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Thread: Tom Brady

  1. #1
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    if it wasnt for the pts coaching staff, would he have been forrible if he was a jet?, or any other team for that matter?

    how much did the pats affect him

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    I think Brady is a very talented quarterback don't get me wrong...but he is not as good as everyone elevates him to be. In that system, any slightly above average quarterback could excel in my opinion. Maybe not 3 Super Bowls in 4 years, but they'd be good. He's nowhere close to guys like Montana and Marino though.

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    Originally posted by preludepunk@Feb 15 2005, 04:35 AM
    I think Brady is a very talented quarterback don't get me wrong...but he is not as good as everyone elevates him to be. In that system, any slightly above average quarterback could excel in my opinion. Maybe not 3 Super Bowls in 4 years, but they'd be good. He's nowhere close to guys like Montana and Marino though.
    Ok, let me get this straight.

    So a 'slightly above average QB' can excel in the Patriots' system, but "maybe not 3 Superbowls in 4 years."

    For all the great game planning Weis did, he did not throw the passes. That was Brady taking on two of the best defenses in the NFL. When the opposing QB was throwing 6 INTs, Brady went 37-54 443 yards 4 TDs 0 INTs. So against the 1st and 10th ranked Ds in yards, and 1st and tied for 2nd D in points allowed, Brady had a 118 rating.

    Yeah, it is the system.

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    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/facts...1405probowl.php

    A textbook study in Brady vs. Manning
    Cold, Hard Football Facts for the week of Feb. 10-16



    What separates Tom Brady from Peyton Manning? Everything you need to know was highlighted in the annual AFC-NFL all-star scrimmage called the Pro Bowl.

    Manning was spectacular in Honolulu, in a game that means nothing. He completed 6 of 10 passes for 130 yards and three touchdowns, earned the game?s MVP honors, became just the first player in 21 years to win the regular-season and Pro Bowl MVP awards in the same season and padded his Pro Bowl resume with his 9th, 10th and 11th all-star game touchdown passes.

    Brady, meanwhile, appeared bored and disinterested during the two drives he played in the Pro Bowl. He said all the right things during the week, but clearly did not care about being in Honolulu. It showed during the game. Just seven days removed from his third Super Bowl-winning performance in four years ? a game in which he posted a 110.2 passer rating against a defense that featured three Pro Bowl defensive backs ? Brady played his single-worst statistical game of the season. He completed just 4 of 9 passes for 48 yards with an interception by Philly defensive back Lito Sheppard -- a full week after it would have counted. Brady?s 21.8 passer rating in the scrimmage was the lowest he?s posted in his entire career.

    Manning?s passer rating of 143.8, meanwhile, made the Pro Bowl the third best statistical game of his record-shattering 2004 season.

    Of course, Manning apologists will look at this as a sign of his greatness. The Cold, Hard Football Facts point and laugh, fully aware that greatness rears its head not in the Pro Bowl scrimmage, but in the do-or-die pressure of playoff football.

    Brady?s brilliance in the postseason pressure cooker and Manning?s brilliance in the meaningless Pro Bowl scrimmage provide a perfect case study in the differences between the two quarterbacks. So, too, do these two recent postseason performances:

    Brady
    In the AFC title game, on the road against 16-1 Pittsburgh, in a hostile environment, against the No. 1 rated total defense and scoring defense in all of football, against a team that did not lose a single home game all season, with wind chills hovering near 0, in a contest in which his team needed him the most, Brady played his very best game of the season. He completed 14 of 21 passes for 207 yards with two touchdowns and no interceptions. New England won, 41-27. It was the most points New England scored since September 2002. It was the most points Pittsburgh surrendered since September 2003. Brady?s 130.5 rating was his highest since a 38-7 win over Buffalo back in November 2002. Brady, of course, did all this following a night in which he lay ill in his hotel bed, with a temperature of 103 and IV needles stuck in his arm.

    Manning
    In the AFC divisional playoffs, on the road against 14-2 New England, in a hostile environment, against the No. 2 scoring defense in all of football, against a team that did not lose a single home game in two seasons, with snow blowing across the field, in a game in which his team needed him most, Manning played his very worst game of the season. He completed 27 of 42 passes for 238 yards with one interception. For the first time in a season in which Manning set an NFL record with 49 touchdown passes, he failed to find the end zone even once. It was the fewest points Indy scored since a 41-0 loss to the N.Y. Jets in, of course, the 2002 playoffs. It was the fewest points New England surrendered since December 2003. Manning?s 69.3 rating was his lowest in any game since, of course, his last playoff loss, a four-interception performance against New England in the 2003 AFC title game.

    In other words, back when the opponents were tough and the games counted, Brady stood head and shoulders above Manning and above the football world.

    In three playoff games, Brady was flawless. Literally. He went through an entire postseason without an interception ? a postseason that included games against the top two scoring defenses in the NFL. His cumulative postseason passer rating of 109.4 (55 for 81, 67.9%, 587 yards, 5 TDs/0 INTs) was his best in any three consecutive games he played all season. Brady, in other words, elevated his performance when the games counted most.

