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Thread: CNN: Kingdom on the Brink

  1. #1
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    If you haven't already caught this, it's being repeated. I saw it this morning, found the perspectives and insight interesting.

    [url=http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/presents/index.saudi.arabia.html]http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/presents/i...udi.arabia.html[/url]

  2. #2
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    ....guess no one watched it (?)

    What I got out of it:

    -- That to stop terrorism, we need to let the Arab nations take care of it themselves. We need to support those 'radicals' within that want reform and denounce Al Qaeda. Change from within. Let them evolve and modernize at their own rate.

    -- We fuel the terrorists by supporting the Saudi Royal Family (and Israel) and bringing war on their homeland (yes there was 9-11 but of course the people are only shown 1 side by the extremists). The Royal Family wants reform, wants to modernize-- we are helping them do this and putting ourselves at jeopardy? Let them do it themselves. Are we doing their dirty work for them?

    And for you Moore obsessionists: He had nothing to do with this real documentary ;) and pictures were featured with Bush and the Royal Family members-- Bin Laden's relatives who he denounced and is considered corrupt by some. It's easy to see how Bin Laden, Al Qaeda win over gullible youth in their terrorist recruits who are fed nothing but what they are told and taught by religious extremists.

  3. #3
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    <duplicate post erased>

  4. #4
    flushingjet
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    wow, I never knew you could find so many anti-Semites, atheists, Wiccans, and anti-Americans all in one forum&#33; KEWL&#33;&#33;&#33;

  5. #5
    [quote][i]Originally posted by flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:05 PM
    [b] wow, I never knew you could find so many anti-Semites, atheists, Wiccans, and anti-Americans all in one forum&#33; KEWL&#33;&#33;&#33; [/b][/quote]
    Check out Democratic Underground. That is the motheload of Anti-Semites Atheists Progressives Anarchists and the like.

  6. #6
    flushingjet
    Guest
    the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays.

  7. #7
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    What are you babbling about flushingjet?

  8. #8
    [quote][i]Originally posted by flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:25 PM
    [b] the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays. [/b][/quote]
    If you&#39;ve been here for a while you&#39;d learn that there are not that many loons here. It is generally the same 2 or three offenders who simply post often. One of them was banned recently. None of them have posted in this thread.

  9. #9
    [quote][i]Originally posted by chiefst2000+Nov 15 2004, 11:46 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (chiefst2000 @ Nov 15 2004, 11:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:25 PM
    [b] the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays. [/b][/quote]
    If you&#39;ve been here for a while you&#39;d learn that there are not that many loons here. It is generally the same 2 or three offenders who simply post often. One of them was banned recently. None of them have posted in this thread. [/b][/quote]
    Can you identify the "loons" for future reference?

    Thanks&#33;

  10. #10
    [quote][i]Originally posted by The Darkstar Conspiracy+Nov 15 2004, 01:13 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (The Darkstar Conspiracy @ Nov 15 2004, 01:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by chiefst2000@Nov 15 2004, 11:46 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin-flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:25 PM
    [b] the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays. [/b][/quote]
    If you&#39;ve been here for a while you&#39;d learn that there are not that many loons here. It is generally the same 2 or three offenders who simply post often. One of them was banned recently. None of them have posted in this thread. [/b][/quote]
    Can you identify the "loons" for future reference?

    Thanks&#33; [/b][/quote]
    Bman was notorious. As is West Coast Mole. I&#39;d also add the new poster JetsmetsIsles (i think thats how its written There was also a poster named Outsider who I would add to that list. Those are the biggest offenders.

    There are also somr other leftwing posters whom although I don&#39;t agree with them in any way, and they are a bit looney, but they add to the conversation here by providing an opposing position on many issues. Folks like Bitoni and Section fit that bill. If everyone agreed all the time these forums would be worthless.

    I think that for the most part the rest of the left leaning folks here are run of the mill Democrats.

