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Thread: Look what the Rethugs are up to now

  1. #1
    Aiming for John Kerry's Purple Heart
    How low will the Swift Boat Veterans sink to defame the presidential candidate's Vietnam record?

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    By Joe Conason



    July 16, 2004 | The hunt for John Kerry has now been contracted to a hired gun.

    A private detective retained by "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" -- the Texas-based group seeking to discredit John Kerry's military record -- is contacting veterans who may have information about the incidents that led to Kerry's Vietnam decorations. According to a former Kerry crew member, several of the Massachusetts senator's old Navy comrades have refused to talk with the detective, a former FBI agent named Thomas Rupprath -- and some have complained that the detective tried to put damaging words in their mouths.


    Rupprath's efforts are clearly intended to discredit Kerry's military record, which should surprise nobody familiar with the "Swift Boat" group. Its leaders are conservative Republicans embittered over Kerry's later antiwar activism and determined that he should never become the nation's commander in chief. Two months ago, their opening salvo against the Democratic presidential nominee fizzled -- in part because it was revealed that several of the same officers now criticizing Kerry had written strongly positive evaluations of him as a young lieutenant decades ago.


    Registered as a "527" organization with the Internal Revenue Service, the "Swift Boat Veterans" group can raise and spend unlimited amounts of money for campaign activities, but is prohibited from working directly with the Bush campaign or the Republican Party. Its spokesmen have repeatedly denied any GOP sponsorship, although several of the group's leaders have longstanding ties with the Republican Party.

    Now Rupprath is pursuing the questions raised by the anti-Kerry veterans -- such as the nature of the wounds that led to the awarding of three Purple Hearts to the young lieutenant, and the circumstances under which he was decorated for valor. In a brief interview with the Dallas Morning News – which broke the news of his investigation on July 12 -- the detective said: "We're not making any accusations until I think we have them truly buttoned up and can be presented in as authentic and credible a manner as possible."

    During the past two weeks, in fact, Rupprath has been inquiring about the now-famous firefight of Feb. 28, 1969, when Kerry ordered his crew to beach their boat on the shores of a Mekong Delta canal and then ran ashore to kill a guerrilla wielding a grenade launcher. The consensus among Kerry's former crew members is that his action saved all their lives, since otherwise the guerilla could have fired a round with enough explosive force to destroy their boat. His Navy superiors agreed, awarding him the Silver Star.

    Kerry's critics have tried to suggest that he recklessly endangered his crew by leaving the boat -- or that the guerrilla was already mortally wounded before Kerry shot him. Presumably the "Swift Boat" group hired Rupprath to find proof of such allegations, but so far he may not be making much progress.

    A pro-Kerry veteran who spoke with the detective said Rupprath explained that "he was just looking into the various incidents that led to Kerry's awards and he was interviewing people about them." The detective didn't learn anything derogatory about Kerry's conduct from him. Rupprath later sent him a typed version of their conversation that contained only a few minor mistakes. The veteran, who asked not to be identified, corrected those errors and returned the interview to the detective.

    Another theme promoted by the "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" is that Kerry somehow exaggerated the injuries that led to his Purple Heart awards, or may even have inflicted them on himself. Kerry's first wound occurred on Dec. 2, 1968, which was the very first night he went on a swift boat patrol. Although several witnesses who were present that night remember that Kerry's arm was creased during a firefight with National Liberation Front guerrillas, a former commander who wasn't there has claimed that there was no report of enemy fire.

    Among the witnesses who does recall the firefight is Pat Runyon, a former crew member on Kerry's boat. He too spoke with Rupprath when the detective contacted him recently -- and told Dallas Morning News reporter Wayne Slater that he was stunned to find serious inaccuracies in a version of the interview that Rupprath later sent to him. The most damning mistake, Runyon said, was an insinuation that Kerry's injury had been caused by a flare rather than a bullet.

    Runyon isn't alone in suspecting that Rupprath may misuse his words, according to Wade Sanders, a former deputy assistant secretary of the Navy who served with Kerry in Vietnam and is publicly supporting the Democrat. Sanders said he has heard lately from a pair of other Navy veterans interviewed by the detective. "They told me that he sent them transcripts [of their interviews] and that they told him that his version was a misrepresentation of what they said."

    Reached in Dallas, Rupprath referred all questions to Merrie Spaeth, the public relations executive and Republican activist who put together the "Swift Boat Veterans" group. Asked about the charges of distortion by Runyon and Sanders, she replied: "I want to just state that I am making no statement."

  2. #2
    Funny stuff Gobbles. You have a problem with Kerrys supposed "band of brothers" exposing him for what they think he is. Many of those folks aren't republicans they just know JK personally. I guess you have no problem with moveon.org calling the president a nazi though. By the article's logic they are a legitimate wing of the democratic party.

  3. #3
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    There is no depth to which these con scumbags will not sink.

