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Thread: AROD deal is what is wrong with Baseball

  1. #1
    Talk about overkill. The yanks aquire the best SS in baseball to put alongside the 2nd or 3rd best SS in baseball. It instantly makes the lineup unstoppable and makes the Yanks the instant favorite to win, no make that, sweep the WS.

    The other teams have no shot....the Yanks have too much firepower. So, to all other teams, they basically have to hope that an injury sidelines a yankee player or that one of the better ones gets caught and suspended for the year using drugs or something.

    How is this trade good for baseball? Its already a sport where some teams may never win again....Pirates, Reds, Devil Rays, Tigers, Padres, Rockies....

    The fan base is eroding because its becoming a 4-7 team race every year.

    Football is a good example of what should be done...Establish a hard cap, keep FA's in the mix, allow for greater scouting opportunities.

    The MLB with no cap means that this nonsense will continue and its sad because ultimatly this league will become the Yankess vs. every other team.

    I have nothing aginst AROD....but I do believe that going to the Yanks only furthers the divide of the haves from the have nots......

    If AROD goes to Boston, that wouldn't have guaranteed anything for them but it would have made for a great story line....now, we all know the ending to this season.

    LL (a sad mets fan who is now even more anxious for Football season)

  2. #2
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    The hard cap-protecting owners(supposedly wise businessmen who suddenly turn to idiots when they buy a sportsfranchise) from their checkbooks, and keeping players underpaid. If like the NFL a guaranteed percentage of all
    revenue was specifically designated for player salaries, some of that might make sense. The NFL's tv revenue and schedule make it somewhat easier, but may be a percentage of allr evenue might work. But you will always have haves and havenots(except idiots like the Mets).

    When you have cheapskates like Wilpon and Selig owning teams with no intention of spending any money in hopes of taking cash in pocket and tax losses on paper, why would the players ever agree? These scummers NEVER are willing to open their books. I'm not for a second buying that the players union is like the autoworkers or the coal miners. But when you have complete assh*les like these idiots and others , how could anyone trust the owners?

    And if you're Mets fan, how can you not be furious over how WiLpon is ruining this team? They could have pIEced together some Reyes/Kazmir deal for him, and they didn't even bother to look into it. DISGRACEFUL.

  3. #3
    While you all whine some more here is something more for the Sox fans to choke on.

    Texas will be giving the Yankees 67 million over the next 7 years to help offset the cost A-Rod' deal. What this means is that the Yankees will be paying 16 mill to A-ROD which I believe is less than what Jeter gets.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball...1p-144390c.html

  4. #4
    This argument that the Yankees are so overpowering NOW is kind of weak. Alfonso Soriano is one of the top 3 young players in baseball and is still getting better. How much better does Arod make the Yankees? They were already pretty awesome. They still have the same question marks with their starting staff.

    If anything the Yankees helped out baseball today. Now the Rangers can operate like a normal team. They should have never signed Arod to that deal, now the Yankees had to bail MLB out. When you are talking about a payroll that was already approaching $170 million this extra $7 mill (which is all AROD adds this season) is not a big deal.

    Jesus F'n Christ stop whining. Every fan of a team would die to have an owner like Steinbrenner.

  5. #5
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    Originally posted by Chrisrud@Feb 16 2004, 12:06 PM


    If anything the Yankees helped out baseball today.
    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

    good one.

  6. #6
    Originally posted by Chrisrud@Feb 16 2004, 12:06 PM
    This argument that the Yankees are so overpowering NOW is kind of weak. Alfonso Soriano is one of the top 3 young players in baseball and is still getting better. How much better does Arod make the Yankees? They were already pretty awesome. They still have the same question marks with their starting staff.

    If anything the Yankees helped out baseball today. Now the Rangers can operate like a normal team. They should have never signed Arod to that deal, now the Yankees had to bail MLB out. When you are talking about a payroll that was already approaching $170 million this extra $7 mill (which is all AROD adds this season) is not a big deal.