  11. #11
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by chiefst2000+Nov 15 2004, 03:23 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (chiefst2000 @ Nov 15 2004, 03:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by The Darkstar Conspiracy@Nov 15 2004, 01:13 PM
    [b] [quote]Originally posted by chiefst2000@Nov 15 2004, 11:46 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin-flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:25 PM
    [b] the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays. [/b][/quote]
    If you&#39;ve been here for a while you&#39;d learn that there are not that many loons here. It is generally the same 2 or three offenders who simply post often. One of them was banned recently. None of them have posted in this thread. [/b][/quote]
    Can you identify the "loons" for future reference?

    Thanks&#33; [/b][/quote]
    Bman was notorious. As is West Coast Mole. I&#39;d also add the new poster JetsmetsIsles (i think thats how its written There was also a poster named Outsider who I would add to that list. Those are the biggest offenders.

    There are also somr other leftwing posters whom although I don&#39;t agree with them in any way, and they are a bit looney, but they add to the conversation here by providing an opposing position on many issues. Folks like Bitoni and Section fit that bill. If everyone agreed all the time these forums would be worthless.

    I think that for the most part the rest of the left leaning folks here are run of the mill Democrats. [/b][/quote]
    I take offense not being considered one of the loons.

  12. #12
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15+Nov 15 2004, 01:43 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (Section109Row15 @ Nov 15 2004, 01:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> [quote]Originally posted by chiefst2000@Nov 15 2004, 03:23 PM
    [b] [quote]Originally posted by The Darkstar Conspiracy@Nov 15 2004, 01:13 PM
    [b] [quote]Originally posted by chiefst2000@Nov 15 2004, 11:46 AM
    [b] <!--QuoteBegin-flushingjet[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:25 PM
    [b] the nameplate is on the front door of that loony bin, it&#39;s when the oddballs fly so free & numerously under the radar in ostensibly non-political forums like "JetsInsider" it&#39;s more surprising&#092;troubling. but heck, why should anything surprise me nowadays. [/b][/quote]
    If you&#39;ve been here for a while you&#39;d learn that there are not that many loons here. It is generally the same 2 or three offenders who simply post often. One of them was banned recently. None of them have posted in this thread. [/b][/quote]
    Can you identify the "loons" for future reference?

    Thanks&#33; [/b][/quote]
    Bman was notorious. As is West Coast Mole. I&#39;d also add the new poster JetsmetsIsles (i think thats how its written There was also a poster named Outsider who I would add to that list. Those are the biggest offenders.

    There are also somr other leftwing posters whom although I don&#39;t agree with them in any way, and they are a bit looney, but they add to the conversation here by providing an opposing position on many issues. Folks like Bitoni and Section fit that bill. If everyone agreed all the time these forums would be worthless.

    I think that for the most part the rest of the left leaning folks here are run of the mill Democrats. [/b][/quote]
    I take offense not being considered one of the loons. [/b][/quote]
    Oh your a loon alright, but your well intentioned. I don&#39;t hold you in the same negative light reserved for WCM and his ilk. Its all relative. People like him and formerly Bman make you seem more reasonable in comparison.

  13. #13
    flushingjet
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by R. Tyme[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 12:29 PM
    [b] What are you babbling about flushingjet? [/b][/quote]
    Actually, WHATCHOO talkin bout?:

    What I got out of it:

    -- That to stop terrorism, we need to let the Arab nations take care of it themselves. We need to support those &#39;radicals&#39; within that want reform and denounce Al Qaeda. Change from within. Let them evolve and modernize at their own rate.

    [SIZE=3]HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAA[/SIZE]


    -- We fuel the terrorists by supporting the Saudi Royal Family

    [SIZE=3]Gotta buy gas somewhere if we cant disturb those Alaskan caribou and Gulf fishies.[/SIZE]

    (and Israel)

    [SIZE=3]Anti-semite - if I have to explain this you have no clue [/SIZE]

    and bringing war on their homeland (yes there was 9-11 but of course the people are only shown 1 side by the extremists). The Royal Family wants reform, wants to modernize-- we are helping them do this and putting ourselves at jeopardy? Let them do it themselves. Are we doing their dirty work for them?

