot I have a lot of expenses.

    I do try to do my part though. We are members of the local community group where we help clean up the neighborhood, give free computer training to kids and seniors, and things of that nature. We donate our old clothes to Goodwill. Our phone company is a non-profit that it&#39;s proceeds go to liberal causes. We use mass-transit instead of driving. All our new appliances we buy are energy efficient. Your right though, I could do more, but being 25 years old I have to establish myself first. I predict in a few years I will have a ton of disposable income and time to dedicate to good causes.

  10. #10
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 28 2004, 06:34 PM
    [b] [quote][b]It&#39;s a perfect scheme...as long as the downtrodden have no hope -- and as long as the Republicans can be blamed for it -- the dems can count on those votes.
    [/b][/quote]

    Or as long as the poor are un-educated, illegal aliens, or convicted of a crime; the Republicans have nothing to worry about from them. They can continue to get rich on the backs of the poor, and remain in office.

    [/b][/quote]
    Let me get this straight: It&#39;s the Republicans&#39; fault that illegal aliens are illegal aliens, and that convicted criminals are convicted criminals?

    Categorizing your position as ludicrous would be giving you way too much credit.

  11. #11
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    This tread has gotten way off topic. The purpose was for people to share their stories and try to explain how they have come to hold their current beliefs. Jets5ever is the only one who took this seriously and has my utmost respect even though we don&#39;t share the same views.

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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 29 2004, 10:56 AM
    [b]This tread has gotten way off topic. The purpose was for people to share their stories and try to explain how they have come to hold their current beliefs. Jets5ever is the only one who took this seriously and has my utmost respect even though we don&#39;t share the same views.[/b][/quote]
    The thread is right on the topic and proves what a hypocrite you are....much like most liberals.

    You chide the President for being a "child of privilage" yet you were brought up in much the same way (&#036;30K for boarding school?? My tuition as St John&#39;s when I left in &#39;86 was &#036;3600 a year plus another 5K for rent/food) and now you brag about how much money you make, what your house is worth.

    The biggest crock and further proof of what a total hypocrite you are is the statement, "I am living the American Dream," yet all you do is berate this nation....

    Why should anyone expect otherwise...you are a confirmed democRAT and like the hypocrites of that party cry for the impoverished while they (the Rats in goverment) are the wealthiest of the two parties (personnel holdings, etc.)

    You are also full of sh&#33;t; if you were a man (loosely held term) of your beliefs you&#39;d live in a two bedroom apartment and because your girlfriend is a retard,

    "[i]Here is another example, the first time my girlfriend from Tenn. came to my parents house in NY, guess what was the most surprising thing for her? She couldn&#39;t believe the amount of black people who drove nice cars. Where she is from black people drive horrible run down cars[/i]"

    you want to generalize that as "how America works".

  13. #13
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    [quote][b]You chide the President for being a "child of privilage" yet you were brought up in much the same way (&#036;30K for boarding school?? My tuition as St John&#39;s when I left in &#39;86 was &#036;3600 a year plus another 5K for rent/food) and now you brag about how much money you make, what your house is worth.
    [/b][/quote]

    Your right, I had just as many privileges as the President, and I readily admit it. But I realize, unlike Bush, that I was fortunate and not everyone has the same advantages. I am not fighting to keep these rights, I am on my own making my own living. I do not rely on daddy to bail me out and support me.

    [quote][b]Why should anyone expect otherwise...you are a confirmed democRAT and like the hypocrites of that party cry for the impoverished while they (the Rats in goverment) are the wealthiest of the two parties (personnel holdings, etc.)
    [/b][/quote]

    Thatís interesting, are you trying to say that if you combined the wealth of all the Democrats and compared it to all the Republicans that the Democrats would be more? BTW, I&#39;ve said this a million times, I&#39;m not a Democrat. Most Democrats piss me off, they are the lesser of two evils.

    [quote][b]You are also full of sh&#33;t; if you were a man (loosely held term) of your beliefs you&#39;d live in a two bedroom apartment and because your girlfriend is a retard,
    [/b][/quote]

    I lived in a 1 bedroom apartment for 3 years and the rent was more than my freaken mortgage. I got really lucky with my house appreciating so much.

    My girlfriend is a retard? I don&#39;t know many retards that graduated with a 3.7 GPA and 2 degrees, a BA in International affairs and a BS in Economics. A retard doesn&#39;t get sponsored by Senator Bill Frist&reg; to go to the Naval Acadamy.

