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Thread: The Religion of Peace Kills Again-IN NJ

  1. #1
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    First the Saturday people; then the Sunday people. Ah, the Religion of Peace, coming to a divesity-stupid town near you.


    'ISLAMIC HATE' EYED IN SLAYS

    By DOUGLAS MONTERO and STEFAN C. FRIEDMAN
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    January 16, 2005 -- The father of a murdered New Jersey family was threatened for making anti-Muslim remarks online and the gruesome quadruple slaying may have been the hateful retaliation, sources told The Post yesterday.
    Hossam Armanious, 47, who along with his wife and two daughters was found stabbed to death in his Jersey City home early Friday, would regularly debate religion in a Middle Eastern chat room, one source said.

    Armanious, an Egyptian Christian, was well known for expressing his Coptic beliefs and engaging in fiery back-and-forth with Muslims on the Web site paltalk.com.

    He "had the reputation for being one of the most outspoken Egyptian Christians," said the source, who had close ties to the family.

    The source, who had knowledge of the investigation, refused to specify the anti-Muslim statement. But he said cops told him they were looking into the exchanges as a possible motive.

    The married father of two had recently been threatened by Muslim members of the Web site, said a fellow Copt and store clerk who uses the chat room.

    "You'd better stop this bull---- or we are going to track you down like a chicken and kill you," was the threat, said the clerk, who was online at the time and saw the exchange.



    But Armanious refused to back down, according to two sources who use the Web site.

    Jersey City Mayor Jerramiah Healy would neither confirm nor deny that cops and prosecutors were looking into the religion motive, saying only that "nothing is being ruled out." But a relative of the mayor who answered the phone at Healy's home said there was information the murders were "religion-related."

    "There are several theories we are looking into, but we are not commenting on any of them at this time," said Hudson County Assistant Prosecutor Guy Gregory.


    Armanious' fervor apparently rubbed off on his daughter, Sylvia who would have turned 16 yesterday.

    "She was very religious and very opinionated," said Jessica Cimino, 15, a fellow sophomore at Dickenson HS.

    A family member who viewed photos of the bloodbath said Sylvia seemed to have taken the most savage punishment.

    "When we saw the pictures, you could tell that they were hurt really, really bad in the face; especially Sylvia," said Milad Garas, the high-school sophomore's great-uncle.

    The heartless killer not only slit Sylvia's throat, but also sliced a huge gash in her chest and stabbed her in the wrist, where she had a tattoo of a Coptic cross.

    Also found murdered were the wife, Amal Garas, and the parents' other daughter, Monica.

    Fred Ayed, the deacon at St. George and St. Shenouda Church, where the deeply religious family attended services, said he's worried that the murders could have a ripple effect.

    "I am concerned for the safety of our community," said Ayed, who knew Hossam for 30 years. "People are scared because one family was slain like cows," said Moheb Ghabour, publisher of a local newspaper for the Coptic community.

    Osama Hassan, director of the Islamic Center of Jersey City, described the relationship between Copts and Muslims as cooperative if not friendly.

    "I think there might be people that can get into physical fights, but not to the point of murder," Hassan said.

    Both the deacon and uncle poured cold water on the theory that the family were the victims of a robbery gone wrong.

    "This is not a robbery, Ayed said. "We found all of the jewelry in the house. They didn't take anything."

    The FBI confirmed it has been called in to help with the case.


    Additional reporting by Heather Gilmore

  2. #2
    Just an amazing story, I almost posted it myself, shortly before you did... I bet we saw the link to this story on the same California based site :lol:

    You know, the amazing thing about this story is all this trouble may've started on a [b]on-line message board[/b] :o

    Just a darn shame and a reminder to everyone that anonymity is this best policy when surfing the Net...Just a simple name given over the Net can yield an address in a matter of seconds. You never know what wacko's are out there and what will set them off.

    This is a tough story. I don't watch a lot of TV news, but I wonder how much play this gets (or has gotten)?

    I know a Michael Savage will see this and run with it.

  3. #3
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    I live less than a mile from where this happened. Current speculation is that it was a robbery.

  4. #4
    Whats amazing is that Internet quarterbacks have called this one without having any idea of whats going on---

  5. #5
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    Nothing taken doesn't sound like a robbery. You don't methodically commit 4 murders to commit a robbery and then take nothing. Neither does cutting the teen girl's cross tattoo sound like soMEthing a common thief would do. Even if you're trying to make it look like something it's not, why would they do that, or even be aware of such a Coptic tradition? The FBI doesn't generally get involved in run-of-the-mill home invasions or homcides. And they have a record of death threats.Further, if you plan to kill people, cutting with knives is very upclose, personal and messy. A gun would be the weapon of choice for someone looking to get it done quickly and cleanly. Criminological fact-people who use knives in homicides are generally acting very emotionally. Again-this was PERSONAL, REAL UPCLOSE HATRED rather than a dispassionate property crime.

