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Thread: Taking Character Too Far

  1. #1
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    Taking Character Too Far

    I am all far having high character guys, and I think Harris and Revis are going to be excellent ball players, but, the Jets had opportunities last year and this year to add some big bodies up front, namely, Gabe Watson and Alan Branch from Michigan, and did not bite on either one. It is pretty frustrating to see those guys playing well and anchoring the 3-4 for Arizona. Both guys fell b/c of some miconception about their motors/character - but when Branch was at UM he was a monster, and the best DL in the Big Ten. Parcells used to say if you are going to make mistakes make them big, and it is about time the Jets start doing that.

  2. #2
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    yeah, we need to be more like the perennial champions, the bengals


    dump

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by scuppers View Post
    I am all far having high character guys, and I think Harris and Revis are going to be excellent ball players, but, the Jets had opportunities last year and this year to add some big bodies up front, namely, Gabe Watson and Alan Branch from Michigan, and did not bite on either one. It is pretty frustrating to see those guys playing well and anchoring the 3-4 for Arizona. Both guys fell b/c of some miconception about their motors/character - but when Branch was at UM he was a monster, and the best DL in the Big Ten. Parcells used to say if you are going to make mistakes make them big, and it is about time the Jets start doing that.
    With all due respect scuppers, you want the Jets to mirror their drafting strategies after the Arizona Cardnials?

    The Patriots in the NFL and the Yankees in baseball have a long stretch of success by drafting and signing good, smart, players with strong work ethics.

    Fans need to have patience.

    We're in the second year of a rebuild.

    Two above average drafts in a row where we found our LT and QB of the future.

    We're not in that bad of shape................

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by scuppers View Post
    I am all far having high character guys, and I think Harris and Revis are going to be excellent ball players, but, the Jets had opportunities last year and this year to add some big bodies up front, namely, Gabe Watson and Alan Branch from Michigan, and did not bite on either one. It is pretty frustrating to see those guys playing well and anchoring the 3-4 for Arizona. Both guys fell b/c of some miconception about their motors/character - but when Branch was at UM he was a monster, and the best DL in the Big Ten. Parcells used to say if you are going to make mistakes make them big, and it is about time the Jets start doing that.
    *Waits for CBNY to tell us that these 300+ pound men take plays off unlike the rest of the big NT/DTs in the league.*

  5. #5
    We run a fairly complicated defense, and Mangini's practices are particularly strenuous. I have no problem with wanting to draft smart, dedicated football players. Furthermore, the NFL has become very strict regarding off-field issues; I wouldn't want to risk having a player suspended.

  6. #6
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    Perhaps a HC with as little experience as Mangeniuz isnt skilled enough to deal with "distractions" or "disruptions" so instead, he adopts a mantra of "character people" so his players act as robots and walk lock step with his program?

    Some Coaches seem to have no problem dealing with an array of "choo-choo's with square wheels" (yes i used a Rudolph the red nose reindeer reference)...

    The bottom line is that we are dealing with pampered athletes that for the most part have been "ushered" through school with the understanding that their destiny lie in non-academic pursuits....a truly talented athlete with "excellent" character would seem to be more the exception rather than the rule IMHO...

    Maybe with some experience under their belts "Tangeniuz's" will realize this and display a willingness and facility for dealing with the "choo-choo's"

  7. #7
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    if the JETS are rebuilding, when do we expect them to be a really good football team? 2015 Please answer that question

    'because everytime this team goes downhill we quickly say this team is rebuilding. Last year when the jets were on fire making runs for the playoffs, i clearly remember a few post saying this team is ready and needs a few pieces to go to the big dance, now the tides have turned.

    'and if we're so building for the future, why not start players who will probably be the future, because obviously some of us think the season is over, if we're rebuilding.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by copernicus View Post
    With all due respect scuppers, you want the Jets to mirror their drafting strategies after the Arizona Cardnials?

    The Patriots in the NFL and the Yankees in baseball have a long stretch of success by drafting and signing good, smart, players with strong work ethics.

    Fans need to have patience.

    We're in the second year of a rebuild.

