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Thread: Good Article on Immigration

  1. #1
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    I know Riggo will be all over this. Several points-the current influx isn't assimilating in part because it's too huge and alien form America, and the labor market doesn't have a demand for unskilled labor as it did in the early 1900s.

    [url=http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_3_immigrant_gang.html]http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_3_immi...grant_gang.html[/url]

  2. #2
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    Thanks for link. Actually, I saw this link on Saturday.

    I've said it many times here to those that employ illegals or want to "protect" them politically: Enjoy the cheap labor and the cheap votes now, because an evil, evil wind is coming your way and you'll wish hundred times over you'd trimmed your own hedges or paid someone a "fair wage" to repair your deck.

    Lets be honest, California is an almost complete fiscal and social disaster now. Everyone knows it and knows why, but so few are willing to talk about the real problem candidly, because they fear they'll be called racist or xenophobic or whatever garbage the slimeball neo-cons on the right or their extreme leftist pals and can think of :rolleyes:

    I started realizing how much of a joke the state was about 10 years ago, when a good friend of mine was told by a cop he would be lucky to make it out of LA alive because he was pumping gas and accidently wearing "gang colors" on a business trip for an engineering firm he had just joined right out of college :wacko:

    Comical thing is, some posters here that are familar with the region have actually stated LA is finished. Realizing LA is a total garbage dump, they brag fervently about Orange County "being the place to be". But guess what, I've been told first hand by so many in the know that even cities like Anaheim are starting to look more and more like LA every day. These folks can run, but they can't hide from the whole state turning into a bankrupt, cesspool right before their eyes.

    Did you know during the "Brady Bunch era" of the 1970's, California had the best schools in nations? Now, just about 20-something years after, the state is ranked 49th overall in the 50 states? Has been that bad for about a decade :o

    Things can't worse, right? Think again, LA PUBLIC schools are now so F'ing broke, they are asking kids families to donate money to buy books, ect

    By the way, I recommend the head up their as*, clueless ones around here don't read the link above. Just sit in your little politically correct, "fairytale" world of exploiting these people for cheap labor and collecting cash from them in various ways (commisions, sales, ect.).

    Mark my words, however, people around here will find out the ugly truth on this issue soon enough and pay a steep price. Matter of fact, in terms of taxes, they are already getting raped like 5 cent street hookers, but are too darn stupid to know it.....

    ....Oh yea, forgot to mention what the illegal crowd did in NYC on 9-11. Special group, huh? <_<

  3. #3
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    I agree with the article, although i am not Mexican or Puerto Rican, I see the craziness that this gang mentality has caused. In the bronx, aka Hell, the Latin Kings ruled with an iron fist till the FBI stepped in and kind of slowed down their progress. Its a matter of destroying the gangs...get at the leadership and squeeze the membership till they yell uncle...

    I believe that if you give birth in this country then you and the baby should be deported. Being born here illegally should not guarantee you citizenship...

    LL

  4. #4
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    Riggo - what, exactly, is a "fair wage" to repair a deck and how did you derive that number?

    I don&#39;t want vagaries or doomsday scenarios about what is lurking behind the door, nor do I want some generality about how you don&#39;t know exactly what a fair wage is, but that it [i]has[/i] to be higher than what illegals make. I&#39;m not asking about anything outside of this narrow issue - what is a "fair wage" for repairing a deck and [i]why?[/i]

  5. #5
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    Illegal immigration is a big problem.

    If it were up to me I would build a wall, post cameras, electrify a fence, dig a moat and/or post armed guards with shoot to kill orders on the borders.

    This is what I would not do: vote for a politician with the following organization in his back pocket - the ACLU ("illegals have the right to free healthcare and education"), the environmentalist wackos ("building fences on the border is enviromentally unsound") or MEChA - organization of mexican-Americans that espouse the return of the lands of the US southwest to mexico by any means necessary ([url=http://www.americanpatrol.com/CALIFORNIA/VILLARAIGOSA/CouncilmanVillyMechaBoy.html]Worst of the Mexican reconquistas back John Kerry[/url]).

    I only disagree with a certain individual on one point. His solution is to vote for kerry as a slap to the President for his lack of a stand against illegals. Methinks that individual may have ulterior motives using immigration as a convienient excuse for his posts.