    Nothing personal-but you don't know my background. So don't presume you're the all-knowing Oz and everyone else is a dope.

  6. #6
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    The local papers[Jersey Journal/Star Ledger(see njo.com)] claim the detectives are leaning towards robbery as a motive. The victims' pockets were turned out and there was a total of 1 penny left in the apartment. Also, the cut on the girl's wrist appears to be a defensive wound-her sister had a similar tatoo that was not cut.

  7. #7
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by JumbalayaJet[/i]@Jan 17 2005, 08:13 PM
    [b] The local papers[Jersey Journal/Star Ledger(see njo.com)] claim the detectives are leaning towards robbery as a motive. The victims' pockets were turned out and there was a total of 1 penny left in the apartment. Also, the cut on the girl's wrist appears to be a defensive wound-her sister had a similar tatoo that was not cut. [/b][/quote]
    Those Arabs are good at making it look like a robery.

  8. #8
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by jetman67[/i]@Jan 17 2005, 07:27 PM
    [b] Those Arabs are good at making it look like a robery. [/b][/quote]
    Could be, and the investigation is on-going, but I'll be keeping the doors locked just in case.

  9. #9
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    [quote][i]Originally posted by JumbalayaJet+Jan 17 2005, 09:32 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (JumbalayaJet @ Jan 17 2005, 09:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-jetman67[/i]@Jan 17 2005, 07:27 PM
    [b] Those Arabs are good at making it look like a robery. [/b][/quote]
    Could be, and the investigation is on-going, but I&#39;ll be keeping the doors locked just in case. [/b][/quote]
    My kid sister lives in JC. I should give her a call, make sure her place is locked tight.

  10. #10
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    I didnt read the first post o fthis thread, too long, I just read the responses.

    That said, yes, the theory by the actual cops working the case, you know, the ones with knowledge of the crime scene, is robbery. All the jewelry and money is missing from the house. The family was also a victim of a robbery in the past

    The funeral was said to resemble funerals from the middle east, people took over the streets, a 1000 of them and carried the coffins to the burial site. A picture on the front page of the NJ star-ledger shows a sign held aloft "we demand justice". Thanks for clearing that up.

  11. #11
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    There&#39;s still some very odd things about this robbery. The man had been threatened twice before about his comments on Muslims over the net. Turns out, a relative had worked on the prosecution of the lawyer for the blind Shiek charged in the original bombing attack on the WTC. There was an eery scene at the funeral when a local Imam started trouble by smiling at the grieving mourners. Jihad in Jersey City? I get the feeling that more will come of this.

  12. #12
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    Jumba-saw the funeral chaos;disturbing....

    "The FBI is investigating this matter--the Agency says it&#39;s not unusal to get involved in a case where four people are murdered.

    But ABC News has learned that a cousin of the slain family has been a translator working for the prosecution in the trial of Lynne Stewart. She is the radical lawyer accused of smuggling messages from imprisoned Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman, to terrorist cell members and associates(Note -this is the cell of Egyptian "Brotherhood" guys who did the first WTC bombing, planned to bomb the tunnels and are hand-in-glove with Al Qeada; Rahman&#39;s son was on video celebrating 9/11 with Bin Laden).

    The police have not ruled out any possible motive. The Coptic community has even offered a &#036;500,000 reward for any information leading to the people responsible for this brutal crime."

    It may very well be a robbery. but using knives is not a very efficient way to conduct a property crime, nor would run-of-the-mill thieves tie up and torture people.

  13. #13
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    The police released details today to stem the mis-information out there, check for the story at star-ledger, among details released, the religious tats WERE NOT damaged in any way, and no religious artifacts in the home were knocked down or broken.

  14. #14
    Bugg, I see you are still hanging on to your assumption that just because someone is Muslim, they are murderous scumbags.

    Fact is Bugg that there are scumbags from all walks of life that will go to their house of worship and claim to be righteous. Yet, outside of the confines of their house of worship they kill others, mollest children, solicit prostitutes, commit adultery, theft, and fraud among many other sins. It happens in all religions. It has happened since the beginning of organized religion.

    We discussed this several times in the past. However, you just want to hang on to your biggoted opinions. Thankfully, I have been too busy to respond to the numerous onesided opinions of posters such as yourself.

    The sad thing is that people died and here you are like a freakin&#39; cheerleeader saying "the religion of peace kills again."

