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Thread: y we shouldnt draft Dunta

  1. #1
    Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man

  2. #2
    Because Dunta is terribly overrated???

  3. #3
    [quote][i]Originally posted by MickeyShuler[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:58 PM
    [b] Because Dunta is terribly overrated??? [/b][/quote]
    yea there isnt alot of depth in this years draft at cb hes a second round pick if hes lucky

  4. #4
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Dunta is just wet behind the ears, he'll get picked in the first round.

    He is rated by 32 pro football teams as the 2nd best corner in this draft, he's a sure first rounder.

  5. #5
    The ONLY CB worthy of Pick #12 is DeAngelo Hall. Dunta is overrated, even though he MAY become a solid NFL Starter, he is NOT a gamebreaker, and is NOT worthy of Pick #12.

    It is possible that One (or more) of the following WILL be available at #12:

    Roy Williams WR
    Mike Williams WR
    Kellen Winslow Jr TE
    DeAngelo Hall CB
    and MAYBE Vince Wilfork DT

    Any of these four (and MAYBE Wilfork, not sure on him) should be selected BEFORE Dunta.

    If Dunta is the B.A.P. at #12, I say trade down in a heartbeat. Get more Picks and a lower first round choice, since all the GAMEBREAKERS (listed above) would be gone already.

  6. #6
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Warfish[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 11:13 PM
    [b] The ONLY CB worthy of Pick #12 is DeAngelo Hall. Dunta is overrated, even though he MAY become a solid NFL Starter, he is NOT a gamebreaker, and is NOT worthy of Pick #12.

    It is possible that One (or more) of the following WILL be available at #12:

    Roy Williams WR
    Mike Williams WR
    Kellen Winslow Jr TE
    DeAngelo Hall CB
    and MAYBE Vince Wilfork DT

    Any of these four (and MAYBE Wilfork, not sure on him) should be selected BEFORE Dunta.

    If Dunta is the B.A.P. at #12, I say trade down in a heartbeat. Get more Picks and a lower first round choice, since all the GAMEBREAKERS (listed above) would be gone already. [/b][/quote]
    How is Dunta overrated? What have you seen or read to justify this opinion?

  7. #7
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    nyj102883
    [quote][b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]

    Well isn't that a fact filled post :) , how about some stats to back up your assumption that he is a bust.

  8. #8
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Warfish[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 07:13 PM
    [b] The ONLY CB worthy of Pick #12 is DeAngelo Hall. Dunta is overrated, even though he MAY become a solid NFL Starter, he is NOT a gamebreaker, and is NOT worthy of Pick #12.

    It is possible that One (or more) of the following WILL be available at #12:

    Roy Williams WR
    Mike Williams WR
    Kellen Winslow Jr TE
    DeAngelo Hall CB
    and MAYBE Vince Wilfork DT

    Any of these four (and MAYBE Wilfork, not sure on him) should be selected BEFORE Dunta.

    If Dunta is the B.A.P. at #12, I say trade down in a heartbeat. Get more Picks and a lower first round choice, since all the GAMEBREAKERS (listed above) would be gone already. [/b][/quote]
    i think that's best analysis i've heard so far.

    those are def. the guys to look at #12 and none of them are there u def. draft down, the fun thing will be is if 2 or more of those guys are at #12!

  9. #9
    [quote][i]Originally posted by nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Mel Kiper:

    "Robinson might have the best cover skills in the draft, and with a nice combine workout capping a solid career he would be an excellent hole filler for a team that needs secondary help."

    Kiper latest Mock has Robinson at #10 to the Texans.

    Scouts, Inc.:

    "The Jets are looking to play more man-to-man coverage next season, and Robinson is the perfect fit because of his speed, playmaking skills and confidence."

  10. #10
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    I don't want Dunta Robinson at 12. If he's the best option left available, we should most definitely trade down and get Will Poole or Robinson if he drops to our new position in the first round. I agree with Warfish. If all those guys he mentioned are gone, we have to trade down.

  11. #11
    [quote][b]How is Dunta overrated? What have you seen or read to justify this opinion? [/b][/quote]

    At the end of the College Season, Dunta was off the map, a player considered (by those who know WAY more about College Football than I do) as a late 2nd Rounder, perhaps a third rounder if he fell. He was NOT, at that time, considered equal to Hall or the other top CB's.