    [SIZE=3]Great, no problem taking all their oil and destroying that "Presence"-like
    cult cube[/SIZE]


    And for you Moore obsessionists: He had nothing to do with this real documentary and pictures were featured with Bush and the Royal Family members-- Bin Laden&#39;s relatives who he denounced and is considered corrupt by some. It&#39;s easy to see how Bin Laden, Al Qaeda win over gullible youth in their terrorist recruits who are fed nothing but what they are told and taught by religious extremists.

    [SIZE=3] Therefore, terrorists are not responsible for their actions?[/SIZE]

    You can pick the pipe back up now....

  14. #14
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    Flushingjet....flush yourself down the toilet, &#39;kay? your response is unfortunately typical. You are the one who is clueless.

    I guess an open discussion on another perspective AS RELATED to a documentary on television is out of the question here. Please some of you, never take an office as a diplomat-- no qualifications there. Nope there&#39;s no such things as looking at issues objectively here from both sides.

    The "and Israel" comment referred to the support and was part of the way we are perceived and hated by the Arab world and this is also used as one-sided propaganda fed to young recruits who become terrorists. But of course, it&#39;s much easier for the simple-minded to label me an anti-semite. I understand the Jewish side of the issues also but the documentary was not about this...it focused on the Arab world. You want to label CNN anti-semitic also for airing it? You must be all for censorship of anything questionable that doesn&#39;t present your narrow view with blinders.

    No where did I say that terrorists are not responsible for their actions, the idea was to get at the route of why they became terrorists and nip that in the bud. Education is key. The documentary pointed out that 75% of Saudi Arabia was under 27 years old. There are &#39;radicals&#39; (how the Islamic extremists would view them) within that want reform and do not agree with the Islamic extremists. There are members of the Royal Family that do not agree with the Islamic leaders (their own religious heads) and this makes them an enemy. The Islamic extremists do not want to modernize (or Westernize), but there are ones within that want to...getting to the youth is key.

    We need to find alternative means of energy other than oil without depending on other countries for it and without destroying our environment...talking about the future of our planet here.

    And I prefer to pass a peace pipe thank you.

  15. #15
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    R-Tyme, you can&#39;t reason with most on the right. They are a little slow.

  16. #16
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by Section109Row15[/i]@Nov 15 2004, 09:04 PM
    [b] R-Tyme, you can&#39;t reason with most on the right. They are a little slow. [/b][/quote]
    I see that&#33; but I gave it a try

  17. #17
    flushingjet
    Guest
    Yeah, "you" guys are real smart. Guess thats why most of our clueless, simple-minded country doesn&#39;t agree with you. Country tyme, sectsless, I&#39;d outclass any of you, any time in a smarts contest. 2nd of all, I wouldn&#39;t take anything seen or heard from al-CNN as fact. 3rd, why don&#39;t you just admit that "modern" Islam, as a worldwide culture or religion is totally full of hate and intolerance. Their tenets are totally illegal in the US & Western world and cannot be suppported by any sane American. We can agree that Saudi Arabia is the font&#092;root of this problem, and they are to blame for extrremism as they create it & fund it. It would be totally justified to overrun that POS litterbox of a country from that vantage point & from a 9&#092;11 vantage point. We could do it in a week, but you know what-we&#39;re not their only customers and they are not the only country capable of supplying oil and supporting Islamic terrorism. There is a possibility by taking an extreme measure against SA that we would destabililize world oil markets&#092;economies. It&#39;s just like any other war we would undertake, the MSM&#092;LLL would be against it, even if it was totally justified. If we captured OBL tomorrow, for example, there would be a very large "Free OBL" movement in the USA and Europe and massive demonstrations in the Islamic world. I could care less, but I&#39;m sure you would be concerned about his mental health. Any concern about ANWR is false, we could drill there without causing any environmental impact at all. The best thing would be to create technologies where we would be independent of ME oil, but our military options will probably have to be exercised first against this cancer, which if you haven&#39;t noticed, has spread all over the world.

