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Thread: Super Bowl Champions that had a run...

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    Super Bowl Champions that had a run...

    Teams that won a more that one, or were considered dynasties in the modern era all had a key ingredient that the Jets have to address (this is no secret) multiple top receiving options.

    Steelers with Lynn Swann & John Stallworth, Cowboys with Michael Irvin & Jay Novacek, 49ers with Jerry Rice & John Taylor...great pass catchers make QB's greater.

    The most glaring weakness on the Jets is and has been for years the pass catchers. There have been some decent combos, but never for any extended period of time due to roster moves or health issues. Continuity of a top combo is a dire need if we are to ever see any extended success as a franchise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    Teams that won a more that one, or were considered dynasties in the modern era all had a key ingredient that the Jets have to address (this is no secret) multiple top receiving options.

    Steelers with Lynn Swann & John Stallworth, Cowboys with Michael Irvin & Jay Novacek, 49ers with Jerry Rice & John Taylor...great pass catchers make QB's greater.

    The most glaring weakness on the Jets is and has been for years the pass catchers. There have been some decent combos, but never for any extended period of time due to roster moves or health issues. Continuity of a top combo is a dire need if we are to ever see any extended success as a franchise.
    Troy Brown, David Givens, Deion Branch, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Christian Fauria and Daniel Graham are all exceptions to that theory. Of course it helps to have great WRs, but a great QB can make things happen with lesser talent. Tom Brady has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pats1960 View Post
    Troy Brown, David Givens, Deion Branch, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Christian Fauria and Daniel Graham are all exceptions to that theory. Of course it helps to have great WRs, but a great QB can make things happen with lesser talent. Tom Brady has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
    I think this thread was intended to address teams that succeeded within the rules of the game

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pats1960 View Post
    Troy Brown, David Givens, Deion Branch, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Christian Fauria and Daniel Graham are all exceptions to that theory. Of course it helps to have great WRs, but a great QB can make things happen with lesser talent. Tom Brady has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
    Brady's a freak we all know that...

    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think this thread was intended to address teams that succeeded within the rules of the game
    yes sir!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    Teams that won a more that one, or were considered dynasties in the modern era all had a key ingredient that the Jets have to address (this is no secret) multiple top receiving options.

    Steelers with Lynn Swann & John Stallworth, Cowboys with Michael Irvin & Jay Novacek, 49ers with Jerry Rice & John Taylor...great pass catchers make QB's greater.

    The most glaring weakness on the Jets is and has been for years the pass catchers. There have been some decent combos, but never for any extended period of time due to roster moves or health issues. Continuity of a top combo is a dire need if we are to ever see any extended success as a franchise.
    Gotta be honest, I think you're putting the cart before the horse. Teams that had runs, winning more than once and being considered dynasties or near dynasties all had top QB's. The WR's were just the gravy after that. Brady did not have some super stable of pass catchers as mentioned before. There have also been alot of teams with a great stable of WR's that just could not get it done, leaving you to scratch your head. ATL is one that comes to mind. Everyone is always on Ryan's jock, but personally I think there's something just not "there" with him, even though he possibly has had the best WR/TE combo in the league.

    WR's are great and you definitely need good ones, but it starts with the QB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    Gotta be honest, I think you're putting the cart before the horse. Teams that had runs, winning more than once and being considered dynasties or near dynasties all had top QB's. The WR's were just the gravy after that. Brady did not have some super stable of pass catchers as mentioned before. There have also been alot of teams with a great stable of WR's that just could not get it done, leaving you to scratch your head. ATL is one that comes to mind. Everyone is always on Ryan's jock, but personally I think there's something just not "there" with him, even though he possibly has had the best WR/TE combo in the league.