    I simply do not trust "Workout Wonders" who improve their status from being a potential #60 pick to a supposed top 10 or top 20 talent. How much they lift or how fast the sprint a 40 is meaningless IMO, and used WAY too much to justify drafting people who didn't play well in college. Seems all NFL GM's want to prove how smart they are by drafting someone who played sub-top level in college but sure did run a fast 40, or did 30 reps, or some such other thing while wearing shorts in the offseason.

    Again, I think my point is this: We have the potential to get an offensive Gamebreaker, a potential Top 5 NFL talent on O, and I do not think our O is nearly good enough for us to skip that opportunity just to get a #4 CB (which Dunta would be, at leats in 2004 and likely in 2005, too). Mike and Roy Williams or Winslow are Gamebreakers and Gamechangers, players that D-Co's had to PLAN to stop. That is a weapon we must have (and we don't right now, regardless of what the Moss fans thank).

    Why pay Penny so much if you're not going to give him the weapons he needs? Moss and McCareins are both solid, but Roy or Mike Williams could be spectacular. Becht is sub-par. Kellen Winslow Jr IS a huge upgrade and an immediate threat that NFL D-Co's HAVE to account for, especilly in a West Coast offense.

    If Williams/Willimas/Winslow/Hall (and maybe Wilfork) ARE gone by #12, then Trade down to get picks (one of which could be Dunta if he falls, no problem at #25 or #30, even if I still think he is a #50-#70 talent who will, at BEST become just another NFL Starter CB, nothing great or spectacular)

  12. #12
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Warfish[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 07:52 PM
    [b] [quote][b]How is Dunta overrated? What have you seen or read to justify this opinion? [/b][/quote]

    At the end of the College Season, Dunta was off the map, a player considered (by those who know WAY more about College Football than I do) as a late 2nd Rounder, perhaps a third rounder if he fell. He was NOT, at that time, considered equal to Hall or the other top CB's.

    I simply do not trust "Workout Wonders" who improve their status from being a potential #60 pick to a supposed top 10 or top 20 talent. How much they lift or how fast the sprint a 40 is meaningless IMO, and used WAY too much to justify drafting people who didn't play well in college. Seems all NFL GM's want to prove how smart they are by drafting someone who played sub-top level in college but sure did run a fast 40, or did 30 reps, or some such other thing while wearing shorts in the offseason.

    Again, I think my point is this: We have the potential to get an offensive Gamebreaker, a potential Top 5 NFL talent on O, and I do not think our O is nearly good enough for us to skip that opportunity just to get a #4 CB (which Dunta would be, at leats in 2004 and likely in 2005, too). Mike and Roy Williams or Winslow are Gamebreakers and Gamechangers, players that D-Co's had to PLAN to stop. That is a weapon we must have (and we don't right now, regardless of what the Moss fans thank).

    Why pay Penny so much if you're not going to give him the weapons he needs? Moss and McCareins are both solid, but Roy or Mike Williams could be spectacular. Becht is sub-par. Kellen Winslow Jr IS a huge upgrade and an immediate threat that NFL D-Co's HAVE to account for, especilly in a West Coast offense.

    If Williams/Willimas/Winslow/Hall (and maybe Wilfork) ARE gone by #12, then Trade down to get picks (one of which could be Dunta if he falls, no problem at #25 or #30, even if I still think he is a #50-#70 talent who will, at BEST become just another NFL Starter CB, nothing great or spectacular) [/b][/quote]
    Scouts, Inc. for ESPN:

    "The Jets are in great position to draft a highly rated player at their biggest position of need, including Robinson at CB, Vilma at LB or Reggie Williams at WR. [b]Of those 3, Robinson is the highest rated prospect[/b] . . . ."

    Scouts, Inc. has M. Williams gone by 12 and Wilfork available.

