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Thread: Should aussie guy play this year or next year?

  1. #1
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    Should aussie guy play this year or next year?

    Gday again
    I beleive that aussie guy should play this year because his stats in aussie rules footy down the page maybe says he should.

    He was offered a chance to play with the jets 7years ago but he declined the offer because he wasnt ready then but feels the time is ripe now.

    From what Ive read on numerous posts many of you must think he plays
    tiddly winks draughts or scrabble down under not aussie rules footy!!!.

    Some fans have said many aussie rules players have tried out & my or may not have made it over there.I know of 2 Bennet&Chapman.
    Darren Bennet is regarded as one of your best all time punters isnt he?

    Nathan Chapman has been waived by greenbay packers .
    Did you know {to the best of my knowledge}that he only played 1 game kicked the ball 3 times for an average of over 39 yards & has been waived?


    I am absoulutely amazed by this & talent scouts from some team should snap him up quickly for reasons that will come clearer down this page.

    For you well informed could you please advise me on all the other aussie afl players who have tried out & not made it?

    Now i have some questions for all of you i hope you answer them maybe not on the thread but in your minds?

    1 Have you ever seen an aussie rules footy game?

    2 Have you seen aussie guy play?

    3 How many times does a punter kick the ball in your game?
    In aussie rules a fullback would kick the ball 30+times a match.

    4 How many times does the punter & the holder catch a ball in your game?
    Over here he catches or marks or gets the ball approximately 25+times under pressure situations.

    5 How many times does a punter & holder pass the ball in your game?
    In aussie rules we pass the ball at al times generally very accurately by handpassing the ball Or kicking it a full back would do this 40+times a match.

    6 How many tackles does a punter & holder do in your game?
    Some of our players could tackle up to thirty+ opponents per game with no padding.

    7 how far would a punter holder run in your game?
    8+ mileswould be the average for most of our players

    8 How many of you have seen the ball kicked over 50+yards?
    It is generally known all our players can do this easily

    9 What age do you start playing in your game?
    Over here we start under 8 year olds in mini league

    So taking all this into account iisnt it feasible that an aussie super star
    with a guided missile for a leg who has been playing over twenty years & training a minimum of three times a week would be capable of playing your game in just about any position?

    Admittedly he hasnt played your rules before but hes been practising them for over 8 months he signed with you in october. How long do you think he needs?He declined 7yrs ago but has been practising with your ball in that time as well.

    I could teach a 5 year old to catch & kick in 8 months.
    This is why Nathan Chapman should also be snapped up by some team Quickly!!!

    If aussie guy isnt given a chance now he could easily give the game away or worse still sign with another club.Ill bet they dont put him in their practise squad!!!!

    Many of you think your game is the best & hardest game in the world but if you asked a rugby fan he would say his game is like wise an aussie rules fan.The one thing which is certain they are all good & are very hard games.

    Serdell

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    Quote Originally Posted by serdell

    1 Have you ever seen an aussie rules footy game? no

    2 Have you seen aussie guy play? no

    3 How many times does a punter kick the ball in your game? for the jets? hopefully none. at worst, 8. usually 4-5.
    In aussie rules a fullback would kick the ball 30+times a match.

    4 How many times does the punter & the holder catch a ball in your game? as many times as he punts - he only catches the ball on the snap before he kicks it. He is not involved in any other offensive or defensive play. Unless it's a trick play (fake punt, at most 1/season) he doesn't pass, he doesn't run, he doesn't catch a pass he doesn't block.
    Over here he catches or marks or gets the ball approximately 25+times under pressure situations.

    5 How many times does a punter & holder pass the ball in your game? Never
    In aussie rules we pass the ball at al times generally very accurately by handpassing the ball Or kicking it a full back would do this 40+times a match.

    6 How many tackles does a punter & holder do in your game? typically, hopefully, none. If your punter has to make a tackle, something has gone very wrong, because it means the return man has gotten by every other defender trying to tackle him. The punter is the last line of defense.
    Some of our players could tackle up to thirty+ opponents per game with no padding.