    But, we already knew that.

  4. #4
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    Again the rats trying stretching the truth....kerri wants to use Vietnam as a rallying cry yet when those who were there with him want to tell what really happened...well that just not right.

    Fact is there are several major anti-kerris Vietnam vet groups out there; I'm sure the rats will try and spin each one of them.

  5. #5
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Bob the Jets Fan™[/i]@Jul 16 2004, 01:14 PM
    [b] There is no depth to which these con scumbags will not sink.

    But, we already knew that. [/b][/quote]
    Funny perspective given the source. Especially after the latest laughfest with the Hollywood elite.

    Kerry is the one who now constantly brings up the war service. He mentioned it again o0n Imus yesterday completely unsolicited.

    His campaign is starting to sound a lot like Rick Lazio when he ran against Hillary.

    No positions and a questionable record in the Senate, just "I'm not Bush".

  6. #6
    Yah and the libs haven't been trying to discredit Bush's National Guard record. :rolleyes:

    Kerry is a complete fraud.

  7. #7
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    See how the libs flock to try and discredit Vietnam vets that disagree with them? These are the guys that fought with herman munster in Vietnam and know his (lack of) character.

    But we're supposed to believe proven liars Dick Clarke and Joe Wilson about the ulterior motives of soon-to-be reelected President Bush.

    Libs are being hoodwinked by a billionaire into believing he's a common man. They'ye being swindled by a fat millionaire by supporting his crappy movie.

    Keep grabbing them ankles for the anarchists, terrorists and commies among us.

  8. #8
    So all you guys are okay with hiring a private detective to dig up dirt on a vietnam veteran? How can you equate Bushes "missing" service records with actually hiring someone to try to misinform the public about a decorated war veteran just because you disagree with his politics?? WTF is the matter with you people!!!??

    FORGET IDEOLOGY FOR ONCE! HOW CAN YOU DEFEND THIS BEHAVIOR???

    BTW, where did Clarke or Wilson lie? (see Wilson's response to senate report post). I hope all of the "moderate" posters read these responses. This type of extremism is going to do Bush in because more and more Americans are starting to wake up and smell the Facism! There is no bigger liar than Bush and Cheney and the best thing about it is it is all on tape. I can't wait for Robert Greenwalds Documentary to be released during the Repulican Convention. It is called, "Uncovered, The Truth About the War in Iraq" and it will provide further proof that his administration will DO and SAY anything to further it's agenda.

    Bush will be defeated in November; you can count on it.

  9. #9
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by NYJet94[/i]@Jul 16 2004, 08:57 PM
    [b] So all you guys are okay with hiring a private detective to dig up dirt on a vietnam veteran? [/b][/quote]
    There are so many Vietnam Vets who hate kerri there is no need for investigating anything on the story.

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    Questioning his service is low. But calling attention to the things he did to dishonor that service when he ran out of the Navy -the Winter soldiers farce, tossed medals, claiming to have seen and COMMITTED atrocities, meeting with Viet Cong in Paris-is all fair game. Kerry hangs out with people who beleive America is evil. May be he believes that too, but his campaign is so below the radar on susbstance it's hard to tell what he believes.

    Read that again-[i]he claimed to have personally committed atrocities in Congressioanl testimony and his book that he took out of print[/i], which no one he served with, pro or con, confirm or remember. What was he, the secret agent war criminal? All of the people he served with stayed on the boat no matter what. Why ddn't he turn himself in, given his professed love for the ICC? Or was his whole post-Vietnam vet persona a self-created preening attempt to ingratiate himself to the Left to advance his political career? Each question answers itself.

  11. #11
    All valid points but you still didn't answer my question of do you think it is right to hire a private detective to try to put words in the mouth of members of his squad or misconstrue what they say just so Bush can win an election??? All the issues you raised can be dealt without having to stoop to this level.

    Also, how can anyone equate Bush being bumped up to top of the list for National Guard "service" with volunteering to go to vietnam???

    If you guys are the patriots you pretend to be there is no way you can find any of this acceptable. It's like Ann Coulter saying Max Cleland accidently fell on grenade so it's basically no big deal and then going on to belittle his war record. Is there no shame at all?? Or is winning at all costs the only rule at work here?

  12. #12
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    Hiring a detective is pretty low-Period .

    But boy Clinton was the guy who hired Pellicano and his ilk to harass would-be accusers regarding his personal mess of a life. Agreed that doesn't justify others doing it. But when Kerry made his four months in country as the centerpiece of his campaign, you cannot now say no one can question it, ever. He thinks it the seminal moment in his life-why shouldn't it be scrutinized if he thinks it's so crucial in his personality and beliefs?

