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Thread: General Anthony Zinni

  1. #1
    any1 else catch Anthony Zinni on 60 mins last night?

    he's dead on 100% correct about the War and has been for some time

    my only wonder is how the right will bash this brave man... he says he had allegations of being anti-semetic... <_<

    [url=http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/60minutes/main618896.shtml]http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/...ain618896.shtml[/url]

  2. #2
    anyone who crooses the bush admin is labled something..21st century gestapo..F_bush..he&#39;s a traitor.

  3. #3
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@May 24 2004, 04:24 PM
    [b] any1 else catch Anthony Zinni on 60 mins last night?

    he&#39;s dead on 100% correct about the War and has been for some time

    my only wonder is how the right will bash this brave man... he says he had allegations of being anti-semetic... <_<

    [url=http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/60minutes/main618896.shtml]http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/...ain618896.shtml[/url] [/b][/quote]
    Bit why did you feel this needed to be posted twice?? The other
    B-Liberal already posted it.. :rolleyes:

  4. #4
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@May 24 2004, 04:24 PM
    [b] any1 else catch Anthony Zinni on 60 mins last night?

    he&#39;s dead on 100% correct about the War and has been for some time

    my only wonder is how the right will bash this brave man... he says he had allegations of being anti-semetic... <_<

    [url=http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/60minutes/main618896.shtml]http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/21/...ain618896.shtml[/url] [/b][/quote]
    I would call that a fair perspective from an intelligent, knowlegeable and experienced man. What&#39;s unfair is CBS completely shutting out similarly fair yet opposed perspectives from equally intelligent, knowledgeable and experienced individuals.

  5. #5
    I saw it bit. I agree with you & shakin. ( how often can one say that?)

    I wonder if it will have any impact on the big rah rah speech tonight? It would be refreshing for our president to admit to any of the many shortcomings of this post war plan strategy, or lack thereof.

    My guess is He will continue to insult our intelligence. Tell us again how we&#39;re doing a just thing by liberalising the Iraqi people in this warr on terror, stay the course, our resolve will not waver bla,bla,bla

  6. #6
    shakin that&#39;s cool ... i especially liked this quote

    [quote][b]It is part of your duty. Look, there is one statement that bothers me more than anything else. And that&#39;s the idea that when the troops are in combat, everybody has to shut up. Imagine if we put troops in combat with a faulty rifle, and that rifle was malfunctioning, and troops were dying as a result, says Zinni.

    I can&#39;t think anyone would allow that to happen, that would not speak up. Well, what&#39;s the difference between a faulty plan and strategy that&#39;s getting just as many troops killed? Its leading down a path where we&#39;re not succeeding and accomplishing the missions we&#39;ve set out to do.
    [/b][/quote]

    as for CBS they are very much a pro-Bush organization... they ran commercials from the white house during the superbowl but their parent company Viacom did not allow CBS to run MoveOn.org&#39;s commercial... doesn&#39;t sound to me like that are overly biased.

  7. #7
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@May 24 2004, 11:46 PM
    [b] shakin that&#39;s cool ... i especially liked this quote

    [quote][b]It is part of your duty. Look, there is one statement that bothers me more than anything else. And that&#39;s the idea that when the troops are in combat, everybody has to shut up. Imagine if we put troops in combat with a faulty rifle, and that rifle was malfunctioning, and troops were dying as a result, says Zinni.

    I can&#39;t think anyone would allow that to happen, that would not speak up. Well, what&#39;s the difference between a faulty plan and strategy that&#39;s getting just as many troops killed? Its leading down a path where we&#39;re not succeeding and accomplishing the missions we&#39;ve set out to do.
    [/b][/quote]

    as for CBS they are very much a pro-Bush organization... they ran commercials from the white house during the superbowl but their parent company Viacom did not allow CBS to run MoveOn.org&#39;s commercial... doesn&#39;t sound to me like that are overly biased. [/b][/quote]
    CBS? Pro-Bush? You have got to be kidding me. Aren&#39;t they the ones that shoved Dick Clarke and his Viacom-published book down our throat? Aren&#39;t they the ones that showed pics of Abu Graib prison.