    Jesus F'n Christ stop whining. Every fan of a team would die to have an owner like Steinbrenner.
    You make a very good point. AROD isn't that much better than Soriano. And alo consider the fact that Yankee stadium is like death to right handed power hitters. The only thing AROD does substantially better than Soriano is make contact with the ball whereas Soriano strikes out an aweful lot. Texas is a hitters park and Soriano is now assured of finally joining the 40/40 club which is an amazing feat. The last trade of this magnitute saw Griffey Jr going to the Reds. We all know the conclusion of that one.

    Also, your argument that the Yankees helped baseball today has some merit. Though I think overall this is bad for baseball, the Yanks bailed out what was once a very respectable franchise. If the Rangers were stuck with AROD they would have been mediocre-bad for at least 7 more years. However, this is exactly why baseball needs a hard cap.

  7. #7
    Originally posted by ScottishJet+Feb 16 2004, 12:10 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (ScottishJet @ Feb 16 2004, 12:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Chrisrud@Feb 16 2004, 12:06 PM


    If anything the Yankees helped out baseball today.
    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

    good one. [/b][/quote]
    Yea that was kind of said a little tongue in cheek. But there is some truth to it that they took the Rangers off the hook

  8. #8
    I agree. People act like we gave up a bag of baseballs for AROD. We gave up a good player in Soriano where if he improves his plate awareness he could be a top 5 player in baseball, a potential 50-50 guy. He was 1 homer shy of going 40-40 in only his second year in the big leagues.....

    AROD will help us more in the playoffs where he has the ability to hit good pitching. Something Soriano cannot do consistently. AROD wont strike out 27 times in the postseason. In addition he makes us much better defensively. We went from having an average defensive infield to a pretty good one.

    The Rangers are better off today to, they get some salary relief to move forward and improve the club (something the AROD deal was preventing them from doing) and at the same time they still got a good player out of the deal.

  9. #9
    I don&#39;t know if the Yankees did baseball a favor, but they sure did Arod a favor ... now he gets to be immortalized as a Yankee, as opposed to suffering the same fate as generations of the numerous great, yet ringless, Red Sox players

  10. #10
    ChrisRud & JetMan,

    You guys make great points. The Rangers got everything they could ask for in this deal. Flexability financially and a potential younger Vladamir Guerrero. By no means did the Yankees "pull one over" on MLB. Every non-Yankee fan will cry that this is unjust, when the fact of the matter is they could only wish for an owner like Steinbrenner. Even with a luxury tax built for him, Steinbrenner always puts his money on the line with the Yankees. Take a look at the new "Murderers&#39; Row" 2004 New York Yankees

    Kenny Lofton
    Derek Jeter
    A-Rod
    Jason Giambi
    Gary Sheffield
    Bernie Williams
    Jorge Posada
    Hideki Matsui
    Enrique Wilson

    First, you realize that your two prized offseason acquisitions are batting 3rd and 5th. Next imagine how much better this makes Jeter and Giambi&#33; :ph34r: Sure, the bottom 4 can be moved around, but does it really matter?&#33; :blink: It seems sureal...

  11. #11
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    Baseball isn&#39;t popular because every year something like this happens in which the Yankees get the best player.

    People around the country hate the Yankees and will forever think that they will win every year because they have all of the money.


    This is why Basketball and Football are 10 times more popular then Baseball.

    Especially football.

    In football any given sunday anyteam can win.

    I also think Football is the most popular because it has the shortest season and least amount of games.

    So everygame counts in the NFL no matter how you put it.

    My fav sports are Football and Baseball in a tie, but Baseball sucks for me and every fan right now except Yankee fans.

    I wish they&#39;d put a cap on Baseball, ban steroids, and the make the parks the original size instead of making them smaller.

    This would really make baseball exciting AGAIN.

  12. #12
    A nice little stat for you guys.