    In his fifth NFL all-star game, Manning was virtually flawless. He?s thrown a Pro Bowl-record 11 touchdown passes. The second-best Pro Bowl quarterback has thrown just seven touchdowns. Manning, in other words, has elevated his performance when the games counted least.

    Of course, the meaninglessness of the Pro Bowl failed to register with ESPN?s mental midgets ? Joe Theismann, Paul Maguire, Mike Patrick ? who announced the game. Early in the scrimmage, ESPN showed a picture of Tom Brady standing on the sidelines.

    ?Tom Brady?s never thrown more than 28 touchdown passes in a season,? said Theismann. ?For Marino and Manning, that?s just half a year.?

    ?They?re just getting warmed up,? joked the slob Maguire, who couldn?t resist worshipping at the altar of meaningless Manning performances.

    It would have been entertaining television ? if Theismann and Maguire didn?t sound so stupid. Marino, of course, played 17 years in the NFL and is the all-time league leader with 420 touchdown passes. Yet he threw more than 28 touchdown passes just four times, and only once in his last 13 years in the NFL. Manning, meanwhile, has thrown for more than 28 touchdown passes three times in seven years ? 33 in 2000; 29 in 2003 and 49 in 2004.

    Manning was worshipped following his 29 touchdown passes in 2003. In fact, he won regular-season co-MVP honors and led an offense that people said couldn?t be stopped. But Brady, according to the likes of Theismann and Maguire, is a statistical nobody after throwing 28 touchdowns twice in his first four years as a fulltime player and winning three Super Bowls.

    Consider this: Brady has averaged more than 24 touchdown passes per season in his first four years as fulltime player. If he plays as long as Marino and keeps up this rate, he?ll finish his career with 388 touchdown passes. That would place him second on the all-time touchdown list. Marino averaged 24.7 TD passes per season. Brady averages 24.2 touchdown passes per season. Not bad for a guy who doesn?t put up big numbers.

    As for Manning, maybe someday he will bottle his Pro Bowl magic and twist off the cap when the games actually count. Until then his lofty numbers in the Pro Bowl, or his six TD passes against an overmatched Detroit team in midseason, merely make a mockery of his postseason ineptitude. Expect his bottle of Pro Bowl brilliance to collect dust with all the other empty honors that sit on Manning?s mantel.

  5. #5
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    Originally posted by New England Hick@Feb 15 2005, 08:29 AM


    In other words, back when the opponents were tough and the games counted, Brady stood head and shoulders above Manning and above the football world.

    All arguements end with that statement.

    There is no equal to Brady's "big-game" performances in the NFL today.

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    Originally posted by PatsFanTX+Feb 15 2005, 08:32 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PatsFanTX @ Feb 15 2005, 08:32 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-New England Hick@Feb 15 2005, 08:29 AM


    In other words, back when the opponents were tough and the games counted, Brady stood head and shoulders above Manning and above the football world.

    All arguements end with that statement.

    There is no equal to Brady&#39;s "big-game" performances in the NFL today. [/b][/quote]
    If it wasn&#39;t for Vinatieri&#39;s 2 kicks.........Brady is JAG&#33;&#33;&#33;

  7. #7
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    Originally posted by PatsFanTX+Feb 15 2005, 08:32 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PatsFanTX @ Feb 15 2005, 08:32 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-New England Hick@Feb 15 2005, 08:29 AM


    In other words, back when the opponents were tough and the games counted, Brady stood head and shoulders above Manning and above the football world.

    All arguements end with that statement.

    There is no equal to Brady&#39;s "big-game" performances in the NFL today. [/b][/quote]
    Don&#39;t waste your time gentleman, these morons still think Chads agreat QB. :lol:

  8. #8
    Originally posted by arsenal1189@Feb 15 2005, 12:14 AM
    if it wasnt for the pts coaching staff, would he have been forrible if he was a jet?, or any other team for that matter?

    how much did the pats affect him
    Ray Lucas, and Vinny T. are all you need look at, in terms of their improvement under Weiss. They didn&#39;t win any Superbowls, but then again, when Vinny had his chance, the Jets fumbled the game away. Brady&#39;s excelled, no doubt about it, when Bledsoe couldn&#39;t , but a good system, that the QB believes in, and enables good choices, certainly helps.

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    Originally posted by shasta@Feb 15 2005, 08:40 AM

    Don&#39;t waste your time gentleman, these morons still think Chads agreat QB. :lol:
    Calling a Pats fan a Gentleman???