  13. #13
    [quote][i]Originally posted by HBJet+Apr 4 2004, 08:27 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (HBJet @ Apr 4 2004, 08:27 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Warfish[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 07:52 PM
    [b] [quote][b]How is Dunta overrated? What have you seen or read to justify this opinion? [/b][/quote]

    At the end of the College Season, Dunta was off the map, a player considered (by those who know WAY more about College Football than I do) as a late 2nd Rounder, perhaps a third rounder if he fell. He was NOT, at that time, considered equal to Hall or the other top CB&#39;s.

    I simply do not trust "Workout Wonders" who improve their status from being a potential #60 pick to a supposed top 10 or top 20 talent. How much they lift or how fast the sprint a 40 is meaningless IMO, and used WAY too much to justify drafting people who didn&#39;t play well in college. Seems all NFL GM&#39;s want to prove how smart they are by drafting someone who played sub-top level in college but sure did run a fast 40, or did 30 reps, or some such other thing while wearing shorts in the offseason.

    Again, I think my point is this: We have the potential to get an offensive Gamebreaker, a potential Top 5 NFL talent on O, and I do not think our O is nearly good enough for us to skip that opportunity just to get a #4 CB (which Dunta would be, at leats in 2004 and likely in 2005, too). Mike and Roy Williams or Winslow are Gamebreakers and Gamechangers, players that D-Co&#39;s had to PLAN to stop. That is a weapon we must have (and we don&#39;t right now, regardless of what the Moss fans thank).

    Why pay Penny so much if you&#39;re not going to give him the weapons he needs? Moss and McCareins are both solid, but Roy or Mike Williams could be spectacular. Becht is sub-par. Kellen Winslow Jr IS a huge upgrade and an immediate threat that NFL D-Co&#39;s HAVE to account for, especilly in a West Coast offense.

    If Williams/Willimas/Winslow/Hall (and maybe Wilfork) ARE gone by #12, then Trade down to get picks (one of which could be Dunta if he falls, no problem at #25 or #30, even if I still think he is a #50-#70 talent who will, at BEST become just another NFL Starter CB, nothing great or spectacular) [/b][/quote]
    Scouts, Inc. for ESPN:

    "The Jets are in great position to draft a highly rated player at their biggest position of need, including Robinson at CB, Vilma at LB or Reggie Williams at WR. [b]Of those 3, Robinson is the highest rated prospect[/b] . . . ."

    Scouts, Inc. has M. Williams gone by 12 and Wilfork available. [/b][/quote]
    He reminds me a lot of the guy who left us at the altar (Winfield).

  14. #14
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Warfish[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 07:52 PM
    [b] [quote][b]How is Dunta overrated? What have you seen or read to justify this opinion? [/b][/quote]

    At the end of the College Season, Dunta was off the map, a player considered (by those who know WAY more about College Football than I do) as a late 2nd Rounder, perhaps a third rounder if he fell. He was NOT, at that time, considered equal to Hall or the other top CB&#39;s.

    I simply do not trust "Workout Wonders" who improve their status from being a potential #60 pick to a supposed top 10 or top 20 talent. How much they lift or how fast the sprint a 40 is meaningless IMO, and used WAY too much to justify drafting people who didn&#39;t play well in college. Seems all NFL GM&#39;s want to prove how smart they are by drafting someone who played sub-top level in college but sure did run a fast 40, or did 30 reps, or some such other thing while wearing shorts in the offseason.

    Again, I think my point is this: We have the potential to get an offensive Gamebreaker, a potential Top 5 NFL talent on O, and I do not think our O is nearly good enough for us to skip that opportunity just to get a #4 CB (which Dunta would be, at leats in 2004 and likely in 2005, too). Mike and Roy Williams or Winslow are Gamebreakers and Gamechangers, players that D-Co&#39;s had to PLAN to stop. That is a weapon we must have (and we don&#39;t right now, regardless of what the Moss fans thank).

    Why pay Penny so much if you&#39;re not going to give him the weapons he needs? Moss and McCareins are both solid, but Roy or Mike Williams could be spectacular. Becht is sub-par. Kellen Winslow Jr IS a huge upgrade and an immediate threat that NFL D-Co&#39;s HAVE to account for, especilly in a West Coast offense.