    Point of fact-McCain's service is second to none. I voted for McCain in the NY primary in 2000. He doesn't advertise his service. Even if he wrote a book, it's been unsaid for the most part. Meanwhile, Kerry and Cleland(who was injured in a combat zone in a noncombat accident) shout I WAS IN VIETNAM on the hour and the half hour. It's practically on their answering machines. It's undignified.

    It's clear that when Kerry saw there was politcal capital to being an antiwar vet, he exaggerated his role to suit the antiwar movement's view of the war to get attention for himslef . Now, he wants to burn all that stuff and pretend he went to the VFW post with his not-fellow Irish-American vets in Southie rather than hangin' with Hanoi Jane doing thai sticks at antiwar rallies.


    It all comes back to a central point-other than warmed-over platitudes("Taking Back America for Americans!"-are we electing an Up With People cheerleader, or a leader?) -what does Kerry really believe in? He ignores his professed faith. His personal relationships are clearly based on money and advancement rather than love. No one really likes him. And if he has any actaul deeply-held beliefs and ideas beyond wanting to ride in Air Force One, by all means, tell us. The guy is damn near made of wood.

    Heck, if Bush loses to Kerry, he will have a hard time shaving for a while. Had the Dems nominated Lieberman, Bush would already be back on the farm moving his stuff back to the ranch.

  13. #13
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    Kerry is correct when he says Foreign Leaders want him to be
    President..Indeed some have him in their Hall of Fame!!!

    [url=http://www.strangecosmos.com/content/item/100378.html]http://www.strangecosmos.com/content/item/100378.html[/url]

  14. #14
    Tom The Nader Fan™
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Bugg[/i]@Jul 17 2004, 12:23 AM
    [b] It's clear that when Kerry saw there was politcal capital to being an antiwar vet, he exaggerated his role to suit the antiwar movement's view of the war to get attention for himslef . Now, he wants to burn all that stuff and pretend he went to the VFW post with his not-fellow Irish-American vets in Southie rather than hangin' with Hanoi Jane doing thai sticks at antiwar rallies.

    [/b][/quote]
    Bugg, stop making sense to Pro-Kerry supporters. You have a better chance of running a Jews for Jesus rally in Tel Aviv and actually converting a member of the Likud party.

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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Bugg[/i]@Jul 17 2004, 12:23 AM
    [b]
    Point of fact-McCain's service is second to none. I voted for McCain in the NY primary in 2000. He doesn't advertise his service. Even if he wrote a book, it's been unsaid for the most part. Meanwhile, Kerry and Cleland(who was injured in a combat zone in a noncombat accident) shout I WAS IN VIETNAM on the hour and the half hour. It's practically on their answering machines. It's undignified.

    It's clear that when Kerry saw there was politcal capital to being an antiwar vet, he exaggerated his role to suit the antiwar movement's view of the war to get attention for himslef . Now, he wants to burn all that stuff and pretend he went to the VFW post with his not-fellow Irish-American vets in Southie rather than hangin' with Hanoi Jane doing thai sticks at antiwar rallies.


    It all comes back to a central point-other than warmed-over platitudes("Taking Back America for Americans!"-are we electing an Up With People cheerleader, or a leader?) -what does Kerry really believe in? He ignores his professed faith. His personal relationships are clearly based on money and advancement rather than love. No one really likes him. And if he has any actaul deeply-held beliefs and ideas beyond wanting to ride in Air Force One, by all means, tell us. The guy is damn near made of wood.

    Heck, if Bush loses to Kerry, he will have a hard time shaving for a while. Had the Dems nominated Lieberman, Bush would already be back on the farm moving his stuff back to the ranch. [/b][/quote]
    Real Combat Vets like Bush 1, shot down in the South Pacific or Dole
    severely wounded in Italy don't make a big Deal out of their Service!
    Even McCain who could have got out of the Hanoi Hilton years earlier
    once the Vietnamese found out his Father was a rear Admiral..Said If
    I go so do all that are here with me!! Instead he stayed another 3 yrs!
    Not 3 months like Wonder Boy who asked to be sent back home&#33; <_<

  16. #16
    Tom The Nader Fan™
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    John Kerry doesn&#39;t even warrant being called a Saigon Cowboy&#33; He&#39;s a Hanoi Cowboy&#33;

    [img]http://www.senate.gov/~kerry/low/i/r0016.jpg[/img]
    [b]THE SWIMMER AND THE WAR HERO[/b]

  17. #17
    OF FAME

    May 31, 2004 - Dr. Jerry Corsi and Jeff Epstein of Vietnam Vets for the Truth report that John Kerry&#39;s photograph is featured in the War Protestors Hall of the War Remnants Museum in Ho Chi Minh City -- a clear indication of the value the Vietnamese communists place on Kerry&#39;s support of their efforts during the Vietnam War. The photograph was received in response to a general request last week for information documenting Kerry&#39;s activities on behalf of the enemy

    [img]http://www.strangecosmos.com/images/content/100378.jpg[/img]

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