    Now isn&#39;t that an oxymoron?? :lol:

  10. #10
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    Originally posted by NEJetFromLI@Feb 15 2005, 08:42 AM

    Ray Lucas, and Vinny T. are all you need look at, in terms of their improvement under Weiss. They didn&#39;t win any Superbowls, but then again, when Vinny had his chance, the Jets fumbled the game away. Brady&#39;s excelled, no doubt about it, when Bledsoe couldn&#39;t , but a good system, that the QB believes in, and enables good choices, certainly helps.
    What&#39;s really funny about this statement is, when Weiss came to NE with Belichick, Jet fans were all over us about how Weiss sucked and how Parcells took his playcalling away from him. Now that Brady is the best QB in the NFL, Jet fans say it&#39;s because of Weiss........ :lol:

  11. #11
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    Originally posted by NEJetFromLI+Feb 15 2005, 08:42 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (NEJetFromLI @ Feb 15 2005, 08:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-arsenal1189@Feb 15 2005, 12:14 AM
    if it wasnt for the pts coaching staff, would he have been forrible if he was a jet?, or any other team for that matter?

    how much did the pats affect him
    Ray Lucas, and Vinny T. are all you need look at, in terms of their improvement under Weiss. They didn&#39;t win any Superbowls, but then again, when Vinny had his chance, the Jets fumbled the game away. Brady&#39;s excelled, no doubt about it, when Bledsoe couldn&#39;t , but a good system, that the QB believes in, and enables good choices, certainly helps. [/b][/quote]
    Yeah right, the system makes the reads, audibles at the line perfectly when needed, and makes the key plays 95% of the time. Keep telling yourself that boys, whats the excuse going to be next year whe Wiese is gon and Brady still is at the top of the League?

  12. #12
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    Originally posted by shasta@Feb 15 2005, 08:46 AM
    Keep telling yourself that boys, whats the excuse going to be next year whe Wiese is gon and Brady still is at the top of the League?
    The refs helped them....

  13. #13
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    In much more interesting news ( :lol: ) Tom Brady and Bridget Moynihan came in 12th place in the ESPN Top Twenty Hottest "jock" couple of all time.....Tom Brady, All-American boy, handsome, courteous, bright, great leader, a "winner" (3 sb titles, two sb mvp&#39;s) and he dates a beautiful starlet. Man &#39;ole man, does this guy have a horse-shoe stuck up his a@@ or what&#33;&#33;&#33;????

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    Manning is head and shoulders above Brady as a QB. Anybody who watches football can tell you that. Who saw old tommy boy look like an average QB at the pro bowl?

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    Yeah, I&#39;m sure TB - who arrived to the Pro Bowl Late (darn SB PARADES&#33;&#33;&#33 who was DEAD tired - yeah, I&#39;m going to judge his skills on a game that doesn&#39;t count.....

  16. #16
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    Originally posted by rsherryjr@Feb 15 2005, 12:55 PM
    Manning is head and shoulders above Brady as a QB. Anybody who watches football can tell you that. Who saw old tommy boy look like an average QB at the pro bowl?
    Did you watch the Patriots/Colts playoff game? You see when it counted, who was the better QB? Brady.

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    Originally posted by Garbanza@Feb 15 2005, 08:57 AM
    Yeah, I&#39;m sure TB - who arrived to the Pro Bowl Late (darn SB PARADES&#33;&#33;&#33 who was DEAD tired - yeah, I&#39;m going to judge his skills on a game that doesn&#39;t count.....
    hahaha excuses, excuses...............Well no matter manning is still head and shoulders above.

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    Originally posted by rsherryjr@Feb 15 2005, 07:55 AM
    Manning is head and shoulders above Brady as a QB. Anybody who watches football can tell you that. Who saw old tommy boy look like an average QB at the pro bowl?
    Yeah, but I also saw Michael Vick look awesome, so...

    I&#39;m not saying that the system hasn&#39;t helped Brady, because it has, but the Pro Bowl shouldn&#39;t be used in any argument pertaining to real football.

  19. #19
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    It&#39;s exhausting isn&#39;t it?
    Trying to prove that Brady isn&#39;t great?

    I think it&#39;s time that we all realize that the things we all used to look at as characteristics of a great QB may have been overblown.

    Brady doesn&#39;t have Manning&#39;s brain, or Culpepper&#39;s arm, or Vick&#39;s speed...but he does have 3 of the last 4 SB titles...and ultimately, no matter how hard you spin it, that is the point of playing the game each season.

    I think part of the reason everyone wants to discredit Brady is his surrounding cast and the way the media has fellated him since 2002. That&#39;s not his fault though. He won a SB with Antowain Smith as his RB for cripe&#39;s sake.

    Face it, the late round nobody from Michigan has made us all look silly by becoming one of the best ever.

    I didn&#39;t buy it when he fumbl..err...tucked the ball against Oakland, but you have to believe it now.

  20. #20
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    Originally posted by The Troll+Feb 15 2005, 08:58 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (The Troll @ Feb 15 2005, 08:58 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-rsherryjr@Feb 15 2005, 07:55 AM
    Manning is head and shoulders above Brady as a QB. Anybody who watches football can tell you that. Who saw old tommy boy look like an average QB at the pro bowl?
    Yeah, but I also saw Michael Vick look awesome, so...

    I&#39;m not saying that the system hasn&#39;t helped Brady, because it has, but the Pro Bowl shouldn&#39;t be used in any argument pertaining to real football. [/b][/quote]
    Vick is awsome

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