    WR's are great and you definitely need good ones, but it starts with the QB.
    ok, but there have been teams with average QB's win it all, I guess the point of my thread is that in order to consistently contend you need a couple of top flight guys catching the ball. The Jets really should have won back in the days of Toon, Walker, and Shuler. What would we give to have those types on the team again/

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    ok, but there have been teams with average QB's win it all, I guess the point of my thread is that in order to consistently contend you need a couple of top flight guys catching the ball. The Jets really should have won back in the days of Toon, Walker, and Shuler. What would we give to have those types on the team again/
    Multiple times? Maybe I'm just misunderstanding what you're saying. "Dynasties" have all had a QB. Teams that have won one here or there don't necessarily. But all of the consistent SB contenders were such because of their QB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    Multiple times? Maybe I'm just misunderstanding what you're saying. "Dynasties" have all had a QB. Teams that have won one here or there don't necessarily. But all of the consistent SB contenders were such because of their QB.
    Multiple times were the guys with the receivers, I just wonder if great pass catchers made really good QB's great. I never considered Bradshaw great, nor Aikman for that matter, however they are considered all timers because of their success. Of course those dynasties had more than pass catchers going for them, but I hope you see what I'm saying

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    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think this thread was intended to address teams that succeeded within the rules of the game
    hahahhahaa!


    solid QB play is the # 1 ingredient all those teams had. ours may yet turn out to be that, his future is yet to be determined ... and certainly WR/TE is glaring weaknesses on our team ... hope & expect our 1st draft pick to be one of the top WR's ... that being said, QB play will be the most important piece of the puzzle

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    ok, but there have been teams with average QB's win it all, I guess the point of my thread is that in order to consistently contend you need a couple of top flight guys catching the ball. The Jets really should have won back in the days of Toon, Walker, and Shuler. What would we give to have those types on the team again/
    I think you're missing a key component here, jw. Look no further than Eli Manning. Guy was an erratic dope behind center for years. Not to say he's a bad QB, but he has a very specific set of skills (like the guy in Taken) that are suited to this version of the game. And how those skills were able to shine was because he had a dominant offensive line that gave him time in the pocket to make decisions and throw to receivers who were able to get open. Like Tom Brady often does, he often had all day to sit in the pocket. All damn day. To the point that he won two Super Bowls and actually had people calling him elite and/or better than Peyton (ROFLMAO). And now that his offensive line is average or below again, we've returned to the old baffled-face Eli of the early days. And guess what? He still has the receiving core that won them their last one.

    Then look at their total success - based not only on protecting their QB and giving him time, but building a defense that does the opposite up front. Gets in Qbs faces, gives them no time to make decisions. Took great receivers and made them non factors. Made a mediocre secondary look like all-pros.

    The recent success of the NY Giants, the Baltimore Ravens, countless other teams should tell you something - that the old adage still stands today - games are won in the trenches
    Last edited by JetPotato; 12-19-2013 at 10:03 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    ok, but there have been teams with average QB's win it all, I guess the point of my thread is that in order to consistently contend you need a couple of top flight guys catching the ball. The Jets really should have won back in the days of Toon, Walker, and Shuler. What would we give to have those types on the team again/
    If we took Marino instead of Kenny we would have..

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    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think you're missing a key component here, jw. Look no further than Eli Manning. Guy was an erratic dope behind center for years. Not to say he's a bad QB, but he has a very specific set of skills (like the guy in Taken) that are suited to this version of the game. And how those skills were able to shine was because he had a dominant offensive line that gave him time in the pocket to make decisions and throw to receivers who were able to get open. Like Tom Brady often does, he often had all day to sit in the pocket. All damn day. To the point that he won two Super Bowls and actually had people calling him elite and/or better than Peyton (ROFLMAO). And now that his offensive line is average or below again, we've returned to the old baffled-face Eli of the early days. And guess what? He still has the receiving core that won them their last one.

    Then look at their total success - based not only on protecting their QB and giving him time, but building a defense that does the opposite up front. Gets in Qbs faces, gives them no time to make decisions. Took great receivers and made them non factors. Made a mediocre secondary look like all-pros.