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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Jan 29 2004, 11:30 AM
    [b] [quote][b]You chide the President for being a "child of privilage" yet you were brought up in much the same way (&#036;30K for boarding school?? My tuition as St John&#39;s when I left in &#39;86 was &#036;3600 a year plus another 5K for rent/food) and now you brag about how much money you make, what your house is worth.
    [/b][/quote]

    Your right, I had just as many privileges as the President, and I readily admit it. But I realize, unlike Bush, that I was fortunate and not everyone has the same advantages. I am not fighting to keep these rights, I am on my own making my own living. I do not rely on daddy to bail me out and support me.

    [quote][b]Why should anyone expect otherwise...you are a confirmed democRAT and like the hypocrites of that party cry for the impoverished while they (the Rats in goverment) are the wealthiest of the two parties (personnel holdings, etc.)
    [/b][/quote]

    Thatís interesting, are you trying to say that if you combined the wealth of all the Democrats and compared it to all the Republicans that the Democrats would be more? BTW, I&#39;ve said this a million times, I&#39;m not a Democrat. Most Democrats piss me off, they are the lesser of two evils.

    [quote][b]You are also full of sh&#33;t; if you were a man (loosely held term) of your beliefs you&#39;d live in a two bedroom apartment and because your girlfriend is a retard,
    [/b][/quote]

    I lived in a 1 bedroom apartment for 3 years and the rent was more than my freaken mortgage. I got really lucky with my house appreciating so much.

    My girlfriend is a retard? I don&#39;t know many retards that graduated with a 3.7 GPA and 2 degrees, a BA in International affairs and a BS in Economics. A retard doesn&#39;t get sponsored by Senator Bill Fristģ to go to the Naval Acadamy. [/b][/quote]
    A retard would be surprised that blacks/greens/whites/purples drive nice cars. Someone even more ignorant would take that statement as an indication of America in general.

    As I&#39;ve posted before...your a stupid young man who needs to live a lot more life and your above response proves it.

  15. #15
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    Shakin - I agree completely about white man&#39;s guilt being a real "thing."

    However, I think this broad topic goes a little outside of politics. Section MAY be a classic case of White Man&#39;s Guilt.

    However, there is also a more braod sense of guilt that some people in modern societies tend to have. Have you ever heard people say things like, "Look, I came from nothing and I made myself what I am today through hard work, etc." This is often true in the sense that they have achieved. But, thousands of peoples have worked for thousands of years to create and develop a society such that any individual&#39;s highly specialized skill set enables them to have enough value to live comfortably in leisure. The machinery involved in this computer I use was developed without any assistance from me, the company I work for is not due to my efforts- the protection I get from laws and government are not due to my endeavors. Simply - we are able to produce a small, specialized fraction of output yet that enables us to have access to almost all types of goods. All of us enjoy a wide variety of essential and non-essential goods that are available to us at low prices. That is astounding. Most &#39;self-made men&#39; merely come from poverty - the DON&#39;T build the house that they live in, or kill the food that they eat, or till the land they use, or wire their own house for heat, or build their own automobile, etc. We all reap the benefits of an economic system we did nothing to help create and if you measured our actual production, it is barely enough for us to sruvive on our own.

    If not for this societal factor, we would all be savages comepeting for berries and vermin and our [i]actual [/i]production would be the deciding factor in regards to the access we have to a variety of essential and nonessential goods. This is nothing that Economics 101 doesn&#39;t tell you and this theme has been the plot line for many a movie, where an affluent person is suddenly stranded and unable to fend for themself off of the land.

    But it is a bit more complex than merely white man&#39;s guilt and is definitely me rambling on a tangent :( . Perhaps some of this is what Section is experiencing...which can be exacerbated by being born into a rich family. This kind of guilt is more internalized and less focused on third parties, while white mans guilt tends to be directed at designated victim groups. The "guilt" I am talking about is really just an elabroate form of being grateful, I suppose....

    Sorry to ramble...

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    [quote][b]A retard would be surprised that blacks/greens/whites/purples drive cars.
    [/b][/quote]

    Not that they drive cars, that they drive nice cars; maybe you should work on your reading comprehension skills. Take a trip down to Tennessee and you will see what I&#39;m talking about (Or practically anywhere else in America.)

    [quote][b]Sorry to ramble...
    [/b][/quote]

    Ramble on....I find your opinions are expressed very rationally and coherently, unlike others who just want to rant and rave.

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    I haven&#39;t had time to elaborate on my story, but kudos to 5ever for showing the only civility on this thread from the conservative side.