    Lastly, doesn&#39;t Zinni have a book coming out too? Published by who? Oh, yeah, Viacom.

  8. #8
    bush is lookin out for Iraq&#39;s best interest

    zinni is motivated purely by money and revenge

    plus he&#39;s an anti-semite

    why is this neo-con character assassination not suprising?

    bush gets all the benefit of the doubt, no one else gets any

    --

    did any1 else hear that crap being shovelled on TV tonight?

    new plan... same as the old plan&#33;

    it&#39;s a joke... even republicans are questioning the President outright...

    do they have a plan for Iraq? not really... just be patient until after the election&#33;

    yeah... ok

  9. #9
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    Bit for you True Americans who would never join the Military let
    this Old Vet enlightnen you about Generals&#33; Most of them are
    like Politicians who think their way is the ONLY Way&#33; Put 10 in the
    same room and you&#39;ll have 10 different opinions..CBS like the rest
    of Major Media are doing their Liberal best to topple Bush..Lets wait
    till Nov to see if their successful..Whats good for America is Bad for
    the Liberal Media ..You won&#39;t see Good things about Iraq in the Major Media.. <_<

  10. #10
    [b]General Anthony Zinni, coward? traitor? or a man doing his duty[/b]

    I&#39;m thinking more along the lines of a man trying to sell a book......

    I&#39;m sure it&#39;s full of fabrications just like that piece of trash Richard Clarke wrote.....

  11. #11
    [quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@May 25 2004, 01:47 AM
    [b] bush is lookin out for Iraq&#39;s best interest

    zinni is motivated purely by money and revenge

    plus he&#39;s an anti-semite

    why is this neo-con character assassination not suprising?

    bush gets all the benefit of the doubt, no one else gets any

    --

    did any1 else hear that crap being shovelled on TV tonight?

    new plan... same as the old plan&#33;

    it&#39;s a joke... even republicans are questioning the President outright...

    do they have a plan for Iraq? not really... just be patient until after the election&#33;

    yeah... ok [/b][/quote]
    Those points you made would have been alot more believeable had you actually quoted someone saying those things. You make up assessments and then attack them????????????? Who was assainating Zinnis character?? Are you making that assumption based on the reaction to Clarke. A man who was clearly pandering to sell his book. A man whose statements clearly contradicted statements he had made 12 months earlier on the same subject matter????????? Get a clue.

  12. #12
    [quote][i]Originally posted by chiefst2000+May 25 2004, 10:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (chiefst2000 @ May 25 2004, 10:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--bitonti[/i]@May 25 2004, 01:47 AM
    [b] bush is lookin out for Iraq&#39;s best interest

    zinni is motivated purely by money and revenge

    plus he&#39;s an anti-semite

    why is this neo-con character assassination not suprising?

    bush gets all the benefit of the doubt, no one else gets any

    --

    did any1 else hear that crap being shovelled on TV tonight?

    new plan... same as the old plan&#33;

    it&#39;s a joke... even republicans are questioning the President outright...

    do they have a plan for Iraq? not really... just be patient until after the election&#33;

    yeah... ok [/b][/quote]
    Those points you made would have been alot more believeable had you actually quoted someone saying those things. You make up assessments and then attack them????????????? Who was assainating Zinnis character?? Are you making that assumption based on the reaction to Clarke. A man who was clearly pandering to sell his book. A man whose statements clearly contradicted statements he had made 12 months earlier on the same subject matter????????? Get a clue. [/b][/quote]
    can you enlighten us on the contradictory statements of 12 months ago? He stated he proposed 300,000 troops on the ground, seal the borders, better un involvement etc.

    sure he&#39;s promoting a book but he impressed me as a very smart general who knew what the situation was & is.