  6. #6
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by jets5ever[/i]@Jul 20 2004, 10:30 AM
    [b] Riggo - what, exactly, is a "fair wage" to repair a deck and how did you derive that number?

    [/b][/quote]
    I think a fair wage to fix a deck is whatever someone is willing to do it for.

  7. #7
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by jets5ever[/i]@Jul 20 2004, 10:30 AM
    [b] Riggo - what, exactly, is a "fair wage" to repair a deck and how did you derive that number?

    I don&#39;t want vagaries or doomsday scenarios about what is lurking behind the door, nor do I want some generality about how you don&#39;t know exactly what a fair wage is, but that it [i]has[/i] to be higher than what illegals make. I&#39;m not asking about anything outside of this narrow issue - what is a "fair wage" for repairing a deck and [i]why?[/i] [/b][/quote]
    Composite or Wood? I just paid &#036;12.50 per linear foot for a Composite. I realize this is not your point, but just in case I wanted to put some numbers out there for you.

  8. #8
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by jets5ever[/i]@Jul 20 2004, 10:30 AM
    [b] Riggo - what, exactly, is a "fair wage" to repair a deck and how did you derive that number?

    I don&#39;t want vagaries or doomsday scenarios about what is lurking behind the door, nor do I want some generality about how you don&#39;t know exactly what a fair wage is, but that it [i]has[/i] to be higher than what illegals make. I&#39;m not asking about anything outside of this narrow issue - what is a "fair wage" for repairing a deck and [i]why?[/i] [/b][/quote]
    I&#39;m not a carpenter. Never been one. When I was in college I worked construction jobs all summers because I liked getting a workout and enjoyed being around real working people. I can tell you this: When you increase the available supply of labor in a drastic way, you do affect wages in a downward manner. Or is that crazy?

    What&#39;s a "fairwage" to work in a slaughterhouse of a meatpacking firm?

    I read in 1960, when the jobs where done almost soley by Americans, a slaughterhouse worker made an average of 6 dollars an hour with [b]full benefits[/b]. By the year 2000, with an overflow of illegal aliens in the U.S, the average worker in a slaughterhouse made 9 dollars per hour and [b]zero benefits[/b] :o

    Nice job, hey? In 40 years, workers in slaughterhouses got a 3 dollar raise and had lost almost all their benefits&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

    I bet the boys at the CATO Institute are messing up their nice golf pants in glee as they read what the "free markets" have brought to the American worker in that sector :rolleyes:

    Look, you want to read your future, read the link above. What&#39;s the old adage about the entire U.S following the lead of California?

    In the 1970&#39;s a bunch of cheap ass neo-cons got in bed with the liberals to open the borders in California. It was real swell for a while--cheap maids, gardners, babysitters, ect. Now the people and their childern are paying the terrible price (both in oppresive taxes and out of control crime) due to this enourmous importation of poverty. Heck, you can even count the NFL as a victim of illegal immigration in Los Angeles--where are the tax dollars to build a stadium, when kids are having class in bathrooms due to a population explosion?


    P.S: [b]Weeb[/b], glad to know I introduced to a new website. You are moving in the right in the direction: Trying to self educate yourself on this topic, while not listening to and drinking Katie Couric&#39;s kool-aid of "political correctness"......Now, only if Bush was as smart as you B)

  9. #9
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    Riggo - my point is (and has been with you for some time) that you lump together too many issues, and also take a narrow view of things, and assume that what is true for the part is also true for the whole. You also have pointed to a clear behavioral shift that you expect to remedy the problem, yet cannot even define what it is you mean by the remedy. You say that we should prepare for gloom and doon unless we are willing to pay a "fair wage" and you cannot even define what a fair wage is&#33; This is supposedly your "solution" yet you cannot even commuicate that solution when pressed on it.