    If Williams/Willimas/Winslow/Hall (and maybe Wilfork) ARE gone by #12, then Trade down to get picks (one of which could be Dunta if he falls, no problem at #25 or #30, even if I still think he is a #50-#70 talent who will, at BEST become just another NFL Starter CB, nothing great or spectacular) [/b][/quote]
    You are way off base....Robinson was highly rated coming into the season and carried high grades from Blesto and National. Just because he was not talked about by the media or given a lot of noteriaty with college football awards doesn&#39;t mean NFL scouts weren&#39;t closely following him. He is definitely not a workout warrior. If you watched him play he has a lot of excellent cover skills.

    Then again it may all be for naught as the Steelers may draft Robinson.

    I also don&#39;t agree this is not a depp draft at CB...it is not a top heavy CB draft and there are no legitimate to ten picks but from the middle of the first round through the end of round three you&#39;ll have guys like Strait, Gamble, Poole, J. Thomas, R. Colclough, K. Smith, Jeremy LeSeuer, Nathan Vashar, Keiwan Ratliffe and all those guys can play at the next level.

    That said I&#39;d rather the Jets trade down in the first, get a guy like Karlos Dansby, and a few more selections if they can.

  15. #15
    [quote][i]Originally posted by nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Hall? A workout warrior who fits the Bradway mold. If he is such a &#39;shutdown&#39; corner, explain (1) when he was assigned to cover Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald in college be was burned as badly as any CB has been facing 1st round WR&#39;s and (2) how come this emerging Deion Sanders manage one INT last season?

  16. #16
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by rajensen088+Apr 4 2004, 08:49 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (rajensen088 @ Apr 4 2004, 08:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Hall? A workout warrior who fits the Bradway mold. If he is such a &#39;shutdown&#39; corner, explain (1) when he was assigned to cover Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald in college be was burned as badly as any CB has been facing 1st round WR&#39;s and (2) how come this emerging Deion Sanders manage one INT last season? [/b][/quote]
    I agree with you rajensen...from a cover skills ability POV I find Hall very overrated. I was in Philly for the Va Tech/Temple game and was not really impressed with his skills. You&#39;re going to here a lot of people say he tries to make of for poor cover skills with his great speed throughout his rookie season.

  17. #17
    [quote][i]Originally posted by rajensen088+Apr 4 2004, 08:49 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (rajensen088 @ Apr 4 2004, 08:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Hall? A workout warrior who fits the Bradway mold. If he is such a &#39;shutdown&#39; corner, explain (1) when he was assigned to cover Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald in college be was burned as badly as any CB has been facing 1st round WR&#39;s and (2) how come this emerging Deion Sanders manage one INT last season? [/b][/quote]
    hes young just rember that Henderson will groom him into a great cb i never said anything about him bein a workout warrior or deion he reminds me more of Champ Dunta is not even close to the player Hall is if you want another Beasley we should pick up Robinson

  18. #18
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    Because of his stupid first name.

  19. #19
    [quote][i]Originally posted by nyj102883+Apr 4 2004, 08:52 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (nyj102883 @ Apr 4 2004, 08:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by -rajensen088@Apr 4 2004, 08:49 PM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin--nyj102883[/i]@Apr 4 2004, 06:50 PM
    [b] Dunta isnt for us hes a bust maybe a second rounder ive seen him play and get burnt left and right Hall is our man he will be great i think we either stay at 12 and hope for Hall to Falls or move back grab Gamble groom him and pick up Teddy Lehman in the second round ..... or you can go the other way and draft vima in the first and sean jones in the second...But HALL is our man i want that guy so bad hes the man [/b][/quote]
    Hall? A workout warrior who fits the Bradway mold. If he is such a &#39;shutdown&#39; corner, explain (1) when he was assigned to cover Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald in college be was burned as badly as any CB has been facing 1st round WR&#39;s and (2) how come this emerging Deion Sanders manage one INT last season? [/b][/quote]
    hes young just rember that Henderson will groom him into a great cb i never said anything about him bein a workout warrior or deion he reminds me more of Champ Dunta is not even close to the player Hall is if you want another Beasley we should pick up Robinson [/b][/quote]
    Sorry but Beasley doesn&#39;t run a 4.3 nor does he know how to tackle like this kid.

  20. #20
    i wouldn&#39;t mind Dunta - but not at 12

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