    7 how far would a punter holder run in your game? very little.
    8+ mileswould be the average for most of our players

    8 How many of you have seen the ball kicked over 50+yards? With what kind of hang time. Football is not aussie rules footy. Hang time is just as important as distance. If you kick the ball too far, too fast, it lets the other team make a big return (unlike aussie rules, the return man from the other team is standing downfield by himself waiting to catch the ball. The punter stands 15 yards behind the line of scrimmage, and everyone else on his team starts from the line of scrimmage. So a 50 yard kick actually travels 65 yards [yardage is judged by distance from the line of scrimmage, not from the punter's foot] and the coverage team [who are trying to tackle the return man] have to run the 50 yards to make a tackle. If you kick it 50 yards in 3 seconds, your fastest coverage guys will only be 30 yards downfield, giving the return man 20 yards of distance between himself and the nearest tackler and almost guaranteeing an easy and big return. Hang time - that is, keeping the ball in the air long enough to get down to cover the return man - is therefore a HUGE component of punting).
    It is generally known all our players can do this easily

    9 What age do you start playing in your game? Pee wee football and mites can be as young as 6.
    Over here we start under 8 year olds in mini league

    So taking all this into account iisnt it feasible that an aussie super star
    with a guided missile for a leg who has been playing over twenty years & training a minimum of three times a week would be capable of playing your game in just about any position?
    No. That's like suggesting that a really good basketball player would make a great aussie rules star because he's a highly trained athelete. Can be Graham run 40 yards in 4.5 seconds, in pads? That's how fast he'd need to be to be a decent receiver or defensive back. A little slower and he could play linebacker, but he'd need to be a WHOLE lot bigger. How often do aussie rules players get blocked by 300lb men? Forget about defensive or offensive line - he'd need to be a third again his current size. QB is completely out - he's never seen anything like an NFL defense or players at NFL speed, and he's never had to throw the ball under an NFL rush. Even as a place kicker (the only position other than punter that makes use of a rocket leg), he'd be a flop; it's a completely different style of kicking. At punter, he's a project, because he needs to work on hangtime and speed (getting the kick off in the 3.2 seconds before the rush gets there). His rocket leg makes him a worthwhile project, and I hope he makes it, but assuming he'll be great at football because he's great at footy would be a mistake.
    Sorry, but you need a reality check.

  3. #3
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    Is this guy his agent or something?

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    I'm all for this year... let him just kick the ball far, something we haven't done in a very long time. People overlook how crappy Toby's kicks were. Check out the sig for my Graham promotion.

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    Buddy your nuts. Just cuz Im a NASTY hockey player and physically fit by no means allows me to play ANY position in lacrosse. Closely related sports, highly different. Remember folks, Westoff said it best himself, This guy is so raw that he's not ready for NFLEurope. One more year training, maybe one year NFLE, then we perhaps have a TOP flight weapon at punter for the next ten years w/ the Noog.

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    Graham can't be any worse than Gowin. I'm tired of having the accurate punter with no leg strength. I don't care if Graham hasn't developed great accuracy yet, I just want a damn punter that can boot the ball more than 38 yards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by keeb
    Buddy your nuts. Just cuz Im a NASTY hockey player and physically fit by no means allows me to play ANY position in lacrosse. Closely related sports, highly different. Remember folks, Westoff said it best himself, This guy is so raw that he's not ready for NFLEurope. One more year training, maybe one year NFLE, then we perhaps have a TOP flight weapon at punter for the next ten years w/ the Noog.
    You are stating what he said 8 mths ago.Are you living in the past? At that time he definitely was so raw he wouldnt be ready for nfle (he didnt have any idea what your game was about then?} He is not saying that about him now however is he?He had had no training whatsoever when he said this 4 other teams had an interest in him.Why do you think he was signed immediately by the jets?What is he like nowwith 8 months training?
    How much training did they give darren bennet?
    Where are the names of all the afl players that havent made it over there?
    Since then Westhoff has admitted he could have a crack at this. When he went to training camp for kickers they were very impressed with him.Im not an agent for him but i have seen him play for many years & yes top basketballers & footballers have become champions in our game& ive seen rugby players become top boxers.Runners become top hurdlers & viceversa
    Hell give you hangtime & regarding 3&1/2 seconds to kick it .Many times they have less time to kick it or pass it .
    So I am still saying he may be an asset in other positions as well.
    Before writing me off why dont you purchase a tape of aussie rules with aussie guy playing?Then maybe your comments wont be as unfounded?
    Serdell

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    Different game. This sport dosen't require that much athleticism from the kicker. Hopefully he won't be making too many tackles. Direction and hang time are key and I've no idea how that relates to his former occupation. I guess the success of his fellow countryman and the pay make it worth the try. Hope he succeeds, but if I had to bet I'd say no.