    NO TEAM HAS EVER WON A WORLD SERIES WITH A PLAYER WITH A &#036;100 MILLION CONTRACT. THE YANKEES NOW HAVE FOUR SUCH PLAYERS

  13. #13
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    Originally posted by latinlawyer@Feb 16 2004, 10:05 AM
    I have nothing aginst AROD....but I do believe that going to the Yanks only furthers the divide of the haves from the have nots......
    So if AROD went to Boston or the Mets it would have been good for baseball? Come on, they are part of the "&#036; haves &#036;" too.

    The only difference is the philosophy of owners (running the team as a win at all costs vs. this is a business too) & the number of championships.

  14. #14
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    Originally posted by Chrisrud@Feb 16 2004, 02:06 PM
    A nice little stat for you guys.

    NO TEAM HAS EVER WON A WORLD SERIES WITH A PLAYER WITH A &#036;100 MILLION CONTRACT. THE YANKEES NOW HAVE FOUR SUCH PLAYERS
    dork.(period)

    Your a Yankees, and are happy.

    Baseball is not a pure sport, its a joke, and the only truly happy fans are Yankee fans.

  15. #15
    TomShane
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    I have to agree it&#39;s irrelevant. When the Angels, with David Eckstein, and the Marlins, with IRod are winning rings, that would suggest that there&#39;s nothing wrong with the sport.

    What IS wrong with baseball is that it takes way too long to play out. Every game is 3 1/2 hrs. and it goes on for 8 months. Society is no longer geared for that kind of marathon season. I like baseball alot, but I cannot be passionate about it because I would burn out by the middle of June. This is why football is #1-- 16 chances to see your team play in the regular season, then, if you&#39;re lucky, you get 3-4 games after that. Boom. You&#39;re done. Baseball? It doesn&#39;t even COUNT for the first 20 games.

  16. #16
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    Originally posted by soppel+Feb 16 2004, 02:10 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (soppel @ Feb 16 2004, 02:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--latinlawyer@Feb 16 2004, 10:05 AM
    I have nothing aginst AROD....but I do believe that going to the Yanks only furthers the divide of the haves from the have nots......
    So if AROD went to Boston or the Mets it would have been good for baseball? Come on, they are part of the "&#036; haves &#036;" too.

    The only difference is the philosophy of owners (running the team as a win at all costs vs. this is a business too) & the number of championships. [/b][/quote]
    Again, Yankees fan, your happy the trade happened.

    Good for you pal.

    I&#39;m unhappy with the way Baseball is ran.

    Baseball accomadates every players little need.

    The NFL is a coaches league, where the coaches control the players, and thats the wya it should be.

  17. #17
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    Originally posted by TomShane@Feb 16 2004, 02:12 PM
    I have to agree it&#39;s irrelevant. When the Angels, with David Eckstein, and the Marlins, with IRod are winning rings, that would suggest that there&#39;s nothing wrong with the sport.

    What IS wrong with baseball is that it takes way too long to play out. Every game is 3 1/2 hrs. and it goes on for 8 months. Society is no longer geared for that kind of marathon season. I like baseball alot, but I cannot be passionate about it because I would burn out by the middle of June. This is why football is #1-- 16 chances to see your team play in the regular season, then, if you&#39;re lucky, you get 3-4 games after that. Boom. You&#39;re done. Baseball? It doesn&#39;t even COUNT for the first 20 games.
    Tomshane, I don&#39;t like you.

    But I agree 100%, took the words right out of my mouth.

    Maybe theres hope for the future in our relationship.