    Two above average drafts in a row where we found our LT and QB of the future.

    We're not in that bad of shape................

    The third phase of rebuilding should see us acquiring thru Draft/FA, the LOS Beasts needed for our Offense/Defense. I'm overall impressed with the quality of players drafted by Tangini. IMO, this is the most crucial. The one that Tangini will make significant player changes. If we can come out of '08 with our QB in place(ie: Clemens) Then the '09 Draft/FA period should top us off for a serious run at the Lombardi Trophy for years to come. 2009-12 we'll be Elite.

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    I very much wanted the Jets to draft Branch, but he hasn't done much this season, missed the first 4 weeks with a broken hand. Still think he will be a good player, but hasn't had any part in Arizona's success so far.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by 32green View Post
    Perhaps a HC with as little experience as Mangeniuz isnt skilled enough to deal with "distractions" or "disruptions" so instead, he adopts a mantra of "character people" so his players act as robots and walk lock step with his program?

    Some Coaches seem to have no problem dealing with an array of "choo-choo's with square wheels" (yes i used a Rudolph the red nose reindeer reference)...

    The bottom line is that we are dealing with pampered athletes that for the most part have been "ushered" through school with the understanding that their destiny lie in non-academic pursuits....a truly talented athlete with "excellent" character would seem to be more the exception rather than the rule IMHO...

    Maybe with some experience under their belts "Tangeniuz's" will realize this and display a willingness and facility for dealing with the "choo-choo's"
    You mean like the "choo choo's" on the Bengals?

    With all due respect, what has it done for them?

    I'd rather invest my time rooting for good players who have good character than street thugs...............

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenReaper View Post
    The third phase of rebuilding should see us acquiring thru Draft/FA, the LOS Beasts needed for our Offense/Defense. I'm overall impressed with the quality of players drafted by Tangini. IMO, this is the most crucial. The one that Tangini will make significant player changes. If we can come out of '08 with our QB in place(ie: Clemens) Then the '09 Draft/FA period should top us off for a serious run at the Lombardi Trophy for years to come. 2009-12 we'll be Elite.
    You got it GreenReaper!

    agree

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by J.E.T.Sfan4life View Post
    if the JETS are rebuilding, when do we expect them to be a really good football team? 2015 Please answer that question

    'because everytime this team goes downhill we quickly say this team is rebuilding. Last year when the jets were on fire making runs for the playoffs, i clearly remember a few post saying this team is ready and needs a few pieces to go to the big dance, now the tides have turned.

    'and if we're so building for the future, why not start players who will probably be the future, because obviously some of us think the season is over, if we're rebuilding.
    You make good points.

    But we havent been in a rebuild phase since year one of Parcells.

    That's a pretty good stretch.

    Two solid drafts in a row where players are contributing.

    Some look like future STUDS: D'BRICK, Mangold, Revis, Leon, and B Smith

    That is a pretty good reason to think this FO will suceed.

    Again, we are not that far away................

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by scuppers View Post
    I am all far having high character guys, and I think Harris and Revis are going to be excellent ball players, but, the Jets had opportunities last year and this year to add some big bodies up front, namely, Gabe Watson and Alan Branch from Michigan, and did not bite on either one. It is pretty frustrating to see those guys playing well and anchoring the 3-4 for Arizona. Both guys fell b/c of some miconception about their motors/character - but when Branch was at UM he was a monster, and the best DL in the Big Ten. Parcells used to say if you are going to make mistakes make them big, and it is about time the Jets start doing that.
    Alan Branch doesn't have a tackle this yr. I'm not following you on this.
    Gabe Watson has been good, but The Jets drafted 4 starters last yr, including Schlagel (I'm just kidding about this part)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by copernicus View Post
    You mean like the "choo choo's" on the Bengals?

    With all due respect, what has it done for them?

    I'd rather invest my time rooting for good players who have good character than street thugs...............
    I agree, actually.

    Obviously, Marvin Lewis couldnt or wouldnt deal the issues his players brought to the table...


    I'm thinkin that there is a spectrum of character and that with some careful scrutiny, we might be able to benefit from picking up a salveable project,but only if the coach has the tools to work with them..