    If this was in fact a religiously motivated crime prpetrated by Muslims then they should go to jail just like anyone else who kills someone. I have lived in FLorida for too long to know if NY/NJ has a death penalty for murder crimes. If they do then so be it.

  15. #15
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    Bigoted, eh? Realistic is more like it. Lived through 9/11 and it&#39;s aftermath in NYC. Sell fantasy elsewhere pal. I go by that site several times a week where friends and neighbors were murdered. You want to call it "bigoted" to call it the way it is, that&#39;s your problem not mine. And until those who really want to live here in peace as Americans speak out against and stop tolerating the terrorists in their midst in Paterson, Florida, Dearborn and Brooklyn, you can stick it. There have been some Muslims who have done so; good for them. But if you guys want to convince us you&#39;re just like everyone else, you&#39;re gonna have to go a whole lot farther in showing your commitment to peaceful pluralism and stop trotting out the racism card evey time anyone calls you on this.


    And as to pluralism-why have Christian Arabs fled for their lives Egypt, Palestine and Lebanon? Would you like to tell us about dhimmitude, how Muslim countries treat Christians, like in the Sudan or Saudi Arabia?How Wahabbis and other Muslims murder Chirstians and blow up their churches? Please, let&#39;s celebrate that great tolerant culture of Islam&#33;

    If you cannot live in a pluralistic culture were people question you and your values, you might feel more comfortable in one of those lockstep Muslim ones that don&#39;t allow any religious freedom.

  16. #16
    [quote][i]Originally posted by Bugg[/i]@Jan 19 2005, 09:07 PM
    [b] Bigoted, eh? Realistic is more like it. Lived through 9/11 and it&#39;s aftermath in NYC. Sell fantasy elsewhere pal. I go by that site several times a week where friends and neighbors were murdered. You want to call it "bigoted" to call it the way it is, that&#39;s your problem not mine. And until those who really want to live here in peace as Americans speak out against and stop tolerating the terrorists in their midst in Paterson, Florida, Dearborn and Brooklyn, you can stick it. There have been some Muslims who have done so; good for them. But if you guys want to convince us you&#39;re just like everyone else, you&#39;re gonna have to go a whole lot farther in showing your commitment to peaceful pluralism and stop trotting out the racism card evey time anyone calls you on this.


    And as to pluralism-why have Christian Arabs fled for their lives Egypt, Palestine and Lebanon? Would you like to tell us about dhimmitude, how Muslim countries treat Christians, like in the Sudan or Saudi Arabia?How Wahabbis and other Muslims murder Chirstians and blow up their churches? Please, let&#39;s celebrate that great tolerant culture of Islam&#33;

    If you cannot live in a pluralistic culture were people question you and your values, you might feel more comfortable in one of those lockstep Muslim ones that don&#39;t allow any religious freedom. [/b][/quote]
    Well said, Bugg.

  17. #17
    Bugg, seriously dude get over it.

    People really do die. I feel sorry for you. You lost some friends on 9/11. I lost a college buddy on that day. He worked at Cantor Fitz and he and his wife just had a baby just a few months earlier. Yeah it sucks.

    Perhaps you ought to look and learn from it instead of crying about losing a couple of friends. Yeah what they did was seriously f@*cked up. But life has to go on.

    As far as your concern of Global Genocide goes. You are right to a certain degree about some of the crap going on in some countries like Saudi Arabia and much of the Arab world. Who do you think protects the leadership of many of the countries that are perpetrating those actions? Does that mean that they condone it? Just watch C-Span sometime and look at some of the lowlifes in our government who broker their deals with these countries. Why do you think many Muslim people have been trying to get the hell out of those countries and are going to the US and EU for a better life? Regardless if it means having to deal with misinformed biggots.

    If you have such a big problem about the mass murder of Christians throughout the world then why don&#39;t you do something about it. Write your congressman, senator and get involved. Spread the good word of Christianity to stop the support for murderous regimes. Let me know how far you get. I bet you will get farther after you filled up your SUV at your local Chevron station.

  18. #18
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    So, I understand now. AMERICA=BAD.

    If it&#39;s so awful and racist here, by all means, you&#39;re free to go.

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    Slight detail, which is by all American crime stats I&#39;ve seen, rather unusual-the family was [u][i][b]beheaded[/b][/i][/u]. Tied to a chair, pistol-whipped, stabbed-I&#39;m sorry to say it happens. Beheadings tend to stand out. Gee, in what culture do they do such things?

    [url=http://www.michellemalkin.com/]http://www.michellemalkin.com/[/url]

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