  18. #18
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by flushingjet[/i]@Nov 16 2004, 07:21 AM
    [b] Yeah, "you" guys are real smart. Guess thats why most of our clueless, simple-minded country doesn&#39;t agree with you. Country tyme, sectsless, I&#39;d outclass any of you, any time in a smarts contest. 2nd of all, I wouldn&#39;t take anything seen or heard from al-CNN as fact. 3rd, why don&#39;t you just admit that "modern" Islam, as a worldwide culture or religion is totally full of hate and intolerance. Their tenets are totally illegal in the US & Western world and cannot be suppported by any sane American. We can agree that Saudi Arabia is the font&#092;root of this problem, and they are to blame for extrremism as they create it & fund it.
    <snip etc> [/b][/quote]
    "country tyme" :lol:

    You sound insulted by my strike-back, what kind of a response did you expect from your one or two sentence responses in this thread that called me an anti-semite and possible goofball?

    Personally I am not a fan of the Islamic religion, think it is a little backwards. If you listen to Islamic followers, it sounds like the last thing their religion is about...is hatred and intolerance. I&#39;ve known people who were Muslims and was honored to get invited to a Muslim wedding years ago. I listened to the Cat Stevens (forgot his Muslim name) interview on some news show because I was a big fan of his back in the day and listening to him, you&#39;d think Islam is the ideal religion to follow. How this got translated and high-jacked so far to the other end by the extremists and terrorists is baffling. (btw, there are also Christian extremists I disagree with)

    One thing I find very interesting about all the talk on how the country voted and the religious right, morals etc. is the idea that this was a fight against Islam. The cross against the Muslim countries. It was so fitting to find and post that cross made of steel beams at the 9-11 site. The Islamic extremists wanted a jihad, a holy war.....maybe they got it, eh? ;)

  19. #19
    [quote][i]Originally posted by R. Tyme[/i]@Nov 16 2004, 10:06 AM
    [b] If you listen to Islamic followers, it sounds like the last thing their religion is about...is hatred and intolerance. I&#39;ve known people who were Muslims and was honored to get invited to a Muslim wedding years ago. I listened to the Cat Stevens (forgot his Muslim name) interview on some news show because I was a big fan of his back in the day and listening to him, you&#39;d think Islam is the ideal religion to follow. How this got translated and high-jacked so far to the other end by the extremists and terrorists is baffling. (btw, there are also Christian extremists I disagree with)
    [/b][/quote]
    Islam is a religion founded on hatred and intolerence. That&#39;s a FACT. It&#39;s in THEIR Qur&#39;an. I&#39;m not expressing an opinion here. It started 1,400 years ago when Allah came to Muhammed in a dream on a mountain. He was told that this new faith would supercede Judaism and Christianity. He was told that anyone who did not convert was an infidel punishable by death. He was told that his mission was to convert the entire Earth to Islam. The culture "developed," isolating itself from the "West." They continued to convert people anywhere they could slowly changing the way Africa and the ME thought. They conquered where and when they could. They even insulted other religions after conquering. The Dome of the Rock, Islam&#39;s most holy place where it is believed Muhammed assended into heaven, was built directly on top of Soloman&#39;s Temple, previously Judaism&#39;s most holy sight. This is where the Arc of the Covenant was kept and where it is believed David saw his vision of angels ascending a golden ladder into the sky. I don&#39;t want to pretend that other religions weren&#39;t as barbaric. We KNOW they were. It was a mad race to convert as many people as they could to their own way of thinking. BUT, Islam was the only religion (as far as I know) that wrote it explicitly into its holy book. The early Mulsims resembled the extremists we are dealing with today. After centuries of resisting any influences of the West, there was a break in the pattern. Of course this changed the way they saw the world and, as a result, themselves. There was a major split in the religion into the Sunni and Shiite "tribes." Some believed the leaders (although there weren&#39;t supposed to be any real "leaders" in the original religion) should be the direct descendants of Muhammed while others believed it was not necessary. (Saddam Hussein, it is believed by some, was a direct descendant.) One side was extremely conservative while the other let more and more Western thought enter their lives.
    My point is (sorry it took so long) is that Islam was not a peacfule religion that got translated and high-jacked. It was a brutal and hateful religion that has transformed itself into a peacful one, HOWEVER there are still some that remain "old school." What has come to question now is why the tolerant and peaceful Muslims haven&#39;t come forth as much as I think they should in condemning what has happened in the last 4 years. There is this blind Islamic "I got your back no matter what" code that, to me, is appalling. THAT&#39;S what I&#39;m most furious at.