  18. #18
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    nice article by Peter Gammons- a Red Sox fan
    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/gammons/story?id=1736367

    Money for nothing with Yankees

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    By Peter Gammons
    Special to ESPN.com


    Feb. 16


    TAMPA, Fla. -- Fairness is not the issue because the rules are the rules. When the Red Sox worked their deals with Curt Schilling and Keith Foulke, they did what the Blue Jays or the Indians or the Padres couldn&#39;t afford to do. Just as what the Yankees did to get Alex Rodriguez was something only they could afford. That&#39;s just the way it is, good old-fashioned Republican baseball, and six strikes haven&#39;t changed the fact that the Yankees are in a different world from the Red Sox, who have a huge advantage over the Rangers or the A&#39;s, just as George W. Bush and John F. Kerry were born with an advantage because they were born rich.


    The Yankees did what the Red Sox couldn&#39;t -- close the deal.


    Boston felt it had to get money back from Rodriguez, the Yankees did not, and getting money back involves the rules. So when Boston had its window -- that time when Yankees general manager Brian Cashman admitted he was "scared" because of Theo Epstein&#39;s remarkable complimentary move to get Magglio Ordonez to replace Manny Ramirez -- the Red Sox made their decision that the additional &#036;4 million to &#036;6 million difference between Rodriguez and Ramirez was not worth it. When the Yankees had their window, well, it was like the Jackson Browne line, "It ain&#39;t like him to argue or pretend. Honey, let me introduce you to my redneck friend."


    So A-Rod is the Yankee third baseman because he so wanted out of Texas he was willing to either throw away &#036;28 million of his contract or switch from the position where he&#39;s arguably the best that ever played. Rangers owner Billy Sol Estes, er Tom Hicks, is happy. George Steinbrenner is cackling happy because he&#39;s Boone-d Larry Lucchino and the Red Sox.


    Of course, talk is cheap, A-Rod isn&#39;t and the &#036;72 million infield isn&#39;t, and the Diamondbacks, Angels and Marlins have won the last three World Series.


    Yankee officials have taken pains to point out they were fortunate in that several circumstances just happened here: Aaron Boone&#39;s rebound playing hoops could clear more than 80 percent of his salary off the books, Drew Henson went off to be the next Tom Brady clearing another &#036;10 million to &#036;14 million, and with the Rangers chipping in &#036;40 million over seven years (as well as picking up the &#036;27 million in deferrals, which Rodriguez restructured so the pay schedule doesn&#39;t start until 2016), the cost to Steinbrenner was calculated as &#036;90 million for seven years. Hey, he already had five of the 12 biggest contracts in the sport ... why not take a sixth, when it&#39;s the best player on the planet.


    What they don&#39;t point out is how fortunate Steinbrenner is to have one of the game&#39;s best general managers, one who works through the beating he takes. When Boone went to the hoop, Cashman called Oakland about Eric Chavez. No harm, no foul. He called the Cardinals about Albert Pujols. He called the Rangers about Rodriguez. But unlike the other rejections, the player and his agent got involved, and when A-Rod found out the Yankees were interested, he and Scott Boras pushed for it knowing that Steinbrenner wouldn&#39;t do what Boras claimed the Red Sox did, namely "walk away from the best player in the game."


    What the Yankees privately say they learned from the Red Sox-Rodriguez negotiations was how not to handle them. "Those negotiations were all public, on both sides," says one New York official. "When a deal like this is negotiated publicly, it has too many ways for it to fail. So we tried to keep it under the radar screen, and work it privately, and nothing came out until the last 48 hours."


    Brian Cashman kept the talks under everyone&#39;s radar.


    The Boston-Texas negotiations did turn into a fiasco, between Billy Sol Estes, er Tom Hicks, leaks to the Metroplex papers, meaningless deadlines and statement after statement by both sides, including the infamous Lucchino reaction to Gene Orza&#39;s initial rejection of the contract adjustment agreed to by Epstein and Rodriguez, which personally assaulted Orza and separated A-Rod from his fellow guild members and essentially eliminated what both Boras and Rodriguez believed would be a difference-splitting compromise between the original &#036;28 million agreement and Orza&#39;s &#036;12 million suggestion.