    Sure, wages in slaughterhouses may have been dropping since 1960. And an increase in the supply of labor could be a part of that. However, improvements in capital - with machinery replacing human labor as a major factor of production - could also be a factor, as well as economies of scale, to use a little jargon. I don&#39;t know, I&#39;m not familiar with this industry. However, even if we assume that your two-sentence summary is true [i]and[/i] comprehensive, what you neglect to mention are the important role of prices and technological innovation, an consumer preferences. What was the cost to the consumer of slaughtered meat, when the costs of production were higher in 1960? I&#39;d be willing to bet that the costs to the consumer were much higher in 1960 than they were in the year 2000, in real dollar terms (are your two wage comarpisons in real dollars or not?). Perhaps people bought less meat in 1960 than in 2000. Perhaps meat is much cheaper now, relative to 1960, and thus to keep margins and remain in business, companies pay laborers less. The thing is, guys like you want "fair wages" or "higher wages" or this or that, and you decry the "greed" of companies, ignoring the fact that lower production costs equals lower prices, and that if companies have to raise their costs of production, many of them will go out of business, reducing employment and reducing competition, which raises prices. Most businesses fail. More businesses fail than succeed. Business owners cannot simpy pay laborers whatever they want to "gouge" them, nor can they pay them whatever they want to be "fair" and remain profitable enough to stay in existence. Have you ever run yor own business? Do you know anyone who does currently?

    A job is a privledge, not a right. A wage is a price, just like the price for, say, a car. Workers negotiate the price of their own labor and time. If it is unacceptable, find another job. If your town or state taxes too much, leave.

    I agree that our borders need to be closed and that we need to get tough on imimgration, and do acknowledge that it increases the supply of labor, along with many other horrible factors. But, IMO, you group together way too many things and ignore other relevant aspects of what types of shifts are presently ocurring on the [i]economy as a whole. [/i]

    That said, I admire your passion and you are dead-on with 99% of what you write....

  10. #10
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Riggins44[/i]@Jul 20 2004, 01:10 PM
    [b] P.S: [b]Weeb[/b], glad to know I introduced to a new website. You are moving in the right in the direction: Trying to self educate yourself on this topic, while not listening to and drinking Katie Couric&#39;s kool-aid of "political correctness"......Now, only if Bush was as smart as you B) [/b][/quote]
    You intentionally misrepresent me. No matter, anyone that reads what I post knows exactly where I stand.

    I&#39;m the one that suggested America dig a moat and fill it with gators and warning signs between the US and Mexico. And it was [u][b]you[/b][/u] that PC&#39;ed out and shreaked how horrible that statement was.

    I bet you never even heard of MEChA before I posted that link.

    So in light of my last post, you still hell-bent on getting herman and the barbie elected?

  11. #11
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    5E, you do make some valid points, but we just disagree. Look, there are some 5.8 billion people around the world making almost slave wages in Third World Countries. Most would be willing to come the U.S and be exploited by some jackass that veiws them as modern day slaves.

    Here&#39;s the problem: The dickhead building contractor that goes out and hires 15 illegals so he can line his own pockets, forces the rest of society to pick up the tab--both financially and socially. I met an illegal in 2000 that was 28 (looked like he was 15). His friend told me he made about 50 dollars a week, but was thrilled because his girlfriend was expecting their 5TH CHILD....With this American born child, I was told, tons of benefits would flow his way.

    How about 8,000 to 10,000 per child for each school year (that&#39;s 5 kids, with Bi-lingual Ed., the cost is double)? How about the citizens picking up the bill for the pregnancy and child birth? If it the baby was premature, could the bill be as high as 250,000? Easily&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

    Throw in Section 8 housing, foodstamps.....well, no use going forward--this is why California is a catastrophe.

    Think the money his slavemaster bosses are saving are worth that kind of government subsidy?

    Want 15-20 million cheap labor serfs running around? Get ready to pay 5 dollars in taxes for every dollar you save. No other way to put it, but to tell you to research California&#39;s plight--which followed the neo-con dogma of cheap labor is good labor <_<


    Give this a quick read: [url=http://www.americanpatrol.com/GUESTCOLUMNS/DWYER/3x10-040720-Dwyer.html]http://www.americanpatrol.com/GUESTCOLUMNS...0720-Dwyer.html[/url]


    *************

    [quote][b]...moat and fill it with gators and warning signs between the US and Mexico. And it was you that PC&#39;ed out and shreaked how horrible that statement was[/b][/quote]
    Total waste. Here&#39;s the deal: Start arresting contractors and others that hire these people and start fining them to the full extent of the law. Outside of the war on terror, we don&#39;t need one guard at the border. If your average suburban block-head gets a 150,000 dollar fine for allowing 15 illegals to work illegaly (which the law clearly states&#33;&#33;), then this problem goes away fast&#33;