  20. #20
    [quote][i]Originally posted by R. Tyme+Nov 16 2004, 08:06 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (R. Tyme @ Nov 16 2004, 08:06 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-flushingjet[/i]@Nov 16 2004, 07:21 AM
    [b] Yeah, "you" guys are real smart. Guess thats why most of our clueless, simple-minded country doesn&#39;t agree with you. Country tyme, sectsless, I&#39;d outclass any of you, any time in a smarts contest. 2nd of all, I wouldn&#39;t take anything seen or heard from al-CNN as fact. 3rd, why don&#39;t you just admit that "modern" Islam, as a worldwide culture or religion is totally full of hate and intolerance. Their tenets are totally illegal in the US & Western world and cannot be suppported by any sane American. We can agree that Saudi Arabia is the font&#092;root of this problem, and they are to blame for extrremism as they create it & fund it.
    <snip etc> [/b][/quote]
    "country tyme" :lol:

    You sound insulted by my strike-back, what kind of a response did you expect from your one or two sentence responses in this thread that called me an anti-semite and possible goofball?

    Personally I am not a fan of the Islamic religion, think it is a little backwards. If you listen to Islamic followers, it sounds like the last thing their religion is about...is hatred and intolerance. I&#39;ve known people who were Muslims and was honored to get invited to a Muslim wedding years ago. I listened to the Cat Stevens (forgot his Muslim name) interview on some news show because I was a big fan of his back in the day and listening to him, you&#39;d think Islam is the ideal religion to follow. How this got translated and high-jacked so far to the other end by the extremists and terrorists is baffling. (btw, there are also Christian extremists I disagree with)

    One thing I find very interesting about all the talk on how the country voted and the religious right, morals etc. is the idea that this was a fight against Islam. The cross against the Muslim countries. It was so fitting to find and post that cross made of steel beams at the 9-11 site. The Islamic extremists wanted a jihad, a holy war.....maybe they got it, eh? ;) [/b][/quote]
    Tyme,

    I like you. Your interested in politics and that is a good thing. Unfortunately you have fallen in to the trap that many "classic liberals" have fallen into. It is a view of the world that is a bit idealistic and naieve. Recent polls by Al Jazeera have shown that 90% of Muslims support the resistance in Iraq. 70% support the idea of beheadings as a legitimate means of resistance. A majority support terrrorism against America.

    These figures are nothing new. The documentary you saw on CNN is a biased look at events in the middle east. You may not know this but CNN is widely known to be a far left leaning news organization. It is understandable that they would air documentarys which seek to paint US policy in a negative light. I can understand Flushingjet&#39;s frustration to see the drivel from that documentary posted in a way that implies some sort of revelation into our Middle East policy that we&#39;ve never heard befort. The fact is that the nonesense that you posted about in the opening of this thread is nonesense that many of us have heard time and time again.

    It further decreases your credibility when you highlite some Mooresque details such as pictures of President Bush with members of the Saudi Royal family. I guess you didn&#39;t realize that without strengthening the royal family theres a good change that Islamic radicals could take over that country. I&#39;ll clue you in on a secret here. That would be VERY BAD.

    I really hope that you are not already indoctrinated by many of these left wing ideas that you have been posting recently. If you keep an open mind you may begin to see where many of those ideas are naieve and foolish.

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