  13. #13
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by savage69[/i]@May 25 2004, 07:26 AM
    [b] Bit for you True Americans who would never join the Military let
    this Old Vet enlightnen you about Generals&#33; Most of them are
    like Politicians who think their way is the ONLY Way&#33; Put 10 in the
    same room and you&#39;ll have 10 different opinions..CBS like the rest
    of Major Media are doing their Liberal best to topple Bush..Lets wait
    till Nov to see if their successful..Whats good for America is Bad for
    the Liberal Media ..You won&#39;t see Good things about Iraq in the Major Media.. <_< [/b][/quote]
    GREAT post savage.

    Zinni is no fool and his words are important. Other generals have certainly stated their opinions and many of them are also critical and many of them are very supportive, and some are even 100% supportive. I&#39;ve read many of them....

    However, Viacom does have a genuine conflict of interest here, even if Zinni [i]himself[/i] does not. Clearly, a balanced report from CBS would include generals who have differeing opinions or rebuttals to what Zinni says, preferably ones that are not on Viacom&#39;s payroll. CBS chooses not to allow such give-and-take because of their conflicted interests. I think to ignore this is to be insincere.

    I will not and do not question Zinni&#39;s character or patriotism. Bitonti likes to think that "only Bush" gets the benefit of the doubt from us righties, yet everyone who bashed Bush gets 100% of the benefit of the doubt from him. Again, you show that you are no different in action from the very people you criticize, you are simply inverted.

  14. #14
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by joewilly+May 25 2004, 10:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (joewilly @ May 25 2004, 10:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by -chiefst2000@May 25 2004, 10:11 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin--bitonti[/i]@May 25 2004, 01:47 AM
    [b] bush is lookin out for Iraq&#39;s best interest

    zinni is motivated purely by money and revenge

    plus he&#39;s an anti-semite

    why is this neo-con character assassination not suprising?

    bush gets all the benefit of the doubt, no one else gets any

    --

    did any1 else hear that crap being shovelled on TV tonight?

    new plan... same as the old plan&#33;

    it&#39;s a joke... even republicans are questioning the President outright...

    do they have a plan for Iraq? not really... just be patient until after the election&#33;

    yeah... ok [/b][/quote]
    Those points you made would have been alot more believeable had you actually quoted someone saying those things. You make up assessments and then attack them????????????? Who was assainating Zinnis character?? Are you making that assumption based on the reaction to Clarke. A man who was clearly pandering to sell his book. A man whose statements clearly contradicted statements he had made 12 months earlier on the same subject matter????????? Get a clue. [/b][/quote]
    can you enlighten us on the contradictory statements of 12 months ago? He stated he proposed 300,000 troops on the ground, seal the borders, better un involvement etc.

    sure he&#39;s promoting a book but he impressed me as a very smart general who knew what the situation was & is. [/b][/quote]
    JW - Chiefs if referring to Clarke, not Zinni, I think.

  15. #15
    thanks mr 5..................nevermind

  16. #16
    [quote][i]Originally posted by joewilly+May 25 2004, 10:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (joewilly @ May 25 2004, 10:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by -chiefst2000@May 25 2004, 10:11 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin--bitonti[/i]@May 25 2004, 01:47 AM
    [b] bush is lookin out for Iraq&#39;s best interest

    zinni is motivated purely by money and revenge

    plus he&#39;s an anti-semite

    why is this neo-con character assassination not suprising?

    bush gets all the benefit of the doubt, no one else gets any

    --

    did any1 else hear that crap being shovelled on TV tonight?

    new plan... same as the old plan&#33;

    it&#39;s a joke... even republicans are questioning the President outright...

    do they have a plan for Iraq? not really... just be patient until after the election&#33;

    yeah... ok [/b][/quote]
    Those points you made would have been alot more believeable had you actually quoted someone saying those things. You make up assessments and then attack them????????????? Who was assainating Zinnis character?? Are you making that assumption based on the reaction to Clarke. A man who was clearly pandering to sell his book. A man whose statements clearly contradicted statements he had made 12 months earlier on the same subject matter????????? Get a clue. [/b][/quote]
    can you enlighten us on the contradictory statements of 12 months ago? He stated he proposed 300,000 troops on the ground, seal the borders, better un involvement etc.