    The recent success of the NY Giants, the Baltimore Ravens, countless other teams should tell you something - that the old adage still stands today - games are won in the trenches

    Well said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think you're missing a key component here, jw. Look no further than Eli Manning. Guy was an erratic dope behind center for years. Not to say he's a bad QB, but he has a very specific set of skills (like the guy in Taken) that are suited to this version of the game. And how those skills were able to shine was because he had a dominant offensive line that gave him time in the pocket to make decisions and throw to receivers who were able to get open. Like Tom Brady often does, he often had all day to sit in the pocket. All damn day. To the point that he won two Super Bowls and actually had people calling him elite and/or better than Peyton (ROFLMAO). And now that his offensive line is average or below again, we've returned to the old baffled-face Eli of the early days. And guess what? He still has the receiving core that won them their last one.

    Then look at their total success - based not only on protecting their QB and giving him time, but building a defense that does the opposite up front. Gets in Qbs faces, gives them no time to make decisions. Took great receivers and made them non factors. Made a mediocre secondary look like all-pros.

    The recent success of the NY Giants, the Baltimore Ravens, countless other teams should tell you something - that the old adage still stands today - games are won in the trenches
    actually this is a terrific point, the line play of those dynasties was fantastic, at least for the Steelers and the Cowboys, the 49ers success probably had a lot to do with the newness of the WC offense in those days

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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage69 View Post
    If we took Marino instead of Kenny we would have..
    can you imagine what those teams would have been like with him at QB, the offensive talent the Jets had and those great D's?

    ugh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pats1960 View Post
    Troy Brown, David Givens, Deion Branch, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Christian Fauria and Daniel Graham are all exceptions to that theory. Of course it helps to have great WRs, but a great QB can make things happen with lesser talent. Tom Brady has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think this thread was intended to address teams that succeeded within the rules of the game

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    actually this is a terrific point, the line play of those dynasties was fantastic, at least for the Steelers and the Cowboys, the 49ers success probably had a lot to do with the newness of the WC offense in those days
    Sooo, we need an awesome WR combo, a great QB, stellar offensive line play and a unique, unprecedented offensive philosophy and we're set for decades.


    Go back to the Hampur.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RaoulDuke View Post
    Sooo, we need an awesome WR combo, a great QB, stellar offensive line play and a unique, unprecedented offensive philosophy and we're set for decades.


    Go back to the Hampur.

    lol, no ****, an early candidate for worst thread of the year

    I lose hahaha

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    I think this thread was intended to address teams that succeeded within the rules of the game
    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    games are won in the trenches
    Wins this thread.

    JW, football is the ultimate team sport. No one guy can win multiple games and have sustained success on his own:
    - If the OL can't block for the QB, even the greats (Brady, Rodgers, Brees, to some extent even Peyton) get rattled.
    - If these guys lose a key receiver, they're not nearly as accurate (Gronk, Wes with NE early and Denver last game, even a tandem as insignificant as Kerley to Geno).
    - And even with a solid OL and top 10 QB play and great receivers, if the RB situation sucks, the whole operation stalls (GB for the past three years).
    - And even if you have all that, if you don't have the defense/coaching/kicking to compliment you, you're in trouble (the one season prior to last year where Peyton got help from Dungy and his atrocious defense, and his kicker didn't lose playoff games for him, he finally got his ring; as opposed to Brady who's played his entire career with the best HC in the league, and during his championship seasons had the most clutch kicker ever and a perennial 'one-step-ahead' defense).

    -----

    ALL that being said, the quickest way to some sort of sustained success is dominant QB play.
    Last edited by greenwichjetfan; 12-19-2013 at 10:29 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin View Post
    lol, no ****, an early candidate for worst thread of the year

    I lose hahaha
    I for one think the QB makes it or breaks it. Insert a solid starter in lieu of Sanchez in our 2 runs with Rex and we'd maybe have a SB. Even if he can't be blamed for the losses, he didn't win them for us either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RaoulDuke View Post
    I for one think the QB makes it or breaks it. Insert a solid starter in lieu of Sanchez in our 2 runs with Rex and we'd maybe have a SB. Even if he can't be blamed for the losses, he didn't win them for us either.
    Idk, Sanchez probably played his best football ever in the playoffs

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