    As long as Spirit of Weeb and Come Back to NY continue to jump into every thread with their nastiness, I don&#39;t think you&#39;ll EVER be considered "reactionary" around here. They even admit to being reactionary in their own anecdotes of why they scream so hard for the right -- Weeb keeps bringing up the OJ Trial as the turning point in his politics, and Come Back talks about anti-war protests he demonstrated against and the idiots he saw there. It would be like me judging all of conservatism and Republicans solely on the people who heckle Matthew Sheppard&#39;s funeral or the Kenneth Lay scandal. I know tailgators does some of the same things and should be called on it as well on occasion; I hate seeing the bar lowered here by the same usual suspects.

    And for the record Weeb, as I&#39;ve said 100 times, I live in one of the HUBS of all things whacky and leftist and am often considered "right wing" jokingly by most of the people I bicker with in town. I have NEVER heard a single sympathetic remark on OJ Simpson&#39;s behalf from ANYONE in Ithaca. To hear them wax on the topic, OJ and his saga embodies all that is wrong and evil about sports culture, testosterone, machismo, "buying" justice, Television, husbands who think they own their wives, penises, and having too much money and influence.

    It&#39;s almost ridiculous to the other extreme from your caricature; hollywood airheads and activist leftists mix about as much as oil and water -- much less, unfortunately, than neocon libertarians and religious nuts. When all is said and done, the reason the Republican machinery is so much better-oiled than the Democrats&#39; right now is simply their ability to coexist their factions peacefully enough to keep voters on the same page (well, that and using 9/11 as a catch-all justification for everything).

    I agree there is a certain "White Man&#39;s Guilt" that exists in America, but I disagree it comes solely from affluent liberals. Pretty much all religions teach guilt as an instrument of humility, many of the more devout forms of Buddhism and evangelical Christianity going so far as to demonize wealth and luxury much like Marxism does. The right wing has busted its ass trying to shove sexual guilt down people&#39;s throats, and tell people that if they&#39;re poor they deserve it and need to just work harder. I absolutely believe more accountability is needed in people, and there is a role that parenting, government programs, or schooling play in that -- but I think both the Left and Right often try to preach their message through guilt in bad ways. Societies that have had bad wars in their past are often paralyzed by a certain guilt -- modern-day Germany comes to mind, or even the American history with Indians, which some want to completely forget or justify and others can&#39;t stop harping on. Mass self-loathing is never a good trait for a society, period.

    I&#39;m just sick to death of the cliche of painting all liberalism as arising out of self-loathing, laziness, guilt, or anti-Americanism. It sure as hell doesn&#39;t for me, and many people I know. And I&#39;ve seen plenty of people on the right who exhibit all of those traits in their own ways.

  18. #18
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Jet Set Junta[/i]@Jan 29 2004, 12:26 PM
    [b] I haven&#39;t had time to elaborate on my story, but kudos to 5ever for showing the only civility on this thread from the conservative side.

    As long as Spirit of Weeb and Come Back to NY continue to jump into every thread with their nastiness, I don&#39;t think you&#39;ll EVER be considered "reactionary" around here. They even admit to being reactionary in their own anecdotes of why they scream so hard for the right -- Weeb keeps bringing up the OJ Trial as the turning point in his politics, and Come Back talks about anti-war protests he demonstrated against and the idiots he saw there. It would be like me judging all of conservatism and Republicans solely on the people who heckle Matthew Sheppard&#39;s funeral or the Kenneth Lay scandal. [/b][/quote]
    You&#39;re being rather presumptuous here....my judgment of liberals did not only come from those I demonstrated against and had face to face confrontations against. It actually started from the hatred spewed out of the mouths of people like Robert Byrd, Ted Kennedy and Al Gore; icons of the liberal movement; men in power who had the opportunity to take care of the present situation but chose to do nothing about it.

    And I do think anyone who berates America, does not support our troops and continually says America is wrong because "it pisses off so many people" yet at the same time proudly states they are "living the American dream" is a hypocrite.

    To try and generalize polarization/problems in America because your girlfriend is surprised black people in NY drive nice cars is sheer and total ignorance.

  19. #19
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Jet Set Junta[/i]@Jan 29 2004, 12:26 PM
    [b] It would be like me judging all of conservatism and Republicans solely on the people who heckle Matthew Sheppard&#39;s funeral or the Kenneth Lay scandal. I know tailgators does some of the same things and should be called on it as well on occasion; I hate seeing the bar lowered here by the same usual suspects.
    [/b][/quote]
    jet Set...I vigorously object to this characterization of me.

  20. #20
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    Jet Set-

    Great post. It&#39;s funny, but the closer we always seem to get to election time, the more and more I am reminded of why I really don&#39;t identify with [i]either[/i] major party. They both sicken me in a lot of ways....


    Too much demagoguery, pandering, cliches, fearful speech (fearful of speaking "wrongly" such that all speech in elections are watered-down sound bites written by handlers and not true discourse)

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