    Here&#39;s what your icon Bush thinks about enforcing our laws (click on radio link near Asa&#39;s photo to listen to a dummy say the U.S has handed away it&#39;s soverignity) :wacko: [url=http://www.americanpatrol.com/DHS/ContactHutchRaidsCA_040626.html]http://www.americanpatrol.com/DHS/ContactH...sCA_040626.html[/url]

    [quote][b]I bet you never even heard of MEChA before I posted that link.[/b][/quote]
    Forget me, have your hero&#39;s at Foxnews ever heard about them? They are a radical seperatist group, which eventually want to "ethnically cleanse" the west of all Whites, blacks and many non-Mexican hispanics. It&#39;s in their constution.

    They are so protected by the media, by the way, that MeCHA members ran for governor of California and mayor of LA, yet WOULD NOT "renounce" their seperatists and strong anti-zionist leanings puplicly :o

    Maybe David Duke or Farrakan should ask them how they can support these ideas, yet still run for office with Katie Couric kissing their fat asses <_<

    [quote][b]So in light of my last post, you still hell-bent on getting herman and the barbie elected?[/b][/quote]

    I&#39;ve said enough on why I expect more from a "conservative" like Bush, than a Boston liberal like Kerry.........

    Let me leave you with this: Bush rubber stamped the trade of Sammy Sosa to Chicago for a "washed up" Jorge Bell :rolleyes:

  12. #12
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Riggins44[/i]@Jul 20 2004, 04:24 PM
    [b] [quote][b]I bet you never even heard of MEChA before I posted that link.[/b][/quote]
    Forget me, have your hero&#39;s at Foxnews ever heard about them? They are a radical seperatist group, which eventually want to "ethnically cleanse" the west of all Whites, blacks and many non-Mexican hispanics. It&#39;s in their constution.

    They are so protected by the media, by the way, that MeCHA members ran for governor of California and mayor of LA, yet WOULD NOT "renounce" their seperatists and strong anti-zionist leanings puplicly :o

    Maybe David Duke or Farrakan should ask them how they can support these ideas, yet still run for office with Katie Couric kissing their fat asses <_<

    [quote][b]So in light of my last post, you still hell-bent on getting herman and the barbie elected?[/b][/quote]

    I&#39;ve said enough on why I expect more from a "conservative" like Bush, than a Boston liberal like Kerry.........

    Let me leave you with this: Bush rubber stamped the trade of Sammy Sosa to Chicago for a "washed up" Jorge Bell :rolleyes: [/b][/quote]
    Why don&#39;t you answer the question: are you still hell-bent on getting a politician staffed by MEChA members and liberal anarchists elected?

    By the way, I would&#39;ve expected an ultra-conservative such as yourself to have tuned into Fox every once in a while. Fox covered MEChA and Lt Gov. Cruz Bustamante&#39;s involvement in that anti-American group in depth during the CA recall election.

    Yep, if you consider yourself conservative, then I&#39;m proud to be a neo-con.

  13. #13
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    Where&#39;s my man Weeb today?

    Hey Weeb, checkout the front page of one our favorite web sites today--[url=http://www.americanpatrol.com]www.americanpatrol.com[/url] today?

    Considering your pal Arbusto has basically destroyed our Border Patrol for short term political gain, the fine Americans at APB did a tape of how it easy it is for a terrorist to traverse our border and detonate a [b]Weapon of Mass Destruction[/b] :o

    Looks like Arbusto&#39;s little game of pandering to criminals could have catastrophic results for law-abiding Americans and their families?

    Where is Arbusto going to attack next, while our borders are a seive just yawning for Americans to get slaughtered by a "dirty bomb"?

    We going to Iran next? Sudan? Jordan? Iceland? Where?

    By the way, there is some good news on the site: American Patriots in North Carolina, Georgia and Kansas are begining to say F&#39;you to Karl Rove elitist liberals and embracing true Republicans B)

  14. #14
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    So how again is the ultra lib from boston going to fix the broken borders and keep my children safe?

    I&#39;m still missing something. Enlighten us.

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