    I'm not speaking of Pac man types or out right "THUGS"...

    If I remember correctly, Coles had some issues and straightened himself out pretty well....

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by 32green View Post
    I agree, actually.

    Obviously, Marvin Lewis couldnt or wouldnt deal the issues his players brought to the table...


    I'm thinkin that there is a spectrum of character and that with some careful scrutiny, we might be able to benefit from picking up a salveable project,but only if the coach has the tools to work with them..

    I'm not speaking of Pac man types or out right "THUGS"...

    If I remember correctly, Coles had some issues and straightened himself out pretty well....
    I guess it's a fine line.

    I dont think Mangini is against drafting players like "Coles" with his type situation.............

    I believe they drafted Titus Adams last season who had some issues..........

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenReaper View Post
    The third phase of rebuilding should see us acquiring thru Draft/FA, the LOS Beasts needed for our Offense/Defense. I'm overall impressed with the quality of players drafted by Tangini. IMO, this is the most crucial. The one that Tangini will make significant player changes. If we can come out of '08 with our QB in place(ie: Clemens) Then the '09 Draft/FA period should top us off for a serious run at the Lombardi Trophy for years to come. 2009-12 we'll be Elite.
    If we are rebuilding then get used to the idea of Chad being around for quite some time. Teams that are rebuilding do not wait until the "third phase" to start their franchise QB. We are not rebuilding. We just plain suck. No one -front office, players, coaches, and fans- could have envisioned a 1-5, very likely to be 1-6 start.

  17. #17
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    I said it at the time of the draft. If we had stayed put at 25 I would have drafted Alan Branch. Is he going to be any good, I have no idea but on paper he fits what we need.

  18. #18
    TMahoney
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    Their approach is to build a core of high character players. The guys we selected under Tannenbaum have all been good people but also good players.

    Now I don't know what they're thinking, but the way I interpret what they've done is like this: You build the foundation with high character guys, and once that is settled then you can afford to take a risk.

    The Bengals tried to build their foundation with convicts and they've imploded.

    The Jets are one of the youngest teams in the NFL, and remember, thats including the coaching staff and the GM.

    They're being conservative at first because they understand they haven't built up the reputation to afford to take bold risks in personell. Belichick can pull it off. Parcells could pull it off. Andy Reid couldn't. Marvin Lewis couldn't. All these coaches are good to great NFL coaches. But the difference is the respect. The respect that Parcells and Belichick receive dwarf what Reid and Lewis receive.

    Tangini is probably thinking: "Establish your team, franchise and self before you risk everything".

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by scuppers View Post
    I am all far having high character guys, and I think Harris and Revis are going to be excellent ball players, but, the Jets had opportunities last year and this year to add some big bodies up front, namely, Gabe Watson and Alan Branch from Michigan, and did not bite on either one. It is pretty frustrating to see those guys playing well and anchoring the 3-4 for Arizona. Both guys fell b/c of some miconception about their motors/character - but when Branch was at UM he was a monster, and the best DL in the Big Ten. Parcells used to say if you are going to make mistakes make them big, and it is about time the Jets start doing that.
    A) With them, the Cardinals are 16th in Run Defense and 17th in Pass Defense. Make no mistake about it, this Cardinals Defense is nothing special at all.

    B)
    if the JETS are rebuilding, when do we expect them to be a really good football team? 2015 Please answer that question

    'because everytime this team goes downhill we quickly say this team is rebuilding. Last year when the jets were on fire making runs for the playoffs, i clearly remember a few post saying this team is ready and needs a few pieces to go to the big dance, now the tides have turned.

    'and if we're so building for the future, why not start players who will probably be the future, because obviously some of us think the season is over, if we're rebuilding.
    Who ever said we were a few pieces away was dilusional based off a soft-schedule 10 wins and alot of smoke and mirrors. We've been rebuilding since Mangini and Tannenbaum came into power, it usually takes 2-3 years to implement a system and get players who fit it. We're at minimum a year away from being where we want to be, and in all likelyhood 2 years away still.

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