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    What Dogginit said is on the money.

    BTW Knorr will start IMO and will be an obvious upgrade over Gowin.

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    Serdell, don't get me wrong, I hope he makes it, and he seems to have the tools in place (rocket leg, atheleticism, drive). But learning a new sport well enough to play it professionally is not easy. Wait til you see him in a game or two - that will tell us what we need to know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doggin94it
    Serdell, don't get me wrong, I hope he makes it, and he seems to have the tools in place (rocket leg, atheleticism, drive). But learning a new sport well enough to play it professionally is not easy. Wait til you see him in a game or two - that will tell us what we need to know.
    What he said. I want him to work out, but its not gonna be quick.

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    Serdell, you need to know you are talking about the very best of the best athletes in the NFL. To say Aussie guy could play any position over here is simply off the mark. Not even close to being accurate.

    As far as punting goes, I think he will end up making the team. As everyone else has already said, he has to learn hang time, accuracy, among other things to be a good punter. Just because he has a cannon for a right leg means nothing in the game of NFL football. Just the same, if his progress was poor he would have been released by now. So I think his remaining with the team is indicative of his ability to make the team in the end.

    As far as all of your questions go, see Doggins remarks. They are dead on........

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    here's my predicition:

    Ben Graham will not only stop the bleeding at the Punter position, but he will be considered among the NFLs best in a relatively short time.

    there is no reason to be pessimistic, the guy is a real athlete and a winner. he's practically a national hero in Australia, this is exactly the type of coup every NFL franchise wishes they could pull off at the specialist position. We might have kids in Pee wee leagues at 6 but how much punting is there? almost none until JV High School. the Jets have been working on Ben Graham since the Parcells era, to have him come through now is huge. Along with Nugent the ST overhaul will make a HUGE difference in the success of this team.

    they say football is 1/3 offense 1/3 defense and 1/3 special teams for a reason - it's a cliche because it is true - last year our ST was a weakness but this year it could be a team strength.

    at least that's my prediction.
    Last edited by bitonti; 05-30-2005 at 12:08 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by serdell
    Before writing me off why dont you purchase a tape of aussie rules with aussie guy playing?Then maybe your comments wont be as unfounded?
    Serdell
    no offense, but maybe you should pick up an NFL rulebook or at least watch a game, because i think you know less about our game than we know about yours.

    But, i am hoping Graham works out, and i think eventually he will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by J-E-T-S_187
    Graham can't be any worse than Gowin. I just want a damn punter that can boot the ball more than 38 yards.
    Amen to that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Narra
    no offense, but maybe you should pick up an NFL rulebook or at least watch a game, because i think you know less about our game than we know about yours.
    Congratulations - you just won "understatement of the year" in next year's poster awards

  17. #17
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    i say this year

  18. #18
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    more questions retraction

    Quote Originally Posted by Narra
    no offense, but maybe you should pick up an NFL rulebook or at least watch a game, because i think you know less about our game than we know about yours.

    But, i am hoping Graham works out, and i think eventually he will.
    Thank you for your advice & you are spot on with your comment.I do know very little about your game(my comments have been unfounded).Ive only seen it played approx 5 times & also twice in movies The mean machine &Heaven can wait.
    So yes I have been making unfounded statements & I apologise if ive offended anybody I can finally see now why he couldnt possibly play any position.I still find it hard to beleive though That he could sit on his *** for a whole match & maybe get only 3or 4 kicks this isnt aussie guy he will be bored shi?less
    Over here in our game he could start say at fullback & finish the game as full forward or ruck, centre or any position.After playing 120 minutes of hard on football But yes I can finally see there are vast differences between both games.

    Please advise me do you also play cricket?Lawn bowls? rugby?soccer? over there or arent thes games heard of?