    The Yankees also knew that at the end of the season, if Boston bid adieu to Nomar Garciaparra, that the Ramirez-Rodriguez deal could be re-addressed. Steinbrenner had an opportunity to "Evil Empire" the Red Sox, which to him makes priceless sense. "The two key issues were the union signing off on the new deferrals and Alex agreeing to move to third, because Derek Jeter wasn&#39;t going anywhere," says a Yankee official. The folks at The Stadium believe Bud Selig is fielding a blitz of protests from a couple of owners -- especially those on Yawkey Way, Boston -- but there&#39;s not a lot baseball can do about the dichotomy between rich and poor. Steinbrenner will just hand out a ton of luxury tax money that owners in Cincinnati and Pittsburgh can put in their pockets.


    Does this mean the Yankees are going to win the World Series? Of course not. Considering that they scored 877 runs (won 101 games and the pennant) with Jeter, Jason Giambi and Bernie Williams hurt much of the season and without any bridge from the starters to Mariano Rivera tells you that they should challenge their own record of 1,067 runs scored, and that they should be in the playoffs. But the Red Sox also have a very good team, one that can score 900 runs and this time has a 1-to-10 pitching staff capable of winning anything, anytime. Oakland&#39;s pitching could beat anyone in October. A lot can happen.


    No one in Boston can accurately forecast whether or not there will be residual damage from the attempted swaps of Garciaparra and Ramirez, of the potential booing of Ramirez because of the revelation that he wanted to play for the Yankees, or the wear of having a half-dozen key players headed for free agency.


    And no one in New York can forecast what could be an insane summer. Jason Giambi wins the home free prize, because he&#39;s out of the spotlight, but there will be simmering pressure on this team. Lose four of six? How will the excitable boy upstairs react? If he rubs a pot roast all over his chest, fine, but if he messes with Joe Torre, it won&#39;t be, because it could be that Torre is the one saint -- OK, manager -- on earth that could handle all these personalities. How will Gary Sheffield and A-Rod react to WFAN and the Back Pages? How will the excitable boy react if Jeter is hurt for 10 days and Rodriguez shines at short? Is any town big enough for both? The excitable boy says the plan is for Kenny Lofton to play center, Bernie Williams says the plan is for him to play center. Hmm. And that&#39;s before one addresses the questions surrounding Jose Contreras and Jon Lieber, as well as having an all right-handed rotation starting 110 games in Yankee Stadium, Fenway Park and Camden Yards.


    Still, those who dismiss the Yankee rotation because of the exiles of Andy Pettitte, Roger Clemens and David Wells may vastly underestimate Mike Mussina, Kevin Brown and Javier Vazquez, or the importance of having Paul Quantrill and Tom Gordon leading into Rivera. It is also February, which gives Cashman 5 months to go get Jarrod Washburn, Odalis Perez, Al Leiter, Mark Buehrle ...


    The same 5 months Epstein has to decipher what the Red Sox will need. Because the Yankees-Red Sox war has escalated to an unprecedented level, both in terms of rivalry, ownership vitriol and their own neighborhood -- where Boston&#39;s payroll is 20 percent higher than 28 other teams, and the Yankees are close to 50 percent higher than the Red Sox, it has become a show separate from those other 28 teams.


    Whether the Red Sox this season win it all or not, they can retool. Say they re-sign Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek. For about the money it would cost them to re-sign David Ortiz and two potential Hall of Famers, Pedro Martinez and Garciaparra, they may be able to sign Eric Chavez (especially with A-Rod in The Stadium), Jose Vidro, Orlando Cabrera and Matt Morris. They don&#39;t think that way in Oakland or Minnesota, Florida or Atlanta. That&#39;s just the way it is.

  19. #19
    Originally posted by JetsD-Mastermind@Feb 16 2004, 02:04 PM
    Baseball isn&#39;t popular because every year something like this happens in which the Yankees get the best player.

    People around the country hate the Yankees and will forever think that they will win every year because they have all of the money.