    sure he&#39;s promoting a book but he impressed me as a very smart general who knew what the situation was & is. [/b][/quote]
    I was referring to Clarke there not Zinni. I have no problem with what Zinni has stated. I was criticising Bitonis penchent for making up statments about "neo-cons" without any direct quotes to back them up. Getting back to the Zinni statements I actually think we have enough troops on the ground in Iraq. I think the emphasis should be on training an Iraqi military force to take over the security of that country. Despite all the negatives we&#39;ve been hearing on the news lately I actually think the Iraq mission has been going very well. It seems as if the Al Sadr uprising has been squashed and the military had no real difficulty there. I&#39;m hopefull that we will bring freedom and Democracy to the Iraqi people and bring our troops home in the near future.

  17. #17
    5ever you and others want to know where the Generals are who agreed with Bush

    maybe there aren&#39;t any? 60 mins asked for a response from Rumsfeld et al and they declined...

    the Pentegon&#39;s civilian leadership created the need for this war using dodgy intel to meet their personal agenda... some Generals signed on but many didn&#39;t and prior to the war it was estimated that 1 in 3 enlisted men questioned the logic of what they were about to do.

    no general in the world would tell you that less troops was a good idea... that disbanding the Iraqi army was a good idea... that de-baathifying was such a good idea

    Rumsfeld and his cronies screwed up bigtime... and like me they never saw real action - but that doesn&#39;t stop you guys from supporting the hell of out of them... while the same crappy plan flounders along and more GI&#39;s die.

    as for the book deal - hey whatever - if it takes writing a book to get the truth out than so be it...

    people should know that Zinni was visably against the war for a long time before his book came out... a long long time - everyone marginalized him so i say if he needs a book to get heard than that seems to be the way of the world.

    every Clinton-basher in the world had a book deal that got them on TV but you guys didn&#39;t seem so concerned about conflict of interest then...

  18. #18
    chiefs, I respectably disagree.........I like the fact that Bush stated his intentions of maintaining troop presence & training the Iraqi people to fight insurgents & claims they have been for a while. Its great to say they are attempting to maintain little damage to the mosques etc.

    I just think that Zinni,who referred to shwartzkoff & scowcrowft concurring, had a better plan than rummy & wolfy. more troops & overwhelm the whole place,seal borders & root out old guard quickly & prevent new insurgents from entering Iraq. Then train the iraqis. then worry about puttting a gov&#39;t in place.

    It seems they are attempting to do all 3 at the same time & it has proven to be inneffective.

    Like herm edwards, he seems incapable of changing the gameplan in the 3rd & 4th quarter. I just wish he would see the flaws in the plan that everyone else seems to see.

  19. #19
    joewilly that&#39;s a great post

    pro-war supporters give all the benefit of the doubt to the President and none of it to anyone who has anything negative to say about the President and the job he&#39;s done so dar

    talking purely military science (i.e. the Art of War) the Iraq situation is troubling on SEVERAL levels.

    besides the borders, the disbanded army, the lack of public safety (i.e. law and order) they just aren&#39;t fighting this the right way

    not talking "hippie love" either - where we sing "give peace a chance"

    if we are gonna fight a war then for pete&#39;s sakes fight it, don&#39;t play footsie with RPG touting 15 year-olds in the ghettos of Falujah and Najaf.

    the mistakes our President and his staff have made directly results in the unecessary deaths of American servicemen, and that&#39;s unacceptable...

    im not sure if John Kerry would be a better Prez than Bush but i can say this without reservation whoever Kerry selects for the jobs of Secretary of Defense, Vice Prez, Nat&#39;l Security Advisor couldn&#39;t possibly be worse than the current crew.

    not to mention Wolfowitz and the others they are all so incompetant it&#39;s disgraceful.

  20. #20
    Thanks bit. I&#39;ve really tried not to bash the bush team too much.
    Bush has chosen the path of rummy, wolfy,cheney & the pnac theory. while I dissagree with their choice of invading iraq, I do not fault their theory of instilling democracy in me for the good of the us.

    I agree with you bit, not only have we jumped in over there, it seems we jumped in with only one foot

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