    How many spectators go to see a superbowl?
    We normally have approx 80000 watching our grand finals

    How many players are on the field at any one time?
    We have 18 with 4 reserves.
    Do you have awards given at the end of the year?Eg best qb p pk running men etc?
    We have 1 main award given to the player (Players) who are regarded as the best & fairest footballers Any player who hasnt been suspended can win this award.The votes are selected by the 3 umpires officiating in each game & are opened at the end of the minor season
    Its called the brownlow medal & yes we have had star who originally knew none of our rules win one!!!

    How do you determine a punters distance?I read earlier in the excellent answers I received that they are based on where the punter gets the ball initially?So if a punter is only being given the ball from say 30 yards out each time His average distance would be less than 30 yards wouldnt it? providing he makes a successful kick?So your stats dont really show your punters real ability?I feel this is unfair on your punters?
    Maybe the stats should be based on successful kicks not distance?
    I apologise for condemning your punters!! On reading the stats I beleived that they could only kick forty+ yards maximum but maybe they can all kick as long as Ausssie guy it just depends from where they are kicking it?
    I would like to finish off that I beleive youll see a great hangtime with aussie guy he can boot it to the moon{a phrase ive never heard before}
    regarding his accuracy you wont even play afl if you arent very decisive & accurate so take my word for it hes very accurate the problem I see he will have is wearing padding.Hes never done this before.
    Yes he does on occassions tackle 300 pound monsters but not all the time.

    Thanks all for bearing with me & my unfounded comments lets hope you win the superbowl this year.From what im reading youve got the players to do this even if aussie guy isnt playing.

    Serdell

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    Please see below......

    .
    Quote Originally Posted by serdell
    How many spectators go to see a superbowl? Millions of people watch the superbowl every year. It is truly an all american event. There is usually about 100,000 that goes to the game. We normally have approx 80000 watching our grand finals

    How many players are on the field at any one time? 22
    We have 18 with 4 reserves.
    Do you have awards given at the end of the year? MVP, Defensive rookie of the year, offensive rookie of the year, etc. Eg best qb p pk running men etc?
    We have 1 main award given to the player (Players) who are regarded as the best & fairest footballers Any player who hasnt been suspended can win this award.The votes are selected by the 3 umpires officiating in each game & are opened at the end of the minor season
    Its called the brownlow medal & yes we have had star who originally knew none of our rules win one!!!

    How do you determine a punters distance? The punters net distance is measured from the line of scrimmage (where the ball is snapped from) forward. The punter lines up 15 yards in back of the line of scrimmage, so yes there distance is not toally accurate. Depending on field position is really what matters to a punters statistics. If he is punting from the opponents 45 yard line his statistics will be skewed and appear to be somewhat less because the punter has to punt the ball very high and a short distance in order to prevent a return. Also placement is very important. The intent is to pin the other team as close to there own goal line as possible. So just punting the ball a long distance would not serve any good in a situation of this nature. I read earlier in the excellent answers I received that they are based on where the punter gets the ball initially?So if a punter is only being given the ball from say 30 yards out each time His average distance would be less than 30 yards wouldnt it? providing he makes a successful kick?So your stats dont really show your punters real ability?I feel this is unfair on your punters?
    Maybe the stats should be based on successful kicks not distance?

    American football measures a punters ability in terms of GROSS and NET yardage. Net yardage is really the very most important statistic of all. The punter will punt from a given spot (15 yards behind the LOS). The actual distance distance of the punt would be called GROSS yardage. Net yardage is the gross yardage minus the 15 yards that the punter stands in back of the LOS and minus the what the punt returner manages to return the ball.
    I apologise for condemning your punters!! On reading the stats I beleived that they could only kick forty+ yards maximum but maybe they can all kick as long as Ausssie guy it just depends from where they are kicking it?
    I would like to finish off that I beleive youll see a great hangtime with aussie guy he can boot it to the moon{a phrase ive never heard before}
    regarding his accuracy you wont even play afl if you arent very decisive & accurate so take my word for it hes very accurate the problem I see he will have is wearing padding.Hes never done this before.
    Yes he does on occassions tackle 300 pound monsters but not all the time.

    Thanks all for bearing with me & my unfounded comments lets hope you win the superbowl this year.From what im reading youve got the players to do this even if aussie guy isnt playing.

    Serdell

  20. #20
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    I'm sick of the Louie Agular and Toby Gowin types. Give me a punter with a rocket leg, and let him learn the nuances of the game.

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