    This is why Basketball and Football are 10 times more popular then Baseball.

    Especially football.

    In football any given sunday anyteam can win.

    I also think Football is the most popular because it has the shortest season and least amount of games.

    So everygame counts in the NFL no matter how you put it.

    My fav sports are Football and Baseball in a tie, but Baseball sucks for me and every fan right now except Yankee fans.

    I wish they&#39;d put a cap on Baseball, ban steroids, and the make the parks the original size instead of making them smaller.

    This would really make baseball exciting AGAIN.
    Does this include teams like the Cardinals, Bungles.

    Last I saw, NBA popularity is sinking faster than a Red Sox fans boner for A-Rod.

    Don&#39;t kid yourself. There are just as many Yankee fans around the country as there are Yankee haters. Same way as there are Dallas Cowboys fans all over the country and LA Fakers fans

  20. #20
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    Originally posted by shawn306+Feb 16 2004, 02:30 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shawn306 @ Feb 16 2004, 02:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--JetsD-Mastermind@Feb 16 2004, 02:04 PM
    Baseball isn&#39;t popular because every year something like this happens in which the Yankees get the best player.

    People around the country hate the Yankees and will forever think that they will win every year because they have all of the money.


    This is why Basketball and Football are 10 times more popular then Baseball.

    Especially football.

    In football any given sunday anyteam can win.

    I also think Football is the most popular because it has the shortest season and least amount of games.

    So everygame counts in the NFL no matter how you put it.

    My fav sports are Football and Baseball in a tie, but Baseball sucks for me and every fan right now except Yankee fans.

    I wish they&#39;d put a cap on Baseball, ban steroids, and the make the parks the original size instead of making them smaller.

    This would really make baseball exciting AGAIN.
    Does this include teams like the Cardinals, Bungles.

    Last I saw, NBA popularity is sinking faster than a Red Sox fans boner for A-Rod.

    Don&#39;t kid yourself. There are just as many Yankee fans around the country as there are Yankee haters. Same way as there are Dallas Cowboys fans all over the country and LA Fakers fans [/b][/quote]
    I agree with you in that there&#39;s know way in hell that Basketball is even remotely as popular as Baseball or Football. Basketball is viewed by many as nothing more than a bunch of extremely overpaid whiners where the only thing bigger than their egos is their criminal record. Basketball still lacks a Michael Jordan-esque player. (although LeBron could be that, it remains to be seen) but until then it will be on the low ranks of popular sports.


    Now about A-Rod, we can all agree that the Ranger definitely overpaid him. Nobody deserves 252 million. I dont really see how this trade in any way shape or form helps baseball. This is just another example of "the rich getting richer" in baseball. There is basically very VERY few teams that are actually going to compete with them this year. Meanwhile, you could scratch off 20 teams that are already not going to make the playoffs this year. Somebody mentioned the fact that teams have owners like Bud Selig that won&#39;t put a dime into their franchise. That is definitely true. But youalso have owners that just can&#39;t afford to pay the kind of money that the yankees dish out regularly. Not every owner has the money to pay for players the way Steinbrenner does Do you actually think a team should have to jack up its payroll to 200 million just to COMPETE? no way.


    The NFL is so much more popular than baseball mainly because of the cap and shared revenue. Which is why you get to see teams like the Panthers playing in a super bowl and a small market team like Green Bay actually existing. Every team has a legitimate chance of winning it all. In baseball, that is just about not possible.


    The Yankees have a payroll of 200 million. The Expos roughly i dunno 20? 40? Who&#39;s gonna do better? If you say the Expos you are living in a dream world. (or smoking crack) The Expos and other small market teams will never be able to attract any kind of quality top tier free agents. Until something is done about the overspending and a salary cap, the playing field will never be level for all MLB teams. And don&#39;t think I&#39;m sitting here defending the Boston Red Sox because I&#39;m not, they are just as guilty of overspending as the Yankees are, just not as extreme.

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